This rule needs to be changed

[Blueliner 69]

If I could change one rule, it would have to do with the game misconduct penalties with boarding/checking from behind calls. I hate it when ******* like Backes pretend to be injured to get the major penalty and a game misconduct and come back out the next shift. I think that if a player gets a game misconduct, the "injured" player should also sit out the rest of the game to prove that the injury sustained was real and serious. I don't mind the five minute major for a dangerous play, but it's a shame a player gets a game misconduct for someone trying to win an Academy Award. What do you guys think about this rule change?

[Statts 4]

I never saw a decent replay of the Lilja hit aside, so I cant comment on that.

But hits from behind can do serious damage. At the end of the day players go home to their wives and kids. Keep them protected.

Edit: oops it was Lilja

Edited February 3, 2009 by Statts

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

If I could change one rule, it would have to do with the game misconduct penalties with boarding/checking from behind calls. I hate it when ******* like Backes pretend to be injured to get the major penalty and a game misconduct and come back out the next shift. I think that if a player gets a game misconduct, the "injured" player should also sit out the rest of the game to prove that the injury sustained was real and serious. I don't mind the five minute major for a dangerous play, but it's a shame a player gets a game misconduct for someone trying to win an Academy Award. What do you guys think about this rule change?

Personally, I think that's a ridiculous suggestion. I have no issue with the rule as it stands. I was at the game tonight, and even though I was disappointed to see the Wings shorthanded for 5 minutes, the penalty was well deserved. Backes was only a couple feet from the boards, and Lilja came in from behind and planted him directly into the boards face first. Whether or not he was seriously injured is irrelevant....if that same play happened to one of the Wings' players, you'd be calling for the offending player's head. I'm glad Backes wasn't seriously injured...it was a poor judgment call from Lilja, and the penalty matched the crime unfortunately. To say that a player who gets rear-ended face first into the boards should have to sit out the rest of the game in order to 'earn' the 5 minute major power play isn't realistic. We should be glad that he wasn't seriously injured, or Lilja would be looking at a suspension as well. The game misconduct has nothing to do with Backes trying to win an Academy Award, it's directly tied to the major boarding penalty. What a ridiculous statement...I'd love to see the reaction if this happened to one of our guys. Totally different story. Take the good with the bad!

[Miss Wing Queen 154]

I agree. If they're going to make Lids and Pav sit out a game for saying they're injured, a similar situation should apply in this case. Backes was back out, what, in the same power play on Lilja, right? Yeah, injured my ass. If he really got hurt, it was because he was already leaning towards the boards and Lilja was coming at him. To Backes: "Have an issue? Here's a tissue."

Edited February 3, 2009 by Miss Wing Queen

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

I agree. If they're going to make Lids and Pav sit out a game for saying they're injured, a similar situation should apply in this case. Brakes was back out, what, in the same power play on Lilja, right? Yeah, injured my ass. If he really got hurt, it was because he was already leaning towards the boards and Lilja was coming at him. To Brakes: "Have an issue? Here's a tissue."

The penalty has nothing to with whether or not the player was injured on the play....

The rule is simple; if a player is standing 2 feet from the boards, with his back facing to you, you can't face plant him into the boards. It's called boarding.

Good for him being able to pull himself together and get out there to attempt to stick it to the Wings as retribution for getting his face slammed into the glass.

I'm all for cheering on the Wings, and I hate bad penalties just like anyone else, but please....try not to be a homer. This has nothing to do with Pav and Nick's suspensions....it's a rule in the game of hockey, and if you break it, you pay the price. Just be glad they only scored once on that power play.

Edited February 3, 2009 by Yzersyukstromberg

[Statts 4]

Personally, I think that's a ridiculous suggestion. I have no issue with the rule as it stands. I was at the game tonight, and even though I was disappointed to see the Wings shorthanded for 5 minutes, the penalty was well deserved. Backes was only a couple feet from the boards, and Lilja came in from behind and planted him directly into the boards face first. Whether or not he was seriously injured is irrelevant....if that same play happened to one of the Wings' players, you'd be calling for the offending player's head. I'm glad Backes wasn't seriously injured...it was a poor judgment call from Lilja, and the penalty matched the crime unfortunately. To say that a player who gets rear-ended face first into the boards should have to sit out the rest of the game in order to 'earn' the 5 minute major power play isn't realistic. We should be glad that he wasn't seriously injured, or Lilja would be looking at a suspension as well. The game misconduct has nothing to do with Backes trying to win an Academy Award, it's directly tied to the major boarding penalty. What a ridiculous statement...I'd love to see the reaction if this happened to one of our guys. Totally different story. Take the good with the bad!

Agreed 100%

I'll take your word on the hit tonight, because Versus only showed one BS camera angle replay.

