NHL is killing hockey in Detroit

[VM1138 1,921]

I've talked to a lot of people who used to watch the Wings. They don't know any of the new players.

Some know Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Holmstrom, and Draper. But since Draper isn't productive anymore, that leaves 3 players (aside from Hasek) that people know. Lidstrom is not that famous because casual fans don't even notice him on the ice (which is the beauty of his style of play).

So the problem is, we have no Shannys, Federovs, or Yzermans. That sort of loyalty takes years to develop. Those players came around at the perfect time. No other Detroit teams were any good consistently, so we latched onto the hope that those players brought.

What do Datsyuk and Zetterberg bring? Nothing new. The team is already good, there's no hope and promise in these guys, we just expect them to continue the great tradition. They need to be part of a huge marketing blitz like the PIstons, Lions, and Tigers have all year long.

The Wings players have little face recognition, no name recognition, and have no amazing storyline like the resurrection of a dead franchise to play.

We are settling into a comfortable zone after years of peaking. It's only natural.

[OsGOD 3]

But it does matter. This is Hockeytown. Don't get me wrong, yeah, I want to see those headlining names a top rank teams too. But if Detroit fans want to get defensive when other cities call them out for being NOT being Hockeytown. We have to be able to back it up. It is embarrassing when we have that written across the ice and the camera pans across the rows of empty seats.

Yes, the money is there, the team isn't hurting ... but the image and ideals of a proud, winning team are not.

I think thats the problem i have... Living within a stones throw of the city... i really don't care about the label hockeytown... It is a mere fraction of what i have come to identify the Red Wings as since the mid-eighties... Hockeytown is nothing more than a keen marketing ploy with a nice handy logo at center ice. The image and Ideals of a proud, winning team are proven by contant march into the playoffs after an 81 game season... It is not and should not be based on some Clever nickname given only after we won a cup.

Sorry i guess being a fan for so long has seprated me from marketing labels. It was fun while it lasted but I still like the wings logo plain at center ice.

Edited October 10, 2007 by OsGOD

[Jwo 7]

People are either refusing to acknowledge the problem or they are ignorant to it. To say the Wings has 17,000 asses in the seats on Monday is a complete lie. According to the Edmonton Sun there were about 13,000 people in attendance to Monday's game. Now I know people are going to respond by questioning the credibility of the Edmonton Sun but I have been going to games for 15 years, seeing the good, the bad, and Monday...the ugly as far as attendance is concerned. When the 4 or 5 top rows are empty there is not 17,000 people in the arena.

STOP with the economy crap, people are going in droves to see the Tigers, the Lions, and soon the Pistons. There are number of problems, and the economy is close to the bottom of the list:

1.) The lockout was all about creating a salary cap and controlling excessive payrolls, the CBA created a nearly 30 million payroll deduction for the Wings, yet ticket prices never decreased. The ability of the Wings to bring the big players to Detroit has decreased and people who are not die-hard Wings fans are not familiar with the new faces. It doesnt matter if you bring older players who are way past their prime, people came out to see them because they know who they are.

2.) Joe Louis is old and boring. For as long as I can remember the same exact songs have played at the same exact time, the same contests at intermission have been going on , and there is absolutely no excitement to the pre-game events. The Detroit Vipers had a better pre-game introduction than the Wings do. When the Wings score a goal its the same horn, no pyrotechnics (Calgary), no lights, nothing. Now, I AM NOT saying that is what I am there for, in fact I love the classic stuff, but we are not talking about me or anyone on this forum, we are talking about bringing the borderline fans to the game. Face it, people like all this BS when they go out to a game. They do this in the playoffs, why not regular season?

3.) The schedule is not interesting. There is no more Avalanche rivalry, and guess what? IF we did create a rivalry, then the NHL would schedule the games on VERSUS and a lot of Detroiters would not even be able to watch it.

4.) Hockey is a lot more difficult to follow than Basketball. Almost anyone can name all of the players on the Auburn Hills Pistons, even if you hate them as I do. Ask the average Detroit sports person to name every player on the Red Wings. This is what people like to do when it comes to sports; they like to know or appear to know who they are talking about and be able to follow their play. Also on this point, the wealth in this area is primarily in Oakland County, where the Pistons are located. It is a hell of a lot easier to pack the family in the car, drive to the palace, park in the big ass lot, and walk up to the stadium. People who go to Joe Louis all have their own little tips and tricks as to where they park, where its cheaper, and how close it is to the stadium. Face it: It is more difficult to go to a Red Wings game.

