Malone leaving Pittsburgh

[YoungGuns1340 1]

http://blog.dispatch.com/cbj/2008/06/tremo...d_tidbits.shtml

The Pens have apparently offered the rights to Ryan Malone to the Columbus Blue Jackets. Its not a sign and trade, so I doubt the BJs will give up much to get Malones rights. This info was apparently confirmed on a Pittsburgh news broadcast.

If the Jackets dont sign him, hell become a UFA. The Pens apparently are going to use Malones space to re-sign Hossa.

I dont mind this move myself. Columbus needs a legit center before they become a big threat, and Malone wont help there. And this just means a key piece is gone for the Pens who are looking real top heavy and wont have any top 2 picks in the 1st round to bulk up on young talent anymore.

[Shaman 713]

Well too bad for them, because it sounds like Hossa is going to Montreal.

[katiephd 0]

Well too bad for them, because it sounds like Hossa is going to Montreal.

Whoa, what?

I'm not disputing the possibility or that it may be a rumor. I just haven't heard that. I just did a google search for "hossa montreal," and all that came up were a bunch of trade rumors from February.

Hmm. Is it bad that I'd like to see Hossa leave Pittsburgh just because I don't exactly wish success on the Penguins? Oops.

[Shaman 713]

Hate to give up my source, but its eklund, i know, really a good one... but seriously, I have a buddy in Montreal and their talking about it in their media i guess.

Edited June 14, 2008 by Shaman464

[PaVel DaTsYuK fan13 0]

I would absolutely love to see Pittsburgh get screwed over and lose Malone and Hossa, but I doubt they would trade the rights to Malone if they didn't think they could re-sign hossa.

[Cicada 4]

i hope Malone likes broken noses...

playing the wings 6 times a year guarantees at least 2 broken noses, although in fairness his own teammate did one of them. i do credit the to stuart and kronwall though since they stopped him from getting out of the way

[Superman54 91]

that would be a good benifit for the jackets, but they are still missing alot on defense to be a threat. I hope Hossa somehow slips away from the Pens.

[SnipeShow 0]

Marian Hossa ---> Pheonix to play with Marcel Hossa? just a thought...

sorry to derail topic

[akustyk 84]

Malone was one of their best guys in playoffs. he at least did care

and tried to do something. dumping him to keep Hossa doesn't

seem like a good option to me.

I'd love to see Malone in Winged Wheel but can't see this happening.

[Hockeytown0001 7,652]

Definately happy to play in Columbus? Maybe all those shots to the nose somehow had an affect on his mental capacity...

[Drake_Marcus 890]

Malone was one of their best guys in playoffs. he at least did care

and tried to do something. dumping him to keep Hossa doesn't

seem like a good option to me.

I'd love to see Malone in Winged Wheel but can't see this happening.

QFT

[Blood On The Ice 15]

Hope they lose Hossa too.

Edited June 14, 2008 by Blood On The Ice

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Itll be interesting to see what happens. Even with the cap going up, they have a ton of players who are gonna eat up cap space like crazy next year with no one around to take a significant pay cut.

Hossa, Fleury, Staal, Orpik, Malkin, and Sykora are all in line for a significant raise either this season or next. Between Malkin, Crosby, Hossa, and Fleury, youre looking at a possible 30 million for 4 players.

Edited June 14, 2008 by YoungGuns1340

[kylee 727]

hmm well if they use Malone's money to resign Hossa i guess that works for them. You will still have to deal with the 3 top players for Pittsburgh: Crosby, Malkin, Hossa. Coming into the Cup finals i was very scared of their offense, not so much anymore

and of all the places Ryan Malone would end up, Columbus.

[Dominator2005 558]

I would love to have Malone in Detroit

Zetterberg - Dats - Homer

Cleary - Franzen - Malone

Flip - Hudler - Sammy (Helm)

McCarty - Draper - Maltby

[cirov19 1]

Malone will leave..

