wings4thecup06

I think it's really interesting, and also pretty damn scary, that we've been in the position of potentially losing AA and Mrazek this summer because this team couldn't find a way to make them work in the system for one reason or another. No matter what you think of either of these players all in all at the end of the day, on a team that's sorely lacking in young talent, these are two guys who have at times shown some of the best potential we've seen from our roster.
Why is Mrazek struggling so much when he's shown that he's clearly capable of elite-level play and has had two solid playoff outings under his belt, and why in the hell are we seriously in a position where we made him available to Vegas in the expansion draft?
Why is AA ready to go to Russia at this point in his career?
Again, on a team that's so sorely lacking in legitimate young talent, these two things should be unthinkable. You've really got to wonder what is going on with this team from the top down that this stuff is going on. Money always plays a part in it, but it seems reasonable to suggest that it's a given that there's gotta be more to it, and clearly Blashill doesn't seem to be a player favorite, and few people seem able to come up with much to defend him.
Only thing I'll say to defend Blash is that he is a young NHL coach, and he's been dealt a s*** hand. Has he made countless fumbles? Yes, absolutely. But he could come around down the line, I'm willing to be open minded about it. 
But not on this team. Already too much poison in the air. Holland has to move aside for someone with a clear and new direction, and Blash has got to go. Probably next summer.
But hey, like Frank said, maybe we can ride this dumpster fire to that big #1 pick! Funny.

While I'm not happy with management's decision to keep everyone and his dog, I think it would have been a stretch to fire Holland right now. Probably not the most popular sentence i'll ever write on here, but step outside the box for a second. This guy was in charge of what, nearly 20 years of consecutive playoff appearances, and then we miss one season. Really? Just looking at that, would you fire him? 
On closer inspection, then we have the long, blundering contracts we're now laboured with, and hiring a coach who I don't think gets the best out of his players. And yea, when you analyse the trends over the last 3 seasons, since we got beaten by chicago, then you have an argument. But at this stage, it's probably a knee jerk response to fire KH
I see also that we're all pining for Stevie Y to come back and be the GM, and I'd love that, but I think we're all sort of acting like that guy who's really into that girl who says she'll leave her boyfriend. Well guess what. She never does leave her boyfriend. Why wouldn't Tampa lock up Yzerman long term? He's been frankly excellent and even missing the playoffs this year, they're in great shape. 
I still think the right move would have been to fire Blashill, given the coaches out there on the market this summer, but also it seems to me that management is sort of in denial about doing this whole rebuild thing. Our D is atrocious, and badly has been needing a proper youth movement for 6 years now. Up front we're looking quite solid with larkin, AA, Mantha, Svech and one or two other pieces, and if Mrazek can bounce back then we're set at G. 
But really, they need to do this properly, and have 2 bad years and trade some assets for a top D man and hope that Cholowski turns into the next Chelios. 
Ofc I'm not expert, but I've watched the same as everyone else has this season with Blashill benching guys he should be playing, and sticking Sheahan and other turds in positions they really shouldn't be. Hopefully the only good thing about Blashill coming back is that he'll be on an incredibly short leash (one can only hope). But really, I'd rather they just be bad next season and miss the playoffs also so we can at least stockpile two good picks. I have a feeling however, KH will do his utmost to try and sign an ageing free agent or two this offseason just to make us semi relevant that we might try and squeeze back in only to be bounced in the first round.

