Osgood proves he doesn't deserve No. 1 spot

[Guest E_S_A_D]

Gotta go with the best Goalie for our team this year...

Ty Conklin.

[Booster313 138]

Some of the goals last night were defensive break downs, but as many have pointed out you get a good goaltender to cover defensive breakdowns. If the defense doesn't ever make a mistake one could argue that nearly anyone with the basic mechanics and a few years of NHL experience could tend goal.

That being said I am not hanging him completely out to dry. There really are no other options out that. Either Osgood will work through his lapse in play or he won't if he doesn't Babcock will go with Ty. That's all there really is to it. We can discuss all we want and yes it is a concern but the fact is Osgood still have a 50/50 chance at being our starting goaltender for the playoffs and only he and Babcock can make that decision.

[Holmstrom96 347]

You can only blame him for the third goal last night. We still need better defense.

[The Secret 304]

I have never thought of Osgood as a starter despite him having great career stats. He has times when he plays great but most of the time he plays adequate enough to get the job done backing a team like Detroit. This year his confidence is gone, maybe its his mojo thats gone... what ever it is he is playing AHL quality hockey and it will cripple us in the play offs. The defense this season hasn't been what we are used too seeing but come on folks, how is it that its the Defense's fault every time Osgood is in net? He never has a chance on any of the goals that get by him... except for the one's from the Red line. Get him a psychiatrist, send him back to goalie school, do what ever it takes to get him playing the way we need him to and in the meanwhile let Conklin get the starts and if possible let's see what our boys in GR might do with a game or 2.... they can't be any worse then Osgood.

[Herr Hockey 0]

As much of an Ozzie fan that I am, I have to think that people are crazy if they want to just brush off his play. It is too reminiscent of Hasek last year. And by that I mean that people can make as many excuses as they want for him on a game-by-game basis, but there's a reason that he is playing poor consistently. If the playoffs started tomorrow, I would trust neither Osgood or Conklin to win 16 games, let alone 4 against the sharks. It's a serious problem as of now, and I think some are in denial about it. That said, we know what Osgood is capable of (some are quick to forget). If he gets on his game, look out.

[maltbymaniac 13]

It's never his fault. Don't say defensmen didn't do there job bla bla bla. Well that's why there's the goalie. So he could stop what the defensmen can't. If the Defense could do everything, why we even dressing a goalie for?

Osgood is responsible for all the goals he let in.

Let's make this clear, I love Osood but I'm honnest guy and I don't let my favorite player get in the way of the truth.

This year up to now HE SUCKS, HAS BEEN PLAYING TERRIBLE / IS PLAYING TERRIBLE ... don't know if he will play like this in the playoffs.

Conklin is playing much better then he is now so I rather go with him. End of story

THIS POST IS SPOT ON.

[b.shanafan14 733]

:nonono:

[wingfan1991 221]

THIS POST IS SPOT ON.

i totally agree with that post.. but then again we're not "true Wings fans" if we do, lol.. some people kill me.

what kills me even more is all the Ozzie interviews, how he keeps on and on about "i feel great, i feel like i'm back to my old self".. UMMM REALLY? god I hate to see when you feel or think you're bad...

[spydrwebb 0]

if conklin started the game, he lets those first two pucks go by him... the third goal ozzie might have been able to stop.

regardless, this is just another blame the goalie thread and it gets old.

our captain summed it up:

When analyzing this current four-game slide, Nicklas Lidstrom looks to the defensive end as to where the Wings have hurt themselves.

"We've been defensively playing with the puck in our own zone too much," Lidstrom said. "We've been looking at the puck and not picking up players. We have to be quicker on pucks and get pucks out quicker."

go back and watch the games... it IS the defense and NOTHING more needs to be said.... really.

[JayUp88 1]

Sometime I wonder if anyone on here (ok not everyone) really knows what hockey is? Let alone even watch the games or do they just look at the scores later at night after watching grey's anatomy.

When the wings are on the penalty kill the whole 1st period what do you expect. Everyone loved Osgood when he was taking us to the Cup last year. Funny how people turn when we are doing bad this season....... oh wait we aren't doing bad this season. teams would kill to have our record this year.

[wingfan1991 221]

Sometime I wonder if anyone on here (ok not everyone) really knows what hockey is? Let alone even watch the games or do they just look at the scores later at night after watching grey's anatomy.

When the wings are on the penalty kill the whole 1st period what do you expect. Everyone loved Osgood when he was taking us to the Cup last year. Funny how people turn when we are doing bad this season....... oh wait we aren't doing bad this season. teams would kill to have our record this year.

why do you and others bring up last year? yes congrats we won.. ozzie was a million times better last year then this year, its a joke what he's doing to this team this year. how can you justify we have to score 4-6 goals a game to win and that's ok cause of our record? do you really feel confident when he's in net? forget about what he's done in the past and look and think what he's doing TODAY. if he's playing bad, why can't we say he's bad? we're realists, that's how I see it. sure there's others on the team who have reeked but no one bigger then him... its unfortuante when you're the goalie you're the last resort and you're the one to get the blame most of the time. with ozzie this year it's clear cut to me and many others.

[Herr Hockey 0]

I know the defense has been lackluster all season too, so Ozzie can't bear the entire burden of the teams' recent struggles, but why is it that blowing off any criticism of Osgood is becoming just as much of a fad as criticizing him in the first place?

[b.shanafan14 733]

When are we going to see a blame Kronwall thread or a blame Draper's lack of hustle thread. Anti-Osgood posters say some of us are ignoring the signs of some terrible goaltending, I argue that many of you have little clue other than to blame a goaltender who has made a career as the whipping boy. When Osgood wins a cup you've "always believed in him! Ozzy Ozzy Ozzy!", when he gets pulled after defensive breakdown after defensive breakdown you've "always known he was a product of the team! Osgood Sucks!". It'd be amusing if it was so sad and predictable.

Next game just for laughs, watch Kronwall the whole game, or see how many times in a week of play he turns over the puck at the faceoff dots while trying a break out or stretch pass from behind his own goal, turnovers that get by even Ty Conklin. And if your attention span is great enough to focus on more than one player to blame, on account of hockey being a team sport, watch how many times Draper is caught not hustling and flat footed, how many times you see him watching the play instead of trying to stop it. And *gasp* whatever you do don't look at three time Norris winner, now 47 year old Chris Chelios.

(Don't be confused by the above statements, I like Kronwall, Draper, and Chelios, and I'm by no means saying Osgood has been terrific. My point is few have been great and many have been a bigger problem than Osgood)

[drwscc 212]

Problem is, if Ozzie has a problem, it results in pucks in the net. There's noone there to bail him out. If Kronwall or Chelios have a problem, the goalie is supposed to be there to bail him out. That's not happening this season. The D is lacking, but the goaltending is not as stellar as it has been in the past, so instead of a "whew, that was close" it's ending up as a goal.

[Swede40 0]

I think it's time to give Conklin 4-5 starts in a row

[Mickeyisms Rule! 0]

Basically, Osgood is somewhat okay if he's on a Stanley Cup winning team, but if the man is struggling you'll drop him like a sack of potatoes.

Nice.

You just be a true fan.

No. You do a reality check. Is Osgood playing at anywhere near the level that he did last season? Osgood has played 2 more games than Conklin. His GAA is .98 goals per game HIGHER than Conklin's. Conklin's saver percentage is .917 to Ozzie's .880.

2008/09

Ty Conklin DET 24 16 6 1 653 54 2.31 599 .917 5 0 0 2 1,400:57

Chris Osgood DET 26 15 4 6 693 83 3.29 610 .880 0 0 2 6 1,515:23

Last year during the regular season, Osgood's numbers were stellar! 2.09 GAA and .914 save %. He EARNED the spot in the playoffs by being the best goalie on the team. Conklin is earning that now.

2007/08

Chris Osgood DET 43 27 9 4 976 84 2.09 892 .914 4 0 3 0 2,408:53

You're not going to win the Cup with the type of play that Ozzie is exhibiting. In fact, Dom got yanked from the playoffs last year with BETTER stats than Ozzie is showing now.

08 playoffs

Dominik Hasek DET 4 2 2 0 89 10 2.91 79 .888 0 0 0 2 205:58

I love Osgood, but he simply isn't playing like he has in the past. The frustration that members here are showing is justified.

[Mickeyisms Rule! 0]

I know the defense has been lackluster all season too, so Ozzie can't bear the entire burden of the teams' recent struggles, but why is it that blowing off any criticism of Osgood is becoming just as much of a fad as criticizing him in the first place?

If the defense sucks so badly, and I do admit that they aren't as dominant as they were last season, then how is it that Conklin's GAA and save% is so much higher than Ozzie's?

Eventually you need to stop pointing the fingers everywhere else. There are enough fingers to point at both the defense and at the goalie.

[Frozen-Man 144]

When are we going to see a blame Kronwall thread or a blame Draper's lack of hustle thread. Anti-Osgood posters say some of us are ignoring the signs of some terrible goaltending, I argue that many of you have little clue other than to blame a goaltender who has made a career as the whipping boy. When Osgood wins a cup you've "always believed in him! Ozzy Ozzy Ozzy!", when he gets pulled after defensive breakdown after defensive breakdown you've "always known he was a product of the team! Osgood Sucks!". It'd be amusing if it was so sad and predictable.

Next game just for laughs, watch Kronwall the whole game, or see how many times in a week of play he turns over the puck at the faceoff dots while trying a break out or stretch pass from behind his own goal, turnovers that get by even Ty Conklin. And if your attention span is great enough to focus on more than one player to blame, on account of hockey being a team sport, watch how many times Draper is caught not hustling and flat footed, how many times you see him watching the play instead of trying to stop it. And *gasp* whatever you do don't look at three time Norris winner, now 47 year old Chris Chelios.

(Don't be confused by the above statements, I like Kronwall, Draper, and Chelios, and I'm by no means saying Osgood has been terrific. My point is few have been great and many have been a bigger problem than Osgood)

:clap: :clap:

Excellent post.

There is hardly ever a thread about how those guys are not towing the line (and like you I like all those guys) but their play has not been what it should be. Ozzy has not played well this year but he is also the perennial whipping boy for all the problems. If the team hadn't taken so many penalties in the first, or had played the PK well or been defensively sound it wouldn't be an issue. I think part (only part some of the blame does lay on Ozzy not playing well) of the problem is that Ozzy can't rely on his D doing their job which makes it harder for Ozzy to anticipate positioning and what he needs to be doing. The also hang him out to dry where he has little chance to make a stop which in turn he doesn't which in turn further erodes his confidence. People keep saying that is the goalies job to make the hard stops - true enough - however, it is also the defenses job to make sure that the other team doesn't get those quality chances. Neither the defense nor the goalie will ever be perfect in their job so one has to compensate for the other at any given moment in a game. NEITHER THE DEFENSE NOR THE GOALIE HAS DONE THIS. The defense has left the goalies out to dry more times than I can ever remember them doing and the goalies have not been up to the extra challenge (which the need to be) but the defense should do their job and limit the times that they put them in that position. I think that at least as much blame falls on defense as falls on Ozzy (this does not diminish the fact that he needs to be better but merely stating that the defense does too).

As to people talking about Ozzy and then comparing him to Nabokov or Turco that is an unfair comparison. Ozzy is making $1.7M this year (cap hit $1.416M) while Nabokov is making $5.5M (cap hit $5.35M) and Turco is making $5.7M (cap hit $5.7M). How is is reasonable to compare those guy's performance with Ozzy's. Lilja has played great for us this year but how far is it to compare him to Andrei Markov, Zdeno Chara, or even Shea Weber. I would still rather have Ozzy for 1.416M than the others for their price tag especially since he is a proven winner (like Mickey Redmond said in the end all he does is win).

[dat's sick 1,002]

When are we going to see a blame Kronwall thread or a blame Draper's lack of hustle thread. Anti-Osgood posters say some of us are ignoring the signs of some terrible goaltending, I argue that many of you have little clue other than to blame a goaltender who has made a career as the whipping boy. When Osgood wins a cup you've "always believed in him! Ozzy Ozzy Ozzy!", when he gets pulled after defensive breakdown after defensive breakdown you've "always known he was a product of the team! Osgood Sucks!". It'd be amusing if it was so sad and predictable.

Next game just for laughs, watch Kronwall the whole game, or see how many times in a week of play he turns over the puck at the faceoff dots while trying a break out or stretch pass from behind his own goal, turnovers that get by even Ty Conklin. And if your attention span is great enough to focus on more than one player to blame, on account of hockey being a team sport, watch how many times Draper is caught not hustling and flat footed, how many times you see him watching the play instead of trying to stop it. And *gasp* whatever you do don't look at three time Norris winner, now 47 year old Chris Chelios.

(Don't be confused by the above statements, I like Kronwall, Draper, and Chelios, and I'm by no means saying Osgood has been terrific. My point is few have been great and many have been a bigger problem than Osgood)

The whole 4th line (Drapes, Kopy, Maltby) have been extremely criticized this season, rightfully so.

Kronwall has been up and down, but mostly down sadly. Cheli sometimes look okay, but much of the time he is actually looking as old as he is.

But nothing can deny the fact that Osgood has been far from himself this season. It's not just about the pucks he lets past him either. It's all the rebounds he can't control, all the times he loses his position and the defense has to bail him out etc. He just spreads this aura of insecurity around him.

Conklin has been almost the opposite. He always looks calm and secure, which I'm sure makes the defense relax a bit. It might be my imagination but I think our defense often looks better with Conks in net.

