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Sleight

Serious Talks Of Expansion...And The Wings Moving East

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Meh, personally I don't care that badly anymore.

Yes, I'd rather the Wings be in the Eastern Conference so I can always get to bed earlier and not stay up late for West Coast games, but there are worse tragedies in life. I can still live with them bing in the West.

If they expand to Kansas City and Las Vegas to get more fans interested in the game, more power to the NHL and I'd be happy for those cities/fans.

If not, oh well. 30 teams is more than enought.

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I wouldn't mind expansion to 32 teams. 32 is a good size. The TV ratings are so low because, c'mon. Anaheim-Ottawa? A fairly obscure Canadian team and a California team. As I recall, ratings for the Angels-Giants World Series a few years back were lousy too, because people across the country tend to rebel against watching California teams not named the Lakers. Actually, them too.

I'd like to see an NHL team in Houston. It's got underrated potential for success. Hockey doesn't have to be a niche sport in the USA, that's defeatist talk and it's ridiculous. The NHL was a boom sport in the early '90s. I have no idea what specific thing we can point to that changed that, but if the NHL acts like a minor league, it'll get treated like one. No thanks. Diminish the NHL, you diminish the Wings, and no Wings fan ought to think like that.

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Expanding right now would be idiotic. What they need to do and they wont because of the owners, is relocate teams. If your going to put a team anywhere put it in wisconson. Badger hockey is nuts and put a NHL team there you got yourself a sucessful hockey market.

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And Also, Kemper Arena (Kansas City's arena since the 60's) is on a bad side of town, on a road that isn't built for it, in a place that's hard to reach. Definitely needed something new!

Precisely the reason that NO ONE wanted to be there - not just hockey teams/fans but performers wouldn't come to Kemper Arena.. they'd either make a hole in their summer/spring schedules to hit up Verizon Wireless Ampitheater or pretty much not come at all. Kemper was leaky, always reeked thanks to the American Royal next door (horse s*** ftl :()

The Sprint Center is a gorgeous new arena, and I'm of the belief that alot has changed in the NHL demographic since the Scouts were in KC. There wasn't nearly as much western interest as there is now (especially with teams within driving distance that have large fanbases - see: Dallas, Colorado). Not to mention the Scouts organization failed when it moved to Colorado too :P and hence the reason we now have the New Jersey Devils.

The poor IHL/UHL teams - we had poor attendance in the winter due to the blind fandom of the Chiefs games (ew..) and the fact Kemper was hell in a handbasket to try and drive down to.. add in the chance for bad weather and no one in their right mind would drive down to the west bottoms to check out a hockey game - especially if something Chiefs related was going on somewhere else in town. IHL then folded, and the UHL team.. well there was some poor management on that end (hooray for promising money that wasn't available!). Not a total lack of support, but it certainly didn't help that we weren't exactly selling out games left and right.

People always sell out the preseason games we get September-ish though... it couldn't be worse than some of the other markets they have now.

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Precisely the reason that NO ONE wanted to be there - not just hockey teams/fans but performers wouldn't come to Kemper Arena.. they'd either make a hole in their summer/spring schedules to hit up Verizon Wireless Ampitheater or pretty much not come at all. Kemper was leaky, always reeked thanks to the American Royal next door (horse s*** ftl :()

The Sprint Center is a gorgeous new arena, and I'm of the belief that alot has changed in the NHL demographic since the Scouts were in KC. There wasn't nearly as much western interest as there is now (especially with teams within driving distance that have large fanbases - see: Dallas, Colorado). Not to mention the Scouts organization failed when it moved to Colorado too :P and hence the reason we now have the New Jersey Devils.

The poor IHL/UHL teams - we had poor attendance in the winter due to the blind fandom of the Chiefs games (ew..) and the fact Kemper was hell in a handbasket to try and drive down to.. add in the chance for bad weather and no one in their right mind would drive down to the west bottoms to check out a hockey game - especially if something Chiefs related was going on somewhere else in town. IHL then folded, and the UHL team.. well there was some poor management on that end (hooray for promising money that wasn't available!). Not a total lack of support, but it certainly didn't help that we weren't exactly selling out games left and right.

People always sell out the preseason games we get September-ish though... it couldn't be worse than some of the other markets they have now.

Good point.

Kansas City wouldn't be a horrible market for a team like some suggest. I mean, if Miami, Florida (well, technically Sunrise, which is a suburb or Miami) can have an NHL team, than Kansas City should be able to support one too.

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I wouldn't mind expansion to 32 teams. 32 is a good size. The TV ratings are so low because, c'mon. Anaheim-Ottawa? A fairly obscure Canadian team and a California team.

so how does expanding to even more remote markets help this?

The NHL was a boom sport in the early '90s. I have no idea what specific thing we can point to that changed that,/quote]

then how can you be so sure it'll come back if you don't knowwhat caused it to diminish?

even at it's "boom" it wasn't that great in popularitiy ,

arena football, poker, cake decorating and re-runs of Law and Order on NBC get better ratings... niche sport???

no doubt about it

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Dynamo I pretty much echo all of your sentiments on league expansion...I can't imagine how anyone could think the NHL is doing itself any favors by adding more teams at this point.

Wasn't expansion a major cause of the league's recent problems to begin with? '90s overexpansion = talent dilution = teams implement the trap/defensive systems to compete = less scoring = less fan interest = league implements all kinds of s***ty ideas trying to force scoring back into the game = we now have a bastardized figure-skating league to watch...and now it's time to start expanding some more? aaaggghhHH#!)$@!H!)!!!!

I get depressed and irritable when I dwell on how incredibly incompetent the NHL's leaders and owners are, so instead I try to think about what my perfect NHL would be like. Sometimes when I'm bored in my 3 1/2 hour long summer classes I compile lists of all the changes I would make. 24 teams...4 divisions...no instigator penalty...balanced schedule...divisional playoff format...weighted draft lottery for all teams........ahh yes the anger is fading already... :satisfied:

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Even though I don't like this talk of expansion, from a selfish standpoint, I would love to get a team back here in Hartford...There's been much talk recently about building a new arena for this alleged expansion team...Even though the Mall had it's moments, if Hartford is ever going to be taken seriously, they've got to get a state of the art arena built...The word is that the Hartford Wolfpack would move down to Danbury and the new NHL team goes into Hartford..As I said though, it's strictly selfish on my part...I don't really think Hartford can handle the NHL....Too many Bruins fans in the north half of the state, and too many Rangers/Islanders/Devils fans in the southern half....Some here in Ct. state, "but we loved the Whalers"..and they did, but I equate that with when someone says "ALL my friends think i'm funny" Problem is, he only has two friends....Just not enough support in my opinion..

You may think I'm crazy but i think the NHL would be wise to put Hartford back in the mix. For one, people from ESPN would go to games like they did before and the NHL would get it's credibility that with the mainstream media. Remember, when they moved to Carolina is when the NHL started not being taken seriously for the most part (or roughly around that time).

Instead of trying to fix hockey in non-traditional markets, how about trying to fix hockey in TRADITIONAL markets....like Chicago or Boston. These were once proud franchises that have been killed off by their clueless owners. How about Bettman putting pressure on these guys to start spending some money or selling the teams?

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Even though I don't like this talk of expansion, from a selfish standpoint, I would love to get a team back here in Hartford...There's been much talk recently about building a new arena for this alleged expansion team...Even though the Mall had it's moments, if Hartford is ever going to be taken seriously, they've got to get a state of the art arena built...The word is that the Hartford Wolfpack would move down to Danbury and the new NHL team goes into Hartford..As I said though, it's strictly selfish on my part...I don't really think Hartford can handle the NHL....Too many Bruins fans in the north half of the state, and too many Rangers/Islanders/Devils fans in the southern half....Some here in Ct. state, "but we loved the Whalers"..and they did, but I equate that with when someone says "ALL my friends think i'm funny" Problem is, he only has two friends....Just not enough support in my opinion..

