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redwinger4747

Lidstrom's Norris chances?

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I was wondering what people think are Lidstrom's chances of capturing a 5th Norris trophy as of now? I know he has been the front runner all season, but Niedermayer seems to be creeping up. He is a few points ahead of Lidstrom (along with Gonchar who doesn't matter) but thankfully was pointless tonight. I think Lids is deserving especially being +36, but unfortunately doesn't lead the league in that category anymore. I'd like to think Lids is a 2:1 favorite still but you never know. What have the experts been saying lately and what do you guys feel about it?

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I think Lidstrom has got it for the 5th time.

In my opinion Lidstrom is more respected throughout the NHL and I think has a better fan base.

So in that case he will take it, with Neidermayer as the runner up.

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I would say he's got it, but if he didn't and anybody other than Niedermayer won it I would be incredibly upset. Having said that I don't think you need to worry, Lidstrom is going to win.

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Wow everyone is very confident, I'm a little worried, I really want him to win it again.

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I really hope he grabs a bunch of points in these final games and maybe lift that +/- a little to ease my tension.

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Lidstrom has been the best all season and should win.

Niedermayer won't win it by the simple fact he hasn't been the best defenseman on his team. Pronger won't win because he missed a ton of time with injury and when healthy was making a case for the Norris but certainly wasn't as consistently as good as Nick has been all year.

Lidstrom should win, with Pronger and Nieds well behind him and close to each other as the remaining finalists.

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I hope all you guys are right. :thumbup: Go Lids and now Go WINGS in the playoffs!!! Red Wave baby! :siren::siren::siren:

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I think Pronger and Niedermayer hurt each other's Norris chances by being on the same team...Lidstrom will win it without a doubt, it's just a question of by how much.

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He's still the best overall defenseman in the league - though maybe not the most dominant as witnessed by Pronger last year in the playoffs. Having said that, his salary still pisses me off. I sure hope he does an Yzerman as he gets on in years.

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As much as I'd love for him to win it, I'm nervous that he won't.

But, I'd prefer to see a Stanley Cup instead of another Norris. :champs:

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I don't know why Pheneuf doesn't get more love. He is a huge physical force w/ skills as well. He pretty much carries the Flamers on the blue line except for the randomness of Hamerlik

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He's still the best overall defenseman in the league - though maybe not the most dominant as witnessed by Pronger last year in the playoffs. Having said that, his salary still pisses me off. I sure hope he does an Yzerman as he gets on in years.

Lidstrom is tied with two others as the third highest paid player in the NHL. If you polled all the GMs and Coaches who the top five players were, Lidstrom would likely come up on most, if not all, ballots.

Jagr is the only other player that makes in Nick's range who even has a CHANCE at claiming that, and with guys like Iginla, Ovechkin, Thornton, Crosby, Hossa and others outperforming him as forwards, he wouldn't. Richards, Sundin, and Yashin don't even come close.

Lidstrom won his fourth Norris last year, and agreed to the SAME SALARY HE WAS MAKING. By comparison, Chara just signed a deal worth 7.5m. Chara was a Norris finalist once in his career. Other guys haven't even done what Chara has and have sick deals.

So, to recap:

Chara=1 Norris finalist, 1 First-team=7.5m.

Lidstrom=4 Norris wins, 7 Norris finalists, 7 First teams, 1 Conn Smythe.=7.6m

Jovanovski=Nothing accomplished=7m

McCabe=Nothing accomplished=7.15m

And then you have:

Pronger=1 Norris win, 1 Hart win, 3 Norris finalists, 1 First team=6.25m

Niedermayer=1 Norris win, 2 Norris finalists, 2 First teams=6.75m

Consider that Lidstrom has accomplished more than Niedermayer and Pronger COMBINED. Even should Pronger and Nirdermayer finish as First teamers this year and one of them win the Norris, Lidstrom still has more Norris trophies than Prongermayer (would be 4-3), has been a Norris finalist more often (would be 8-7), and more first team selections (would be 7-5). Pronger's Hart is offset by Lidstrom's Smythe.

Lidstrom at 7.6m is a bargain. Iginla and Lecavalier are the only other players making 7m+ who play like they deserve it, and neither is as deserving of his paycheck as Lids is of his. Martin Brodeur is probably the highest paid player who is a better value for the dollar than Nick...and that's because Brodeur is VASTLY underpaid and will likely take home the Hart this summer.

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Lidstrom is tied with two others as the third highest paid player in the NHL. If you polled all the GMs and Coaches who the top five players were, Lidstrom would likely come up on most, if not all, ballots.

Jagr is the only other player that makes in Nick's range who even has a CHANCE at claiming that, and with guys like Iginla, Ovechkin, Thornton, Crosby, Hossa and others outperforming him as forwards, he wouldn't. Richards, Sundin, and Yashin don't even come close.

Lidstrom won his fourth Norris last year, and agreed to the SAME SALARY HE WAS MAKING. By comparison, Chara just signed a deal worth 7.5m. Chara was a Norris finalist once in his career. Other guys haven't even done what Chara has and have sick deals.

