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imisssergei

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A few of my friends and I were talking about the Wings goaltending situation next year. We all tossed around ideas off each other. Everything from signing Kipper or J.S. as UFA's, to keeping Dom. I am of the strict line of thinking that Dom needs to go. He is no better than Osgood, so why bother to keep him around when he is one injury away from being the biggest distract since.....he was last time he was with Detroit? I don't see why we would.

That being said, I suggested this. In all likelyhood, Colorado will buyout Jose Theodore. Why not sign him? He will be looking for an opportunity to play, amd remember he once was the NHL Hart, and Veznia Trophy winner. I would think with the general lack of intrest, due to his poor preformance in Colorado, few teams would be seriously looking at him. However, if you get a motivated Theodore, who will get to face Colorado a few times every year to prove it was a mistake to let him go, and he can return to even 75% of the goalie he once was, we would have a steal. Given there are a lot of 'ifs' here, but there would be just as many 'ifs' in resigning Dom. At least there is some potential that Theodore could be great.

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A few of my friends and I were talking about the Wings goaltending situation next year. We all tossed around ideas off each other. Everything from signing Kipper or J.S. as UFA's, to keeping Dom. I am of the strict line of thinking that Dom needs to go. He is no better than Osgood, so why bother to keep him around when he is one injury away from being the biggest distract since.....he was last time he was with Detroit? I don't see why we would.

That being said, I suggested this. In all likelyhood, Colorado will buyout Jose Theodore. Why not sign him? He will be looking for an opportunity to play, amd remember he once was the NHL Hart, and Veznia Trophy winner. I would think with the general lack of intrest, due to his poor preformance in Colorado, few teams would be seriously looking at him. However, if you get a motivated Theodore, who will get to face Colorado a few times every year to prove it was a mistake to let him go, and he can return to even 75% of the goalie he once was, we would have a steal. Given there are a lot of 'ifs' here, but there would be just as many 'ifs' in resigning Dom. At least there is some potential that Theodore could be great.

You know i was thinking the exact same thing this morning. If we got him for league min. i don't see why this isn't a bad idea.

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A few of my friends and I were talking about the Wings goaltending situation next year. We all tossed around ideas off each other. Everything from signing Kipper or J.S. as UFA's, to keeping Dom. I am of the strict line of thinking that Dom needs to go. He is no better than Osgood, so why bother to keep him around when he is one injury away from being the biggest distract since.....he was last time he was with Detroit? I don't see why we would.

That being said, I suggested this. In all likelyhood, Colorado will buyout Jose Theodore. Why not sign him? He will be looking for an opportunity to play, amd remember he once was the NHL Hart, and Veznia Trophy winner. I would think with the general lack of intrest, due to his poor preformance in Colorado, few teams would be seriously looking at him. However, if you get a motivated Theodore, who will get to face Colorado a few times every year to prove it was a mistake to let him go, and he can return to even 75% of the goalie he once was, we would have a steal. Given there are a lot of 'ifs' here, but there would be just as many 'ifs' in resigning Dom. At least there is some potential that Theodore could be great.

anyone for having one true goalie thread? instead of seeing 5 of these pop up every day?

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Dom needs to go? He's no better than Osgood? Dude, seriously! What are you smoking? :huh:

He isn't. Look at the numbers. Dom has a SP of .913, Ozzie of .904, and for a guy who gets to play about half the games he deserves, for Ozzie to put up those numbers isn't easy.

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Here are the stats for the three goalies.

Goalie_________GP_W_L_OT_GAA_Sv%_SO

DOMINIK HASEK_ 53 36 11 5 _2.09 0.910 _7

JOSE THEODORE 32 12 15 1 _3.27 0.890 _0

CHRIS OSGOOD_ 18 _9 _3 5 _2.52 0.904 _0

This suggests two points to me.

1. Theodore's stats don't belong anywhere near Hasek's or Osgood's. Theodore lost the starter's job in Colorado to Budaj this season. You might as well argue for Jim Carey to be signed.

2. Hasek's stats are is better than Osgood's, and Hasek has been more durable this season. His health remains a concern, but less so than before this season.

