puckbags 863 Report post Posted August 7, 2007 So Cammalleri scores 34 goals and gets 80 pts last year and an arbitrator only awards him 6.7 for two years, 3.6 and 3.1 for the next two years. Penner who is basically the same age had 29 goals and 45 pts gets 4+ million a year. Isn't it the arbirtrator's job to give a guy fair market price? If that is the case the guy who did Cammalleri's case must've been drunk or something!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Opie 308 Report post Posted August 7, 2007 I think the difference is that it is pretty well assumed that Lowe paid Penner for potential where as Arbitration is all about what you are doing now. An arbitrator in order to stay arbitrary in the hearings can not use (rather should not use) past years or future years to decipher value, it has to be this year. That is the only way it could be fair and arbitrary to both sides. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hank 0 Report post Posted August 7, 2007 I think the difference is that it is pretty well assumed that Lowe paid Penner for potential where as Arbitration is all about what you are doing now. An arbitrator in order to stay arbitrary in the hearings can not use (rather should not use) past years or future years to decipher value, it has to be this year. That is the only way it could be fair and arbitrary to both sides. I think another part of these rulings is that both sides have to submit how much money they think they're worth and the arbitrator decides, based on what's submitted by both sides, where the total will fall. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toby91_ca 620 Report post Posted August 7, 2007 If that is the case the guy who did Cammalleri's case must've been drunk or something!! I think the guy who gave Penner $4 million+ was the drunk (Lowe). Big difference here is that Penner was given a contract that grossly overpays (i.e. the reason Burke was so upset with Lowe, not necessarily upset than an offer was made). Kinda funny that the two sides in the Cammalleri case were so far off. Mike wanted $6 million a year? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted August 7, 2007 Derek Roy just got 4. Cammalleri just got robbed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
puckbags 863 Report post Posted August 7, 2007 I think the guy who gave Penner $4 million+ was the drunk (Lowe). Big difference here is that Penner was given a contract that grossly overpays (i.e. the reason Burke was so upset with Lowe, not necessarily upset than an offer was made). Kinda funny that the two sides in the Cammalleri case were so far off. Mike wanted $6 million a year? Thats what i don't understand..if he wanted 6million a year and they were offering 2.6 million a year I figured with the kind of year that he had that they might meet somewhere close to the middle which would be about 4.3 million. He can't be happy with the fact the King's think he is only worth 2.6 million. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toby91_ca 620 Report post Posted August 7, 2007 Derek Roy just got 4. Cammalleri just got robbed. Another situation where a team overpaid for a guy (Roy), but Buffalo really couldn't afford to lose him after the offseason they have had so far. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
irishtemper14+25 11 Report post Posted August 7, 2007 lol cam got robbed and so did avery imo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
martyrme19 73 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 Does anyone else here think that arbitration is bulls*** to begin with? I mean, if a player can get awarded an extra 3 mil a year to their contract for exceeding expectations, shouldnt they be forced to pay a team back for not fulfilling expectations? (see feds and yashin). I mean, what the hell is the point of a contract? You signed it, so you stick to it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 (edited) Another situation where a team overpaid for a guy (Roy), but Buffalo really couldn't afford to lose him after the offseason they have had so far. If you see how great Roy is defensively, and the fact that hes still at least a 25+ 60+ guy (and im pretty sure hes only 24 or so), they really didnt overpay by much. One of the best two way goal guys under 26 in todays game easy. Edited August 8, 2007 by YoungGuns1340 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lidstromfan5 3 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 Cammalleri is awesome. Go Blue! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
puckbags 863 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 If you see how great Roy is defensively, and the fact that hes still at least a 25+ 60+ guy (and im pretty sure hes only 24 or so), they really didnt overpay by much. One of the best two way goal guys under 26 in todays game easy. Fair enough.. i see what you're getting at with Roy but I mean Cammalleri had 80 pts, 16ppg, 37 pp pts, he was a plus 5 on a rancid defensive team. He doesn't play to his small stature at all. All i'm saying is if arbitrator's are supposed to use other players as a comparison to figure out what a guy should make then Cammalleri should have gotten a better shake. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Opie 308 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 Does anyone else here think that arbitration is bulls*** to begin with? I mean, if a player can get awarded an extra 3 mil a year to their contract for exceeding expectations, shouldnt they be forced to pay a team back for not fulfilling expectations? (see feds and yashin). I mean, what the hell is the point of a contract? You signed it, so you stick to it. He isn't renegotiating his current contract. His contract expired, he is an RFA, he didn't like their original offer and went to Arbitration. Now without arbitration the team could have given him whatever they wanted to. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wing Nut 19 0 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 He isn't renegotiating his current contract. His contract expired, he is an RFA, he didn't like their original offer and went to Arbitration. Now without arbitration the team could have given him whatever they wanted to. Exactly!! Abitrators are supposed to be impartial but are they really? I'v often wondered if the league commissioner "He who's name must not be spoken" has an understanding with the arbitrators to help control the salaries these guys make and there create a measuring stick for other RFAs and UFAs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kp-Wings 3 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 Oddly enough, Kyle Calder had about 30 or so less points last season then Cammalleri did this season, and ended up getting a pretty similar amount from his abitration. Arbitration is a joke. When you consider the fact that Diver (Derek Roy) got 4 million a season, when Cammalleri, who had more points and doesn't flop around on the ice like a fish, get's less money. I don't get it. It'd be nice if they had some consistancy with these cases. Cammalleri got robbed. End of story. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BeeRYCE 2 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 Cammalleri and Avery got robbed, and Avery moreso. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Opie 308 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 Cammalleri and Avery got robbed, and Avery moreso. Please explain this theory to me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
toby91_ca 620 Report post Posted August 8, 2007 Arbitration is a joke. When you consider the fact that Diver (Derek Roy) got 4 million a season, when Cammalleri, who had more points and doesn't flop around on the ice like a fish, get's less money. I don't get it. It'd be nice if they had some consistancy with these cases. Roy's contract was not the result of an arbitration hearing. I can absolutely guarantee you that had he gone to arbitration, he wouldn't have been awarded $4 million. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
martyrme19 73 Report post Posted August 9, 2007 He isn't renegotiating his current contract. His contract expired, he is an RFA, he didn't like their original offer and went to Arbitration. Now without arbitration the team could have given him whatever they wanted to. oooooooh Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BeeRYCE 2 Report post Posted August 10, 2007 Please explain this theory to me. They should have been paid more. Cams should have been in the 4.5M range, and Aves in the 3M range. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Opie 308 Report post Posted August 10, 2007 (edited) I understand that Cams got under paid and so did Avery but how is it that Avery got more of the proverbial shaft than Cammalleri. Avery at most deserved 2.5 (IMHO) and Cammalleri as you stated should have got at least 4.5. My question (and I should have worded it better) was how did Avery get robbed more than Cammalleri. Edited August 10, 2007 by Opie Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YoungGuns1340 1 Report post Posted August 10, 2007 You guys are missing a big point: GMs and players both go into arbitration with a game plan. They plead their case why they think they should recieve X number of dollars, and GMs explain why they think they should pay X number of dollars. I think more credit needs to be given to Lombardi here. He obviously came in to arbitration very prepared and with a good argument as to why Cammalleri didnt deserve 4M per or whatever it was Cammy wanted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites