LeftWinger

spend the majority of the money on defense, BUT if Holland could find a player to put in 30-40, maybe 50 more goals and can score consistently (unlike Franzen) then why not add that dimension?

I totally agree! Which is why I said spend most the money on making the D better, so we don't have as many third period farts...but I said IF Holland can get a goal scorer, then why not? If the D brings the GAA back up to the top 5, then adding a player that can score 30+ goals would be icing on the cake! Again, to the OP, I am not saying don't get better defensively, but after that, if we can add scoring, then do it!

4.5 million isnt overpaying I wouldnt say, that seems about fair value to me. He put up 51 points, is ahuge hitter/ can fight and he is better defensively than Rafalski. Rafalski was getting paid 6 million when the cap was lower. Wiz is only gonna get better.
The more I think about it the more I can see them sign him, I know people have heard he doesnt like the wings but ive also read he only said that because his blackhawk teammates would chirp him.
Adding him would give detroit one of, if not the hardest hitting defense in the league

With all the respect to the OP...then how the hell we've lost 8 one goal games vs Sharks past 2 Playoffs?
Last year Howard wasn't good and Lebda and Meech were patrolling the blue line,but this year Jimmy was very good and our D men were solid so I'm totally with Babs on signing top 6 forward to provide us more scoring depth

I really don't understand where this comes from, in 75 games last season he only had 38 PIM's... He has has ONE season where he had more than 100 PIM's that was 103 in Chicago...All others were 36, 39, 30, 56 and last season's 38 PIM's... In 329 career games he has 302 PIM's and 103 of those came in one 68 game season... I don't believe he takes stupid penalties at all... At least not to the point to where he can be labeled.

I really don't understand where this comes from, in 75 games last season he only had 38 PIM's... He has has ONE season where he had more than 100 PIM's that was 103 in Chicago...All others were 36, 39, 30, 56 and last season's 38 PIM's... In 329 career games he has 302 PIM's and 103 of those came in one 68 game season... I don't believe he takes stupid penalties at all... At least not to the point to where he can be labeled.

I suddenly just now realized that the Bruins haven't won the Cup since 1972....wow 38 years! That has to be the longest drought for an American team.... Go Bruins!

I suddenly just now realized that the Bruins haven't won the Cup since 1972....wow 38 years! That has to be the longest drought for an American team.... Go Bruins!

Well, if we're talking about suggestive overtones:
Canucks? A little racist isn't it?
Blackhawks? Disrespecting the Native American are we?
Red Wings? Really? Ewwwwwww!

It gonna be the Detroit Red Wings! They are gonna move to the Eastern Conference and will be re-branded Eastern Conference Champions instead of Western Conference Champions on their way to another Stanley Cup Championship! Sheesh guys!

It gonna be the Detroit Red Wings! They are gonna move to the Eastern Conference and will be re-branded Eastern Conference Champions instead of Western Conference Champions on their way to another Stanley Cup Championship! Sheesh guys!

Interesting that both of those have Joseph Morrow falling to Detroit at 24. I'd like that. Good offense, and while he's not tall, 197 lbs at 6' at his age is ******* bulky as hell. He's gonna be one stocky dude when he's fully grown. Suppose he has another inch.. 6' or 6'1", 215-220 lbs? That kid is gonna be one strong dude. Also seems to be a guy that likes a good bit of the fisticuffs. Skill set could suggest a large (muscle mass), well-rounded two-way d-man with a taste for the occasional scrap.
Personally, I'd be fine with Mayfield at 24th if there's nothing else incredibly interesting still available. However, if Morrow is still available at 24th I'd take him ahead of Mayfield in a heartbeat.

It gonna be the Detroit Red Wings! They are gonna move to the Eastern Conference and will be re-branded Eastern Conference Champions instead of Western Conference Champions on their way to another Stanley Cup Championship! Sheesh guys!

Zetterberg and Filppula are both listed at 6 feet, not undersized. Datsyuk is the most skilled player in the league and Crosby has generational talent.
You can name a couple small players who are a few of the best in the league, but for everyone of those small ones there is 5 who aren't small.
So now that youve listed Datsyuk and Crosby as proof that drafting smaller forwards are great.. tell me about how great Hudler and Jason Williams are? You know, the 2 most worthless Red Wings the last few years who have done nothing for the team

Youre assuming he'll grow, you have no clue if he'll add 30 pounds or gain another few inches.
Mayfield doesn't need to grow, it is just likely he will put on weight because he is 6'4 and underweight for his height.
Khocklachev is undersized, I'm sure he is a great player but now what the wings need. I can see Armia or whoever because he is 6'3 but why the hell when there are guys that big on the board, would the wings pick another small forward when there is equal skill with size that is going to be around?

ok, ok, ok, I will take Draper in place of Hudler....