Edited by sibiriak

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Here are the stats for the three goalies.

Goalie_________GP_W_L_OT_GAA_Sv%_SO

DOMINIK HASEK_ 53 36 11 5 _2.09 0.910 _7

JOSE THEODORE 32 12 15 1 _3.27 0.890 _0

CHRIS OSGOOD_ 18 _9 _3 5 _2.52 0.904 _0

This suggests two points to me.

1. Theodore's stats don't belong anywhere near Hasek's or Osgood's. Theodore lost the starter's job in Colorado to Budaj this season. You might as well argue for Jim Carey to be signed.

2. Hasek's stats are is better than Osgood's, and Hasek has been more durable this season. His health remains a concern, but less so than before this season.

IF you really want to look at stats, you can't consider GAA, that is a BS stat. It reflects more on the team than the goaltender. Case and point, Luongo, his GAA is 2.26. You can't tell me the Wings wouldn't be coating into the playoffs first in the West, and polishing up another Presidents Trophy with him in net.

The only fair stat to judge a goalie with is his Save Percentage. Dom is .910, Ozzie .904, and Theodore .890. But if you look at what Theodore is capable of, signing him to a league minimum contract, or maybe a little more wouldn't be a bad move. If nothing else he could be a hold over until Howard and/or Liv are ready. I'm not saying lets go out and give the guy $3mill per. But why not look at him?

And what do you mean Dom has been more durable this season? Than what or who? Dom is not even a true nuber one anymore. Seriously, how could he be described as a 'number 1' when for the better part of the season didn't play road or back to back games?

Edited by imisssergei

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You already created one Dom rant topic, why create another? Strange logic you people have.

Edit: Sorry, but when I seen you wanted to bring Jose "Open Door" Theodore in instead of having Hasek, that just set me off. Do you really think he is any better than Hasek? He's not. He lost his starting job to a rookie. He's a flash in the pan.

Really, if you ask most hockey analysts, they will say Theodore should not have won the Hart Trophy that year anyways. Iginlas 96 points was probably more impressive. And now that we're 5 years down the line, Iginla is still a dominant player in the league. Theodore? Hardly.

Edited by Kp-Wings

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A few of my friends and I were talking about the Wings goaltending situation next year. We all tossed around ideas off each other. Everything from signing Kipper or J.S. as UFA's, to keeping Dom. I am of the strict line of thinking that Dom needs to go. He is no better than Osgood, so why bother to keep him around when he is one injury away from being the biggest distract since.....he was last time he was with Detroit? I don't see why we would.

That being said, I suggested this. In all likelyhood, Colorado will buyout Jose Theodore. Why not sign him? He will be looking for an opportunity to play, amd remember he once was the NHL Hart, and Veznia Trophy winner. I would think with the general lack of intrest, due to his poor preformance in Colorado, few teams would be seriously looking at him. However, if you get a motivated Theodore, who will get to face Colorado a few times every year to prove it was a mistake to let him go, and he can return to even 75% of the goalie he once was, we would have a steal. Given there are a lot of 'ifs' here, but there would be just as many 'ifs' in resigning Dom. At least there is some potential that Theodore could be great.

He is no better than Osgood? Are you serious? Please explain to us how you came up with that. As far as Theodore, there is a reason that Colorado will buy him out. He is not good. He had one good year and that's it. So why on earth would we want him?

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2nd in GAA and 5th in wins, but sarcasm noted :P

for the moment. It depends on when you look at the stats and who's played a game since Dom has. Big deal. He's still one of the top goalies in the NHL and should be appreciated for what he's doing for the team.

the person starting this thread is either woefully misinformed or trying to start a goalie war. Or both. :hehe:

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You already created one Dom rant topic, why create another? Strange logic you people have.

Edit: Sorry, but when I seen you wanted to bring Jose "Open Door" Theodore in instead of having Hasek, that just set me off. Do you really think he is any better than Hasek? He's not. He lost his starting job to a rookie. He's a flash in the pan.

