Osgood has worst save percentage in the league

[Dave Anderson 0]

There has been a lot of talk about defence this year. Sure, there is room for improvement in our defence. But the statistics show that we have out-shot our opponents in 29 of 49 games this year. That is the best record in the league (SJS is second with 24). We have the fifth best defence in terms of shots against per game. So overall, even though our defence hasn't been as good as last year, it has still been one of the best in the league.

One stat sticks out one the negative side though: Osgood's save percentage of 88.0%. Out of all 44 goalies that have played this year, Osgood has the lowest save percentage. That's right - Osgood is in last place.

To me, save percentage is the only really relevant statistic for goalies. After all, stopping shots is what they are there for. How can Detroit expect to win the cup with the worst goalie in the league? Why are people focusing on the defence when goal-tending seems to be the obvious flaw in our roster? Our number one goalie is worse than the back-up on all other all other teams!

In my mind, we need to:

1) Short-term: Dump Osgood. Make Conklin number one, and bring up Larsson as the back-up (Larsson has a much better save percentage than Howard). To those who say Larsson isn't ready I contend that we already have the worst goalie in the league - Larsson only has to be better than one goalie to be an improvement on Osgood.

2) Long-term: Make room in the cap to acquire a goalie before the next trade dead-line. Any goalie. Remember - all other goalies in the league have performed better than Osgood.

Am I making sense?

(All stats are from nhl.com)

[GoWings1905 2,694]

Oh good, another Ozzie thread. Conklin gave up four goals yesterday and has allowed nine in his past two starts. When are people going to realize the bigger issue lies within the defense? Neither of these two goalies are designed to carry the team when the defense doesn't play at a high level.

Edited February 1, 2009 by GoWings1905

[Echolalia 2,961]

Carl Weathers (born January 14, 1948) is an American actor, as well as former professional football player in the United States and Canada. He is well known for playing Apollo Creed in the Rocky series of films, as well as his role as Dillon in the first Predator movie.

Contents

[hide]

* 1 Biography

o 1.1 Personal life

o 1.2 Football career

o 1.3 Acting career

* 2 Filmography

* 3 References

* 4 External links

[edit] Biography

[edit] Personal life

Weathers was born in New Orleans, Louisiana.[1] He graduated from St. Augustine High School and then went to San Diego State University. Outside of acting, he is a member of both Big Brothers and the United States Olympic Committee. In April 2007, he married Jennifer Peterson, a documentary filmmaker.

[edit] Football career

Carl played two years at Long Beach City College in 1966-1967 playing linebacker. At San Diego State University, Carl was a member of the football team. This led to a brief career as a linebacker with the Oakland Raiders, where he played 7 games in 1970 and one game in 1971. He joined the British Columbia Lions of the Canadian Football League in 1971 and played until 1973, 18 games in total. He retired in 1974 to become an actor.

In his football career, he played for hall-of-fame coaches Don Coryell at San Diego State and John Madden with the Oakland Raiders.

[edit] Acting career

Weathers had his first parts in two Arthur Marks directed 1970s blaxploitation films: Bucktown and Friday Foster, both in 1975. Weathers also appeared in an episode on the 70's sitcom Good Times as an angry husband who suspected his wife of cheating on him with J.J. Ironically, though his character was presumably supposed to be older, Carl is actually one year younger than Jimmie Walker. He noted that this was not the first time he worked with Arthur Marks; they had known each other since they were young.

In 1976, he starred alongside Sylvester Stallone in Rocky as Apollo Creed, a role he would reprise in the next three Rocky films in 1979, 1982, and 1985. For the most recent film in the Rocky series, Rocky Balboa, Sylvester Stallone asked Weathers, Mr. T, and Dolph Lundgren for permission to use footage from their appearances in the earlier Rocky movies. Mr. T and Dolph Lundgren acquiesced, but Weathers wanted an actual part in the movie, even though his character died in Rocky IV. Stallone refused and Weathers decided not to allow Stallone to use his image for Rocky flashbacks from the previous movies. They instead used new footage of a fighter who looks similar to Weathers.[2]

In 1978, Carl portrayed misogynist Vince Sullivan in the TV movie, Not This Time. Weathers also starred in a number of action films for the small and big screen, including: Force 10 from Navarone (1978), Predator (1987), Action Jackson (1988), and Hurricane Smith (1992), and is briefly seen as an Army MP in one of the three released versions of Close Encounters of the Third Kind. As a member of the cast of Predator, Weathers worked with future California governor Arnold Schwarzenegger and future Minnesota governor Jesse Ventura. Many years later he appeared in a spoof segment on Saturday Night Live, announcing that he was running for political office and urging viewers to vote for him on the basis that "he was the black guy in Predator".

He also appeared in Michael Jackson's "Liberian Girl" music video, and played Chubbs in Happy Gilmore, teaching Happy how to play golf.

During the final season of In the Heat of the Night, his character of Hampton Forbes replaced Bill Gillespie at the chief of the Sparta, Mississippi police. He continued that role in the television movies based on the series. Another noted TV role was on the cop show Street Justice where he played Sgt. Adam Beaudreaux. He also played as MACV-SOG Colonel Brewster in the CBS series Tour of Duty.

In 2004, Weathers received a career revival as a comedic actor beginning with appearances in 3 episodes of the comedy series Arrested Development as a cheapskate caricature of himself, who serves as Tobias Fünke's acting coach. He was then cast in the comedies The Sasquatch Gang and The Comebacks.

Weathers had a guest role in two episodes of The Shield as the former training officer of main character Vic Mackey.

Weathers provided the voice for Colonel Samuel Garret in the Pandemic Studios video game, Mercenaries: Playground of Destruction.[3] In 2005, he was a narrator on Conquest! The Price Of Victory - Witness The Journey of the Trojans!, an 18-part television show about USC athletics.

Weathers is a principal of Red Tight Media, a film and video production company that specializes in tactical training films made for the United States armed forces.[citation needed]

He also appeared in one episode of ER as the father of an injured boxer during their 2008 finale season.

He is currently acting as "Brian "Gebo" Fitzgerald" in advertising for Old Spice's sponsorship of NASCAR driver Tony Stewart.

He also appears in an ongoing series of web-only advertisements for Credit Union of Washington, dispensing flowers and the advice that "change is beautiful" to puzzled-looking bystanders.

[YoungGuns1340 1]

Oh good, another Ozzie thread. Conklin gave up four goals yesterday and has allowed nine in his past two starts. When are people going to realize the bigger issue lies within the defense? Neither of these two goalies are designed to carry the team when the defense doesn't play at a high level.

I agree that defense is our biggest issue, but you can't excuse our goaltenders from their performance. They give up a soft goal every game. Of recent memory, the 3rd goal against Conklin last night, and the third goal against Osgood in Dallas. Have people forgotten that giving up soft goals is not something that is supposed to happen every game? Every once in a while, yeah, its gonna happen.

This is the thing - if your defense makes a mistake, it is the goaltenders JOB to make up for it. This year, when our defense has made a mistake, more often than not its in the net. Goalies around the league make up for their teams shoddy defense. Conklin and Osgood - on most nights - haven't been able to do that.

Also, the point that everyone seems to be missing in this goaltending vs defense debate is the fact that its a lot easier to change ONE guy than it is to change SIX. Especially when our goaltending tandem combined makes less than any of our Top 4 Dmen. But you get what you pay for, I guess.

[betterREDthandead 58]

No, you're not making sense. Conklin is not particularly proven - he's a career backup. You want to dump the guy that won us our Cup last year and go into the playoffs with a career backup and a guy who's played exactly zero NHL games in his life. This is terrible management.

The Wings are where they are partly because it's well known they treat their players right, and with loyalty. A hair-trigger reaction to one stat line in the middle of the season is quite possibly the dick-est thing you can do to one of your players, even by Brian Burke's standards.

And then, this:

Remember - all other goalies in the league have performed better than Osgood.

I didn't realize personnel decisions should be made solely on the basis of half a season, throwing out everything every other player has done in the past. By your logic we should go get Legace back, despite the fact that we know he doesn't hold up in the playoffs. Or Johan Hedberg, despite his career-long suckitude.

Lastly, there are more than 44 goalies that have played this season. The list only shows those on pace to play a certain number of games. Guys who aren't, don't show up. But hey! Save percentage is all that matters. Patrick Lalime's is .886. Better goalie than Osgood, absolutely, yup, never mind that he's been washed up for five years now and the whole world knows it. We could get him for the league minimum, too. GREAT IDEA.

Straight up? This is just irrational Osgood-hate sugarcoated with statistics and a pretense at logic. You've probably hated Osgood for a while now and are taking the opportunity to kick him while he's down. I certainly hope that's the case, because the alternative is a total lack of perspective, with no ability to evaluate goalies beyond a laser-focus on one number in the stat line and a Memento-style lack of memory beyond the first game of the present season.

[2probert4 8]

Oh good, another Ozzie thread. Conklin gave up four goals yesterday and has allowed nine in his past two starts. When are people going to realize the bigger issue lies within the defense? Neither of these two goalies are designed to carry the team when the defense doesn't play at a high level.

