Hockeytown Red Wings 245 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 NHL Commissioner Darren Pang? Hell, I'd be ok with that. Darren Pang is a great hockey guy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BuckeyeWingsfan80 209 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Except the KHL can not sustain such salaries with their paltry revenues. Bettman just needs to go - get in an actual hockey guy as a commissioner, not an NBA reject, and I think the NHL can flourish again.... it is already doing so, depite Bettman. The KHL doesn't know that and their clubs won't admit it to the players..... I'm telling you, the Cup doesn't necessarily mean as much to the Europeans as it does to the Canadians and the Americans. More issues like this one, especially when it ONLY involved european players is going to sour the situation further. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coolio Mendez 7 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 (edited) Except the KHL can not sustain such salaries with their paltry revenues. Bettman just needs to go - get in an actual hockey guy as a commissioner, not an NBA reject, and I think the NHL can flourish again.... it is already doing so, depite Bettman. What's wrong with what Bettman's doing? The owners and players are extremely happy with what Bettman has done for them (increased revenues, increased profits, increased exposure). The NHL has outpaced both the NBA and MLB in revenue growth and television audience in the past 15 years. Between 1986 and 1993, Gary Bettman increased NBA revenues by 211% (revenue growth has slowed since he left)e, their TV audience by 361% (it's fallen since he left), and was named Street and Smith's Sports Businessman of the year 3x. Since 1993, Gary Bettman has increased NHL revenues by 430%, he's increased player salaries by 246%, television revenue has doubled since Ziegler left office, and the television audience has increased 3.6% in the US, and 13.5% in Canada. He was also named Street and Smith's Sports businessman of the year twice more (including the year after the lockout). He's done what the owners have asked him to do. And as long as he does what THEY want, his job security is pretty good. Edited January 25, 2009 by Coolio Mendez Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BuckeyeWingsfan80 209 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 The NHL is the cream of the crop as far as talent goes. Minus the Olympics, winning the Cup is the highest honor for a professional hockey player. I think that's the point of the picture. Who says winning the Cup is of the same value to a player from outside of North American AND not already in the NHL? Different people, different cultures. This episode won't do it probably, but at some point you are going to see more players go the Jagr route. It's just a matter of whether those players even considered playing in the NHL or not. The NHL, as a whole, has a public perception problem, the point of my point which was muddied by a very cryptic picture that still doesn't make sense, episodes like this and "leadership" like we've seen from Toronto is only going to worsen the situation and make leagues like the KHL that much more aggressive. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Statts 4 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Except the KHL can not sustain such salaries with their paltry revenues. Bettman just needs to go - get in an actual hockey guy as a commissioner, not an NBA reject, and I think the NHL can flourish again.... it is already doing so, depite Bettman. Exactly. Some owners are throwing money at high profile players, but there nothing more than toys that they are paying out of their own pocket. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Statts 4 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Who says winning the Cup is of the same value to a player from outside of North American AND not already in the NHL? Different people, different cultures. This episode won't do it probably, but at some point you are going to see more players go the Jagr route. It's just a matter of whether those players even considered playing in the NHL or not. The NHL, as a whole, has a public perception problem, the point of my point which was muddied by a very cryptic picture that still doesn't make sense, episodes like this and "leadership" like we've seen from Toronto is only going to worsen the situation and make leagues like the KHL that much more aggressive. Ok, maybe not winning the Cup, but the NHL is where the best hockey athletes play. Any serious athlete wants to compete at the highest level, which is the NHL. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yzerman191 37 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 (edited) Who says winning the Cup is of the same value to a player from outside of North American AND not already in the NHL? Different people, different cultures. This episode won't do it probably, but at some point you are going to see more players go the Jagr route. It's just a matter of whether those players even considered playing in the NHL or not. The NHL, as a whole, has a public perception problem, the point of my point which was muddied by a very cryptic picture that still doesn't make sense, episodes like this and "leadership" like we've seen from Toronto is only going to worsen the situation and make leagues like the KHL that much more aggressive. While we can't generalize, the Stanley Cup is a huge deal for hockey players no matter where you go. Players look at the NHL as a place where they can compete against the best of the best for the highest salaries, for international recognition, and for the ultimate trophy. I don't care where you're from, be it Russia, Sweden, Finland, etc; if you're a hockey player with the highest of aspirations, the NHL is where you want to be. Also, I think the recent death in a KHL hockey game (due to negligence) stands to discourage players from playing there more than a few dumb policies of Gary Bettman. And for the record, Jagr was quoted by THN saying that if Mario Lemieux called him up today and offered him a spot on the Penguins' roster for the league minimum, he'd have to "think very hard on it." Doesn't sound like jumping ship for the money was worth it to him, and Jagr is a guy that is reputedly a very "greedy" player. Edited January 25, 2009 by Yzerman191 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heroes of Hockeytown 694 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 As best I can tell, there's nothing in writing anywhere about this rule, apparently being more or less a "gentlemen's agreement" between the GMs and League. With that being said, I think it's Holland and the Red Wings' duty to politely blow them off and ice Nick and Pavel anyways. What are they gonna do about it? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