Really, if you ask most hockey analysts, they will say Theodore should not have won the Hart Trophy that year anyways. Iginlas 96 points was probably more impressive. And now that we're 5 years down the line, Iginla is still a dominant player in the league. Theodore? Hardly.

Hah, that turned into a Dom rant by no accord of mine. Sorry if that bothers you...

My argument is this, Hasek is old, and getting worse. He won't be as good next season as he was this. Yes Theodore lost his job to a rookie, but a stellar one at that, don't forget. I do not disagree, I always have a hard time with a goalie winning the MVP, as the goalie depends so heavily on what's in front of him.

However, Theodore COULD be good. He would make a solid backup, and if he could regain that MVP form, we would have one hell of a starter on our hands, you can't argue that. But, I know, there are a lot of ifs....

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IF you really want to look at stats, you can't consider GAA, that is a BS stat. It reflects more on the team than the goaltender. Case and point, Luongo, his GAA is 2.26. You can't tell me the Wings wouldn't be coating into the playoffs first in the West, and polishing up another Presidents Trophy with him in net.

The only fair stat to judge a goalie with is his Save Percentage. Dom is .910, Ozzie .904, and Theodore .890. But if you look at what Theodore is capable of, signing him to a league minimum contract, or maybe a little more wouldn't be a bad move. If nothing else he could be a hold over until Howard and/or Liv are ready. I'm not saying lets go out and give the guy $3mill per. But why not look at him?

And what do you mean Dom has been more durable this season? Than what or who? Dom is not even a true nuber one anymore. Seriously, how could he be described as a 'number 1' when for the better part of the season didn't play road or back to back games?

Both GAA and Sv% stats depend on the team in front of the goalie, as well as on the goalie himself.

A team that is playing very defensive hockey would reduce the GAA and increase the Sv% by forcing the opponents to shoot from the perimeter.

A puck-posessing team would reduce the GAA but decrease the Sv%, because more of the opponent chances would come on a fast counter attack.

A team that is bad defensively will reduce the GAA, and will have an uncertain effect on the GAA.

So both GAA and Sv% stats have their respective shortcomings.

But when one goalie has the Sv% that is .020 higher than another, that is always significant. 0.910 is solid NHL starter stat. 0.890 is the third string backup stat. Again, there is at least one better goalie than Theodore ON COLORADO'S ROSTER.

Theodore is ranked 38th in GAA and 39th in Sv%. Any way you slice it, Theodore sucks. You think he has great potential, but he is 30 years old and heonly had 2 seasons with "good" stats in his career. That is Sv% over 0.910 and over 30 GP. Jim Carey also had 2 good seasons. Lets bring him back. :P

Hasek spent less time than Osgood on IR this season. That is what Imean by being more durable. He satrted in 53 games this season. That is 18th in the league (there are 30 teams in NHL BTW). So what do you mean by "Dom is not even a true number one anymore"?

EDIT for typos and crlarity.

Edited by sibiriak

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Both GAA and Sv% stats depend on the team in front of the goalie, as wellas on the goalie himself.

A team that is playing very defensive hockeywould reduce the GAA and increasethe Sv% by forcing the opponents to shoot from the perimeter.

A puc-posessing team would reduce the GAA but decrease the Sv%, because more of the opponent chances would come on a fast counter attack.

A team that is bad defensively will reduce the GAA, and will have an uncertain effect on the GAA.

So both GAA and Sv% stats have their respective shortcomings.

But when one goalie has the GAA that is .200 higher than another, that is always significant. 0.910 is solid NHL starter stat. 0.890 is the third string backup stat. Again, there is at least one better goalie than Theodore ON COLORADO'S ROSTER.

Theodore is ranked 38th in GAA and 39th in Sv%. Any way you slice it, Theodore sucks. You think he has great potential, but he is 30 years old and heonly had 2 seasons with "good" stats in his career. That is Sv% over 0.910 and over 30 GP. Jim Carey also had 2 good seasons. Lets bring him back. :P

Your argument is intersting, and holds some truth. However, regardless of style, the Sv% will always be the true indication of a great goalie. I won't even argue that Theodore deserves a shot, but you'd have to concied this point. If Bujdai was on Detroits roster, Dom wouldn't be starting.

