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lots of teams, looking for lots of things


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#1 theman19

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 09:21 PM

With the shocker of feds to the jackets (and i was so loving kicking the crap out of them too.) i believe this is going to be the start of one of the craziest trade seasons in recent memory. Alot of teams need a few things and a few teams need a lot of things (st. louis i'm talking to you) irrgardless there's some intresting players out there who might become avaliable if someone meets another teams need

Boston needs a D man, they have two rookies playing for quite a few min. and are starting to slip. They could ride it out and hope leetch and zhamnof (i hate russian names) come back quickly or they could look to ship sergei samsonov who is an ufa next season

Tampa needs goaltending in the worst possible way right now as john graham has been less then spectacular. I doubt they'll let go of anyone good (fedotenko might be trade bait if he doesn't shape up) but given some other teams desire to rebuild they might get someone decent for a draft pick,...which leads us to our next team

Washington needs a whole heck of alot, one thing they don't seem to need anymore are olaf kolzig and brendan witt. Witt asked for a trade and will probably get it but not till the deadline. The leafs have expressed the most intrest in him but who there trying to trade for him (allison and antropov) arn't anything washington needs. Kolzig on the other hand has been rumored to be going to tampa for quite sometime now.

New jersey has stopped the bleeding so far with a few games under the win side but it's obvious this team is going to be in rebuilding mode soon. If they continue to struggle look for them to shake up there line up and maybe dump some excess salary.

NYR is doing remarkably well but tom poti is still sucking majorly for his club, i doubt anyone will take him and his 2.5 million dollar salary but you never know.

Buffalo wants to get ride of biron, but not until miller returns

st. louis needs to dump salary now,....unfortuanly under the blessed new cba they may not be able too. Even still i'm sure someone stupid will bite on one of there extremly over-priced players

no ones going to trade for ninnama he's not good enough for 2.5

anybody got anything else?

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#2 Rice

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 10:00 PM

Theres a lot of teams that need things every year. An early season blockbuster such as the Fedorov trade doesnt mean it will be a trade-crazy year.
In a 2005 study published by the journal Nature, researchers at Durham University in England concluded that, across a range of sports, we found that wearing red is consistently associated with a higher probability of winning. The researchers also suggested that red's effect may subconsciously intimidate opponents in athletic contests, especially when the athletes are equal in skill and strength.

#3 theman19

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 10:02 PM

QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 15, 2005 - 11:00PM)
Theres a lot of teams that need things every year. An early season blockbuster such as the Fedorov trade doesnt mean it will be a trade-crazy year.

how about a new system where if you suck you just can't add more talent to replace holes. i think the cba will put alot of teams in the hunt for a trade. I never said it was going to be a trade happy year, only that it was going to be crazy. meaning not alot of trade but some key players going in different directions.

Edited by theman19, 15 November 2005 - 10:03 PM.

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#4 Rice

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 10:28 PM

QUOTE (theman19 @ November 15, 2005 - 11:02PM)
how about a new system where if you suck you just can't add more talent to replace holes.

Is that not what Colombus just did? What are you talking about?

Why exactly does a cap prevent bad teams, e.g. Columbus, from adding talent to replace holes?

Edited by ARice89, 15 November 2005 - 10:31 PM.

In a 2005 study published by the journal Nature, researchers at Durham University in England concluded that, across a range of sports, we found that wearing red is consistently associated with a higher probability of winning. The researchers also suggested that red's effect may subconsciously intimidate opponents in athletic contests, especially when the athletes are equal in skill and strength.

#5 theman19

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 12:01 PM

QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 15, 2005 - 11:28PM)
Is that not what Colombus just did? What are you talking about?