55fan 5,133 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 As best I can tell, there's nothing in writing anywhere about this rule, apparently being more or less a "gentlemen's agreement" between the GMs and League. With that being said, I think it's Holland and the Red Wings' duty to politely blow them off and ice Nick and Pavel anyways. What are they gonna do about it? Theoretically, they could force the Wings to forfeit for playing ineligible players. I doubt it will come to that since they weren't planning to play them when they decided to bow out of the ASG due to injuries. With Datsyuk's injury, who even knows if he'll be ready to play then? Has anyone heard how serious it is? Those hip flexors can be a pain in the butt. Too bad it was a gentlemen's agreement (same conclusion I've reached, BTW). If it was in writing, they could force Bettman to suspend Crosby, per the original statement. I like Crosby, but I'm miffed at his suggestion that Nick and Pav just wanted rest. Maybe he didn't mean it that way, but the implication was pretty strong. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
egroen 384 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 (edited) What's wrong with what Bettman's doing? The owners and players are extremely happy with what Bettman has done for them (increased revenues, increased profits, increased exposure). The NHL has outpaced both the NBA and MLB in revenue growth and television audience in the past 15 years. Between 1986 and 1993, Gary Bettman increased NBA revenues by 211% (revenue growth has slowed since he left)e, their TV audience by 361% (it's fallen since he left), and was named Street and Smith's Sports Businessman of the year 3x. Since 1993, Gary Bettman has increased NHL revenues by 430%, he's increased player salaries by 246%, television revenue has doubled since Ziegler left office, and the television audience has increased 3.6% in the US, and 13.5% in Canada. He was also named Street and Smith's Sports businessman of the year twice more (including the year after the lockout). He's done what the owners have asked him to do. And as long as he does what THEY want, his job security is pretty good. You're giving Bettman a lot of credit there, for things that may or may not have been entirely his doing - especially considering he was not even the commissioner of the NBA during that time. The fact is he is the only commissioner in all of North American pro sports to lose a full season and another half season due to labor disputes, and not a world war. Fans have literally lost 10% of hockey during his tenure as commissioner. I have a tough time excusing that. Edited January 25, 2009 by egroen Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
puckloo39 5,686 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 (edited) Too bad it was a gentlemen's agreement (same conclusion I've reached, BTW). If it was in writing, they could force Bettman to suspend Crosby, per the original statement. I like Crosby, but I'm miffed at his suggestion that Nick and Pav just wanted rest. Maybe he didn't mean it that way, but the implication was pretty strong. Crosby is a child, literally. A very talented one, but a child in many ways. He'll never be Steve Yzerman, that's for certain. Here's what an actual all-star calibre player had to say: from hockey news Jerome Iginla sez: "Lidstrom's been at a lot of all-star games and he's played a lot of long seasons, which is a good thing - you want to win championships," said Iginla. "I don't think as players here we judge that situation. [i supposed he's referring to whether Lidstrom's absence, or Datsyuk's, is an issue with the players] "A lot of us would love to be in that situation, where you've had longer seasons and been in so many all-star games." Apparently, the PTB in the All Star selection underground flat-out turned down Rafalski and HOSSA as replacements for Nick and Pasha. I have no link to substantiate, but I believe I read that somewhere. I can see why Bettman would want names like Nick and Pasha, but Raffi and Hossa aren't exactly chopped liver. The whole thing is suspect. I hope they re-vamp it next season or drop it entirely. EDIT: based on the post below, I now know the Wings who could have stepped in declined. My bad... but I don't blame them. There is such a thing as taking one for the team, and then there's team solidarity. Maybe the entire squad decided to hang with Nick and Pasha and refuse to participate. I'm with them. Edited January 25, 2009 by puckloo39 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
randomwingsfan 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writ...ex.html?eref=T1 Michael Farber on cnnsi.com rips into Bettman. Lead story on their main page right now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
egroen 384 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Don't think Lidstrom's and Datsyuk's images are being tarnished as a result of the way Bettman handled this? Articles like this are all over the place: http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/star+a...5408/story.html All-star absentees 'spoiled brats' by Theo Fleury Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HockeytownRN 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Don't think Lidstrom's and Datsyuk's images are being tarnished as a result of the way Bettman handled this? Articles like this are all over the place: http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/star+a...5408/story.html All-star absentees 'spoiled brats' by Theo Fleury "I bet some of these new guys don’t even know who Ted Lindsay is. Have a chat with this Hall of Famer and I guarantee when he’s done you’ll have a whole new respect for the game and what these guys did for your spoiled asses. This is not about you, it’s about it’s about tradition. Get with the program" This story is unbelievable! I'm sure Pavs and Lids have no idea who Ted Lindsay is. Has he been around to watch Lidstrom the past 10 years?! He talks about never being hit while playing in the ASG....has he ever played INJURED?! I think it is rediculous that all of this is happening b/c of a spur-of-the-moment decision the day before the ASG. I bet Nik and Pavel will be told certain things they can say about this, but I would LOOOVE to be a fly on the wall to hear what they really think. Wish they could defend themselves right now though as this is only getting further out of control if you ask me. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
