haroldsnepsts

*cough* Oilers *cough* Though they may finally turn it around this time with Chiarelli and McLelland there. They just have to keep Mactavish and Lowe away from the controls.

Agreed. If only for the simple reason that there's not enough hours in the day to do a good job at both positions.

Definitely. I'm setting an extremely low bar here. Shanny has shown himself to be not insane and is at least saying the right things, though he has no track record as team president. The GM is the key. Going to Toronto without that in place is putting a ton of faith in Shanahan hiring the right guy for that job.

Leafs still don't have a GM in place, correct? With Shanny as president and a reputable GM in place I could almost see it as something other than a massive gamble.

It just confirms for me that no one really has an inside scoop on this or knows what's actually going on other than Babcock and the teams involved.

Though the real lebrun just retweeted this, though I have no idea who he's retweeting or the authenticity of flightaware. Pierre LeBrun retweeted Jeff Veillette @Jeffler · 6m6 minutes ago MLSE's private jet is scheduled to head to Detroit later today and depart within three minutes of arrival. http://flightaware.com/photos/view/334911-9a6d812c5b8800b9c0c814927ca8c17bbb374469/aircrafttype/GLF4 …

Good catch. Everyone needs to beware of fake Twitter accounts. Make sure they're verified. Also, posting false info will get you suspended or banned (not that it's what happened in this case).

He's mucked some things up in the past, like Iginla to Boston (the first time). Probably pretty reliable but I wouldn't put him equal with McKenzie.

It's sort of choosing the dream of turning that franchise around, while ignoring all common sense.

To the original point, I think Babcock is one of the best coaches in the league. I don't really know enough about Blashill to comment on him as the alternative so it's hard to say. I certainly don't care about the money situation. It's not coming out of my pocket and it doesn't count against the cap. If Babcock stayed I wouldn't be upset. I'd like to see what he does as the young guys continue to develop and hopefully Kenny makes some moves in the offseason to bolster a blueline that desperately needs it. But there's also a part of me that thinks it would be fun to have a new coach. Maybe the message has gotten stale, even with all the new assistants. 10 years is a long time. They could get some new blood in the organization that would maybe give the Wings that "new coach" bump for a season or two while Dats and Z are still producing. Add a good move by Kenny to that new energy and it might be enough to get the Wings over the hump, even if only short term. It comes down to if Blashill (or whoever else replaces Babcock) is a better fit for this team right now. And frankly I have no idea. It could end up a huge success or a disaster. With Babs it won't be a disaster but likely more of an incremental change.

With Ken Holland by his side. But it's just Babcock wanting this? He could've done it because Holland asked him to. He could've done it as a favor to Dreger. He could've done it because he really loves all this attention. No one has any actual idea what his motivations are, so who cares? And no, that one sentence would have done little to end this crap. There was tons of media coverage and speculation before that TSN interview. If he said he doesn't negotiate publicly, it would just be the same endless speculation we're having now. Honestly I'm surprised at the amount of coverage this whole thing is getting but as an American not living in the Detroit area, I didn't realize how big Canada's fixation on him would be after the Gold medal wins.

Why would Babs part ways with the Wings since we have Suter? Kypreos said that was a done deal. He's just throwing more speculation on the fire in hopes of looking like he had a scoop.

If the whole process disgusts you so much, why follow it so closely? It's like repeatedly drinking spoiled milk.

You're missing my point. "Family" and "winning" are pretty broad and commonly used terms. Of course you'd think anyone would have to check with their family and would also want to win. It's answering a question without really saying anything. But to publicly get into the nitty gritty of what he liked or disliked with his offer from the Wings or what he considers the downsides of staying with the team would be bad strategically and frankly a jerk move to an organization that's treated him well. And minus the TSN interview, with Ken Holland by his side, he is negotiating his contract privately.

In the press? Not really. It not only would be a stupid move strategically but would make public matters that are best handled privately. Say for example it is that he doesn't have faith in Ken Holland, why throw him under the bus like that in public? What does that possibly help? It only embarrasses Holland and the Wings by stirring up a media storm and makes Babcock look bad. And Babcock sounds like a pretty blunt guy regarding most matters as a coach. I'm guessing he and Holland have had a lot of frank discussions. Him not airing them publicly doesn't mean he's not being honest.