[Blueliner 69]

Don't get me wrong here. I agree with the five minute major. What I have a problem with is players who don't get injured when they are checked from behind and pretend to be hurt in order to get a player kicked out. I've seen many players do this. And it pissed me off when they came right back out the next shift and my teammate is in the locker room. Right after the hit, Backes got to his knees and eventually skated off under his own power. He obvisously didn't have any serious injuries.

To amend my suggestion. I think the player that took the penalty should sit out the five minutes and can only return after that once the player he hit returns to the game. Or a game misconduct can be given if there is intent or he could of easily avoided the hit.

I know these things can be tough to judge, but again they are sometimes obvious.

[Blueliner 69]

if that same play happened to one of the Wings' players, you'd be calling for the offending player's head.

Something similar to this just happened with Stuart. The other player didn't do anything wrong, but he indirectly caused him to go head first into the boards. I was't mad at that player. Most hits from behind are accidental and it's a shame that it happens. But it does happen and you can only hope for the best.

Again, don't get me wrong here. I don't think players should fake injuries and make people think for a moment that they're seriously hurt. It's not fair to everyone else to make them think that.

[zaxx 0]

Have you ever played hockey and been hit from behind or even ridden hard into the boards from behind. The Lilja hit pissed me off as well but I was mad at Lilja. Undisciplined, unacceptable, and out of line is how I explain his behavior. It was a stupid thing to do and if he was not suspended I would hope Uncle Mike would bench his ass. Even if it was a mistake it was not) he needs to be reminded of why that is wrong.

[Statts 4]

Don't get me wrong here. I agree with the five minute major. What I have a problem with is players who don't get injured when they are checked from behind and pretend to be hurt in order to get a player kicked out. I've seen many players do this. And it pissed me off when they came right back out the next shift and my teammate is in the locker room. Right after the hit, Backes got to his knees and eventually skated off under his own power. He obvisously didn't have any serious injuries.

To amend my suggestion. I think the player that took the penalty should sit out the five minutes and can only return after that once the player he hit returns to the game. Or a game misconduct can be given if there is intent or he could of easily avoided the hit.

I know these things can be tough to judge, but again they are sometimes obvious.

Try taking a hit from behind and we'll talk. Sometimes that s*** just hurts for a minute and you need a second or two to to gather yourself. If you're completely faking being hurt, then I don't like that. But to make a player sit to prove he is actually hurt makes no sense.

Players safety is #1.

[Blueliner 69]

Try taking a hit from behind and we'll talk. Sometimes that s*** just hurts for a minute and you need a second or two to to gather yourself. If you're completely faking being hurt, then I don't like that. But to make a player sit to prove he is actually hurt makes no sense.

Players safety is #1.

So what part of my amendment do you have a problem with? I have not said that you don't have any pain or anything after you get hit from behind. I'm sure it does hurt. Like I said, these hits are usually accidental. If someone did it on purpose, they should face a huge suspension and also criminal charges. But if a player just gets the wind knocked out of them for a few seconds, a game suspension isn't the right punishment. Maybe a five minute major and a ten minute misconduct is sufficient enough? That equates to about fifteen minutes of time out of the game.

I guess my position on this subject wasn't stated clearly enough. In no way do I think what Lilja did was right. Yes, it's a dangerous play, but he didn't try to do it. He just got caught in a bad spot. He should face a strict penalty, but not that strict.

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

Don't get me wrong here. I agree with the five minute major. What I have a problem with is players who don't get injured when they are checked from behind and pretend to be hurt in order to get a player kicked out. I've seen many players do this. And it pissed me off when they came right back out the next shift and my teammate is in the locker room. Right after the hit, Backes got to his knees and eventually skated off under his own power. He obvisously didn't have any serious injuries.

To amend my suggestion. I think the player that took the penalty should sit out the five minutes and can only return after that once the player he hit returns to the game. Or a game misconduct can be given if there is intent or he could of easily avoided the hit.

I know these things can be tough to judge, but again they are sometimes obvious.

The degree of injury sustained by a player who is boarded has no bearing on what penalty is given. Boarding is a 5-minute major penalty, which also carries with it a game misconduct. The injury or lack thereof has nothing to do with the penalty...

Do you really think Backes was pretending to be injured? I doubt it. He got flattened....and just because his face wasn't rearranged, doesn't mean he wasn't dazed by the hit. I wouldn't have gotten up that quickly either, but I sure as hell would have been out there on the ensuing power play, provided I was healthy and ready to go.

The amendment you're suggesting isn't concrete enough. Penalties can't have variables. They need to be steadfast rules, and can't vary based on the level of injury sustained. Boarding = 5 minutes + game misconduct...simple and fair.

[Blueliner 69]

high sticking has a variable. you can take an eye out doing that.

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

Something similar to this just happened with Stuart. The other player didn't do anything wrong, but he indirectly caused him to go head first into the boards. I was't mad at that player. Most hits from behind are accidental and it's a shame that it happens. But it does happen and you can only hope for the best.

Again, don't get me wrong here. I don't think players should fake injuries and make people think for a moment that they're seriously hurt. It's not fair to everyone else to make them think that.

The Stuart play a few games ago was in no way similar to the boarding call we witnessed by Lilja tonight. Stuart got slightly tangled up with the opposing player while coming in to the end boards, slipped up, and went in to the boards hard and awkward. There was no foul on the play, and hence, no penalty. That's just one of those things that can happen when two big men approach the boards at a high speed.

Andreas Lilja's hit tonight was not accidental...it was an undisciplined play that was dangerous and could have severely injured Backes. I stand by my original statement that the penalties given were reasonable considering the foul. Again, these are big men we're talking about here....professionals...they know the rules, and they know the punishment if they break those rules. I like Lilja, but he made a bad move tonight, and he paid the price. Again....I'm just glad that Backes wasn't severely injured. If he was, Andreas might be facing a suspension. Just take a look at Gauthier from the Kings...he just got handed a 5-game suspension for a dirty hit the other day. We don't need that, and we don't need that type of play giving our team a bad name either.

[Statts 4]

The degree of injury sustained by a player who is boarded has no bearing on what penalty is given. Boarding is a 5-minute major penalty, which also carries with it a game misconduct. The injury or lack thereof has nothing to do with the penalty...

Do you really think Backes was pretending to be injured? I doubt it. He got flattened....and just because his face wasn't rearranged, doesn't mean he wasn't dazed by the hit. I wouldn't have gotten up that quickly either, but I sure as hell would have been out there on the ensuing power play, provided I was healthy and ready to go.

The amendment you're suggesting isn't concrete enough. Penalties can't have variables. They need to be steadfast rules, and can't vary based on the level of injury sustained. Boarding = 5 minutes + game misconduct...simple and fair.

Thanks. You just saved me a good 10 min.

Agree 100%

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

high sticking has a variable. you can take an eye out doing that.

What's the variable with high sticking?

It's a 2 minute penalty. It's a 4 minute penalty if you draw blood.

There's no variable there. It's clearly written.

A variable would be if, let's say the player gets hit with a high stick...blood drawn, and he needs to go the locker room for stitches, and can't make it back to the bench for about 12 minutes...your idea would mean that the penalized player can't go back on the ice until the injured player is back on the ice playing again. Know what I mean? You can't have that in hockey. The penalty has to be clearly written and can't have that variable.

I'm having fun with this though...good argument for sure!

[seeinred 1,488]

The degree of injury sustained by a player who is boarded has no bearing on what penalty is given. Boarding is a 5-minute major penalty, which also carries with it a game misconduct. The injury or lack thereof has nothing to do with the penalty...

Do you really think Backes was pretending to be injured? I doubt it. He got flattened....and just because his face wasn't rearranged, doesn't mean he wasn't dazed by the hit. I wouldn't have gotten up that quickly either, but I sure as hell would have been out there on the ensuing power play, provided I was healthy and ready to go.

The amendment you're suggesting isn't concrete enough. Penalties can't have variables. They need to be steadfast rules, and can't vary based on the level of injury sustained. Boarding = 5 minutes + game misconduct...simple and fair.

You can get 2 minutes for boarding.

Edit:

A minor or major penalty, at the discretion of the Referee, based upon the degree of violence of the impact with the boards, shall be imposed on any player who checks an opponent in such a manner that causes the opponent to be thrown violently in the boards.

Penalties can and do have variables.

Edited February 3, 2009 by SeeinRed

[stormboy 47]

yeah, i guess the question is for me...like, what was the ref thinking the second he blew his whistle, you know? 'cause i agree that injury shouldn't have a bearing on the call, but more the intent/undisciplined nature of the offense. i wonder if the ref immediately thought, major + game, or if he was only going to call a 2 min. minor until the blues player got up.

either way, i don't think he was faking. IMO, there are only a few players that are really divers in the league. this isn't soccer, thank god. glad he's not hurt, we survived the game, hopefully lils isn't suspended. if not, then i'm over it.

plus, it will make lilja's PIM totals go up, which might make it look like he's more of a badass.

[norrisnick 1]

That was a marginal 2 minute call and an inexcusable 5 minute call. Guys get rubbed out from behind left and right. Backes' lid popped off and he felt it. He was getting up but Murray was smart enough to have his trainer sprint out there and tell him to stay down a bit longer. The initial call was 2 minutes, but that dog and pony show made it 5 + game, which is why Lilly was pulled out of the box and sent off. And wonder of wonders Backes was out on that PP.

If you're going to bump up a penalty because of an "injury" there damn well better be an injury. Embelishment is a penalty the last time I checked.