So, to recap:

Chara=1 Norris finalist, 1 First-team=7.5m.

Lidstrom=4 Norris wins, 7 Norris finalists, 7 First teams, 1 Conn Smythe.=7.6m

Jovanovski=Nothing accomplished=7m

McCabe=Nothing accomplished=7.15m

And then you have:

Pronger=1 Norris win, 1 Hart win, 3 Norris finalists, 1 First team=6.25m

Niedermayer=1 Norris win, 2 Norris finalists, 2 First teams=6.75m

Consider that Lidstrom has accomplished more than Niedermayer and Pronger COMBINED. Even should Pronger and Nirdermayer finish as First teamers this year and one of them win the Norris, Lidstrom still has more Norris trophies than Prongermayer (would be 4-3), has been a Norris finalist more often (would be 8-7), and more first team selections (would be 7-5). Pronger's Hart is offset by Lidstrom's Smythe.

Lidstrom at 7.6m is a bargain. Iginla and Lecavalier are the only other players making 7m+ who play like they deserve it, and neither is as deserving of his paycheck as Lids is of his. Martin Brodeur is probably the highest paid player who is a better value for the dollar than Nick...and that's because Brodeur is VASTLY underpaid and will likely take home the Hart this summer.

GREAT analysis, I agree wholeheartedly with everything you said. Great job of laying everything out. :clap:

An interesting fact, Lidstrom is the only currently playing defenseman that has a Smythe under his belt. Pronger is also interestingly the only defenseman playing right now to have a Hart.

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Lidstrom is tied with two others as the third highest paid player in the NHL. If you polled all the GMs and Coaches who the top five players were, Lidstrom would likely come up on most, if not all, ballots.

Jagr is the only other player that makes in Nick's range who even has a CHANCE at claiming that, and with guys like Iginla, Ovechkin, Thornton, Crosby, Hossa and others outperforming him as forwards, he wouldn't. Richards, Sundin, and Yashin don't even come close.

Lidstrom won his fourth Norris last year, and agreed to the SAME SALARY HE WAS MAKING. By comparison, Chara just signed a deal worth 7.5m. Chara was a Norris finalist once in his career. Other guys haven't even done what Chara has and have sick deals.

So, to recap:

Chara=1 Norris finalist, 1 First-team=7.5m.

Lidstrom=4 Norris wins, 7 Norris finalists, 7 First teams, 1 Conn Smythe.=7.6m

Jovanovski=Nothing accomplished=7m

McCabe=Nothing accomplished=7.15m

And then you have:

Pronger=1 Norris win, 1 Hart win, 3 Norris finalists, 1 First team=6.25m

Niedermayer=1 Norris win, 2 Norris finalists, 2 First teams=6.75m

Consider that Lidstrom has accomplished more than Niedermayer and Pronger COMBINED. Even should Pronger and Nirdermayer finish as First teamers this year and one of them win the Norris, Lidstrom still has more Norris trophies than Prongermayer (would be 4-3), has been a Norris finalist more often (would be 8-7), and more first team selections (would be 7-5). Pronger's Hart is offset by Lidstrom's Smythe.

Lidstrom at 7.6m is a bargain. Iginla and Lecavalier are the only other players making 7m+ who play like they deserve it, and neither is as deserving of his paycheck as Lids is of his. Martin Brodeur is probably the highest paid player who is a better value for the dollar than Nick...and that's because Brodeur is VASTLY underpaid and will likely take home the Hart this summer.

Your detailed argument is excellent, though I don't think overpaying others is a good yardstick and I don't think any defenseman at 7.6 is a bargain if you are a GM and must be responsible for fielding a competitive team. Frankly, I think GM's are still adjusting to the cap idea and that is why you are seeing inflated salaries. Also, there are plenty of GMs out there willing to overpay for perceived marque players and surround them with youngsters and and a wish and a prayer mostly for attendance reasons.

Look, if you consider cost vs. value then this conversation is moot. No one is going to argue, say, Yashin vs. Zets with regards to this. If you want to field a great team then how can you argue Lids vs. someone like Visshnesky or Pheneuf (sp) ? You can't. I've heard the same argument applied to Datsyuk and no one seems to blink, though I think Dats will prove this year to be in the elite post playoffs.

There are few if any players worth 7 mil in the salary cap era. Nick, I would agree is close.

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The real issue is that I like this team as they are now constructed. I would love to see the same basic team come back next year minus Lang, Lilja, and possibly Sammuelson. But I see no way that they will be able to sign Calder, Bert, Dats, etc. w/ the 7.6 mil salary. Maybe that's OK and you sacrifice some of these guys, but I would hate to let any of the 3 I mentioned walk regardless of the playoff outcome.

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Hes got it , Niedermayer at second , and my buddy Andreas will be thrid in voting :D

You stole mine... lilja. :P

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As Nick keeps collecting the awards, there has been much more focus on his play, and as everyone keeps focusing, they keep discovering how incredible of a player Lidstrom really is. He has his next Norris and the respect he deserves as one the best players out there, and one of the greatest D to ever play the game (some people may rank him as one of the greatest to ever play)

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