Hossa, 29, can become an unrestricted free agent July 1 and the Penguins are hoping their offer, believed to be seven-years worth just over $50 million, will keep him from hitting the open market.

http://www.thefourthperiod.com/news/pit080614.html

[chrisdetroit 189]

Itll be interesting to see what happens. Even with the cap going up, they have a ton of players who are gonna eat up cap space like crazy next year with no one around to take a significant pay cut.

Hossa, Fleury, Staal, Orpik, Malkin, and Sykora are all in line for a significant raise either this season or next. Between Malkin, Crosby, Hossa, and Fleury, youre looking at a possible 30 million for 4 players.

It doesn't matter. Even if they were able to keep everybody (which they can't), they are no match for the Wings. They scored 10 goals against us in 6 games which is only 1.67 goals/game. We shut them down.

They will lose at least a few of their top players and will be worse next year than this year. I wouldn't expect to see them in the finals next year and even if they are, it won't matter. Their team is built on a handful of superstars and a bunch of free agents. They gave away alot of their young talented guys to get Hossa. Not exactly a good strategy.

Oh, and their coaching is below average.

The top teams next year will probaly be;

The Wings

San Jose

Aneheim (if they can sign somebody that can score)

Dallas

Montreal ?

Ottawa?

[B.B. 0]

I think this is a good move by the Pens. If you look at their salary situation and you account for the upcoming salary increases for Malkin, Fleury and Staal, the Pens could either try to re-sign both Orpik and Malone or just go for Hossa. It looks like they are going for Hossa.

Hossa is a legit superstar and was their second best forward in the playoffs. It is a no-brainer to keep a guy like him. Now, they will probably bump Stall and Talbot into top six roles. A top 6 of Crosby, Malkin, Hossa, Sykora, Talbot and Stall is good. Easily one of the best in the league, if not the best in the league. Everyone except Sykora figures to be better next year. Now, they still need better defensemen in order to be at our level, but I think this is a step in the right direction for them.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Malone will leave..

http://www.thefourthperiod.com/news/pit080614.html

They want to sign him for 7.15M? He can get a good 1M more than that on the open market at least.

[eva unit zero 271]

I think this is a good move by the Pens. If you look at their salary situation and you account for the upcoming salary increases for Malkin, Fleury and Staal, the Pens could either try to re-sign both Orpik and Malone or just go for Hossa. It looks like they are going for Hossa.

Hossa is a legit superstar and was their second best forward in the playoffs. It is a no-brainer to keep a guy like him. Now, they will probably bump Stall and Talbot into top six roles. A top 6 of Crosby, Malkin, Hossa, Sykora, Talbot and Stall is good. Easily one of the best in the league, if not the best in the league. Everyone except Sykora figures to be better next year. Now, they still need better defensemen in order to be at our level, but I think this is a step in the right direction for them.

The Penguins currently have under contract six forwards and six defensemen who dressed in the finals. The total cap hit for those 12 players is about $32m. Orpik is the only regular defenseman unsigned, and he is going to be SEVERELY overpaid this summer. Malone is a versatile depth forward but is not worth the $3-4 million he is going to likely get. If you budget $7.5m for Hossa, the Pens then have about $16m to sign at least 2 goalies, 1 defenseman, and 6 forwards. Fleury will likely see around $5m. Malkin and Staal will both be RFA after this season, so figure another $6m in raises is coming then. If you hold that space open, then the Penguins have $5m to fill out 1 G, 1 D, and 6 F. They can probably fill their fourth line, 13th forward, seventh D spot, and add Sabourin as backup (already under contract) for a total of $3.5m, leaving about $1.5m to sign two more forwards; that kind of money gets them nobody above the third line. Look for the Pens to try and shovel off Darryl Sydor's contract for a low-paid second or third line forward or a draft pick.They would also have to add one more depth d-man, for a salary close to $500k. That extra cap space allows them to retain Dupuis, who played well with Crosby and Hossa. Assuming they are able to retain primarily returning roster players, here is what the regular lines might look like:

Dupuis/Crosby/Hossa

Talbot/Malkin/Sykora

Kennedy/Staal/Ruutu

Roberts/Hall/Laraque

Gonchar/Gill

Letang/Whitney

Scuderi/Goligoski

This lineup might not be as formidable right now as the one seen in the finals...but it has the advantage of sustainability. and a lot of those guys; notably Staal, Whitney, Kennedy, and Malkin, have bright futures and are likely to perform considerably better in future playoff runs than they did this time around.