Ok...3 of those 4 ages are wrong. Pietrangelo is 27, Tarasenko is 25, Schwarz is actually 24 and Berglund is 28 (you are 7 years off with this one) and other then Tarasenko none of those players are elite. So based based on the fact that they don't appear to be getting any better and if anything are regressing (as a team), and they have proven they can not get it done in the playoffs, they should re-build....right? You always contended that since the Wings got bounced first round, they should tank. Shouldnt that apply to the Blues as well?
For the record, I dont think they should, but my point is with your philosophy, any team that is not a favourite in the here and now, or are not a team that already suck but have a franchise player should automatically tank/re-build. It's easy to say after the fact when hindsight is 20/20 that a team should have re-built, but in the moment when your team is a contender, to just pull back and completely tear things down can be absolutely detrimental to a team and the fan base. The average fan is not going to put up with a team that is constantly hitting the reset button.
You always bring up how the Wings should have started a re-build in 2012, which I'm sorry but at the time was just wrong. I dont know of any team that has 2 elite players on their roster, and a solid group of complementary talent that would make that decision, not to mention there is no way the fans would have accepted it. Add to that the fact that in 2013 we were 1 goal away from making the final 4 and knocking out the eventual cup champions, and it completely makes sense why would Holland did not tear anything down. What he did was start a re-build on the fly and hoped that his kids would become high end players before his elite players regressed, in theory it made sense as it worked between 2002 and 2008. In hindsight, our big 4 regressed quicker then we expected due to injury, and our kids didn't amount to more then top 6 players. When that happened, the next logical move was to speed up the re-build, which Holland sort of did.
With that being said, I am not going to sit here and make it sound like Holland is perfect, he is far from it and definitely made mistakes, especially this past summer. I think that the Nielsen, Ott, and Miller signings were all bad decisions on his part. I think he should have ate Datsyuk's contract, though I get why he didn't considering the reaction from the fans, but never the less it was still a mistake as I think he should have brought up Mantha, Bertuzzi and whomever from the start and rolled with it. I still think that the young core of this team is very good, and with a few extra pieces I think they can make some noise. Hopefully we trade Vanek and Green before the deadline, and try to get rid of Howard and E in the summer. If we pull off those moves, get a good draft pick, trade for the d-man we so desperately need, and throw in a coaching change for a guy like Hitchcock, and I think we are in a lot better of a position then most think.

This team is as bad as it is in large part because of Blashill's incompetence.  Not giving AA a ton off PP time because of his defensive lapses, but giving Helm, Abdelkader, and Sheahan time there because "puck retrieval and defense" is borer line retarded.  The PP is supposed to possess the puck, not dump it in, and score, not be defensively responsible.  Sheahan and Glendening playing anywhere but the 4th line is equally moronic.  I get that they do some good things, but if a forward can't score, he's not very useful 5 on 5.  Hell, even the goons in the 80's and 90's would get a goal or two a year.  Glendening averaging 13:50 TOI a game, 1 goal in 50 games.  Sheahan ZERO goals playing 14:30 a night in 48 games.  Neither would be playing 10 minutes a night for a competent coach, and they'd likely be scratches or waived by a good team.  that's about 2/3 of the problem.  Blashill is the worst coach in the NHL.  He's a moron.  I half expect him to yell "CASH ME OUSSIDE HOW BOW DAH????" next time a reporter questions his player usage.
 
The other third is roster management.  Anyone still think Helm, Glendening, Abdelkader, and Nielsen were worth those contracts?  Helm and Abdelkader are nearing the age where players like them tend to start slowing down and are at the early part of their deals.  Helm's on a 33 point pace over a full season.  Abdelkader is on a 26 point pace.  Glendening is at best an average 4th line player, the kind of guy who gets by on working hard and is easily replaceable.  Nielsen hasn't been bad, but you give a guy like him a contract when you're a contender and need a second line center to put you over the top, not when you need to rebuild.  They needed to re-sign Dekeyser, and that's the type of deal guys like him get, but he's over his head playing on the top pairing and Holland did nothing to bring in someone to help.
 
The scary part is Holland is still talking like they have a chance at making the playoffs and actually doing something.  I have a bad feeling he's going to stand pat at the deadline because "you can't lose guys like Vanek and Green when you're trying to make the playoffs."