By your logic, .200 GAA higher makes such a huge difference, but your argument doesn't hold up. Dom has a .910, Theodore a .890, that is a .040 difference. How does that even make sense? Theodore hasn't played much this season, and when he has played, he has needed sunscreen for his neck. But can you seriously argue that Dom is a better option next year?

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Your argument is intersting, and holds some truth. However, regardless of style, the Sv% will always be the true indication of a great goalie. I won't even argue that Theodore deserves a shot, but you'd have to concied this point. If Bujdai was on Detroits roster, Dom wouldn't be starting.

By your logic, .200 GAA higher makes such a huge difference, but your argument doesn't hold up. Dom has a .910, Theodore a .890, that is a .040 difference. How does that even make sense? Theodore hasn't played much this season, and when he has played, he has needed sunscreen for his neck. But can you seriously argue that Dom is a better option next year?

By " .200 GAA " I actually meant 0.020 Sv%. Sorry, that was confusing.

EDIT - Budaj has played a total of 86 NHL games in his life. It is too early to judge how good he will be. So to answer your question, I'd much rather have Dom next year than Bugaj. A year after next, probably Budaj, but only if he keeps improving.

If the Wings go after a big name goalie next year, then they will not be able to sign either Datsyuk or Bertuzzi, or perhaps both.

That big name goalie better be worth it. :)

Edited by sibiriak

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I'd like to see Howard backing up either Osgood or Hasek next year. One of them should go so he can get some NHL experience and we can start easing him into the starting slot in a few years. Both Hasek and Osgood will play for cheap and want to stay in Detroit, which makes life easy for us. Giguere will command big money on the FA market, I'd rather have either Hasek/Osgood for >1mil than him for 5-6mil.

Ideally I guess I'd like to see an approximate 60-20 Osgood-Howard split next season, maybe give Liv a few games to see if he can steal the backup spot.

Edited by StaticWithABeat

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I'd like to see Howard backing up either Osgood or Hasek next year. One of them should go so he can get some NHL experience and we can start easing him into the starting slot in a few years. Both Hasek and Osgood will play for cheap and want to stay in Detroit, which makes life easy for us. Giguere will command big money on the FA market, I'd rather have either Hasek/Osgood for >1mil than him for 5-6mil.

Ideally I guess I'd like to see an approximate 60-20 Osgood-Howard split next season, maybe give Liv a few games to see if he can steal the backup spot.

Just about any senario that does not include Dom coming back is ok with me. I think with our prospects in goal, and on defence, we should be spending our money on guys who can score. I like the idea of having Osgood as a mentor for Howard and Liv.

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The UFA goalies worth thinking about are only these three: Giguere, Backstrom from MN, or Biron. The last two are not really proven starters yet.

And Joseph and Belfour are the UFAs next season as well. So Holland has a fallback. :P

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Here's a look at goalies who have been good or decent starters at least once in their career:

J.S. Giguere

Jamie McLennan

Patrick Lalime

Jussi Markkanen

Sean Burke

Niklas Backstrom

David Aebischer

Mike Dunham

Stephane Valiquette

Kevin Weekes

Robert Esche

Curtis Joseph

Jocelyn Thibault

Curtis Sanford

Johan Holmqvist

Jean-Sebastien Aubin

Wade Flaherty

Mika Noronen

Ed Belfour

Here are the choices. Go ahead and pick one.

Edited by Kp-Wings

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Here's a look at goalies who have been good or decent starters at least once in their career:

J.S. Giguere

Jamie McLennan

Patrick Lalime

Jussi Markkanen

Sean Burke

Niklas Backstrom

David Aebischer

Mike Dunham

Stephane Valiquette

Kevin Weekes

Robert Esche

Curtis Joseph

Jocelyn Thibault

Curtis Sanford

Johan Holmqvist

Jean-Sebastien Aubin

Wade Flaherty

Mika Noronen

Ed Belfour

Here are the choices. Go ahead and pick one.

Not much there , Gigeure or CuJo maybe ?

I'd keep Hasek though

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