5.) Hockey is not dicussed on ESPN anywhere near the way it used to be. This is the place that the general sports fan gets their information, and hears about big plays, scores, players, etc. and follows up with heightened interest in the sport.

I dont have anymore time but these are just some of the reasons, disagree with me if you want, I understand. This is what we need, to discuss thoughts and new options to the problems from the people who know the Red Wings and want to revive Hockeytown. Maybe someone will hear us sooner rather than later.

I just found out last year that Mateen Cleaves does not play for the Pistons anymore.

[OsGOD 3]

I just found out last year that Mateen Cleaves does not play for the Pistons anymore.

HOW COOL! I just found out by reading your post that we even had him

2.) Joe Louis is old and boring. For as long as I can remember the same exact songs have played at the same exact time, the same contests at intermission have been going on , and there is absolutely no excitement to the pre-game events. The Detroit Vipers had a better pre-game introduction than the Wings do. When the Wings score a goal its the same horn, no pyrotechnics (Calgary), no lights, nothing. Now, I AM NOT saying that is what I am there for, in fact I love the classic stuff, but we are not talking about me or anyone on this forum, we are talking about bringing the borderline fans to the game. Face it, people like all this BS when they go out to a game. They do this in the playoffs, why not regular season?

4.) Hockey is a lot more difficult to follow than Basketball. Almost anyone can name all of the players on the Auburn Hills Pistons, even if you hate them as I do. Ask the average Detroit sports person to name every player on the Red Wings. This is what people like to do when it comes to sports; they like to know or appear to know who they are talking about and be able to follow their play. Also on this point, the wealth in this area is primarily in Oakland County, where the Pistons are located. It is a hell of a lot easier to pack the family in the car, drive to the palace, park in the big ass lot, and walk up to the stadium. People who go to Joe Louis all have their own little tips and tricks as to where they park, where its cheaper, and how close it is to the stadium. Face it: It is more difficult to go to a Red Wings game.

2) Hell yeah the Vipers had an awesome intro... those were the games to go to.... When wings score don't they have the "FIRE ABOVE ICE" on the jumbotron? also they do have red lights at go off on the bottom corners. Wait they do that stuff in the post season? Dammit Mr. Moneybags I want my money back.. all i got to see was some unispired musical rendition of who knows what.

4) has anyone found out what Issah Thomas latest harrassment suit will have a bearing on whether he starts the season? I can imagine not having him out there with Vinny Johnson and Bill Lambeer for the home opener? Oh they don't play for them anymore.. s***! well at least we got big bad afro Wallace

I couldn't name 4 current pistons.

Edited October 10, 2007 by OsGOD

[BringHomeTheCup! 0]

I just found out last year that Mateen Cleaves does not play for the Pistons anymore.

I just found out about 3 seconds ago that Mateen Cleaves (who the hell is he anyhow?) played for the Pistons.

Seriously folks, I love to go see the boys play live. Nothing beats it. I love knowing what to expect at the Joe, the classic stuff as a previous poster called it. This is my biggest problem. I live an hour and a half from the Joe, you have to pay for parking, tickets aren't cheap, and we all know the concessions are ridiculous. Every single game I goto I can expect to drop over $100 BEFORE paying for my tickets. Illitch needs to get some marketing gurus together and offer some ticket packages like they do for the Tigers (4 tickets, 4 sodas, 4 hot dogs for whatever price.) Just getting people in the rink will generate revenue, even if the tickets are basically given away for free.

[OsGOD 3]

I just found out about 3 seconds ago that Mateen Cleaves (who the hell is he anyhow?) played for the Pistons.

Seriously folks, I love to go see the boys play live. Nothing beats it. I love knowing what to expect at the Joe, the classic stuff as a previous poster called it. This is my biggest problem. I live an hour and a half from the Joe, you have to pay for parking, tickets aren't cheap, and we all know the concessions are ridiculous. Every single game I goto I can expect to drop over $100 BEFORE paying for my tickets. Illitch needs to get some marketing gurus together and offer some ticket packages like they do for the Tigers (4 tickets, 4 sodas, 4 hot dogs for whatever price.) Just getting people in the rink will generate revenue, even if the tickets are basically given away for free.

They already do... its some fancy french phrase.. Ala Carte... and prices start at $400

[cjeder 0]

Does anybody know what the portion of the empty seats reflect unsold tickets vs people who just didn't show up?

[nate_327 0]

its because detroit is a peice of crap of a city and people can't afford to go the the games. seriously, detroit is like gotham city. And, the joe louis arena is a peice of crap. They have like 4 bathrooms in the whole place. they need to do some SERIOUS renovations and make the games exciting. do a light show at the begining, do an inense introduction like they would do at Bulls games back in the day. They did light shows and intense introductions at pre season leafs games.