Might see more physicality than most game nights

I don't like to assign blame, but really, if I'm a young guy, I might be questioning whether or not I wanted to play for this coach. A few people on here have pointed out that this team looks de-motivated at times, and I agree, and I have to think that's got to have something to do with blashill right? If you want to play and win for your coach, you're going to play harder yea? 
So it goes with our young guys who actually have talent, like Mantha and AA, and to an extent Sproul, can you imagine how frustrated they must have been under his tenure? look at AA last year, late in the season he was making a huge impact, only to basically get 5 minutes a game and watch ECHL worthy Andersson get a call up and play in front of him?? 
Or even at times this season where Blashill has publicly called him out for his bad points, or limited his ice time after playing well. Look at Mantha, who I think we can all agree has been playing excellent in December and early January, then he has what, one bad game, and gets his ice time slashed from 20 to 15 minutes for the next 4 games? 
Ofc I'm not the coach, but I have to wonder also at this point what he's got against Sproul. The guy came in and played well I thought. 

Considering the Wings picked Drew off the waiver wire years ago, it was a pretty good pickup, IMHO.  No way Ken would have gotten anything for him in trade though.  Rival GM's seem to have played more hard ball with Kenny than other GM's I think, because they don't want to be the one that sets the Wings up for another huge playoff streak (or extend the current one).  
We can thank Drew for his service, but to throw Kenny under the bus for not getting return on him is, IMHO, quite misguided.  If he gets picked up, good for him, and best of luck against the other 28 teams he faces.  If not, he can help to develop the next generation of PK stalwarts in Grand Rapids.

I do too, but frankly, they've looked really good in say, 3 of the last 4 games or so and have beaten two of the top teams in the league. It's really tight in the East (6 points out of the last wild card spot and 4 points back of Toronto for 3rd in the division). Frankly, if this team isn't more than 10 points out I see KH sitting on his hands. 
While it wouldn't be the worst thing, they've clearly got an opportunity to get something good for Vanek right now, and they could actually attempt to sort out or D. It would really go a long way to getting this team off to a good start in LCA next year. 
All it takes is solid goaltending, another top quality D man, and a good C (or further development of AA and Larkin), and we could easily be in the mix next year. This team just needs some key young players to take another step forward (like we've seen from Mantha and to an extent AA) and things will be looking good. A good high pick in the draft and some help on D in exchange for Vanek would be something management would be extremely smart in doing, even if it costs them the beloved streak. 

The thing is now though, you watch, the Wings will go on a little bit of a run, not a massive one, but just enough to put them on the playoff bubble. 
Which means Holland won't sell, he'll probably stand pat, and we'll end up either missing the playoffs or just squeaking in and getting dumped in the first round again. Vanek walks for nothing and we miss a great opportunity to set us up well for next season with a high pick of our own and another first from another team.....
That's just the way I see it. I'm glad this team has put it together the last week or so and I obviously want to see the Wings win, but really, for the long term future of this franchise, it couldn't have come at a worse time imo. We're not close to competing this year, and extending the streak by squeaking in just reinforces the badly managed philosophy of the last few years. 

I do too, but frankly, they've looked really good in say, 3 of the last 4 games or so and have beaten two of the top teams in the league. It's really tight in the East (6 points out of the last wild card spot and 4 points back of Toronto for 3rd in the division). Frankly, if this team isn't more than 10 points out I see KH sitting on his hands. 
While it wouldn't be the worst thing, they've clearly got an opportunity to get something good for Vanek right now, and they could actually attempt to sort out or D. It would really go a long way to getting this team off to a good start in LCA next year. 
All it takes is solid goaltending, another top quality D man, and a good C (or further development of AA and Larkin), and we could easily be in the mix next year. This team just needs some key young players to take another step forward (like we've seen from Mantha and to an extent AA) and things will be looking good. A good high pick in the draft and some help on D in exchange for Vanek would be something management would be extremely smart in doing, even if it costs them the beloved streak. 

The thing is now though, you watch, the Wings will go on a little bit of a run, not a massive one, but just enough to put them on the playoff bubble. 
Which means Holland won't sell, he'll probably stand pat, and we'll end up either missing the playoffs or just squeaking in and getting dumped in the first round again. Vanek walks for nothing and we miss a great opportunity to set us up well for next season with a high pick of our own and another first from another team.....
That's just the way I see it. I'm glad this team has put it together the last week or so and I obviously want to see the Wings win, but really, for the long term future of this franchise, it couldn't have come at a worse time imo. We're not close to competing this year, and extending the streak by squeaking in just reinforces the badly managed philosophy of the last few years. 

I do too, but frankly, they've looked really good in say, 3 of the last 4 games or so and have beaten two of the top teams in the league. It's really tight in the East (6 points out of the last wild card spot and 4 points back of Toronto for 3rd in the division). Frankly, if this team isn't more than 10 points out I see KH sitting on his hands. 
While it wouldn't be the worst thing, they've clearly got an opportunity to get something good for Vanek right now, and they could actually attempt to sort out or D. It would really go a long way to getting this team off to a good start in LCA next year. 
All it takes is solid goaltending, another top quality D man, and a good C (or further development of AA and Larkin), and we could easily be in the mix next year. This team just needs some key young players to take another step forward (like we've seen from Mantha and to an extent AA) and things will be looking good. A good high pick in the draft and some help on D in exchange for Vanek would be something management would be extremely smart in doing, even if it costs them the beloved streak. 

Neither am I, and I actually wouldn't be too upset with it tbh. I think a bad finish will finally tell KH that he can't get by with mediocre band aids to try and sneak into the playoffs, and instead that it's time for a few changes. I do fear however that if KH does a Dombrowski and sells off a few pending FA's for prospects he'll get fired by the Illitch crew and thus he won't do anything even if we're out of a playoff spot in february...
Maybe chance for a new era, what with moving to LCA next year. 

Would you consider Hall a superstar? Definitely Karlsson and Lundqvist, and the Rangers have a better core than we do right now. 
 
But I agree. It's a coaching issue. And we've all seen Blashill's inability and lack of desire to play young players over veterans - see last year, Tatar and Nyquist's ice time cut, AA playing 4 mins in the playoffs, Sproul scratched for 7 or so games after being very effective.
I personally wonder if there's pressure over head from management to 'win or else' and thus the safest way to do that is to play veterans who at least are competent at this level. 
Granted I never saw the Wings in the deadwings era, but having watched this team for nearly 20 years now, I can't ever remember a time when we looked this bad.
Guys don't seem to have energy or desire There's literally no forecheck We seem to be stuck offensively and play a dump and chase style half the time and rarely come up with the puck  The PP usage is baffling but I wonder if Blashill putting Sproul and Green together is just his way of trying to break us out of a funk by putting our best offensive D men on the same unit?  Another PP observation is zone entries. They are just lost without Datsyuk bringing the puck in and setting up everytime.  Even then, the forecheck really does get me. As you're rightly saying, we are quick and have good speed, but no one seems to know how to utilise it. 
And with Howard playing like an all star, I would have assumed we'd be a bit better than this right now
For whatever reason, I get the impression that this team is trying to play a puck possession game, can't because they aren't skilled enough, so they dump and chase, yet don't have the tenacity or physicality to succeed there either.
 
 
 

I genuinely feel this won't happen though, even if it's obvious we're out of the playoff picture before the deadline. 
I never thought they'd fire Dombrowski (but they did) and when he traded away pending FA's Price, Cespedes etc for high end prospects which will definitely help them the next few years, I thought it was incredibly smart. But it ended with him losing his job. 
I get the feeling the same will happen with the Wings if KH did something similar. Trade Smith, Vanek, hell even Howard if he keeps playing this well. (Some here will argue KH should be long gone and it wouldn't be a bad thing). My point is that especially with the new building opening next year I don't think ownership will want to see the Wings as sellers or even missing the playoffs the year before it opens.....
If they do take that approach and don't sell and just sit and watch more players walk for free (and we lose Howard or Mrazek in the expansion draft - sod's law we'd lose Mrazek as they'd protect Howard) it'll hamper us some more I feel
 

Taking a step back to cool off and look at this situation for a second, none of these players we've lost through waivers here recently have gone on to be, or ever were projected to be all stars. Pulkkinen had something this team sorely lacked (right hand, booming shot), but never really was given the opportunity to excel at this level. Lets be thankful we're not doing a Boston and losing a guy who is in arguably one of the top 10 fowards in the league today....
I think what bothers me truly is the fact that its bad management and poor decisions which is resulting in us losing players like this. It's not the quality of players, it's more the way we're losing them. For me, (and I'd like to think this is why a lot of anger and frustration is coming toward KH at the moment) its the simple fact that all of these situations were/are avoidable. In trying to find reasoning behind it all, I think KH's hands are sort of tied by ownership here, and maybe we really need to question what's going on behind the scenes instead of just venting at KH for his inability to do things. 
Look at it this way. Ownership has probably said the biggest thing they care about is simply having a winning team and making the playoffs, regardless. If we look at the Tigers (who had a great season thanks to how Dombrowski traded all the pending free agents 2 years ago for excellent prospects who were a core part of the team's success this past season), DD was fired for his trade deadline day sale. You have to think that if KH doesn't keep signing 'veteran plugs' and frees up roster spots for guys like Pulkkinen, Mantha, AA, Sproul and Ouellet to actually play every night and establish their game at the NHL level, it could blow up in his face if the kids don't produce, the Wings miss the playoffs and KH loses his job.  
The same goes for a trade. Say we trade Nyquist and a couple prospects/picks for Trouba, and he struggles? We lose offense and get worse. Not a risk he's willing to take. 
And on the surface, it's incredibly short sighted. Sure, a guy like Vanek has a proven track record and looks like he plays better right now than say AA or Mantha. But in 2 years time? Given the ice time, we all know that both Mantha and AA would be better players, and the organisation would have 2 genuine, young top 9/6 forwards entering their primes HAVING 2 years + of NHL experience instead of being 24/25 and trying to figure out how to thrive in the NHL. 
And it really pisses me off when I hear all these quotes from Blashill and management saying the young guys have to knock someone off the roster or be better than everyone else just to get a job. And that's fine if you're actually going to give them the chance to learn and play at the NHL level. But there isn't actually the opportunity for any of these kids to actually earn it. (the exception was Larkin, but he is for our organisation a generational player) AA getting 6 minutes a night doesn't cut the mustard either. Look at the quotes from Fletcher after the Wild claimed Pulkkinen:
"He's played a top-six role at every level," said Wild general manager Chuck Fletcher. "It remains to be seen whether he can do it at the NHL level, but that's the opportunity we'd like to give him, and we'd certainly like to see if he can do it."
Pulkkinen has played 70 NHL games, and the Wild are giving him the chance to excel and prove what he can do. Where is this philosophy from the Wings? They'd rather have one of Minny's washed up cast offs (Vanek) in hope he can rediscover his magic from 10 years ago when he was lighting it up in Buffalo as a young 20 something player. And if he scores 20, then great. But this is a player who is trending downwards, and we can all objectively see is just holding up a roster spot for Mantha or AA to learn and grow their games at the NHL level. 
And fundamentally, that is the problem plaguing the Wings right now. KH is scared of giving young guys the opportunity because he knows they'll experience growing pains which = losing which = missing the playoffs which = KH losing his job. And in the short term, that means the team won't be as successful. But in the long term it would mean we'd potentially be better. 
But instead, he goes out and signs over the hill veterans (Ott, Vanek) whom he knows will at least play at a respectable level, just enough for us to make the playoffs = KH keeps his job. 
And as a result, it stunts the growth of the organisation because guys who are on the cusp of the NHL (Seriously, how many years have we been talking about Sproul and Ouellette?) don't get the chance to grow their game and we lose them to waivers.....
 
