Your assessment of Today

[ShanahanMan 473]

I don't think Ken Holland is a bad GM. In fact, I think he's a very good one.

But let's be realistic. He has openly acknowledged this team has weaknesses on a number of occasions, dating all the way back to the Wings' last postseason exit. He stood pat over the summer because he thought it wise to wait until the deadline. Fair enough. He stood pat in the regular season because, even though it was painfully obvious that our youngsters weren't going to cut it, the emergence of Henrik Zetterberg bought him some time, allowing him to keep looking forward to the deadline, not the here and now. Fair enough.

Then deadline day comes. Surely after all of this waiting and hyping, and with all of this cap room, Holland would finally make good on his talk. Right?

Folks, the answer is a resounding "NO."

That, to me, is inexcusable. Holland had a fantastic opportunity to make some quality moves for dirt cheap today, but in the end, he only has Brad Stuart to show for it. All of that waiting, all of those "tough decisions" (e.g. letting Markov walk because of cap concerns) -- they all ultimately led up to...Brad Stuart? As much as I like Stuart, this whole saga gets a big "WTF" from me.

Now, I'm not one to advocate trading just for the sake of trading; if there are no genuinely palatable deals to be made, then you don't make any deals. But when you hear that a guy like Prospal was had for dirt cheap, and then you juxtapose that with all of Holland's talk about needing some more secondary scoring at "the right price" (whatever that is)...something's not adding up.

This roster has issues, guys -- and I'm not talking about its current injuries. Has it dominated thus far? Yes, but as history shows us, the regular season means little. More specifically, it's not an especially reliable indicator of postseason success. Just ask the Wings, who have developed a knack for fizzling out in the playoffs despite strong showings in the regular season. The way you, as a GM, put an end to such a trend is by taking a good hard look at the team's weaknesses and doing everything in your power to ensure that these weaknesses are either as small a factor as possible or eliminated altogether. I thought Holland did a great job in seeing to it that this team got grittier and more resilient last season. It's no coincidence that that was the Wings' deepest run in years.

But the problems don't stop there, which is troubling because it seems like Holland did stop there. Sure, the Wings are tougher, but that doesn't cover other issues like their lack of scoring depth and their lack of a big, physical, crease-clearing, top 4 guy on the blue line. No matter how much anyone wants it to be true, a secondary scoring group consisting of Hudler, Flip, Sammy and Cleary will not cut it in the postseason. You think Hudler's having problems now? Just wait until he goes up against the likes of the Ducks in the playoffs. This secondary scoring group would be excusable only if the Wings were well-equipped to handle a long, taxing, one-goal series against a monster shutdown squad like the Ducks. But, seeing as how that would require an extremely solid, well-rounded blue line, which the Wings lack (undersized, too o-minded, not much snarl), the secondary scoring group remains unequivocally pathetic.

This will be my last post here. I simply can't stomach the kind of crap Holland pulled over on Motown this season.

Inexcusable, unacceptable. Goodbye.

you're absolutely right.

don't run out though....

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Sane and rational post. I like it.

I agree with pretty much everything he said. But anyone wanna place bets it's truly his last post here?

But honestly I didn't expect this trade deadline to fix it. Holland has done an okay job, but under his leadership the Wings have had a slow decline in size, toughness, and yes I'm going to say it, grit. It's why I'm glad to have Stuart. At least that gives a little something to the blueline.

Look at the Wings 97 and 98 roster. Think about how many of those guys were big and could play tough and could play the game. I'd love to have a lineup like that again.

Replacing those type of players is a much bigger process than any deadline moves can fix.

[Grim 5]

All blame aside, it was Kenny himself who declared this team's need for a depth defenseman and a secondary scorer. by all accounts, he only accomplished half of those goals.

optimists, bandwagoners, sourpusses alike... the greatest perception on how well Kenny has done will be reflected by the number of empty seats during the opening rounds.

[Guest CaliWingsNut]

I agree with pretty much everything he said. But anyone wanna place bets it's truly his last post here?

But honestly I didn't expect this trade deadline to fix it. Holland has done an okay job, but under his leadership the Wings have had a slow decline in size, toughness, and yes I'm going to say it, grit. It's why I'm glad to have Stuart. At least that gives a little something to the blueline.

Look at the Wings 97 and 98 roster. Think about how many of those guys were big and could play tough and could play the game. I'd love to have a lineup like that again.

Replacing those type of players is a much bigger process than any deadline moves can fix.

anyone wanna make a poll on how long it'll be?

[eva unit zero 271]

Well, I'll put it this way.

The Wings' major needs were a defensively capable, gritty defenseman and someone to take Sammy's place on the power play. With Stuart, they fill both holes.

Ideally, Stuart resigns for 2-3 years, somewhere around his current salary. His skill set first the Wings very, very well and I have been interested in picking him up since he was a Shark.

The only team of contenders that is deeper as far as scoring forwards go is Ottawa. And even that is a very slight difference.

Anaheim is the only team with a defense that can come close to matching Detroit's, and there is no contending team with significantly better goaltending than Detroit.

