Andy Sutton to the Islanders

[Heaton 1]

http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/hock..._york_islander/

[Rice 42]

OMG KENNY HE WOULD'VE BEEN A GOOD PICKUP!!!!!!

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

OMG KENNY HE WOULD'VE BEEN A GOOD PICKUP!!!!!!

He was too tall to ever play for us. Besides, if we signed him, then we'd have to get rid of our enforcer Lilja.

[theman19 47]

cue detailed, but not overly though out response on how this was the one guy who'd solve our grit problem, and that Holland is terrible GM for not signing him in 5,4,3,......

[Wings_Dynasty 267]

Don't explode yet, we don't know how much he is being paid.

[Kp-Wings 3]

OMG KENNY HE WOULD'VE BEEN A GOOD PICKUP!!!!!!

He's more physical then anything we have on our current blueline.

God forbid Holland actually signs somebody over 6'0. Ridiculous.

[Kp-Wings 3]

Double post...

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=215900&hubname=nhl

Terms of the deal were not released, and it doesn't look like they will be. So, in my mind, Holland let another one get away.

Edited August 11, 2007 by Kp-Wings

[Guest DetroitIan]

He would have been excellent in the winged wheel. But obviously it wasnt meant to be. I just gotta keep the hope alive, that Kenny has his eye on a solid d-man out there. We just have to be patient right now. Hopefully within the next month, we will have an idea about who we might aquire defensively.

[MaynardJKeenan 1]

The Isles were rumored to be after him of Markov. Maybe Markov will decide to sign for less here now.

[Heaton 1]

3 years 3m/yr.

No need for Sutton or Markov we have enough capable defensemen. Also, Andy Sutton isn't even that great defensively nor that great physically. Hell, the fan favorite Andreas Lilja has more hits than Sutton the past 2 seasons and most importantly of course, _ONE_ less fight!

We have a logjam at defense anyway, Lidstrom, Kronwall, Rafalski, Chelios, Lilja, Lebda, Meech, Quincey - from my perspective, Markov has a take it or leave it offer not because of what he did here but because he's really not needed. He didn't really do much while he was here, he had a few decent hits but I don't remember being anything special when not paired with Lidstrom.

Edited August 11, 2007 by Heaton

[wingsfan93 0]

i agree we arent in need of another dman

[eva unit zero 271]

3m for Sutton is way too much. Sutton is like a bigger, slower Markov...except that Markov is better at both ends of the ice. This could mean Markov will sign for less here (if the Isles were the other 'interested' team, it means lack of competition) or it could solidify his demands (a lesser player of the same style being signed for 3m means Markov is worth more, right?)

[Kp-Wings 3]

Well, with that option gone, I just assume play Quincey or Meech.

I see no reason bring back Markov. None. He's not that physical, nor does he provide offense, nor is he a great defensive barricade either. Why wasted even 3 or so million on him? I'd rather play Quincey at this point, since there's nothing left on the free agent market, and Quincey played very well during the playoffs.

Save the money for the trade deadline. Hopefully Holland doesn't flaunt his ass by saying he's going to make some big move, only not to because "the cost is too high".

[Wings_Dynasty 267]

3 years 3m/yr.

No need for Sutton or Markov we have enough capable defensemen. Also, Andy Sutton isn't even that great defensively nor that great physically. Hell, the fan favorite Andreas Lilja has more hits than Sutton the past 2 seasons and most importantly of course, _ONE_ less fight!

We have a logjam at defense anyway, Lidstrom, Kronwall, Rafalski, Chelios, Lilja, Lebda, Meech, Quincey - from my perspective, Markov has a take it or leave it offer not because of what he did here but because he's really not needed. He didn't really do much while he was here, he had a few decent hits but I don't remember being anything special when not paired with Lidstrom.

Wow, if all that is true (especially about the fight numbers) I'm not that disappointed that he didn't sign here. We have it good compared to other teams in that we can rely on our GR prospects. But, I would still like to see Markov back.

[irishtemper14+25 11]

yea well maybe now the isles dont want danny...hopefully he wont come back

[theman19 47]

3 years 3m/yr.

No need for Sutton or Markov we have enough capable defensemen. Also, Andy Sutton isn't even that great defensively nor that great physically. Hell, the fan favorite Andreas Lilja has more hits than Sutton the past 2 seasons and most importantly of course, _ONE_ less fight!

We have a logjam at defense anyway, Lidstrom, Kronwall, Rafalski, Chelios, Lilja, Lebda, Meech, Quincey - from my perspective, Markov has a take it or leave it offer not because of what he did here but because he's really not needed. He didn't really do much while he was here, he had a few decent hits but I don't remember being anything special when not paired with Lidstrom.

and with that,..heaton brings balance to the force.

[Drake_Marcus 890]

3 years 3m/yr.

No need for Sutton or Markov we have enough capable defensemen. Also, Andy Sutton isn't even that great defensively nor that great physically. Hell, the fan favorite Andreas Lilja has more hits than Sutton the past 2 seasons and most importantly of course, _ONE_ less fight!

We have a logjam at defense anyway, Lidstrom, Kronwall, Rafalski, Chelios, Lilja, Lebda, Meech, Quincey - from my perspective, Markov has a take it or leave it offer not because of what he did here but because he's really not needed. He didn't really do much while he was here, he had a few decent hits but I don't remember being anything special when not paired with Lidstrom.

[Heroes of Hockeytown 694]

How well my comfort is revived by seeing your intelligent posting again, Heaton. Our D is solid. LGW culture practically parodies itself with its lust for size and grit, as ever.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Sutton gone now?

Drat.

/sarcasm

[theman19 47]

spectors has his price listed at 3 year for 9 million. That's what he got from the islanders,....that's ridiculous

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Well, with that option gone, I just assume play Quincey or Meech.

I see no reason bring back Markov. None. He's not that physical, nor does he provide offense, nor is he a great defensive barricade either. Why wasted even 3 or so million on him? I'd rather play Quincey at this point, since there's nothing left on the free agent market, and Quincey played very well during the playoffs.

Save the money for the trade deadline. Hopefully Holland doesn't flaunt his ass by saying he's going to make some big move, only not to because "the cost is too high".

So you wouldn't bring Markov back at Sutton's price because he's not that physical, doesn't provide offense or nor is hea great defensively? Yet you want Andy Sutton?

1. Sutton isn't even in Markov's league defensively. Sutton actually makes Markov look like Konstantinov defensively. Sutton has been a minus player more seasons than he's been a plus player. Markov has been a minus player just 2 times in 9 seasons. So if Markov isn't a great defensive barricade as you say, then Sutton looks like a New Orleans levee.

2. Offensively did you know they had the same amount of points last season and Markov had 4 goals to Sutton's 2. Markov has consistently been a bigger point producer than Sutton. Sutton's responsibilities grew in Atlanta as did his ice time so in the 4 years he's been there his point total is 102 to Markov's 102 over the same time period. You claim Markov doesn't provide offense, well then statistically neither does Sutton.

3. As far as physicality is concerned, you are one of the few people i've ever seen accuse Markov of not being physical. Or maybe you're simply referring to fights. Did you know Sutton ONLY HAD 1 FIGHT LAST SEASON! And he only had 2 fights the year before. 3 fights in the past 2 years. Markov had 1 last year and 1 the year before + 1 in the playoffs. So even from a fistic standpoint Sutton doesn't outshine Markov in the slightest.

4. And this is the most important one of them all. ANDY SUTTON CAN'T SKATE. This guy make Derian Hatcher look like Mike Gartner for pete's sake. Sutton is a pylon on skates.

IMO, I wouldn't pay Markov 3 million. Well, maybe I would but I wouldn't like it. As for Sutton, I wouldn't give him more than 2.5. What am I supposed to pay him more for? Because he's tall. Being tall doesn't equate to anything. Show me a defender over 6-4 who's worth anything and i'll show you 10 that suck donkey nuts. Height is overrated when you can't skate, are poor positionally and have a long history of being a semi-retard who takes terrible penalties and flies off the handle at times when its convenient to fight somebody smaller than yourself. Sutton's supposed to be so tough his fight card includes guys like

Olli Jokinen

Vincent Lecavalier

Adam Mair

Eric Brewer.

In the past 3 years the only guys he's fought that could be considered heavyweights, which is what Sutton should be given his size are Eric Boulton and Ryan Vandenbusche and neither of those guys is close to Sutton's size. How come there's no Peters or Belak or Colton Orr on his fight card? Because he's a puss when it comes down to fighting guys his own size or that are legitimate tough guys.

Sutton is a big guy who has decent skills that are somewhat elevated by his immense size and the fact that he played on an Atlanta team that could put up points. He's a minus player for his career and prone to blunders and brain farts all the time. He's about as overrated as any player has been on a Wings board in a long time.

sorry for the post length but the Sutton love affair was getting ridiculous.

Edited August 11, 2007 by GordieSid&Ted

[Kp-Wings 3]

Yeah, so Sutton didn't fight a lot this year. Look at his fight card in years past.

You think the Sutton talk is ridiculous? Well, I happen to think the Markov talk is ridiculous. Why? Because he played with Lidstrom almost the whole season. Lidstrom could make Maxim Kuznetsov look like a good defenseman.

Besides that, I have watched Sutton, and while he hasn't fought as much, he still hits more than Markov. Markov was a total puss in the Anaheim series.

I don't know why Markov is looked at like he's some spectacular defenseman. And before you turn this around on me saying "Well, why do you think Andy Sutton is so good?", I have admit before that Sutton does have his problems. But I still feel he'd be much more valuable to this team, because he's actually physical. Our only physical defenseman currently is Kronwall, and he breaks something every time he lays out a decent hit.

