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The goaltending deficit in Detroit


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#1 boomer

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 02:57 PM

I was wathching the Holland interview on Tsn's trade watch segment 2009 last night. Briefly the moderator alluded how Holland has always managed to bring in that last piece of the puzzle come playoff time. Holland's view was good defence is what championship teams are all about, in hockey or any sport for that matter he stated. He used the Brad Stuart example for last year's cup run, and the Jaime Mcoun aquisition at the deadline years back that also helped the Wings secure the Cup. He stated that playoff hockey is all about being able to win those key low scoring games. Well Mr. Holland if that's the case you better secure your self a starting goaltender that can stop an average of 25 shots a game(that's what net minders get in Detroit; because what you have right now is goaltending that allows on average 3 to 4 and sometimes atrociously more goals per game despite low shot totals. Prime example, Osgood's performance last night against the Coyotes - mediocre goaltending which has been Detrot's achilles heel all year. So Mr Holland make no mistake about it to keep the Cup it will be all centered on you getting us a goaltender who can assure us more often than not that in 20 something shot games he can shut the door and give our D the breathing room they need to go all the way.

#2 Ms_Hockey

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:04 PM

Here we go again. rolleyes.gif
QUOTE (Datsyerberger @ January 19, 2009 - 01:32PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A new Lemieux-McCarty fight, as seen by internet forum posters.

Lemieux cheapshots a player with his walker, drawing the ire of D-Mac, who hobbles over. They draw their canes, salute, and cross them, then proceed to repeatedly whack eachother over the heads while hanging onto the bench with their other hands for balance. D-Mac then hits Lemieux's hip, which gives out, Lemieux feebly falls to the ground, crumpling as D-Mac continues to land barely noticeable Yoda-esque cane strikes. Lemieux's age begins catching up to him, crying "what a world, what a world..!" as he melts into a puddle of goo.

#3 YoungGuns1340

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:12 PM

One or the other has to be fixed. I'm confident that if the Wings were to somehow rectify the defense, that Conklin would be adequate enough to win some playoff games. Conklin has a .915 save percentage%. If we can strengthen our defense and cut down on those shots in the slot, I think you'd probably see Conklin pull off some games with only a goal or two against.

One things for sure, though. We have to fix one or the other. If we can boost our defense, then we should be able to insulate our goaltenders. But if we can't do that, then we need a goalie whos gonna make up for our defensive gaffs. And neither Osgood nor Conklin seems capable of being a game stealer.
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#4 PROBIE4PREZ

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:16 PM

annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd the canidates are? ....dont kno many elite goalies that will go for picks .. Osgood needs confidence and in the next 30 games he has a chance to change peoples minds ..
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#5 RedArmy

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:17 PM

QUOTE (YoungGuns1340 @ February 5, 2009 - 03:12PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
One or the other has to be fixed. I'm confident that if the Wings were to somehow rectify the defense, that Conklin would be adequate enough to win some playoff games. Conklin has a .915 save percentage%. If we can strengthen our defense and cut down on those shots in the slot, I think you'd probably see Conklin pull off some games with only a goal or two against.

One things for sure, though. We have to fix one or the other. If we can boost our defense, then we should be able to insulate our goaltenders. But if we can't do that, then we need a goalie whos gonna make up for our defensive gaffs. And neither Osgood nor Conklin seems capable of being a game stealer.

amen to that, but 5 shut outs are pretty impressive for conks this season... Ozzie keeps stinking up the joint, unfortunately. I don't know if getting a goaly will help it might make Conks disgruntled and send Ozzie into further downward spiral...

#6 Ms_Hockey

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:25 PM

QUOTE (RedArmy @ February 5, 2009 - 03:17PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
amen to that, but 5 shut outs are pretty impressive for conks this season... Ozzie keeps stinking up the joint, unfortunately. I don't know if getting a goaly will help it might make Conks disgruntled and send Ozzie into further downward spiral...

I can't imagine it would hurt Osgood like that. He's one of the most laid back goaltenders in the game. He doesn't get angry. He doesn't smack his stick on the goalposts when a puck goes in. He just moves on and pretends it never happened.

I'm sure if we got a new goalie, Osgood would understand. As for Conks - I can't say.

EDIT: My grammar was atrocious.

Edited by Ms_Hockey, 05 February 2009 - 03:26 PM.

QUOTE (Datsyerberger @ January 19, 2009 - 01:32PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
A new Lemieux-McCarty fight, as seen by internet forum posters.

Lemieux cheapshots a player with his walker, drawing the ire of D-Mac, who hobbles over. They draw their canes, salute, and cross them, then proceed to repeatedly whack eachother over the heads while hanging onto the bench with their other hands for balance. D-Mac then hits Lemieux's hip, which gives out, Lemieux feebly falls to the ground, crumpling as D-Mac continues to land barely noticeable Yoda-esque cane strikes. Lemieux's age begins catching up to him, crying "what a world, what a world..!" as he melts into a puddle of goo.

#7 Datsyerberger

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:51 PM

Awesome! Another thread on this is just what we needed!

Seriously, I could make 10,000 threads on the poor team defense, which is the much greater problem at hand here if you examine the quality of scoring chances rather than SV% alone, but it wouldn't make the situation any less irritating.

I'm not saying goaltending shouldn't be discussed, just that this could go in one of the pre-existing threads (Some on the front page!) which have already gone over these same points 2939282190 times.
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#8 mindfly

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:53 PM

Why is osgood living in denial and lying to himself..

"I feel real good out there. I feel sharp and confident"

BS osgood.. BS!

#9 Drake_Marcus

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:54 PM

QUOTE (Ms_Hockey @ February 5, 2009 - 02:04PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Here we go again. rolleyes.gif


? So you feel that Ozzy's performance isn't worrying? Sure our defense hasn't looked great out there, but they aren't getting that last line of defense goaltending you expect from your goalie. In the games where they do get that (ie. when Conks is on his game or Oz is having a good night) the score is very low. A few times Ozzy has played great but got killed by the defense in front of him. No question on that- it's happened. BUT those nights are much less common than the nights where Ozzy just isn't there for us.

Team defense is definitely troublesome right now, but goaltending is definitely the most impactful change one can make to solve this problem in a single move.
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#10 Z and D for the C

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 03:56 PM

I think bettman is spiking ozzie's water at the net.

Just cause you look like the gimp don't mean you play like the gimp!


#11 Drake_Marcus

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 04:00 PM

To be honest- I think Ozzy would really benefit from the Wings bringing in his off season goaltending coach (not the current guy they have in Detroit/GR). All of Ozzy's great changes and improvements in his game came from his off season goaltending coach.
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#12 puckloo39

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 04:05 PM

QUOTE (Ms_Hockey @ February 5, 2009 - 02:25PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I can't imagine it would hurt Osgood like that. He's one of the most laid back goaltenders in the game. He doesn't get angry. He doesn't smack his stick on the goalposts when a puck goes in. He just moves on and pretends it never happened.

I'm sure if we got a new goalie, Osgood would understand. As for Conks - I can't say.


I don't disagree with any of the above. Perhaps he's a little too laid back for his own (and the Red Wings') good? Babcock called him out after last night, not throwing Ozzie under the bus but certainly pointing at him as the problem. I am hoping Ozzie takes it for what it is: a public announcement that the #1 goalie in Detroit has to be better than he's been, and soon.

A little self-directed anger in Ozzie's case might be a good thing, for a change. As for Conklin, he's just thrilled to be a Wing, and shows it every time he's out there. He's got 5 shuts outs, which happen to be all of the shut outs the Wings have this season.

Before any of you all start in with, "but, they play differently in front of Ozzie..." If they do, you can probably figure out why, if you just think about it. The Wings can't play their game when they are worrying about making up a goal deficit, game in and game out. They can't play loose (as Ozzie suggested, saying some players ought to loosen up), when they have in the back of their heads that every lead they get is likely to be surrendered in the next shift.

Ozzie can't rest on last season's laurels. Last season was last season.

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#13 digitaljohn88

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 04:15 PM

QUOTE (mindfly @ February 5, 2009 - 01:53PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why is osgood living in denial and lying to himself..

"I feel real good out there. I feel sharp and confident"

BS osgood.. BS!



I'd rather have him at least pretend to be confident than take the Manny Legace route:

"OH GOD, why me! I'm so bad! My team hates me I'm the worst player in the NHL... SOMEBODY GET ME A GUN"

biggrin.gif biggrin.gif

Edited by digitaljohn88, 05 February 2009 - 04:16 PM.


#14 dat's sick

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 04:20 PM

QUOTE (mindfly @ February 5, 2009 - 09:53PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why is osgood living in denial and lying to himself..

"I feel real good out there. I feel sharp and confident"

BS osgood.. BS!

Atleast he's thinkin positive. Not like Legace who looks like he's about two seconds away from killing himself after a bad game.

Fake Edit: ..beaten by digitaljohn.

#15 Echolalia

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 04:22 PM

Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood Osgood

#16 swiss_fan

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 04:45 PM

Osgood's play has been sooo brutal. One soft goal again yesterday. He averages one or two per night.
I think one of the best think for the RW would be that Osgood go on to play like this: It would leave no other option to KH than to aquire a goaltender at the deadline. In the other hand if Osgood's play increase but just a little bit to become less than average-average, this could bite us back in the longterm and not be enough to go far this spring..

There is still the option his play become really better, but i don't think it would come by magic in spring..

#17 boomer

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 04:50 PM

[quote name='PROBIE4PREZ' date='February 5, 2009 - 03:16PM' post='1537871']
annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd the canidates are? ....dont kno many elite goalies that will go for picks .. Osgood needs confidence and in the next 30 games he has a chance to change peoples minds ..
Sorry but if the team keeps playing catch up hockey like they been playing for most of the season, come play off time they'll be drained. As for getting a number one goalie for a draft pick your probably right it ain't going to happen. But if you take the route that Conklin has been solid enough and you need someone feasible to platoon him with well here are your top candidates: Edmonton-Roloson;Mtl Halak ;Colorado Budjai ;Atlanta Hedberg; Ottawa Gerber; Toskala Toronto. Just look at Thomas and Fernandez in Boston and you'll get my drift. And as far as anyone's feelings- hey I'm still thinking how Mike Vernon got scewed years ago cuz management looked to Osgood to do it on the cheap. And if that's not the solution then clear the salary cap we don't need anymore long term snipers with fat contracts; roll the dice the trade Phil way .

#18 NomadFromKazoo

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 05:05 PM

QUOTE (boomer @ February 5, 2009 - 02:57PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I was wathching the Holland interview on Tsn's trade watch segment 2009 last night. Briefly the moderator alluded how Holland has always managed to bring in that last piece of the puzzle come playoff time. Holland's view was good defence is what championship teams are all about, in hockey or any sport for that matter he stated. He used the Brad Stuart example for last year's cup run, and the Jaime Mcoun aquisition at the deadline years back that also helped the Wings secure the Cup. He stated that playoff hockey is all about being able to win those key low scoring games. Well Mr. Holland if that's the case you better secure your self a starting goaltender that can stop an average of 25 shots a game(that's what net minders get in Detroit; because what you have right now is goaltending that allows on average 3 to 4 and sometimes atrociously more goals per game despite low shot totals. Prime example, Osgood's performance last night against the Coyotes - mediocre goaltending which has been Detrot's achilles heel all year. So Mr Holland make no mistake about it to keep the Cup it will be all centered on you getting us a goaltender who can assure us more often than not that in 20 something shot games he can shut the door and give our D the breathing room they need to go all the way.

So how exactly did you come up with this thread idea exactly? Wow, a thread about Ozzie. Talk about out of the blue. Is it that you hadn't seen one in over 5 minutes? Ozzie threads by the way are like bad goal tending . Even though it seems like a bad goaltender can't stop a shot, they are still usually stopping about 90% of them. Just like it only seems like almost every thread is about Ozzie when actually probably only like 40% of them are. OK, Ozzie threads are worse at this point then bad goal tending, but the principle's the same.
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#19 interminded

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 05:49 PM


Are people joining this forum to just make their very first post about our goaltending ?

I guess it's hard to have some original thoughts...

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#20 hckypete96

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Posted 05 February 2009 - 06:18 PM

ray emery.
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