[Guest jaytan]

Yeah, well at least everybody doesn't hate us.

[wingfanatic4alltime 32]

i was just about to post something about this i apologize ahead of time for the length of my rant but this is a topic that just gets under my skin. The economy obviously deserves a part of the blame about the attendance but here is the really reason gary bleeping betteman. I really hope he is watching he is killing hockey in detroit plain and simple. Now does he want more wings attendance on road games or when fans watch games in supposed hockeytown does he want the audience see all the empty seats. Its as obvious as a punch in the face that we need to be moved to the east who the hell wants to watch nashville, columbus and chicago 8x a year its ridiculous. The NHL needs to hire someone who actually knows the great sport and not a damn basketball guy. Hockey will never be basketball or football its a regional sport joe schmo is arizona wont give a damn about the coyotes. I love this game its my favorite sport and what betteman has done to this great game is criminial. Betteman needs to save face and resign its a disgrace that he is in charge of this great game. 2 lockouts in his tenure as commish, the nhl has fallen off the face of the earth. Hockey already failed in atlanta once why expand there a second time. I really hope mr illitch was telling the truth in that interview in the detroit news that the schedule is going away next season. YOU CANT CREATE RIVALRIES plain and simple. This league is having a slow death and the only way to save this league is to get a guy who actually gives a damn about this great sport as the new commish, like a brett hull, chris chelios etc. As im typing this im obviously watching the game and what gets the biggest appluse of the night? A fight or a scrum, and betteman along with the other clowns are trying to get away from fighting thats smart. Well that is it for my rant i apoligize again for the length but this topic really gets me angry.

[Izzy24 44]

its because detroit is a peice of crap of a city and people can't afford to go the the games. seriously, detroit is like gotham city. And, the joe louis arena is a peice of crap. They have like 4 bathrooms in the whole place. they need to do some SERIOUS renovations and make the games exciting. do a light show at the begining, do an inense introduction like they would do at Bulls games back in the day. They did light shows and intense introductions at pre season leafs games.

An incense introduction!? Oh, "intense" nevermind.

[Defenseman13 0]

I have a theory that probably has been brought up here before but I thought was worth discussing again; having the Wings in Western Conference in the Central Division is hurting attendance. The rivalries that the people in the Detroit area have historically followed are dead. We need more games against Montreal,Boston and most importantly Toronto,it also doesnt help that the Blackhawks have basically iced a team of kittens for the past 5 years. I understand the importance of fostering NEW rivalries but is it worth losing Detroit? I know there are a few theories for why attendance is dropping off and while its not time to panic yet ,18000 a game is still very good, there is reason for concern if the trend continues.

Not only do I agree with this theory, but I've seen it since the lockout.

I'ts not that simple, but the league should at least be able to schedule games and solve the Rubik's Cube regarding high turnout.

In other words, the division rivalries suck.

From my perspective, as a Sharks fan/former season ticket holder, I could really care less about seeing 8+ games vs. the Ducks/Kings.

What really packs em in is the WIngs, and what really is OWED to hockey fans is seeing original six teams visit the arenas more than once every three years.

I want to see the Leafs. I want to see Boston. I want to see the Wings more. Hell, even the Lightning or the Devils, or NYI or NYR.

The Charks do all right with the selling of tickets it seems, but the league in general seems to be missing a big part of what makes hockey history important.

And as far as the rivalry thing goes, I think it's possible. There were 100+ fights in the preseason, and despite the bullshoot instigator rule, fighting is alive and well. Heck, the record PM in a game is the Ottawa/Philly game a few years back. So there's this horrible contradiction between what the league/Bettman wants as far as cleaning up the game, yet the increase in division games seems to beguile the current gameplay strategy. It's failing. EVeryone who's ever played even broom hockey knows how bad it gets when you see the same people night after night... so basically the whole new season structure is in itself ONE BIG INSTIGATOR PENALTY.

And if there's one thing I want to say about my Game... when you make decisions based on marketing strategy, and ignore what the players and the league wants, well then... you take a part of the game''s heart away, and ultimately it will die. Fighting? Ask the players. Cheap shots? Ask the players who will get suspended for a game or three when they try to police their own game. And yet we have 8+ division games vs. any given team. Punish the cheap/head/boarding.... but let the league police it's own.

Ok, I'm tired and boozed. Out.

Edited October 11, 2007 by Defenseman13