Gosh I hope Draper doesn't get re-signed....

It gonna be the Detroit Red Wings! They are gonna move to the Eastern Conference and will be re-branded Eastern Conference Champions instead of Western Conference Champions on their way to another Stanley Cup Championship! Sheesh guys!

I'd be fine with us trading Hudler for Wolski straight up right now, then they can buy out Hudler at less if they want to, or roll with him... I personally think Hudler could still be a valuable player and DO NOT WANT TO turn this into yet ANOTHER Hudler thread, but I think Wolski would really find his niche here and could be huge for us... I'd even be willing for the Wing's to eat the additional 1m in salary for that trade off if needed...
To be honest, I'd rather roll with them both, but I'd take Wolski over Hudler right now and I think he could turn into a 70+ pt a year guy here, maybe more...

I like how the article mentions that all trade deals the wings have been thinking of have Hudler as the outgoing player (ie, not Filppula) yet your "logical" conclusion is, of course, trade Filppula.

Some you people's trade ideas are completely outlandish.
#1 Philly doesn't want our overpaid garbage.
#2 Smith is NOT going to be in the NHL full time this year (probably not next year either) - He's been below average defensively in the AHL
#3 Detroit isn't Philly's only trade partner in the NHL - They can do better getting CBJ's 8th pick, unless Kenny wants to offer up Helm, Smith, and Tatar + our 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounder. That 8th pick is worth more than our top 3 picks...
That said, Holland could probably get Pronger for a bit cheaper since he has a bad contract...

The problem is, as I've stated before, Carter is Philly's go-to faceoff guy. They won't be dealing him without getting a faceoff guy back. Your deal would either have to see Abdelkader added, or Hudler swapped out for Filppula. Ultimately I don't see it going down without Filppula going the other way; Franzen is good on draws and a good player, but he's older than Carter, worse defensively, and a worse passer. Similar in that both are snipers first, but there's not enough cap relief there. Especially with what is lost. Flip has everything Carter does except the shot. And that's a $2.25m difference, which if Philly is lucky might be enough to buy Leino's shot.
Post about Meszaros

Mursak, Abby, and a 2nd for Carter is a steal. There's a good chance only one of Mursak or Abby will be a regular forward on the Wings this coming season. So we're looking at trading a young 4th liner and a young spare forward plus a pick for an elite goal scorer. And age isn't really that big of a factor; Carter is 26, Abdelkader is 24, Mursak is 23. So the only thing here is, do you think that keeping Mursak and Abdelkader, knowing that you'll get maybe 100-120 man-games between them next season and possibly the season after, do you think that beats out Carter's 70-80 games on immediate impact? And do you think having Carter long-term as a top-line caliber player while Mursak and Abdelkader develop into 3rd liners or potentially 2nd liners, and the Wings get a player with the pick who has to go through the development process... which helps the team out more in the next ten years?
I would say that trading for Carter, by a wide margin. If they take a Mursak/Abby deal instead of the Flip/Abby deal I posted, the Wings CAN'T refuse. It would be stupid. The Wings would be able to dress lines like this:
Zetterberg/Datsyuk/Holmstrom
Hudler/Carter/Cleary
Franzen/Filppula/Bertuzzi
Draper/Helm/Eaves
Franzen/Zetterberg/Bertuzzi
Filppula/Datsyuk/Holmstrom
Hudler/Carter/Cleary
Draper/Helm/Eaves
Zetterberg/Carter/Cleary
Filppula/Datsyuk/Holmstrom
Franzen/Hudler/Bertuzzi
Draper/Helm/Eaves
Most NHL teams would be happy with any of those first three lines as their top line. One to test out of course would be Franzen/Carter/Bertuzzi... but I don't see that one working out very well.

Hudler is with Carter because Carter is a pure goal scorer. You put playmakers with goal scorers. If we get Carter for Flip (plus), which is the most likely swap, and put Z with Dats, who would you put as Carter's playmaker? Cleary? Helm? Draper? Hudler is the answer. Franzen on Emmerton's wing was primarily to allow for three strong scoring lines, but perhaps you can make one of these switches:
Zetterberg/Datsyuk/Holmstrom (or Bertuzzi)
Hudler/Carter/Franzen
Cleary/Helm/Eaves
Mursak/Emmerton/Bertuzzi (or Holmstrom)
Miller
Zetterberg/Datsyuk/Holmstrom
Hudler/Carter/Cleary
Bertuzzi/Franzen/Miller
Mursak/Helm/Eaves
Emmerton
Perhaps even:
Zetterberg/Datsyuk/Cleary
Hudler/Carter/Franzen
Mursak/Helm/Eaves
Holmstrom/Emmerton/Bertuzzi
Miller.
Do you like those any better? And what wingers would you put with Carter that provide the goal-scorer a playmaker? I'd love to hear your answer. The Wings, assuming Flip and Abby are traded for Carter, would have three top-end playmaking forwards. Z, Dats, and Hudler.
So again: If Z and Dats are together, you put Hudler with your best remaining goal-scorer. Carter. If you like, you can put both Carter and Franzen on that line. Could be pretty wicked, especially as a second line.

Tradeable top-six forwards the Wings have right now:
Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Filppula, Franzen, Hudler, Holmstrom
Z and Dats won't be traded despite Philly's desire. Homer won't be traded, and Philly won't be interested anyway.
Leaves Flip, Mule, and Huds.
Flip is the logical core of a trade, because Franzen and Hudler are better suited to wing, while Flip is equally strong in all three spots. There would be a remaining core forwards of Richards, Briere, Giroux, Hartnell, Versteeg, and Van Riemsdyk, plus a possibly returning Ville Leino. That would add up to seven top-six level forwards capable of 40+ points. Flip would, of course, not be the only piece in the deal, but would provide a faceoff man equal to Carter. Faceoffs are a key point as to why a Filppula/Abdelkader deal might work for Carter. Philly wouldn't trade away their only good faceoff man for a winger like Hudler, who is below average on faceoffs. Blair Betts, at 50.3%, and Claude Giroux (50.046%, or 548 wins and 547 losses) the only player signed for next season other than Carter (54.7%) who was better than a flat 50% who took more than 10 draws.
They will want a faceoff man back. They also can't take too much cap hit back because they need to clear space to sign Bryzgalov. Granted, the numbers being tossed around include both Bobrovsky and Leighton, one or both of whom will not be on the roster, so that's a bit of freedom. But sending Filppula, Abdelkader, Kindl/Smith, and a 1st might bring back Carter and one of Coburn/Carle/Meszaros. The reason I include Abby is because Philly desperately needs faceoff help. This deal allows them to sign Leino simply within the cap relief it provides, and they will have a full roster signed underneath the cap. Thing is, in real life they probably would have to make a deal like this, and then also either trade off Versteeg or not sign Leino, Or perhaps trade two of Carle/Coburn/Meszaros.
They have about $4.5m, give or take, under the cap right now (assuming Bobrovsky is the backup). They have to sign Bryz, Leino, Carcillo, Powe, Nodl, plus O'Donnell or a replacement. Probably looking at the neighborhood of $13m total for those six guys. So... clearing up $8.5m from the cap, are we? Versteeg sounds like a good bet. send him off for a pick and a depth forward or prospect. Cut $2.5m. Now we're at $6m. Let's make that Carter/Filppula deal. Say in the Steeger deal it was a prospect, so we can make Abs work as the replacement for him. Flip and Abs together cut about $4.5m from Carter and Versteeg. Kindl is a savings of $2.5 to $3.25 over Carle/Coburn/Meszaros. So now, all that needs to be cleared up is another $750k-$1.5m. Maybe cut Jody Shelley from the roster and you've got the difference and you drop one of the league-leaders in leaving his team shorthanded.
If Carter IS traded to the Wings in the kind of deal I proposed, I'd like to see a lineup as such:
With Draper:
Zetterberg/Datsyuk/Holmstrom
Hudler/Carter/Cleary
Bertuzzi/Franzen/Mursak
Draper/Helm/Eaves
Miller/Emmerton
Without Draper:
Zetterberg/Datsyuk/Holmstrom
Hudler/Carter/Cleary
Franzen/Emmerton/Bertuzzi
Mursak/Helm/Eaves
Miller.
Yes. I realize that I put Emmerton on the third line and Helm on the fourth line. I'm not crazy. Emmerton is more suited to being a playmaking center for Franzen and Bertuzzi, and keeping the DHE (or the MHE, as it were) together as a checking line while putting a playmaker of Emmerton's skill on the third line is better than having no real checking line.