[lets go pavel 2]

I agree. If they're going to make Lids and Pav sit out a game for saying they're injured, a similar situation should apply in this case. Backes was back out, what, in the same power play on Lilja, right? Yeah, injured my ass. If he really got hurt, it was because he was already leaning towards the boards and Lilja was coming at him. To Backes: "Have an issue? Here's a tissue."

Actually I believe Backes signed a few autographs and shook some hands on the way back from the dressing room, proving he was in fact legitimately injured, and thus there was no need for him to sit.

In all seriousness the replay VS showed was horrible, so I have no idea what Lilja actually did, but I do agree that th egame misconduct cannot be tied to the player injury ... if it were, we would see even more people faking injuries. Besides, the injury doesn't necessarily correllate to the intent. An accidental hit with no intent could result in serious injury, while a clearly malicious hit could do no harm. Which one deserves the misconduct?

[Guest GordieSid&Ted]

If I could change one rule, it would have to do with the game misconduct penalties with boarding/checking from behind calls. I hate it when ******* like Backes pretend to be injured to get the major penalty and a game misconduct and come back out the next shift. I think that if a player gets a game misconduct, the "injured" player should also sit out the rest of the game to prove that the injury sustained was real and serious. I don't mind the five minute major for a dangerous play, but it's a shame a player gets a game misconduct for someone trying to win an Academy Award. What do you guys think about this rule change?

You do realize that all players embellish calls at some point. Whether its boarding or a stick to the face, you see guys throw their heads back like they just took a bullet between the eyes.

I understand that it "pisses" you off. But whether the guy is hurt or is only pretending to be hurt isn't the point. That's the problem with people not comprehending the rules. And its the league's problem as well. You shouldn't punish somebody based on how severely you hurt them. That's ******* stupid. You punish for the hit, for the intent, for the carelessness.

What would you think if Lilja broke Backes neck? Given your opinion of how the rules should work, I would argue Lilja shouldn't be able to return to the game of hockey at all until Backes healed from his neck injury, even if it took 5 years.

Punishments need to be doled out for the act, not whether or not you really hurt the guy.

I give this thread a big old s***burger.

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

You can get 2 minutes for boarding.

Edit:

Penalties can and do have variables.

OK, my bad on that. What I'm saying is that the major boarding penalty carries a game misconduct with it.

The variables you're talking about, as opposed to the ones proposed by blueliner, are much different. There's no such penalty in the NHL that takes into account how long the injured player remains off the ice, and applies that as the length of the penalty to the offending player...that's what I mean by variable. It's one thing to allow the ref discretion as to the severity of the hit, but to let them choose whether the penalty should be 2, 4, 5, 10, 12, 14, whatever minutes long is not reasonable. They give the ref 2 choices, minor or major, and they go from there.

Thanks for the clarification on the boarding rule.

[Hockeytown_Ryan 119]

You do realize that all players embellish calls at some point. Whether its boarding or a stick to the face, you see guys throw their heads back like they just took a bullet between the eyes.

I understand that it "pisses" you off. But whether the guy is hurt or is only pretending to be hurt isn't the point. That's the problem with people not comprehending the rules. And its the league's problem as well. You shouldn't punish somebody based on how severely you hurt them. That's ******* stupid. You punish for the hit, for the intent, for the carelessness.

What would you think if Lilja broke Backes neck? Given your opinion of how the rules should work, I would argue Lilja shouldn't be able to return to the game of hockey at all until Backes healed from his neck injury, even if it took 5 years.

Punishments need to be doled out for the act, not whether or not you really hurt the guy.

I give this thread a big old s***burger.

The Rule is 5 and a game for a serious boarding call (major Penalty) If Backes had broken his neck then Lilja would be in the same category that Bertuzzi is in, and would not be fair.

The league wants to cut down on those penalties and punish the act for the "Kids Watching At Home". I know the kids know better, But if one penalty isnt called because of injury or not then the decision to run someone from behind will go rampant. Do I belive that the penalty was justified ABSOLUTELY.....Should the player act it out...no..... But get your face mashed into the boards by someone twice your size and tell me if you remember where you are at that moment?

But in Football if a player is injured and causes a TIME OUT, he MUST LEAVE the field and cannot participate in the next play. That type of Precautionary measure COULD be adopted by the NHL reguarding a player who is injured and causes the game to stop and then decide "I'm ok Ill Play"

But IF Llilja had caused a breakage in a neck on that play SHould Lilja be out until Backes can play?? NO way Steve Moore isnt playing Hockey and Bertuzzi is!!!!!

[Blueliner 69]

The only reason why he was given five minutes was because Backes was "injured." If he would have gotten up right away, Lilja would have only gotten two minutes.

[esteef 2,679]

At least we're talking about a Wing dishing out punishment to someone else, instead of the other way around as usual. I wonder what would've happened had Janssen been in the game?

esteef