[edicius 3,269]

They want to sign him for 7.15M? He can get a good 1M more than that on the open market at least.

I was thinking the same thing. It all really comes down to whether or not Hossa will take a paycut to stay in Pittsburgh, because this offer is undoubtedly a paycut.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

The Penguins currently have under contract six forwards and six defensemen who dressed in the finals. The total cap hit for those 12 players is about $32m. Orpik is the only regular defenseman unsigned, and he is going to be SEVERELY overpaid this summer. Malone is a versatile depth forward but is not worth the $3-4 million he is going to likely get. If you budget $7.5m for Hossa, the Pens then have about $16m to sign at least 2 goalies, 1 defenseman, and 6 forwards. Fleury will likely see around $5m. Malkin and Staal will both be RFA after this season, so figure another $6m in raises is coming then. If you hold that space open, then the Penguins have $5m to fill out 1 G, 1 D, and 6 F. They can probably fill their fourth line, 13th forward, seventh D spot, and add Sabourin as backup (already under contract) for a total of $3.5m, leaving about $1.5m to sign two more forwards; that kind of money gets them nobody above the third line. Look for the Pens to try and shovel off Darryl Sydor's contract for a low-paid second or third line forward or a draft pick.They would also have to add one more depth d-man, for a salary close to $500k. That extra cap space allows them to retain Dupuis, who played well with Crosby and Hossa. Assuming they are able to retain primarily returning roster players, here is what the regular lines might look like:

Dupuis/Crosby/Hossa

Talbot/Malkin/Sykora

Kennedy/Staal/Ruutu

Roberts/Hall/Laraque

Gonchar/Gill

Letang/Whitney

Scuderi/Goligoski

This lineup might not be as formidable right now as the one seen in the finals...but it has the advantage of sustainability. and a lot of those guys; notably Staal, Whitney, Kennedy, and Malkin, have bright futures and are likely to perform considerably better in future playoff runs than they did this time around.

Its not really about this season upcoming season though. Its about the season after that. And if Shero isnt smart about THIS season, hell screw himself over for the next, unless he has some serious talent in the Wings that he can use to replace the likes of Gill, Sykora, and Dupuis who are ALL going to get raises after next year. Pittsburgh has ONE season to repeat with their current roster.

Dupuis - currently 880k, market price will be at least 2M after playing on Crosby or Malkins wing for a season ( he had 11 points in 13 games after being traded to the Pitts)

Sykora - same deal as dupuis, except with his reputation, he could easily see 3.5-4M

Fleury - hell get around 5M, and the closest comparison to him is Lundqvist. Most other tenders of Fleurys calibre have outdated contracts signed under lower caps. Not to mention, they can only sign him to one or two years if they do make it to arbitration. If they choose to sign him to a one year contract, they could be in even deeper trouble come the 09-10 season.

Hossa - 7.5 is a good figure

Malkin - 8.5 is a modest estimate here

Orpik - he made 1M this year, but he became vastly overrated in the playoffs alone, and could see 3M

Staal - theyll lock him up to a long-term contract, which at his age, likely means hell be overpaid in the beginning years. Hes already made 2.2M with bonuses. Staal will be banking on signing his contract with his full potential in mind. The kid could see - as crazy as it sounds - 4-5 million. A this point in his career, hes a young Patrick Sharp, whos nearly at that 4M mark as of now.

Gill - His stock has already risen significantly. He could earn a 500k raise easily should he have another strong performance next year.