puckloo39 5,686 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Don't think Lidstrom's and Datsyuk's images are being tarnished as a result of the way Bettman handled this? Articles like this are all over the place: http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/star+a...5408/story.html All-star absentees 'spoiled brats' by Theo Fleury this couldn't be any funnier if it actually WAS a joke. Theo Fleury, of all people, calling out ... anyone? Never mind Nick and Pavel? It's January, otherwise I would assume this is an April Fool's joke. I can't imagine that anyone with an ounce of intelligence would give this article any credence. However, I assume that most hockey fans possess an ounce of sense, in that case. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reds4Life 51 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 I guess Theo started drinking again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjlegend 155 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 With the allegedly "injured" and "excused from the Young Stars game" Steve Mason in net, Columbus is getting their ass kicked Jan. 27. 8-0. I'm actually kind of glad these guys get an extra game off at this time of year, but I just wish it wasn't league-imposed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
asmith18 3 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Bettman is an idiot in every way. Just b/c his superstar Crosby won't be playing, the Red Wings pay the cost. I'd rather have a healthy wings lineup than them play in the all-star game. The voting was prolly rigged anyway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RockyMountainWingGal 108 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 I actually find it interesting that the league asked for other Red Wings players instead of the two that pulled out, and reportedly (TSN) the Wings said no. Maybe that was when they decided to go ahead with the one game suspensions. Crap I would have sent Huds and Raffy or something similar and just avoided the whole thing..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 I actually find it interesting that the league asked for other Red Wings players instead of the two that pulled out, and reportedly (TSN) the Wings said no. Maybe that was when they decided to go ahead with the one game suspensions. Crap I would have sent Huds and Raffy or something similar and just avoided the whole thing..... Or they could have the ASG at the end of the season and avoid ALL of this. esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
redwing19 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Sure criticize the guy, but people on this board blow things out of proportion calling for his head. I'm not the biggest Bettman fan but he sure as hell has done more good for the game then most people have come to realize. What has he done for the league, he has watered the product down by expanding in areas where hockey is just a pastime ( Florida,California,Arizona; what do you see common with these areas that I do not, to me these areas mean sun and beaches not hockey. ) You seem to me to be to young to know what hockey was and should be. Expansion should have stopped after the WHL was brought in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coolio Mendez 7 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 You're giving Bettman a lot of credit there, for things that may or may not have been entirely his doing - especially considering he was not even the commissioner of the NBA during that time. The fact is he is the only commissioner in all of North American pro sports to lose a full season and another half season due to labor disputes, and not a world war. Fans have literally lost 10% of hockey during his tenure as commissioner. I have a tough time excusing that. Those are facts and facts don't lie, I'm not making up those stat People get on him because he was the commissioner during the lockouts? Well guess what, if you were the commissioner, there still would have been a lockout......or else you would be out of a job. The league is a business and needs to be run like a business, and not all customers are going to get what they want. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coolio Mendez 7 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 What has he done for the league, he has watered the product down by expanding in areas where hockey is just a pastime ( Florida,California,Arizona; what do you see common with these areas that I do not, to me these areas mean sun and beaches not hockey. ) You seem to me to be to young to know what hockey was and should be. Expansion should have stopped after the WHL was brought in. Florida? California? Arizona? Can you explain to me when Bettman brought those teams in? Bettman has only added 4 teams to the NHL, all other teams were added by John Ziegler (San Jose, Anaheim, Tampa, and Miami) - Atlanta (failed once but 26 owners liked the money they would be getting) - Columbus (which has been financially profitable) - St. Paul (which has been financially profitable) - Nashville (which had an excellent prospectus and raised initial funds faster than any franchise in NHL history) Read what I had typed up in the previous page. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edicius 3,269 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 Don't think Lidstrom's and Datsyuk's images are being tarnished as a result of the way Bettman handled this? Articles like this are all over the place: http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/star+a...5408/story.html All-star absentees 'spoiled brats' by Theo Fleury In all my years playing and watching the game I never once (saw) the likes of it. Did Wayne ever pull the chute? Mario? Stevie Y? Mess? Brodeur? Theo obviously didn't pay attention last year. Dumbass. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ms_Hockey 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2009 The world is changing. And the KHL among others are actually trying to compete. Some good to great players will gravitate to wear the money talks and they aren't treated like cheap rentals for exhibitions like what Bettman is doing here. I don't think it's changed to a point where hockey players don't understand the importance of the Stanley Cup. Even with Bettman trying to dig his grimy little fingernails into everything, the amount of determination and pure skill it takes to get your hands on that Cup is well known - even outside of the US & Canada. Even if a player would much rather stay in the KHL, there's a certain amount of respect there for a team who has won Lord Stanley. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites