Why are the Pens automatically annoited the "dynasty" tag?

[MalkinsJock 0]

Serious question. I realize that they have an extremely young and talented group but nothing ive seen thus far shows that they're on track to be this decades Oilers.

Their core of Crosby-Malkin-Fleury is really all they have going into the future. Malkin is going to cost a pretty penny to resign. Hossa isn't going to come cheap either. Brooks Orpik and Malone are two other major pieces of their team that are up for contract. Lets also not forget Fleury.

But, on the flip side, you have a Detroit team that is dominating every team in the league. The entire roster is signed for the foreseeable future except for Zetterberg and Franzen. If Stuart is re-signed, that will solidify this exact roster for seasons to come. You can count on at least four seasons of Lidstrom-Rafalski, Kronwall-Stuart. Pavel is signed for seven years and Zetterberg will get a similar contract.

Whos to say that this team isn't in the perfect position to be the new "dynasty"?

[Doggy 130]

They're not.

[GiantRobot 0]

They're not.

At all.

[edicius 3,269]

Thirded.

Hossa's merely a rental, so he's not coming back and it's very likely that Malkin will split sooner rather than later.

[CdnWingsFanEh 2]

Whos to say that this team isn't in the perfect position to be the new "dynasty"?

I'm taking this part of your statement to mean the redwings, not the Pens...?

[up2here 41]

Serious question. I realize that they have an extremely young and talented group but nothing ive seen thus far shows that they're on track to be this decades Oilers.

Their core of Crosby-Malkin-Fleury is really all they have going into the future. Malkin is going to cost a pretty penny to resign. Hossa isn't going to come cheap either. Brooks Orpik and Malone are two other major pieces of their team that are up for contract. Lets also not forget Fleury.

But, on the flip side, you have a Detroit team that is dominating every team in the league. The entire roster is signed for the foreseeable future except for Zetterberg and Franzen. If Stuart is re-signed, that will solidify this exact roster for seasons to come. You can count on at least four seasons of Lidstrom-Rafalski, Kronwall-Stuart. Pavel is signed for seven years and Zetterberg will get a similar contract.

Whos to say that this team isn't in the perfect position to be the new "dynasty"?

Who appointed them a dynasty? They have 10 free agents at the end of this year.

[DEVILSWATERBOY 10]

What is a dynasty? to me it is a team that is consistantly in the playoffs has won some championships and is always the odds fav to win it all. s***sburg has not done this since 1992 they have along way to go to be able to carry the name dynasty and in this time and era of the NHL I do not see it happening for them, they will lose players in the off season.

The dynasty tag to me has been the Wings since 97 GO WINGS BRING IT HOME BOYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[toby91_ca 620]

Well, they are actually following the same pattern as the Oilers almost exactly, except just a year or two sooner. The Oilers were a very young and talented team in the early 80's and the first year they made the finals they were swept by the Islanders. Inexperience.....

The next year they came back and won it all.

I can see where people will try desparately to draw comparisons......they need to, they want something to talk about. However, there is a very key difference here, the times were different back then. Everyone was heart broken when the the Oilers weren't kept together for the long term, but if you think about it, the core (Messier, Gretzky, etc.) were together for 9 or 10 years. Even that is unheard of these days. The cap will hinder the chances of ever having another dynasty like that.

If I am not mistaken, I don't a single player on those 80's Oiler teams made more than $1 million.

[up2here 41]

Well, they are actually following the same pattern as the Oilers almost exactly, except just a year or two sooner. The Oilers were a very young and talented team in the early 80's and the first year they made the finals they were swept by the Islanders. Inexperience.....

The next year they came back and won it all.

I can see where people will try desparately to draw comparisons......they need to, they want something to talk about. However, there is a very key difference here, the times were different back then. Everyone was heart broken when the the Oilers weren't kept together for the long term, but if you think about it, the core (Messier, Gretzky, etc.) were together for 9 or 10 years. Even that is unheard of these days. The cap will hinder the chances of ever having another dynasty like that.

If I am not mistaken, I don't a single player on those 80's Oiler teams made more than $1 million.

You cant compare those two teams simply because of the eras they played in. Because of free agency next years Penguins team will look much different. According to www.nhlscap.com the Pens have 15 unrestricrted free agents including 9 players in the line-up last night. Marc-Andre Fleury is also a restricted free agent who could be subject to a offer from another team. The Oilers didnt have to face any of that.

[VM1138 1,921]

You cant compare those two teams simply because of the eras they played in. Because of free agency next years Penguins team will look much different. According to www.nhlscap.com the Pens have 15 unrestricrted free agents including 9 players in the line-up last night. Marc-Andre Fleury is also a restricted free agent who could be subject to a offer from another team. The Oilers didnt have to face any of that.

I've been learning more about how the Pens work, and I don't think they could be a dynasty. They're not different than say, Tampa Bay. Even if they come back to win it this year, no way do they do it again.

Malkin's ego won't let him stay in Pitts unless he bankrupts the place. He's already said he's giong for the max. I guess MAF has expressed interest in going elsewhere, the Pens fans seem to think they'll be losing a lot of their role players after this year, Roberts will retire, and their coach is terrible and would need to be replaced.

I see this as more of a "last hurrah" for the Pens instead of the Wings. They may be dismantled next year.

[Shaman 713]

Everyone here is hitting the nail on the head, Malkin will be gone soon, MAF wont stick around if he feels that there wont be the Defense to take him deep, Crosby is good, but isnt great if people cant finish what he starts (IE Malkin, Hossa, etc). So unless they can get everyone back on a steal, they will be a playoff team every year, but, they wont be a cup contender every year.

[Shaman 713]

PS, They arent even 1% as talented as the 83 oilers, I hate the comparison... MAF is nt Fuhr, no D man on there team can even be mentioned in the same conversation as Coffey, and Neither Malkin nor Crosby will ever be #99, they are like half of him each, Crosby can set up, Malkin can finish, neither will be able to do both with the same ability that Wayne had.

[flyerdog 0]

Serious question. I realize that they have an extremely young and talented group but nothing ive seen thus far shows that they're on track to be this decades Oilers.

Their core of Crosby-Malkin-Fleury is really all they have going into the future. Malkin is going to cost a pretty penny to resign. Hossa isn't going to come cheap either. Brooks Orpik and Malone are two other major pieces of their team that are up for contract. Lets also not forget Fleury.

But, on the flip side, you have a Detroit team that is dominating every team in the league. The entire roster is signed for the foreseeable future except for Zetterberg and Franzen. If Stuart is re-signed, that will solidify this exact roster for seasons to come. You can count on at least four seasons of Lidstrom-Rafalski, Kronwall-Stuart. Pavel is signed for seven years and Zetterberg will get a similar contract.

Whos to say that this team isn't in the perfect position to be the new "dynasty"?

I posted about this in another thread...I"ve read accounts that they will have 14 FAs at the end of this season... the biggest being MAF (RA)..and next season Staal and Malkin...

MAF will expect a generous offer, and Malkin will expect near Crosby numbers..HOssa will command at least $6M - $7M on the market...in this age of the salary cap...you simply can't pay everybody...

[TrueBlueblood 0]

Serious question. I realize that they have an extremely young and talented group but nothing ive seen thus far shows that they're on track to be this decades Oilers.

Their core of Crosby-Malkin-Fleury is really all they have going into the future. Malkin is going to cost a pretty penny to resign. Hossa isn't going to come cheap either. Brooks Orpik and Malone are two other major pieces of their team that are up for contract. Lets also not forget Fleury.

But, on the flip side, you have a Detroit team that is dominating every team in the league. The entire roster is signed for the foreseeable future except for Zetterberg and Franzen. If Stuart is re-signed, that will solidify this exact roster for seasons to come. You can count on at least four seasons of Lidstrom-Rafalski, Kronwall-Stuart. Pavel is signed for seven years and Zetterberg will get a similar contract.

Whos to say that this team isn't in the perfect position to be the new "dynasty"?

You have to understand that this is Bettman's "new" nhl, and he happens to resent the original 6 teams, at least that's what I believe, so he probably has PR machines spouting this BS that the Pens are the next dynasty.

I heard him say that when teams like the Red Wings and Rangers, also Toronto/Montreal win it's a waste because they already have an established fanbase. Bettman favors the expansion teams so he is the one pushing the Pens and has since the end of the lockout. Pittsburgh gets way too much credit and respect from all the so-called experts and it's a shame that more people aren't giving the Wings their props. That may be because of the older average age of the players, but I don't think that should take anything away from them. It doesn't seem fair to me either.

Edited May 28, 2008 by TrueBlueblood

[toby91_ca 620]

I posted about this in another thread...I"ve read accounts that they will have 14 FAs at the end of this season... the biggest being MAF (RA)..and next season Staal and Malkin...

MAF will expect a generous offer, and Malkin will expect near Crosby numbers..HOssa will command at least $6M - $7M on the market...in this age of the salary cap...you simply can't pay everybody...

From everything that I have heard, Malkin will want a lot more than Crosby. The thing is, if players really felt they had something special going, they might consider taking less to keep the team together. In looking at Malkin, I'm not sure I see him doing that. It's become more recent as I didn't see it before. I'm not sure what it is, just a feeling I have.

P.S. this has nothing to do with any Greedy Russian theory.

[Seraph 240]

Serious question. I realize that they have an extremely young and talented group but nothing ive seen thus far shows that they're on track to be this decades Oilers.

Their core of Crosby-Malkin-Fleury is really all they have going into the future. Malkin is going to cost a pretty penny to resign. Hossa isn't going to come cheap either. Brooks Orpik and Malone are two other major pieces of their team that are up for contract. Lets also not forget Fleury.

But, on the flip side, you have a Detroit team that is dominating every team in the league. The entire roster is signed for the foreseeable future except for Zetterberg and Franzen. If Stuart is re-signed, that will solidify this exact roster for seasons to come. You can count on at least four seasons of Lidstrom-Rafalski, Kronwall-Stuart. Pavel is signed for seven years and Zetterberg will get a similar contract.

Whos to say that this team isn't in the perfect position to be the new "dynasty"?

I think a lot of the reason people see them as that is because Gretzky himself has predicted that Crosby will break a lot of his records. That paired with the fact that he's surrounded by a lot of brilliant and talented players makes it look like the beginnings of the Oilers dynasty.

[Dabura 12,207]

One word: marketing.

[BlueMonk 102]

I think it's mostly wishful thinking on the part of hockey fans, because it would signal a kind of renaissance for the league in terms of popularity and marketing. Look, all the people who were in favor of a salary cap have to understand that a symptom of that kind of economic system is that teams can't keep all their stars. The Pens have a window of opportunity here, but it's already going to close a little after this season when they have to make choices about who they're going to keep.

The challenge will be to get a winning tradition going that makes players want to stay and take a hometown discount. That breeds a winning culture that puts team before individual concerns like money and statistics. If you can manage that, you have a chance to be successful for a long time. You need look no further than the Red Wings for the template. Or the New England Patriots in the NFL (having illegal videotape doesn't hurt, either).

[irishtemper14+25 11]

i hear where you are coming from, but i dont think people are calling them a dynasty now. They are saying in 5 years with the exact same roster (assuming the young players live up to potential) that they should be a dynasty....but thats ridiculous

[Behind Enemy Lines in CO 11]

One word: marketing.

This is exactly why the league has pushed the Pens over the Wings recently. You need to look at the big picture of how to market the league.

Bettman is right in that having a win in a city where hockey is not on the front page of the sports section every night is a bigger deal than when an original 6 team does win. By having teams besides the Original 6 win they expand the fan base AND encourage advertisers to sign up. It is easier to convince a large company to spend advertising dollars on the NHL when they know someone in Florida or Arizona is also watching as opposed to only having a few cities in a few Eastern-oriented US states viewing their commercials.

Also, think of this situation as if you owned a company with several complimentary products. You have the old and trusted brand name (Wings here) that everyone knows but sometimes just does not get the job done (1999 & 2003 playoff upsets). You also have a new product that basically does the same thing however you can promote it in a sexy way (Crosby) and attract some new customers at the same time. What would you do? And do not start down the road about letting the Original 6 cities hang out to dry because of the lack of attention - this is a very sound marketing strategy that is in use every day by every major company. Yes, the hardcore fans are taken for granted in the NHL, as they are in every other sports league.

As a Wings fan living in Colorado, I see first hand the bandwagon fans and their support of the Dives. I also will bemoan the fact that the Wings do not get the respect they deserve. However, the only way for the Wings to get their respect is to put the puck in the net and win games.

[10 Minute Misconduct 104]

Penguins dynasty faces obstacles in Wings, salary cap

But today's question is this: will the parallel hold for the Penguins? Will they learn their lesson from being swept by the Wings — an outcome that appears highly likely after they were unable to muster even as much as a goal in the first two games — or are they just a shooting star in the sky, making their mark ever so briefly?

Unfortunately, it appears to be the latter. It's not a matter of ineptitude. A fairly qualified observer on the matter, Wayne Gretzky, says there are really three NHL seasons. The first is the regular season. Then come the playoffs. Then comes the Stanley Cup final.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nhl/story/8181314...ngs,-salary-cap

Edited May 28, 2008 by 10 Minute Misconduct

[VM1138 1,921]

You have to understand that this is Bettman's "new" nhl, and he happens to resent the original 6 teams, at least that's what I believe, so he probably has PR machines spouting this BS that the Pens are the next dynasty.

I heard him say that when teams like the Red Wings and Rangers, also Toronto/Montreal win it's a waste because they already have an established fanbase. Bettman favors the expansion teams so he is the one pushing the Pens and has since the end of the lockout. Pittsburgh gets way too much credit and respect from all the so-called experts and it's a shame that more people aren't giving the Wings their props. That may be because of the older average age of the players, but I don't think that should take anything away from them. It doesn't seem fair to me either.

That's absolutely stupid. No one in any form of business is stupid enough to believe that crapping all over ESTABLISHED fan bases in favor of creating non-existent ones is a smart policy. Sure, cultivate new fanbases, but totally neglecting and abusing the EXISTING ones that are keeping your league afloat is ridiculous.

This should've been hyped as the Finals to establish a Dynasty, not just a Pens dynasty. If the Wings win this thing, they're best positioned to win next year. Maybe they need to add a role player, or a more consistent scorer, preferably someone who has never won the Cup.

I think the key to breaking the second-Cup-run-itis is to bring on fresh faces who are just as eager to win it and can infect the team with that energy. So after a Cup win, secure what we have, and replace with a better scorer.

Honestly, I see the Wings as the dynasty to beat in the next few years. If any team can repeat in this day and age, it's the Wings, who have shown they only get better each year and have shown they can break all the assumed conventions of the post-cap era.