09-10

Dupuis (2) - Crosby (8.7) - Hossa (7.5)

Talbot (1.2) - Malkin (8.5) - Sykora (3.5)

Kennedy(800k) - Staal (4) - Ruutu(1.2)

Roberts (1.5) - Hall (800k) - Laraque(1)

13th (500k)

Gonchar(5) - Gill (2.5)

Whitney (4) - Orpik (3)

Letang (835k) - Scuderi (1)

7th (500k)

Fleury (5)

Sabourin (800k)

Total: 64M

Now lets say they only get Staal for a great deal at 3.3M or so long-term, Roberts retires and is replaced with some youngster making 700k, and Orpik is let go and replaced this season with Goligoski, who will make around 1M (he made 984k this year). Thats still a salary hit of nearly 61M per season. Also keep in mind that replacing guys like Sykora and Dupuis - should they choose that route - with guys of equal calibre that will take significantly less pay is nearly impossible unless done through a trade with a team that is rebuilding. Even then, if they manage to cut salary elsewhere and can cut a million or so, thats still nearly 60M in salary on your basic 22.

Not only would that projected 09-10 team have either little or no room to move or be over the cap limit (the cap going up 5-6 million next year would be unlikely), but they'll have a weaker team than whats shaping up to be the 08-09 squad as well as this season.

Edited June 15, 2008 by YoungGuns1340

[mpitts 0]

I was thinking the same thing. It all really comes down to whether or not Hossa will take a paycut to stay in Pittsburgh, because this offer is undoubtedly a paycut.

Hossa has already publicly stated that he will take less money to play for a winner.

[miksteri 55]

8.7 for Crosby? why didnt he sign for less to make room for other players?

If i was a superstar like him, id take a paycut to get caproom for other good players in the team, but thats just me thinking...

8.7mill or 7mill or even 6mill? so what? You would still live happily ever after with that money, of course, then there are his sponsorship income too. Still lives in SuperMarios mansion? wtf!?

[eva unit zero 271]

Its not really about this season upcoming season though. Its about the season after that. And if Shero isnt smart about THIS season, hell screw himself over for the next, unless he has some serious talent in the Wings that he can use to replace the likes of Gill, Sykora, and Dupuis who are ALL going to get raises after next year. Pittsburgh has ONE season to repeat with their current roster.

Dupuis - currently 880k, market price will be at least 2M after playing on Crosby or Malkins wing for a season ( he had 11 points in 13 games after being traded to the Pitts)

Sykora - same deal as dupuis, except with his reputation, he could easily see 3.5-4M

Fleury - hell get around 5M, and the closest comparison to him is Lundqvist. Most other tenders of Fleurys calibre have outdated contracts signed under lower caps. Not to mention, they can only sign him to one or two years if they do make it to arbitration. If they choose to sign him to a one year contract, they could be in even deeper trouble come the 09-10 season.

Hossa - 7.5 is a good figure

Malkin - 8.5 is a modest estimate here

Orpik - he made 1M this year, but he became vastly overrated in the playoffs alone, and could see 3M

Staal - theyll lock him up to a long-term contract, which at his age, likely means hell be overpaid in the beginning years. Hes already made 2.2M with bonuses. Staal will be banking on signing his contract with his full potential in mind. The kid could see - as crazy as it sounds - 4-5 million. A this point in his career, hes a young Patrick Sharp, whos nearly at that 4M mark as of now.

Gill - His stock has already risen significantly. He could earn a 500k raise easily should he have another strong performance next year.

09-10

Dupuis (2) - Crosby (8.7) - Hossa (7.5)

Talbot (1.2) - Malkin (8.5) - Sykora (3.5)

Kennedy(800k) - Staal (4) - Ruutu(1.2)

Roberts (1.5) - Hall (800k) - Laraque(1)

13th (500k)

Gonchar(5) - Gill (2.5)

Whitney (4) - Orpik (3)

Letang (835k) - Scuderi (1)

7th (500k)

Fleury (5)

Sabourin (800k)

Total: 64M

Now lets say they only get Staal for a great deal at 3.3M or so long-term, Roberts retires and is replaced with some youngster making 700k, and Orpik is let go and replaced this season with Goligoski, who will make around 1M (he made 984k this year). Thats still a salary hit of nearly 61M per season. Also keep in mind that replacing guys like Sykora and Dupuis - should they choose that route - with guys of equal calibre that will take significantly less pay is nearly impossible unless done through a trade with a team that is rebuilding. Even then, if they manage to cut salary elsewhere and can cut a million or so, thats still nearly 60M in salary on your basic 22.