Why exactly does a cap prevent bad teams, e.g. Columbus, from adding talent to replace holes?

it doesn't. It prevents teams like us from going out and picking up a 4 million dollar d-man to cover our lines. It also keeps a team like tampa from covering there goalie holes by trading for a high priced goalie. Notice i didn't say we sucked, but tampa's goaltending sure is. Under the old system they'd just throw money on it and pick someone up. Use your head! It has nothing to do with bad teams with low payroles, and yes that's exactly what columbus did. However teams like columbus historically would have never had that chance to pick up a player like feds under the nhl pre-cba because the ducks would have found no reason to let go of his large salary. (brian burke issues aside) What makes this trade season different is the fact that the succesful teams (like my beloved wings unfortunatly) can't just go out and trade for a ridiculous player who's on a bad team. High priced players on struggling teams will not last, and only the teams who have cap room are goign to be able to participate in the big trades unless someone gets cut loose who's in the very least a big dollar player. Therefore i go back to my above statement there are going to be more blockbuster trades (not in numbers persay but in quality) this year.

Edited by theman19, 16 November 2005 - 12:02 PM.

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#6 Rice

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 05:53 PM

QUOTE (theman19 @ November 16, 2005 - 01:01PM)
Notice i didn't say we sucked, but tampa's goaltending sure is. Under the old system they'd just throw money on it and pick someone up.

They couldnt in previous years either; unless you know something I dont and theres always high priced free agent goalies at this time of year.
In a 2005 study published by the journal Nature, researchers at Durham University in England concluded that, across a range of sports, we found that wearing red is consistently associated with a higher probability of winning. The researchers also suggested that red's effect may subconsciously intimidate opponents in athletic contests, especially when the athletes are equal in skill and strength.

#7 theman19

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 06:11 PM

QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 16, 2005 - 06:53PM)
They couldnt in previous years either; unless you know something I dont and theres always high priced free agent goalies at this time of year.

again,..missing the point, and yes there is high priced goalies at the deadline sometimes,..can we say dominic hasek? I knew ya could. (traded from buffalo to detroit for kozlov) The point i was trying to make was teams can't just throw money on problems anymore they actually have to be smart with trades. Players that where signed for a ridiculous amount of money and have maxed out ineffective teams caps will be traded. One more thing on the goalie problem if you don't think st.louis will try to pick up a goalie on a trade, and washington isn't trying to get ride of a goalie (kolzig) you have no idea what's going on.

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#8 Rice

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 06:22 PM

QUOTE
again,..missing the point, and yes there is high priced goalies at the deadline sometimes,..can we say dominic hasek?


You might be thinking of Dominic Hasek but I know for a fact the Wings traded for Dominik Hasek during the summer of 2001, and as far as I know thats considered the offseason and not the "deadline".

QUOTE
The point i was trying to make was teams can't just throw money on problems anymore they actually have to be smart with trades.


So, what you're saying is a team with plenty of cap space, e.g. Chicago, didnt throw money at Khabibulin? Sure it didnt work out as planned, but it could have.

So, you're saying next year when the Wings have all this free cap-space they wont be able to throw money at UFA's anymore?

The point is teams will always be able to throw money at players to get them to sign; just not in the large scale of the past. Small-market teams of course will be able to compete for free agents better than in the past because the more successful teams will likely have less cap space, hence hindering their ability to throw out large amounts of money. Nevertheless, teams can still throw money at a weak spot to address it. I dont understand where youre getting the idea that a team must trade to address a weakness.

QUOTE
One more thing on the goalie problem if you don't think st.louis will try to pick up a goalie on a trade, and washington isn't trying to get ride of a goalie (kolzig) you have no idea what's going on.


Since when were we talking about St. Louis and Washington's goalie situations?
In a 2005 study published by the journal Nature, researchers at Durham University in England concluded that, across a range of sports, we found that wearing red is consistently associated with a higher probability of winning. The researchers also suggested that red's effect may subconsciously intimidate opponents in athletic contests, especially when the athletes are equal in skill and strength.

#9 theman19

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 06:40 PM

QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 16, 2005 - 07:22PM)

You might be thinking of Dominic Hasek but I know for a fact the Wings traded for Dominik Hasek during the summer of 2001, and as far as I know thats considered the offseason and not the "deadline".



So, what you're saying is a team with plenty of cap space, e.g. Chicago, didnt throw money at Khabibulin? Sure it didnt work out as planned, but it could have.

So, you're saying next year when the Wings have all this free cap-space they wont be able to throw money at UFA's anymore?