The mall... and Brass Bonanza. If the bring a team back they have to bring the Brass.

The song was even my cell's ringer for a long time... :ph34r:

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if expanding to 32 teams gets the Wings in the Eastern Conference, I'm all for it...and getting Jerry Bruckheimer involved with the league can only be a good thing...almost everything he touches turns to gold (Pirates, CSI, etc.)...he is a HUGE fan and people like him need to be involved in the league.

Prediction: If Jerry Bruckheimer does indeed get a team in Vegas or somewhere else, Pat Brisson (Crosby's agent) will be running the team...they are friends and I remember seeing a story on Sportsnet about Brisson...he wants to be a GM some day.

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Good point.

Kansas City wouldn't be a horrible market for a team like some suggest. I mean, if Miami, Florida (well, technically Sunrise, which is a suburb or Miami) can have an NHL team, than Kansas City should be able to support one too.

Putting a team back in KC would make sense for Bettman. A team couldn't make it in Atlanta so lets put a team back there. A team couldn't make it in KC so lets try that too. Unless they are expanding to the Northeast or back in Canada there are no other markets that should have hockey. Unless possibly the Northwest with either Portland or Seattle but to me thats even pushing it. I would love to see the Wings in the East but it's not going to happen ever sadly. And the league does not need any more teams.

And I don't know about only going down to 20 teams but 24-26 teams would be ok. some teams getting axed and some relocating.

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Putting a team back in KC would make sense for Bettman. A team couldn't make it in Atlanta so lets put a team back there. A team couldn't make it in KC so lets try that too.

And people sit here begging for teams to return to Winnipeg, Hartford, Quebec?

Those cities failed just as miserably as Atlanta or KC did, and much more recently.

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Seniority doesn't matter. Columbus is more east, so they would go. I would much prefer the Wings seeing the Rangers, Bruins, Leafs, and Habs than just the Hawks. But that would leave the Hawks alone in the West.

The question is, what new team would be placed in our division to replace them. All divisions have 5 teams. If Columbus leaves, that leaves the central with 4, and if Nashville is moved that leaves 3. So would KC be placed in our division and the new Canadian team since the proposed Hamilton team will not be able to be in the same division as the Maple Leafs (if they get past the rule where a team can't play that close to the Leafs).

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And people sit here begging for teams to return to Winnipeg, Hartford, Quebec?

Those cities failed just as miserably as Atlanta or KC did, and much more recently.

But there is a difference at least with Winnipeg and Quebec. Those two teams could draw a crowd and the Jets had some success on the ice and Quebec was atop the Eest before losing in round one in 95. Both those teams had financial problems was the big reasons. Atlanta and KC and no success on any level. The couldn't draw fans in, especially KC, and I don't think the Scouts ever made the playoffs and the Flames could never made it out of roound one. And I think the big argument is that at least Quebec, Hartford and Winnipeg are hockey markets. The Jets and Nordiques left fans behind at least. The Flames left behind nothing and the Scouts left behind KC and Denver along the way before landing in Jersey. With the cap maybe some of those cities could afford it now. I would rather see the NHL try it back in any of those 3 markets before trying KC again or going to Las Vegas.

Edited by StevieY9802

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i think right now the league is trying to hard to try to rebuild it's self. where they should start should be on the television show, they need to get off of OLN and back with ESPN before they do anything. i kind of see moving a team out in las vegas a risky situation. imagine the risk that you are taking with players potentially throwning games because they are gambling on them. things like that are something that the game of hockey doesnt need right now especially since they want to rebuild a fan base. i also think that moving teams around might be too much because the pred and blue jackets havent been around that long and need to be playing better in order to get more fans out. maybe if there was no *cough salary cap cough* then it would be easier to make a better team. the NHL is trying too hard to build the name back up if they dont be careful they might lose a big fan base because i for one do not want to see a team like the wings move any where and i am sure a lot of other people agree with me.