 

Taking a step back to cool off and look at this situation for a second, none of these players we've lost through waivers here recently have gone on to be, or ever were projected to be all stars. Pulkkinen had something this team sorely lacked (right hand, booming shot), but never really was given the opportunity to excel at this level. Lets be thankful we're not doing a Boston and losing a guy who is in arguably one of the top 10 fowards in the league today....
I think what bothers me truly is the fact that its bad management and poor decisions which is resulting in us losing players like this. It's not the quality of players, it's more the way we're losing them. For me, (and I'd like to think this is why a lot of anger and frustration is coming toward KH at the moment) its the simple fact that all of these situations were/are avoidable. In trying to find reasoning behind it all, I think KH's hands are sort of tied by ownership here, and maybe we really need to question what's going on behind the scenes instead of just venting at KH for his inability to do things. 
Look at it this way. Ownership has probably said the biggest thing they care about is simply having a winning team and making the playoffs, regardless. If we look at the Tigers (who had a great season thanks to how Dombrowski traded all the pending free agents 2 years ago for excellent prospects who were a core part of the team's success this past season), DD was fired for his trade deadline day sale. You have to think that if KH doesn't keep signing 'veteran plugs' and frees up roster spots for guys like Pulkkinen, Mantha, AA, Sproul and Ouellet to actually play every night and establish their game at the NHL level, it could blow up in his face if the kids don't produce, the Wings miss the playoffs and KH loses his job.  
The same goes for a trade. Say we trade Nyquist and a couple prospects/picks for Trouba, and he struggles? We lose offense and get worse. Not a risk he's willing to take. 
And on the surface, it's incredibly short sighted. Sure, a guy like Vanek has a proven track record and looks like he plays better right now than say AA or Mantha. But in 2 years time? Given the ice time, we all know that both Mantha and AA would be better players, and the organisation would have 2 genuine, young top 9/6 forwards entering their primes HAVING 2 years + of NHL experience instead of being 24/25 and trying to figure out how to thrive in the NHL. 
And it really pisses me off when I hear all these quotes from Blashill and management saying the young guys have to knock someone off the roster or be better than everyone else just to get a job. And that's fine if you're actually going to give them the chance to learn and play at the NHL level. But there isn't actually the opportunity for any of these kids to actually earn it. (the exception was Larkin, but he is for our organisation a generational player) AA getting 6 minutes a night doesn't cut the mustard either. Look at the quotes from Fletcher after the Wild claimed Pulkkinen:
"He's played a top-six role at every level," said Wild general manager Chuck Fletcher. "It remains to be seen whether he can do it at the NHL level, but that's the opportunity we'd like to give him, and we'd certainly like to see if he can do it."
Pulkkinen has played 70 NHL games, and the Wild are giving him the chance to excel and prove what he can do. Where is this philosophy from the Wings? They'd rather have one of Minny's washed up cast offs (Vanek) in hope he can rediscover his magic from 10 years ago when he was lighting it up in Buffalo as a young 20 something player. And if he scores 20, then great. But this is a player who is trending downwards, and we can all objectively see is just holding up a roster spot for Mantha or AA to learn and grow their games at the NHL level. 
And fundamentally, that is the problem plaguing the Wings right now. KH is scared of giving young guys the opportunity because he knows they'll experience growing pains which = losing which = missing the playoffs which = KH losing his job. And in the short term, that means the team won't be as successful. But in the long term it would mean we'd potentially be better. 
But instead, he goes out and signs over the hill veterans (Ott, Vanek) whom he knows will at least play at a respectable level, just enough for us to make the playoffs = KH keeps his job. 
And as a result, it stunts the growth of the organisation because guys who are on the cusp of the NHL (Seriously, how many years have we been talking about Sproul and Ouellette?) don't get the chance to grow their game and we lose them to waivers.....
 
 

How many years now have we been saying that for? And how far has it got us?
Seriously this team needs a trade of a core player to light a fire under everyone else's asses to show them they're accountable, and to give AA and Mantha a spot to let them know their jobs are on the line if they don't produce

Agree with you on nielsen, and an important signing. Also thought the term was too long, but this is the nature of the beast these days its seems.
Side note, I love how everyone is preparing for another lockout with all the contracts signed at the moment being mostly made up of bonuses which are salary protected....
Also agree about Helm. While he has been inconsistent, his speed is an element that is key these days, and while the money was a bit too much, I'm glad he;s still here.
I have a problem with the Vanek signing for 2 reasons:
1. It represents an ongoing philosophy from KH whereby it seems he keeps signing 'veterans' on cheap deals that were once pretty good but are now obviously falling off the table in the hopes they regain their old magic. The problem here is that they actually don't regain this kind of magic, and instead of being a key player like KH hopes they will be, the end up clogging up a roster spot and prohibiting the team moving forward.
2. It's also another example of how KH really doesn't seem to want to give guys like Mantha and AA a real chance at getting good quality minutes at the NHL level, let alone make the roster. My own personal opinion is that it's holding this team back. We need to develop these new core players and give them the responsibility, yet eliminating roster spots by signing veterans who are basically past their prime is misguided in my opinion, and tantamount to another first round exit. (i'll eat my hat is Vanek scores 20-30 goals and am perfectly fine with that)
Ott I don't mind, because he brigns needed grit and energy and someone who actually will stick up for teammates besides Smith and Abby. Yes, it still eats another roster spot though, but ah well...

I'm not sure if it will be Nyquist or Tatar or worst case Athanasiou or Mantha traded, but I definitely see some sort of trade in the near future to bring in a top 4 (hopefully top 2) defenseman. There's no way we should go into the season with 16 forwards (18 if you're including Athanasiou and Mantha) without shedding a player or two. Sure, Holland could send Athanasiou and Mantha down to play another season in Grand Rapids, and he could waive Frk and Callahan, assuming they'd clear, and he could once again pencil Jurco and Pulkkinen in as the 13th / 14th forwards, but that would be terrible asset management. A trade needs to happen to alleviate the log jam. If Holland signed all these players just so he could play them over the kids, I will be very disappointed. I would much rather have seen Pulkkinen / Jurco / Frk given an opportunity over Vanek, and I would much rather Callahan / Bertuzzi given the opportunity over Miller / Ott... We'll have to see how it all plays out over the next few months...

I agree, and I wasn't exactly thrilled with the Vanek signing either. I think it's a good value signing, but unnecessary, unless there is actually a trade in the works... I don't really look at it as him taking a spot from Athanasiou / Mantha, but rather Pulkkinen / Jurco / Frk. The former are top 6 forwards while the latter, like Vanek, are / should be slotted in 3rd line right wing. I'd like to see a trade before training camp to alleviate some of the log jam up front. If we can trade Nyquist / Tatar along with Pulkkinen in a package for a top pair defenseman, while freeing up a spot in the top 6 for Athanasiou / Mantha as well as a spot in the bottom 6 for Vanek / Frk, it all works out...
I actually like the Ott signing more than I do the Miller signing, but neither were needed. I can see Miller playing every game he's healthy though, and Ott used sparingly...

Agree with you on nielsen, and an important signing. Also thought the term was too long, but this is the nature of the beast these days its seems.
Side note, I love how everyone is preparing for another lockout with all the contracts signed at the moment being mostly made up of bonuses which are salary protected....
Also agree about Helm. While he has been inconsistent, his speed is an element that is key these days, and while the money was a bit too much, I'm glad he;s still here.
I have a problem with the Vanek signing for 2 reasons:
1. It represents an ongoing philosophy from KH whereby it seems he keeps signing 'veterans' on cheap deals that were once pretty good but are now obviously falling off the table in the hopes they regain their old magic. The problem here is that they actually don't regain this kind of magic, and instead of being a key player like KH hopes they will be, the end up clogging up a roster spot and prohibiting the team moving forward.
2. It's also another example of how KH really doesn't seem to want to give guys like Mantha and AA a real chance at getting good quality minutes at the NHL level, let alone make the roster. My own personal opinion is that it's holding this team back. We need to develop these new core players and give them the responsibility, yet eliminating roster spots by signing veterans who are basically past their prime is misguided in my opinion, and tantamount to another first round exit. (i'll eat my hat is Vanek scores 20-30 goals and am perfectly fine with that)
Ott I don't mind, because he brigns needed grit and energy and someone who actually will stick up for teammates besides Smith and Abby. Yes, it still eats another roster spot though, but ah well...

I hate that Holland comment with all of my heart and soul. It's stupid on so many levels. It encapsulates everything that's wrong with the state of the Wings.
Just for starters (I'm only going to launch one complaint here, but please know that I could write an entire essay about this quote), "Why does anyone think he is going to be the answer in Detroit?" is a straw man argument, one Holland has trotted out before when attempting -- and failing -- to convincingly rationalize a decision to hold a younger player back, i.e. keep him in the minors when it's obvious to anyone and everyone not named Ken Holland that the player in question should be playing in the National Hockey League.
People don't want Anthony Mantha in the lineup because they feel he's The Answer. They don't feel he's The Answer. What people feel is that Anthony Mantha brings certain elements to the lineup that are sorely lacking and sorely needed, e.g. size, high-level vision/thinking, scoring prowess, playmaking ability.
It's like a Wings fan saying, "Thomas Vanek is 32, slow-footed, poor defensively, and he doesn't drive possession. He was at the center of a gambling scandal. He was bought out by the Wild (i.e. they are literally paying him to not play for them). Why does anyone think he is going to be the answer in Detroit?"
Holland didn't sign Thomas Vanek because he feels he's The Answer. Holland doesn't think he's The Answer. What Holland feels is that Thomas Vanek brings certain elements to the lineup that are sorely lacking and sorely needed, e.g. size...high-level vision/thinking...scoring prowess...playmaking ability....

After sleeping on it, I like the Nielsen move (albeit too much term really) and Ott on paper gives us some sandpaper this team sorely lacks.
While Vanek might turn good, he's trending massively downwards, and is essentially just likely to take up a roster spot.
If this team is ever going to move forward, they need to give AA and Mantha a starting role with lots of minutes.
But, we can see, that KH refuses to move the youth of this team forward it would seem and having them compete for jobs at camp is just another misnomer that equals 'you'll start in GR'.
I guess I'm just frustrated. Both the Vanek and Ott signings would be good if this team was actually close to competing for the cup - like Stuart and Dallas Drake in 08. But they're not. And the reality is, while they might play well, they're both taking up roster spots for younger guys who need to learn how to carry the torch and actually take us forward. Otheriwse we won't see another Cup for a good decade.
These are just my thoughts. But why is KH so unwilling to pull the trigger on a trade, and risk giving up say, Tatar or Nyquist for a good defenseman? Yes they'll cost a lot, but we have too many soft Tatar's and Nyquists, and with numerous guys (Sproul, Oullette, Frk?, Jensen) now no longer waiver exempt, what have we got to lose?

Stamkos was kind of a pipe dream anyway, and to know that he re-signed makes it a hell of a lot easier to swallow than choosing some other team on the market than the Wings.
Really though, this team needs a trade. And not someone minor, like Jurco. Someone with bigger responsibility to show that they aren't happy with this team, and that everyone isn't as safe and secure as they thought and that they have to actually take responsibility for playing better.
I am very scared that KH will overpay Okposo, Lucic or Nielson and for at least 5 years and we'll have another Steven Weiss on our hands and the Datsyuk money he freed up will be worthless.
Much much rather see them promote AA, Mantha, Ouellet and Sproul full time and give Mrazek 60 starts and just go with it. If we miss the playoffs we miss. I'd much rather see the organisation actually take a stance in believing in our young guys going forward and actually giving them the minutes and responsibility to reach their potential, rather than every year tagging on some old aged players way past their golden years who eat up minutes just to make us another easy target for a first round exit, frustrating everyone more in the process.
Give us a direction Ken, right now we're stuck in no mans land.