The point is teams will always be able to throw money at players to get them to sign; just not in the large scale of the past. Small-market teams of course will be able to compete for free agents better than in the past because the more successful teams will likely have less cap space, hence hindering their ability to throw out large amounts of money. Nevertheless, teams can still throw money at a weak spot to address it. I dont understand where youre getting the idea that a team must trade to address a weakness.



Since when were we talking about St. Louis and Washington's goalie situations?

all this free cap space? who are we losing exactly? yzerman and chelly don't make very much 3 million between the two of them if that. To keep williams where going to have to pay him more than the 500,000 or so where paying him now. Lids will come back cheaper or not at all but that doesn't mean where going have 12 or 13 million dollars under the cap to spend,....do your research. Who cares if we didn't trade at the deadline for hasek,...again,..not the freaking point. Your point was goalies can't be aquired by teams in blockbuster trades (you said the deadline but that's not what was implied)

Who's talking about st. louis and washington? I AM in the first post i made on about this. Don't blame me for totally jacking this thread out of context and ingnoring everything i posted in my first thought. jezzz i'll just delete the bloody thread since no one wants to talk about possible trade senerios and you only want to talk about how much knowledge you have on a trade system that HAS NEVER BEEN USED BEFORE.

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#10 Rice

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 07:15 PM

QUOTE
all this free cap space? who are we losing exactly?


Let's see.

Lidstrom -7.6 million
Shanahan -2.12 million
Yzerman -1.25 million
Chelios -850 thousand
Samuelsson -537.5 thousand
Mowers -450 thousand
Lilja -650 thousand
Rivers -450 thousand
Legace -1.162 million
Osgood -900 thousand

Without the players above, (according to LGW) Detroit's cap number is approximately 17 million. That leaves us with 23 million dollars, just a minor difference from 12 wouldnt you say? Maybe you should do your research. Lidstrom is not a guarantee to come back cheaper, if at all.

QUOTE
Who cares if we didn't trade at the deadline for hasek,...again,..not the freaking point. Your point was goalies can't be aquired by teams in blockbuster trades (you said the deadline but that's not what was implied)


No no, I said that goalies couldnt be acquired by "throwing money at them" as you said; meaning that they couldnt be signed as free agents during the trade deadline because of the obvious reason that none of them are free agents at the deadline.



But okay, lets talk about trade scenarios.
In a 2005 study published by the journal Nature, researchers at Durham University in England concluded that, across a range of sports, we found that wearing red is consistently associated with a higher probability of winning. The researchers also suggested that red's effect may subconsciously intimidate opponents in athletic contests, especially when the athletes are equal in skill and strength.

#11 theman19

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 07:28 PM

QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 16, 2005 - 08:15PM)

Let's see.

Lidstrom -7.6 million
Shanahan -2.12 million
Yzerman -1.25 million
Chelios -850 thousand
Samuelsson -537.5 thousand
Mowers -450 thousand
Lilja -650 thousand
Rivers -450 thousand
Legace -1.162 million
Osgood -900 thousand

Without the players above, (according to LGW) Detroit's cap number is approximately 17 million. That leaves us with 23 million dollars, just a minor difference from 12 wouldnt you say? Maybe you should do your research. Lidstrom is not a guarantee to come back cheaper, if at all.



No no, I said that goalies couldnt be acquired by "throwing money at them" as you said; meaning that they couldnt be signed as free agents during the trade deadline because of the obvious reason that none of them are free agents at the deadline.



But okay, lets talk about trade scenarios.

thank you, but tell me this first, if legacy wins the cup you really think he's going to come back for 1.1?

now then on to trade? do you think we can add anything to our roster before the deadline.

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#12 Heaton

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 07:32 PM

QUOTE (theman19 @ November 16, 2005 - 07:28PM)
thank you, but tell me this first, if legacy wins the cup you really think he's going to come back for 1.1?

now then on to trade? do you think we can add anything to our roster before the deadline.

It might be another Mike Vernon scenario if the Wings feel that Jimmy Howard is ready. If Legace demands a raise after winning the cup, he wouldn't get more than 2.5 regardless.

Edited by Heaton, 16 November 2005 - 07:34 PM.

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#13 Rice

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 08:14 PM

I think that if our goaltending begins to crumble towards the end of the season/beginning of the playoffs, Holland will make a move. Turco?