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i think right now the league is trying to hard to try to rebuild it's self. where they should start should be on the television show, they need to get off of OLN and back with ESPN before they do anything. i kind of see moving a team out in las vegas a risky situation. imagine the risk that you are taking with players potentially throwning games because they are gambling on them. things like that are something that the game of hockey doesnt need right now especially since they want to rebuild a fan base. i also think that moving teams around might be too much because the pred and blue jackets havent been around that long and need to be playing better in order to get more fans out. maybe if there was no *cough salary cap cough* then it would be easier to make a better team. the NHL is trying too hard to build the name back up if they dont be careful they might lose a big fan base because i for one do not want to see a team like the wings move any where and i am sure a lot of other people agree with me.

I agree with everything but the no salary cap part. More free agents would go to bigger markets keeping them away from the small markets. Would you rather big money in Detroit or big money in Columbus? Paul Kariya doesn't end up in Nashville without a Salary Cap. It made it so he couldn't go to the big markets because they had the same amount of money to spend as the smaller teams. By your arugment that without a cap would make it easier how come the Blue Jackets were competitive before the cap?

As for getting off of Verus yes I agree. They need something that will promote the game better and get it out to more people which ESPN would. But at the same time ESPN needs to give more love to them then they did before. NHL2Night like once a week at midnight isn't enough. But having something like that and sports center is better than what versus has.

And about Vegas I agree too. I thought that was a big reason why pro sports weren't there already. I know they have minor league stuff for sports but thats not the same.

And why would the Wings be moving anywhere? The best team in the west and still one of the most popular teams would be moving?

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I agree with everything but the no salary cap part. More free agents would go to bigger markets keeping them away from the small markets. Would you rather big money in Detroit or big money in Columbus? Paul Kariya doesn't end up in Nashville without a Salary Cap. It made it so he couldn't go to the big markets because they had the same amount of money to spend as the smaller teams. By your arugment that without a cap would make it easier how come the Blue Jackets were competitive before the cap?

As for getting off of Verus yes I agree. They need something that will promote the game better and get it out to more people which ESPN would. But at the same time ESPN needs to give more love to them then they did before. NHL2Night like once a week at midnight isn't enough. But having something like that and sports center is better than what versus has.

And about Vegas I agree too. I thought that was a big reason why pro sports weren't there already. I know they have minor league stuff for sports but thats not the same.

And why would the Wings be moving anywhere? The best team in the west and still one of the most popular teams would be moving?

move to the Eastern Conference, not move cities

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move to the Eastern Conference, not move cities

If thats the case he's wrong that alot of people would agree with him about not wanting to see them move. The feeling I get from people in here and elsewhere is that they would like to see the Wings in the East. I for one am sick of all the travel.

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i think right now the league is trying to hard to try to rebuild it's self. where they should start should be on the television show, they need to get off of OLN and back with ESPN before they do anything. i kind of see moving a team out in las vegas a risky situation. imagine the risk that you are taking with players potentially throwning games because they are gambling on them. things like that are something that the game of hockey doesnt need right now especially since they want to rebuild a fan base. i also think that moving teams around might be too much because the pred and blue jackets havent been around that long and need to be playing better in order to get more fans out. maybe if there was no *cough salary cap cough* then it would be easier to make a better team. the NHL is trying too hard to build the name back up if they dont be careful they might lose a big fan base because i for one do not want to see a team like the wings move any where and i am sure a lot of other people agree with me.

This is the one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. These guys are MULTI-MILLIONAIRES! They make more money just showing up to the arena everyday than they ever could from participating in some kind of point shaving scheme. Not many people are that stupid or that much of a degenerate gambler that they would risk their freedom, their careers and their future MILLIONS OF DOLLARS doing something so ILLEGAL!!!

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