Some of the goals these 2 have been allowing SHOULD BE STOPPED. I agree with the point that yes the defense needs to shore up, but the goalies giving up crap goals doesn't help. Kronwall needs to step it up in a major way....

[GoWings1905 2,694]

I agree that defense is our biggest issue, but you can't excuse our goaltenders from their performance. They give up a soft goal every game. Of recent memory, the 3rd goal against Conklin last night, and the third goal against Osgood in Dallas. Have people forgotten that giving up soft goals is not something that is supposed to happen every game? Every once in a while, yeah, its gonna happen.

This is the thing - if your defense makes a mistake, it is the goaltenders JOB to make up for it. This year, when our defense has made a mistake, more often than not its in the net. Goalies around the league make up for their teams shoddy defense. Conklin and Osgood - on most nights - haven't been able to do that.

Also, the point that everyone seems to be missing in this goaltending vs defense debate is the fact that its a lot easier to change ONE guy than it is to change SIX. Especially when our goaltending tandem combined makes less than any of our Top 4 Dmen. But you get what you pay for, I guess.

Both goalies can definitely improve (Ozzie especially), but I have trouble placing too much blame on the goalies after watching the Red Wings defensive effort on most nights this season. Opposing teams have it far too easy in the Red Wings zone. I almost feel like the Red Wings need another big, physical defenseman that can actually force players off the puck. Rafalski, Lebda and Kronwall aren't getting the job done. Stuart needs to be a physical force when he comes back.

Like you said, it's a combination of lackluster play from both the goalies and defense. My prevailing feeling though is we will see the goalies get much better when/if the Red Wings decide to focus on defense.

Edited February 1, 2009 by GoWings1905

[ben_usmc 253]

although I agree we shouldn't trade him, but people seem to keep holding onto last year. Fine then so Draper/Maltby played decent last year so lets not make changes there either. Maybe you should also keep in mind that Ozzy was a back up last year, to Hasek. So put Ozzy as a back up once again make him earn it back. I also would love to see what Howard and Larsson have for a few games, maybe Ozzy could be fighting an injury for about 10 games , get himself back to his old self.

Also betterRED not everyone that thinks Ozzy has been sucking hates him. That is stupid statement to make, I would assume everyone would be much happier with Ozzy playing well because that means the Wings are playing well. Maybe you just like Ozzy so much you refuse to see the obvious, which is OZZY BLOWS RIGHT NOW!!!!!!!!

Edited February 1, 2009 by ben_usmc

[lets go pavel 2]

Carl Weathers (born January 14, 1948) is an American actor, as well as former professional football player in the United States and Canada. He is well known for playing Apollo Creed in the Rocky series of films, as well as his role as Dillon in the first Predator movie.

Contents

[hide]

* 1 Biography

o 1.1 Personal life

o 1.2 Football career

o 1.3 Acting career

* 2 Filmography

* 3 References

* 4 External links

[edit] Biography

[edit] Personal life

Weathers was born in New Orleans, Louisiana.[1] He graduated from St. Augustine High School and then went to San Diego State University. Outside of acting, he is a member of both Big Brothers and the United States Olympic Committee. In April 2007, he married Jennifer Peterson, a documentary filmmaker.

[edit] Football career

Carl played two years at Long Beach City College in 1966-1967 playing linebacker. At San Diego State University, Carl was a member of the football team. This led to a brief career as a linebacker with the Oakland Raiders, where he played 7 games in 1970 and one game in 1971. He joined the British Columbia Lions of the Canadian Football League in 1971 and played until 1973, 18 games in total. He retired in 1974 to become an actor.

In his football career, he played for hall-of-fame coaches Don Coryell at San Diego State and John Madden with the Oakland Raiders.

[edit] Acting career

Weathers had his first parts in two Arthur Marks directed 1970s blaxploitation films: Bucktown and Friday Foster, both in 1975. Weathers also appeared in an episode on the 70's sitcom Good Times as an angry husband who suspected his wife of cheating on him with J.J. Ironically, though his character was presumably supposed to be older, Carl is actually one year younger than Jimmie Walker. He noted that this was not the first time he worked with Arthur Marks; they had known each other since they were young.

In 1976, he starred alongside Sylvester Stallone in Rocky as Apollo Creed, a role he would reprise in the next three Rocky films in 1979, 1982, and 1985. For the most recent film in the Rocky series, Rocky Balboa, Sylvester Stallone asked Weathers, Mr. T, and Dolph Lundgren for permission to use footage from their appearances in the earlier Rocky movies. Mr. T and Dolph Lundgren acquiesced, but Weathers wanted an actual part in the movie, even though his character died in Rocky IV. Stallone refused and Weathers decided not to allow Stallone to use his image for Rocky flashbacks from the previous movies. They instead used new footage of a fighter who looks similar to Weathers.[2]

In 1978, Carl portrayed misogynist Vince Sullivan in the TV movie, Not This Time. Weathers also starred in a number of action films for the small and big screen, including: Force 10 from Navarone (1978), Predator (1987), Action Jackson (1988), and Hurricane Smith (1992), and is briefly seen as an Army MP in one of the three released versions of Close Encounters of the Third Kind. As a member of the cast of Predator, Weathers worked with future California governor Arnold Schwarzenegger and future Minnesota governor Jesse Ventura. Many years later he appeared in a spoof segment on Saturday Night Live, announcing that he was running for political office and urging viewers to vote for him on the basis that "he was the black guy in Predator".

He also appeared in Michael Jackson's "Liberian Girl" music video, and played Chubbs in Happy Gilmore, teaching Happy how to play golf.

During the final season of In the Heat of the Night, his character of Hampton Forbes replaced Bill Gillespie at the chief of the Sparta, Mississippi police. He continued that role in the television movies based on the series. Another noted TV role was on the cop show Street Justice where he played Sgt. Adam Beaudreaux. He also played as MACV-SOG Colonel Brewster in the CBS series Tour of Duty.

In 2004, Weathers received a career revival as a comedic actor beginning with appearances in 3 episodes of the comedy series Arrested Development as a cheapskate caricature of himself, who serves as Tobias Fünke's acting coach. He was then cast in the comedies The Sasquatch Gang and The Comebacks.

Weathers had a guest role in two episodes of The Shield as the former training officer of main character Vic Mackey.

Weathers provided the voice for Colonel Samuel Garret in the Pandemic Studios video game, Mercenaries: Playground of Destruction.[3] In 2005, he was a narrator on Conquest! The Price Of Victory - Witness The Journey of the Trojans!, an 18-part television show about USC athletics.

Weathers is a principal of Red Tight Media, a film and video production company that specializes in tactical training films made for the United States armed forces.[citation needed]

He also appeared in one episode of ER as the father of an injured boxer during their 2008 finale season.

He is currently acting as "Brian "Gebo" Fitzgerald" in advertising for Old Spice's sponsorship of NASCAR driver Tony Stewart.

He also appears in an ongoing series of web-only advertisements for Credit Union of Washington, dispensing flowers and the advice that "change is beautiful" to puzzled-looking bystanders.

Make it happen, Kenny!

[dicksmack 33]

No, you're not making sense. Conklin is not particularly proven - he's a career backup. You want to dump the guy that won us our Cup last year and go into the playoffs with a career backup and a guy who's played exactly zero NHL games in his life. This is terrible management.

The Wings are where they are partly because it's well known they treat their players right, and with loyalty. A hair-trigger reaction to one stat line in the middle of the season is quite possibly the dick-est thing you can do to one of your players, even by Brian Burke's standards.

And then, this:

I didn't realize personnel decisions should be made solely on the basis of half a season, throwing out everything every other player has done in the past. By your logic we should go get Legace back, despite the fact that we know he doesn't hold up in the playoffs. Or Johan Hedberg, despite his career-long suckitude.

Lastly, there are more than 44 goalies that have played this season. The list only shows those on pace to play a certain number of games. Guys who aren't, don't show up. But hey! Save percentage is all that matters. Patrick Lalime's is .886. Better goalie than Osgood, absolutely, yup, never mind that he's been washed up for five years now and the whole world knows it. We could get him for the league minimum, too. GREAT IDEA.

Straight up? This is just irrational Osgood-hate sugarcoated with statistics and a pretense at logic. You've probably hated Osgood for a while now and are taking the opportunity to kick him while he's down. I certainly hope that's the case, because the alternative is a total lack of perspective, with no ability to evaluate goalies beyond a laser-focus on one number in the stat line and a Memento-style lack of memory beyond the first game of the present season.

Here again we see the soft-minded notion that criticism must be irrational hating. Several hockey commentators have said that while the Wings are a great team, their achilles heel is in net. I bet these likely non-fans are just haters too. Last season Oz and Dom were around tops in the league no? Most attributed that to the Wings' stellar defense. Ozzie, however showed he was playing well to the very top! This year is different. He (and Conklin too) have given up way too many softies. I fear that the Wings will stick with Ozzie cuz he went all the way last year. My gut tells me Conklin would be the more solid tender. Look what he did for Pittsburgh late last reg. season... I hope that unless Ozzie turns it around, the Wings make a move for a goalie before the deadline.