Not only would that projected 09-10 team have either little or no room to move or be over the cap limit (the cap going up 5-6 million next year would be unlikely), but they'll have a weaker team than whats shaping up to be the 08-09 squad as well as this season.

You must have missed the point in my post when I stated I was saving $6m under next season's cap to allot for Malkin and Staal getting raises. Based on my numbers, the Pens next year would be around 50m. When I filled out the lines I only used existing names on the condition that all of those players could be retained within the salary constraints the Pens have for those positions. If the Pens cannot do so, as you seem to feel, they will replace them with players who can fit into those cost conditions. I personally don't see Gary Roberts demanding $1.5m when he was a healthy scratch to start the finals. The Pens will pay him less than $1m, or he will not be playing for them. Ray Shero knows he needs to focus on retaining as much of his skilled youth as possible, not overpaying fourth line veterans who are not key pieces. Roberts and Ruutu will be making less than $1m if they stay in Pittsburgh. Laraque probably goes elsewhere if he doesn't sign for less than 750k.

Laraque and Ruutu were both overpaid and 30+ when they came to Pittsburgh. Neither are worth to the Penguins what you are suggesting they will be paid; both are replaceable by cheap young players who will do what they do just as well for the salary the Pens can affor to pay.

As far as Orpik...he is not worth $3m. He might get it, but the guy is going to be a #3 defenseman and PK specialist for the majority of his career. Think about it...Orpik is probably the 4th best defenseman Pittsburgh had last season. Most people think Brad Stuart at $3m is iffy for a 4th defenseman. Well guess what; Brad Stuart would be, at worst the #3 defenseman on last year's Penguins. Possibly the #2.

Orpik might get a little better, but he's the same age as Nik Kronwall and not nearly as good...and he's not as good as Kronwall was when he signed his deal. Based on the fact that most on here lambasted Ken Holland for signing that deal, and the fact that 'potential' has been given as a major reason why young players should get more than a comparably skilled veteran....I see no reason for Brooks Orpik, who is older but worse than Kronner was when Nik was 'overpaid' I see no reason for Orpik to make upwards of $2m. He'll probably get more from a team that thinks he can be a #1...but I don't think he's worth that much.

Also...I never said the Pens would be as good as they were last year; it's fairly obvious that by losing a top-four defenseman and a top-six forward and replacing them with a 7th defenseman and a fourth line the Pens will be worse; but they will be sustainable using the requirements I laid out.

At some point, I expect one of Malkin, Staal, or Crosby-likelihood in that order-to be either traded or converted full-time to the wing. Think of the 1995-96 Red Wings and Fedorov/Yzerman/Primeau. Primeau was the worst of the three defensively and on faceoffs, and didn't want to play wing. Had Keith been willing to play left wing, the Wings might never trade for Shanahan.

If Malkin is willing to be converted to wing full-time, he might stay on, giving the Pens a top-four of Crosby, Malkin, Hossa, and Staal down the road on their two scoring lines. With the Pens apparently not giving much effort to retaining Malone, I can see this being a likely solution.

However, I expect Staal to play third line most of next season, and here's why:

He's in a contract year, and he was successful as the checking line center this past year. This allows the Penguins to justify keeping a more talented player in a role that reduces his scoring output without feeling the heat from the PA. Then they sign him to a more reasonable deal, and put him on the top two lines.

EDIT: Orpik is a good #3 at best, meaning among all defenseman, he is in the top 90 but not the top 60. The 61st-paid defenseman last season made $2.6m, and the 90th paid defenseman made 1.824. If Orpik is on the high side of that, he makes between $2.2m and $2.6m. He's 27, so it's not like he is still oozing potential to skyrocket in his performance. The best you'll get is maybe a minor improvement over the next couple years. He's not going to pull a Kronwall and go from depth defenseman to star; Kronner did it at a younger age and is actually younger than Orpik.

Edited June 15, 2008 by eva unit zero