I love Ozzie. Every game this season I've been hoping and praying that he will have a good game and start turning the corner, but sooner or later you have to realize that you can't give him all these chances if he never takes them. I don't see people screaming for Ozzie to get traded, we know he can and will return to form at some point, but right now we really, really have to play Conks as our no.1.

[Yzerman191 37]

This thread isn't merely about last night, for all of you saying "two of those three weren't his fault." This thread is about his overall play thus far this season. It's also not about how much worse other players have been, because I'm absolutely sure somebody will make a thread about that sooner or later (I don't think we have a player that hasn't had a thread like that this year). Yes, our defense has been questionable this season. However, a hall-of-fame caliber (as many here argue) goalie such as Osgood should rise to the challenge. Look at his career as an Islander; he had terrible defense, little offense to counterbalance the goals, but he rose to the challenge, and his stats tell the same story. This year, his save percentage is DEAD LAST in the league for goalies playing at least 15 games.

People can't simply criticize Osgood on here without being labeled anti-Osgood; for some reason, it's taboo. Yes, of course we appreciated him last season: he was reliable, consistent, clutch, and COMPETENT. The fans' appreciation for Osgood was well deserved. However, if we can appreciate him when he's doing well, we can criticize him when he's doing poorly. Same goes for any player. Datsyuk, whom everyone is claiming to be our best player, received much criticism early on this season due to his slow start. Since he's improved his play, people are calling him our best player. I'm not saying I dislike Osgood any more than I did last season; I'm saying that he's none of those things he was last year and doesn't, at this point in time, deserve the starting role.

[HOCKEY MATTERS 167]

Oz is certainly not playing up to his capacity. I say sit him for a few games. Conks is paying better right now and deserves to start. Oz usually gets fired up after having to ride the pine. Seems like we have gone through this enough time that it can be considered pathetic, imho.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

It's never his fault. Don't say defensmen didn't do there job bla bla bla. Well that's why there's the goalie. So he could stop what the defensmen can't. If the Defense could do everything, why we even dressing a goalie for?

Osgood is responsible for all the goals he let in.

Let's make this clear, I love Osood but I'm honnest guy and I don't let my favorite player get in the way of the truth.

This year up to now HE SUCKS, HAS BEEN PLAYING TERRIBLE / IS PLAYING TERRIBLE ... don't know if he will play like this in the playoffs.

Conklin is playing much better then he is now so I rather go with him. End of story

Great post. What is it with people not understanding the concept of a goaltender's role? If we just wanted to guy to stop the stoppable shots, we'd put Piet Van Zant in net and be done with it - maybe Darren McCarty. A goaltender is supposed to make the tough stops that keep you in the game - hes supposed to steal a few goals. Not games, but goals. Just like Turco did for the Stars last night. Was he great? No. But he was good enough.

Think of it this way. If Pavel Datsyuk was only scoring goals when he had an open or near open net, but couldn't score a goal when the goaltender was well positioned, would you still call him a good goal scorer? Not in a million years. Yet thats basically the argument that half the people are making on this board in Ozzie's defense.

And I love how we have a slew of psychics on this board that just "know" Osgood "will" be better in the playoffs. After all, isn't that what happened with Hasek?

[Datsyerberger 279]

"More games prove us that the Wings defense is lazy and it sucks."

Fixed.

Ozzie has been unspectacular, but the defense every other game or so has been downright putrid.

That said, Conklin is hot right now.. start the hot 'tender.

[egroen 384]

For the 1st quarter of the season, it seemed like a lot of flukey goals were going in on Osgood - strange deflections, weird bounces, 5 on 3s, etc. It still seems like that - but you do not give up 3-4 goals every night because of bad luck. He needs to sit for an extended period and get his s*** together - he is playing small, not challenging enough and seems to lack confidence - continuing to start him has not been helping, so sit him.

[Vladifan 680]

People here blamed me about that I keep saying Osgood should not be our first starting goalie. So, I write this by expecting many people's fingering on me. --->

The only fingering response I'll do with your post is to let you know I think you're just one more member of the Three-Cornered-Finger-Snap Club. Simple but totally non-constructive answer to what's happening with the Wings.

The Red Wings got out-hustled, out-played and generally had their butts handed to them last night. Cheli, Filppula, Kronwall and Draper (as someone so aptly points out later in this thread) ALL sucked. And you're ticked so for whatever ill-begotten reasoning you can come up with, you grasp at an easy answer. In other words, it's your ego talking, not your brain.

To say that Ozzie sucks reminds me of SO many Avs' fans and their t-shirts saying "Red Wings Suck" as our guys beat the crap out of them. Over and over and over.

What I'd really like to hear from you and others like you is how Babcock, et al, motivates THE WHOLE FRICKING TEAM to start playing up to the level we (should) know they can play.