[Ms_Hockey 0]

Here we go with the Osgood threads again.

This is getting pathetic.

[AtomicPunk 296]

Welcome, Dave. I see you wasted no time piling on our goalie. You'll fit in fine here.

Just remember, he is lazy and he sucks, and that any goalie on the farm team is better than he is.

Edited February 1, 2009 by AtomicPunk

[Dave Anderson 0]

Oh good, another Ozzie thread. Conklin gave up four goals yesterday and has allowed nine in his past two starts. When are people going to realize the bigger issue lies within the defense? Neither of these two goalies are designed to carry the team when the defense doesn't play at a high level.

I don't see how you can argue that the defence is to blame. Defence is in fifth place in allowed shots - Ozzie is in last place in shots stopped.

[Outsider 42]

I don't see how you can argue that the defence is to blame. Defence is in fifth place in allowed shots - Ozzie is in last place in shots stopped.

You should stop watching the stat lines on NHL.com, and start watching the Games.

[lets go pavel 2]

I don't see how you can argue that the defence is to blame. Defence is in fifth place in allowed shots - Ozzie is in last place in shots stopped.

Quality, not quantity. We have been giving up way to many breakaways and easy shots. That's not to excuse Ozzie's performance, but our shots allowed certainly doesn't tell the whole story of how our defense is playing.

[Outsider 42]

Quality, not quantity. We have been giving up way to many breakaways and easy shots. That's not to excuse Ozzie's performance, but our shots allowed certainly doesn't tell the whole story of how our defense is playing.

Truer words were never spoken.

Well.....except for betterREDthandead's avatar/sig, that is.

[Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204]

And yet, he hasnt been even close to the worst.

Raycroft, Lalime, Toskala, Giguere, Hedberg, Legace, Turco, Auld, Garon have all been worse. You need to watch the games, not the stats. Yeah, Ozzies been bad the past couple games, but throughout the season he's had solid games and kept us in some games, some games he gets us the save. He's just been very hot and cold, that's been his problem. Plus, he has no confidence, and then our defence has no confidence, and that's a recipe for disaster. Honestly, what are you trying to prove with this thread? We know he hasnt been great, but your mistaken if you think he's been the worst.

[Dave Anderson 0]

Honestly, what are you trying to prove with this thread? We know he hasnt been great, but your mistaken if you think he's been the worst.

I'm wondering why all the focus is on signing Hossa and Franzén. Our offense would still be great without either.

The top priority signing-wise should be signing a top goalie. Why settle for anything less than the best goalie in the league?

[Dave Anderson 0]

And yet, he hasnt been even close to the worst.

While Osgood might not be the worst goalie in the league once the playoffs start, can anyone realistically hope that he will be one of the best? If not, why would we settle for anything less than that?

[lets go pavel 2]

I'm wondering why all the focus is on signing Hossa and Franzén. Our offense would still be great without either.

The top priority signing-wise should be signing a top goalie. Why settle for anything less than the best goalie in the league?

Because he's not available? Because we don't need him to win?

Edited February 1, 2009 by lets go pavel

[Statts 4]

You should stop watching the stat lines on NHL.com, and start watching the Games.

Exactly

I really hate when people throw out numbers like they tell the whole story.

[cusimano_brothers 1,655]

As a Club...

After 49 games:

Club average goals allowed per game is 2.94 per game, ranking 35th (of a possible 65 seasons), highest since 1960 and highest in this decade.

Club average goals scored per game is 3.65 per game, ranking 9th (of a possible 65 seasons), highest since 1995 and highest in this decade.

[lets go pavel 2]

As a Club...

After 49 games:

Club average goals allowed per game is 2.94 per game, ranking 35th (of a possible 65 seasons), highest since 1960 and highest in this decade.

Club average goals scored per game is 3.65 per game, ranking 9th (of a possible 65 seasons), highest since 1995 and highest in this decade.

I must be missing something ... what is your point?

[Vladifan 680]

Oh good, another Ozzie thread. Conklin gave up four goals yesterday and has allowed nine in his past two starts. When are people going to realize the bigger issue lies within the defense? Neither of these two goalies are designed to carry the team when the defense doesn't play at a high level.

WORD. Even the defense says it's mostly the defense. Thenk yew. Not sure about your take on the goalies. I'd like to think they're both just going through an iffy time at the same time.

And no. Pigs don't fly yet but you just never know....Science and aeronautics are wonderful things.

[cusimano_brothers 1,655]

I must be missing something ... what is your point?

As a Club...