Witt might be possible as well.
In a 2005 study published by the journal Nature, researchers at Durham University in England concluded that, across a range of sports, we found that wearing red is consistently associated with a higher probability of winning. The researchers also suggested that red's effect may subconsciously intimidate opponents in athletic contests, especially when the athletes are equal in skill and strength.

#14 eva unit zero

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 02:24 AM

QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 16, 2005 - 09:14PM)
I think that if our goaltending begins to crumble towards the end of the season/beginning of the playoffs, Holland will make a move. Turco?

Witt might be possible as well.

Why would Detroit make a trade for a goalie who has had very limited playoff success when they already have one who has a solid playoff history including a Cup win and another who is playoff untested but certainly capable?
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#15 theman19

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 02:17 PM

QUOTE (eva unit zero @ November 17, 2005 - 03:24AM)
QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 16, 2005 - 09:14PM)
I think that if our goaltending begins to crumble towards the end of the season/beginning of the playoffs, Holland will make a move. Turco?

Witt might be possible as well.

Why would Detroit make a trade for a goalie who has had very limited playoff success when they already have one who has a solid playoff history including a Cup win and another who is playoff untested but certainly capable?

thank you for gracing us with your presence eva ( i mean that, i'm not being sarcastic) Good call on the goaltending situation i think if anything we're going after some d and possibly a hard checking right wing.

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#16 Rice

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 03:52 PM

QUOTE (eva unit zero @ November 17, 2005 - 03:24AM)
Why would Detroit make a trade for a goalie who has had very limited playoff success when they already have one who has a solid playoff history including a Cup win and another who is playoff untested but certainly capable?

Well, for one, I'm not just pulling this out of my ass. Holland has said that if they dont feel confident with their goaltending towards the end of the season they could make a move.

And, if things stay the way they are now (Osgood backing up Legace), I would rather have Osgood backing up Turco. Wouldnt you?
In a 2005 study published by the journal Nature, researchers at Durham University in England concluded that, across a range of sports, we found that wearing red is consistently associated with a higher probability of winning. The researchers also suggested that red's effect may subconsciously intimidate opponents in athletic contests, especially when the athletes are equal in skill and strength.

#17 theman19

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 06:03 PM

QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 17, 2005 - 04:52PM)
Well, for one, I'm not just pulling this out of my ass. Holland has said that if they dont feel confident with their goaltending towards the end of the season they could make a move.

And, if things stay the way they are now (Osgood backing up Legace), I would rather have Osgood backing up Turco. Wouldnt you?

isn't turco's salary way above what we can afford?

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#18 Rice

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 06:11 PM

QUOTE (theman19 @ November 17, 2005 - 07:03PM)
QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 17, 2005 - 04:52PM)
Well, for one, I'm not just pulling this out of my ass. Holland has said that if they dont feel confident with their goaltending towards the end of the season they could make a move.

And, if things stay the way they are now (Osgood backing up Legace), I would rather have Osgood backing up Turco. Wouldnt you?

isn't turco's salary way above what we can afford?

3.1 million. Depends on how much Holland would be willing to part with.


In a 2005 study published by the journal Nature, researchers at Durham University in England concluded that, across a range of sports, we found that wearing red is consistently associated with a higher probability of winning. The researchers also suggested that red's effect may subconsciously intimidate opponents in athletic contests, especially when the athletes are equal in skill and strength.

#19 theman19

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 11:51 PM

we need toughness and D right freaking now

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#20 BringDMacBack

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Posted 18 November 2005 - 01:55 PM

QUOTE (ARice89 @ November 17, 2005 - 04:52PM)
Well, for one, I'm not just pulling this out of my ass. Holland has said that if they dont feel confident with their goaltending towards the end of the season they could make a move.

And, if things stay the way they are now (Osgood backing up Legace), I would rather have Osgood backing up Turco. Wouldnt you?

In a word NO. I don't think there has ever been a debate that Manny is the BEST back up goalie in the NHL. And as witnessed by most last night when Osgood got confused and tossed that puck in our net. I'm not sure I'd let him back my car up.





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