A top four, two-way defenseman with grit and puck skills was the only real 'need' Detroit had. Stuart fills that hole perfectly. I wanted to see Hossa...but not at the price Pittsburgh paid. If you consider that Armstrong for Dupuis would have been a fair straight swap, then Pittsburgh gave up Christensen, Esposito, and a first pick. That would compare to Detroit giving up Filppula, Kindl, and a first for just Hossa. To that I say a big HELL NO. I was willing to give up ONE of those things, not all three.

Brad Richards? It would have been him and Holmqvist for Filppula, Howard, and Draper. No thanks.

Sergei Fedorov? He could probably have been had for Derek Meech if you go based simply on value. But that would have been an intra-divisional trade...so it wasn't happening for less than a guy like Hudler or Ericsson. Not worth it.

Ruutu or Ladd would have cost Filppula or Hudler. No thanks.

Brandon Bochenski? Traded by Anaheim to Nashville for future considerations. No chance of Bochenski in Detroit.

Prospal? Picard and a conditional pick, equates roughly to Ericsson and a pick. No way in hell.

So that's all the secondary scoring that moved at the deadline. None of it was worth what the Wings would have had to give up, and only Hossa and Richards would have been an upgrade over what's currently on the second line.

So saying that Holland failed because he didn't pick up a second liner is false. He didn't overpay for a second liner because it was a want, not a need. He got Stuart at a bargain by not having to give up a roster player or top prospect but still acquiring the best fit available for our most glaring need.

So, a grade? A-. It would only have been an A or A+ had he managed something like Samuelsson for Prospal, Lebda for Satan, or some other trade for secondary scoring that would have been an upgrade without giving up any important players or skilled youngsters.

[Cruiser008 37]

Some of you seriously act like the sky is falling; look at what happened last year? We got a big-bad power-forward and a gritty two-way winger, which is exactly what we needed. And what happened in the playoffs? They did squat, and ultimately our lack of depth on D was our un-doing. This Anaheim is totally stacked because they essentially cheated the cap, but at least with our improved D (compared to last year since Rafalski + Stuart > Schneider + Markov) we at least have a good chance. Besides we weren't gonna throw the farm to get Hossa or Richards because we're in the business of contending for the cup EVERY year, 'cause that's WHAT WE DO.

The other things is matchups; Dallas and San Jose both improved greatly, but if they play Anaheim and soften each other up (like San Jose did to us last year, remember?) than what was originally a disadvantage becomes an advantage instead.

[Offsides 21]

I think the Red Wings 2008 team is a sinking ship. This trade deadline kind of made me realize it. We have so many injuries. Last year injuries stopped us, I think they will this year too. It's sad because I think our team (even without addition) is fantastic.

I think it's good we kept our young talent and now we can acquire some FA's in the offseason and use our money and still have our talent that we didn't waste on a rent-a-player who probably wouldn't make a dent in helping us in the post season because of our other problems.

I'm thankful Holland didn't make a dumb trade. I would have loved Fedorov but who knows what happened.

[betterREDthandead 58]

This will be my last post here. I simply can't stomach the kind of crap Holland pulled over on Motown this season.

Inexcusable, unacceptable. Goodbye.

Ever seen Tombstone? You know that scene where Wyatt Earp rides out of town and sees Curly Bill and says "I want you to know, it's over between us" and Curly Bill goes, "Well? Bye." Yeah.

[vangvace 12]

I agree with pretty much everything he said. But anyone wanna place bets it's truly his last post here?

But honestly I didn't expect this trade deadline to fix it. Holland has done an okay job, but under his leadership the Wings have had a slow decline in size, toughness, and yes I'm going to say it, grit. It's why I'm glad to have Stuart. At least that gives a little something to the blueline.

Look at the Wings 97 and 98 roster. Think about how many of those guys were big and could play tough and could play the game. I'd love to have a lineup like that again.

Replacing those type of players is a much bigger process than any deadline moves can fix.

Now comes the next question...

When will the wings free agents resign? I'm going to hope that it happens before the playoffs. At least Cleary, Howard, and a couple others.

It's gonna be a really grumpy offseason around lgw if we don't at least hear about talks in the works before Jul 1 if not much sooner.

[WingFanInStarLand 0]

Sigh...I think people do have a right to be a bit peeved at Holland given his stated desire in the offseason to save cap space for the deadline...but outside of Hossa (who we could not afford) who did you really want? Feds...meh to each his own. I love the Stuart deal, and for all the hoopla over the deadline deals I really don't think much has changed balance of power wise in the Western Conference.