The other thing I don't understand about Markov is he is so loved because he "plays it safe". You know, we have so many defenseman on the current Wings team that play the exact same way, and are better, so what is the point of bringing back, especially for his ridiculous salary demands?

Like I said: under no circumstance do I want Markov back, unless he takes at or below what he made last season. Signing him would just delay the prospects development, and since he brings no special attributes to the table, he's not worth signing.

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

Yeah, so Sutton didn't fight a lot this year. Look at his fight card in years past.

You think the Sutton talk is ridiculous? Well, I happen to think the Markov talk is ridiculous. Why? Because he played with Lidstrom almost the whole season. Lidstrom could make Maxim Kuznetsov look like a good defenseman.

Besides that, I have watched Sutton, and while he hasn't fought as much, he still hits more than Markov. Markov was a total puss in the Anaheim series.

I don't know why Markov is looked at like he's some spectacular defenseman. And before you turn this around on me saying "Well, why do you think Andy Sutton is so good?", I have admit before that Sutton does have his problems. But I still feel he'd be much more valuable to this team, because he's actually physical. Our only physical defenseman currently is Kronwall, and he breaks something every time he lays out a decent hit.

The other thing I don't understand about Markov is he is so loved because he "plays it safe". You know, we have so many defenseman on the current Wings team that play the exact same way, and are better, so what is the point of bringing back, especially for his ridiculous salary demands?

Like I said: under no circumstance do I want Markov back, unless he takes at or below what he made last season. Signing him would just delay the prospects development, and since he brings no special attributes to the table, he's not worth signing.

My whole beef with Sutton is that he doesn't fight and when he does, he fights guys that are below his weight class. I have a great clip of an Oilers/Thrashers game where Sutton didn't want any part of Laraque so he went after somebody like Eric Brewer during a brawl. I remember the commentators calling him out for it. They may have been biased at that instant but Sutton has a history of that.

I'm not a huge Markov supporter, I just wanted to address the comments you made about Sutton being better at every aspect of the game than Markov. The proof is in the pudding and the stats don't lie. Markov played with Nick for a season, whoopdeedo. He had even better numbers on different teams with a lesser partner. I laid all the stats out for you, Sutton is a liability on defense while Markov is solid in his own end. Both are about equal offensively but Sutton is given far more opportunity to be offensive than Danny. Neither one fights much at all. As for the being physical part, i'd like to see the hit totals the past 3 years for each before I say one way or the other for certain.

You don't have to like Markov and you're right we shouldn't bring him back unless his demands come way down, but that doesn't change the fact that he's a better defenseman than Sutton and that your insinuation that Sutton was better offensively and defensively is completely wrong.

[eva unit zero 271]

Yeah, so Sutton didn't fight a lot this year. Look at his fight card in years past.

You think the Sutton talk is ridiculous? Well, I happen to think the Markov talk is ridiculous. Why? Because he played with Lidstrom almost the whole season. Lidstrom could make Maxim Kuznetsov look like a good defenseman.

Besides that, I have watched Sutton, and while he hasn't fought as much, he still hits more than Markov. Markov was a total puss in the Anaheim series.

I don't know why Markov is looked at like he's some spectacular defenseman. And before you turn this around on me saying "Well, why do you think Andy Sutton is so good?", I have admit before that Sutton does have his problems. But I still feel he'd be much more valuable to this team, because he's actually physical. Our only physical defenseman currently is Kronwall, and he breaks something every time he lays out a decent hit.

The other thing I don't understand about Markov is he is so loved because he "plays it safe". You know, we have so many defenseman on the current Wings team that play the exact same way, and are better, so what is the point of bringing back, especially for his ridiculous salary demands?

Like I said: under no circumstance do I want Markov back, unless he takes at or below what he made last season. Signing him would just delay the prospects development, and since he brings no special attributes to the table, he's not worth signing.

Markov is better than Sutton. Sutton signed for about what Markov wants. As far as playing style..we have NOBODY who plays like Markov. Markov is a good skating, physical, defensively skilled defenseman. Who else fits that bill. Lidstrom, Rafalski, Kronwall, Chelios, Lilja, or Lebda? None of those guys puts all three of those attributes together the way Markov does. Markov is the best defenseman left on the market (and was when Sutton was still available) and would help this team. He is worth 3m to 3.5m, the question is whether Holland feels it is more important to use that space on Markov, or to save that space for a potential deadline acquisition.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

I would have loved to have Sutton here because of his size and physicality. Yes, he's not as physical as he should be, but still a lot more aggressive than anyone on our blue-line. As for his fighting ability, that had nothing to do with me wanting him here. I mean come on, the guy lost to Vinny Lecavalier of all people.