Agreed about not showing his cards. Imagine interviewing for jobs and talking publicly about every aspect of your thought process, especially when you may stay and still respect your current employer. What's he supposed to say? "It's not entirely about the money, but frankly Kenny's offer was so low it ticked me off a bit and I think maybe they undervalue me here." "I feel like my message may have gotten stale in the locker room and I'd do better with a new team that has some top end prospects." "I don't have faith that Holland will be able to do much more than make small tweaks to this team in the next few years, and that's not going to get us a Cup." "I'd really like a change but my family really wants to stay here. So I have to sell them on the idea of moving and really have to be sure about where I'm going." People seem to latch on to a few things Babcock has said publicly but have to remember this is a job interview process and he can't or shouldn't talk about 90% of what's going on.

Right. Which makes little sense to me. You're blaming Babcock equally for what is 100% Holland's responsibility. Of course the decisions aren't without input from others. Just like Babcock consults people in his decisions. But their disagreeing on rosters has been well documented over the years. And even if Babcock has Holland's ear and is lobbying for these things, it's still ultimately Holland's job to decide what's best for the team in those situations. If giving too much weight to his coach's opinions is causing him to make bad decisions, it's still absolutely Holland's fault. And frankly if that's the case, that's even worse and Holland should probably go. He's there to run the team, not be a patsy for his coach.

For me I think my tolerance for Babcock's headscratching moves is I see other coaches doing very similar things, like it's a part of some trending coaching philosophy or something. Watching the Kings, Sutter has similar tendencies. Quenneville too. Blackhawks fans (and yesterday even the announcers) were questioning Quenneville's insistence on going with Runblad in spite of his poor play while Timonen stayed glued to the bench for most of the game. I can't pretend to understand it, but watching the Kings have seen he's not the only one who seems oddly stubborn about certain things. As for Holland, my view is about the same as it has been. Great development of talent, but some uncharacteristically bad signings over the last few seasons and repeated failure to bolster the defense in the post-Lidstrom era.

I thought they were supposed to talk today? I think Babcock is a great coach, but after all this drama it's gonna be a little annoying if he ends up staying. Though I guess it gives all of us and definitely the media something to blather on about in between playoff games.

I don't know about San Jose but Toronto, Buffalo, and St. Louis all asked permission to speak with Babcock. So how exactly is that nobody asking permission to speak with him? Toronto is a mess, but also the biggest franchise in Canada. And St. Louis is still currently employing a very good coach in Hitchcock, yet still asked. If Babcock weren't in demand this circus would likely be over already.

Earned Holland a 5-year contract extension by getting Kenny's mediocre rosters into the playoffs year after year?

It's a good question. The only plausible answers I can come with is he feels that his offer from the Wings is low, or he feels like after 10 years his time is up here in Detroit and it's time to change it up.

While I agree with your second point, your first point isn't true.

I don't disagree. I wasn't so much arguing that teams throwing money around was a sound strategy from a hockey perspective, but that it can still be from an ownership perspective. And they definitely have limited shelf life if the team still isn't winning, though that shelf life can still last several seasons. I think the Suter and Parise signing has handicapped the Wild, but it's also gotten then them into the playoffs three years in a row, twice into the second round. From an owner's perspective I'm guessing that's paying off financially. Basically I'm just saying "win when it matters" doesn't necessarily mean you have to win the Stanley Cup for it to be a financial success. As for Toronto, who the hell knows how that will go. I'm still surprised they fired Carlyle. I'm sure Babcock would be paid extremely well to go there, and I can kinda understand the dream of turning that franchise around, but you have to believe you'll have the support you need and will be put in a position to succeed. I don't think you can say that about the Leafs organization, unless Shanny has some master plan he's not revealed yet.

Franchises, especially ones who've been losing for a long time, also throw money around to demonstrate to their fan base that they are dedicated to winning and will do what it takes. And to also give that fan base hope and renew their interest, especially their interest in spending money on tickets and merchandise. To call it a hype driven debacle if Babcock doesn't win the Cup for some team isn't true. If a franchise like Toronto paid $5 million for Babcock and he even just gets them into the playoffs for a few years in a row, that deal more than pays for itself without sniffing the Cup.