I love how everyone is slobbering over Dallas right now as the "new favorite". Living in Dallas while I'm not in school, I've watched that team for a looong time. They are hardworking and underappreciated, but a Stanley Cup threat they are not. Everyone said that in the previous thread, yet somehow the acquisiton of the underachieving overpaid Brad Richards changes that? Yes, spare me the "Smythe 2004" talk. He was great no doubt, but he played with great teammates. Now most of his points come on the PP and he isn't good even strength...in Dallas he will play with Modano and Lehtinen (not exactly Vinny and StLouis). He will be good, but nowhere near the "gamebreaker" that his price tag and the hype his trade brings him. Dallas is great defensively, but their offensive strategy plays into our defense's hands. Ribeiro/Morrow and Richards/Modano/Lehtinen will try to enter the zone with the puck and make pretty plays. When I saw us play them in January in Dallas, it was hilarious how effective we were at keepiing them out of our zone with a 1-0 lead. They couldn't generate aaaaaaaaaanything. They don't have the physicality to wear us down. I pray to god we get to play them....

San Jose certainly improved with Campbell, but something just doesn't seem right with this team...ever. The sum of its parts always seems to be greater than its whole, and while Brian will help the PP, if they can't get more scoring out of Marleau and Cheechoo this team is going nowhere fast. If they get those guys going and Nabokov stays hot, lookout, but...this team never can get to the level that it should be at. That, and their mental weakness makes me feel ok about a matchup with them...

Vancouver, Calgary, Minny did nothing...the same teams that we have done pretty well against this year, no need to jump in there.

Finally there are those pesky Ducks. This is a damn good hockey team with a great D and a gritty set of forwards. They have the physicality to wear us down and Giguere (despite my hatred for him) is clutch against us. A tough fight indeed, but the Wings have really elevated their game against them this year. They are bigger than us, but our guys always seem to fight with heart and determination. They may have the upperhand, but its awfully close, and they have noone to center that 2nd line, which could cut into their scoring depth, (just like us).

Overall my point is that we are somewhat disappointed, but when we get healthy we are still right there with Anaheim for the role of the favorite in the WC. We may need a lot of things to go right to beat them (51,26, 93, 37 all get clutch, stay healthy) but to say that Dallas and SJ are better than us when healthy is a joke.

Plus-Stuart will play better than you think!

[akustyk 84]

Well, I'll put it this way.

(...)

So, a grade? A-. It would only have been an A or A+ had he managed something like Samuelsson for Prospal, Lebda for Satan, or some other trade for secondary scoring that would have been an upgrade without giving up any important players or skilled youngsters.

to large extent I'd agree with you. but seeing how some fine players flew for just 3rd/4th round picks

I would like Holland to fish some depth forward (just to have more experience in case of injuries)

who in worst case could end up in Griffs. that's a fair deal.

I understand not everything was possible and Holland is very cautious about Wings future but this

small pickup keeps me from giving him A. A= or B+ in my book.

[jim3033 1]

I think we have a good team and today's aquisition will help a lot. But I don't understand the cap space. I don't see why kenny didn't go out in the summer or midseason and grab someone instead of gambling on a last minute aquisition.

Kind of feel like there was a plan to offer for Hossa more than the competitors but Pittsburgh went ape-s*** and pulled off the upset. Who knows. We have a team that can win the cup. Contingent upon injuries. It'll boil down to a bad call or a cheap shot in the playoffs.

[Opie 308]

Ever seen Tombstone? You know that scene where Wyatt Earp rides out of town and sees Curly Bill and says "I want you to know, it's over between us" and Curly Bill goes, "Well? Bye." Yeah.

You smell that, smells like somebody died!!!!!

[The_Cub 0]

I can kinda understand most deal that went down, but the Huet thing leaves me totally puzzled.

[JayUp88 1]

I can kinda understand most deal that went down, but the Huet thing leaves me totally puzzled.

they were clearing up cap space...... but it back fired on them. I think.

[akustyk 84]

clearing vap space & making room for Jaroslav Halak who's an excellent prospect

and could as well be the No 1 goalie soon (if not with Habs then with another

team for a hefty price)

[RockyMountainWingGal 108]

This will be my last post here. I simply can't stomach the kind of crap Holland pulled over on Motown this season.

Inexcusable, unacceptable. Goodbye.

So you're mad at Ken Holland because he didn't make some blockbuster trade that made the NHL homepage cover, and you are going to take your frustrations out on Mr. Holland by not posting on LGW anymore? I somehow don't think he'll get the message.

Come now, you spent some time writing up your eulogy on Holland - if the Wings get healthy and return to winning ways and look good when the playoffs start - don't be a stranger - come back and join us - we won't hold it against you.

[RedArmy 4]

So you're mad at Ken Holland because he didn't make some blockbuster trade that made the NHL homepage cover, and you are going to take your frustrations out on Mr. Holland by not posting on LGW anymore? I somehow don't think he'll get the message.

Come now, you spent some time writing up your eulogy on Holland - if the Wings get healthy and return to winning ways and look good when the playoffs start - don't be a stranger - come back and join us - we won't hold it against you.

I agree. Everyone keeps assuming that Holland was the monarch responsible for all Wings moves around the deadline. What if the truth is, that Scottie, Stevie Y and Babcock all agreed and supported Holland's decision. I don't think anyone operates in a vacuum in the wings organization... Maybe they wanted another scorer, but it was too "expensive" to get the one they felt would fit in.. Babcock even said himself recently he doesn't think there will be major moves and doesn't think there should be...