Lidstrom is Hurting

[Broken 16 381]

It seems pretty obvious to me. He's still playing incredible hockey, but he seems a lot more tentative than he usually is. Not many discussions going on about the D situation with all the forwards bieng negotiated with, but I think there are a couple issues. I'm not in any way, shape or form advocating the trade of Lidstrom. But seeing him hindered reminds me how fragile our defense is without him.

I've gone through the season so far assuming that there was a lack of focus because most nights the Red Wings defensive game is far from stellar. I think the D needs new blood. I predict Holland will ship someone off the roster and bring in a suprising name.

Edited February 15, 2009 by Broken 16

[Electrophile 3,554]

He's going to have to have surgery on that elbow in the off-season. As for your scenario of sending someone down to bring in some fresh D blood, who do you have in mind? Or are you just hypothesizing at this point?

[Broken 16 381]

He's going to have to have surgery on that elbow in the off-season. As for your scenario of sending someone down to bring in some fresh D blood, who do you have in mind? Or are you just hypothesizing at this point?

Hypothesizing about the Wings is one of my favorite past times.

I don't want anyone to get sent down. I want to see a trade. Does Kronwall have a NTC? I wouldn't mind seeing him get shipped at the deadline. <puts on flame retardent suit>

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

Hypothesizing about the Wings is one of my favorite past times.

I don't want anyone to get sent down. I want to see a trade. Does Kronwall have a NTC? I wouldn't mind seeing him get shipped at the deadline. <puts on flame retardent suit>

I disagree on that...I think that shipping out Kronwall is a bad idea altogther. We'd be better off trying to find a way to get Jonathan Ericsson healthy and up in the NHL, rather than moving a solid D-man like Kronner. I'd hate to see him go...

If I traded any of our D-men, it would be Lebda, but sadly, he doesn't carry any trade value. We'd more than likely be forced to deal a forward in order to shore up the D. My choice would be Filppula and Lebda packaged for a D-man, and maybe a draft pick, if that could be done. Not sure if that will happen, or who we realistically could get, considering the Wings' team salary, but I'd be interested to see what might happen at the deadline.

[Broken 16 381]

I disagree on that...I think that shipping out Kronwall is a bad idea altogther. We'd be better off trying to find a way to get Jonathan Ericsson healthy and up in the NHL, rather than moving a solid D-man like Kronner. I'd hate to see him go...

If I traded any of our D-men, it would be Lebda, but sadly, he doesn't carry any trade value. We'd more than likely be forced to deal a forward in order to shore up the D. My choice would be Filppula and Lebda packaged for a D-man, and maybe a draft pick, if that could be done. Not sure if that will happen, or who we realistically could get, considering the Wings' team salary, but I'd be interested to see what might happen at the deadline.

The only reason I mention Kronwall is because his physical game has all but disappeared and he has trade value. I find it alarming that I've watched almost every single Wings game this season and I can honestly say that I can't remember a single bone-crushing open ice hit from him. I'm sure there have been some, but nothing sticks out... at all.

Edited February 15, 2009 by Broken 16

[CenterIce 83]

The only reason I mention Kronwall is because his physical game has all but disappeared and he has trade value. I find it alarming that I've watched almost every single Wings game this season and I can honestly say that I can't remember a single bone-crushing open ice hit from him. I'm sure there have been some, but nothing sticks out... at all.

Would you rather have a injured Kronwall who can't play during the playoffs or a healthy Kronwall who can dish out the hits during the playoffs, when everything is on the line?

[norrisnick 1]

Nick is playing absolutely dominating D right now. He may have pain in his elbow, but it isn't affecting his game.

[TheUkrainian 49]

Yeah, I have a feeling that Kronner is holding back a bit before the playoffs start. Once they start, he will go back to destroying guys. (I hope)

[edicius 3,269]

Yeah, I have a feeling that Kronner is holding back a bit before the playoffs start. Once they start, he will go back to destroying guys. (I hope)

And if you really look at things, he's been damn productive lately. 16 points in the last 15 games is nothing to sneeze at.

[soonboomer 31]

oh great...another "the sky is falling thread"....FAIL

[Yzersyukstromberg 0]

The only reason I mention Kronwall is because his physical game has all but disappeared and he has trade value. I find it alarming that I've watched almost every single Wings game this season and I can honestly say that I can't remember a single bone-crushing open ice hit from him. I'm sure there have been some, but nothing sticks out... at all.

You know, it's funny you mention that...I was saying the exact same thing to my friend at the game the other night. I've been to every single home game this year, and I could count Kronner's big hits on one hand. However, having said that, I really feel like Kronner has picked up his game on an overall basis, piling up the assists, and slowly cutting down on his giveaways. I'm more than confident that he's still got the big, bonecrushing hits in him, but I think that maybe the coaching staff and management have asked him to hold back the real big ones until the postseason...we already know he's battled injuries throughout his career, and the risk of him getting hurt is too high...notice how he's played 54 of 56 games this season, much more than usual. I'm thinking you're going to see Nik deliver the hits come playoff time, but during the regular season, when you're only playing a club once, there's really less of a need to deliver the monster hit. In a series, where you're playing the same team up to 7 times in a row, the big hit becomes more important, with the possibility of shaking guys up or knocking them out of a series....

In my opinion, this guy is a keeper...we'll want him around once Lidstrom decides to retire...

[TheUkrainian 49]

And if you really look at things, he's been damn productive lately. 16 points in the last 15 games is nothing to sneeze at.

Yeah, I just hope that when his hard hitting returns, his point production doesn't drop off.

[Broken 16 381]

oh great...another "the sky is falling thread"....FAIL

It's not a "sky is falling" thread... EPIC FAIL

Nick is playing absolutely dominating D right now. He may have pain in his elbow, but it isn't affecting his game.

C'mon... Dominating? That's going a little far. He's coughed up the puck more this season than any other season I can remember. Again... this isn't a knock on him. He's still better than 90% of other d-men. Also... I'm sorry, pain in his elbow is ABSOLUTELY affecting his game. I'm sure he would tell you the same thing.

Would you rather have a injured Kronwall who can't play during the playoffs or a healthy Kronwall who can dish out the hits during the playoffs, when everything is on the line?

So you think he can just turn it off and on at will... I hope you're right. We'll see.

And if you really look at things, he's been damn productive lately. 16 points in the last 15 games is nothing to sneeze at.

I'm not concerned about his point production. The Wings are really gonna need his physical game for the playoffs. I hope he can turn it on whenever like the above poster implies. I'm skeptical.

[xBrave_Heartx 0]

I think when we are 100% healthy, he might rest it a few games before the playoffs start

[TheUkrainian 49]

Once the playoffs come around, Datsyuk will turn into the hulk and start laying people out.

[norrisnick 1]

C'mon... Dominating? That's going a little far. He's coughed up the puck more this season than any other season I can remember. Again... this isn't a knock on him. He's still better than 90% of other d-men. Also... I'm sorry, pain in his elbow is ABSOLUTELY affecting his game. I'm sure he would tell you the same thing.

Yes. Dominating. He's always been a slow starter and this season it's been compounded by a short summer and adjusting to a visor. But he's been rock solid compared to ALL other defensemen, not just 90%. I don't think Wing fans realize how many mistakes the top D make around the league. No one in league history has ever been as flawless as Nick has been throughout his career. Others may have been more dominating in one facet or another, but in terms of mistake free positional defense no one touches Nick. So a slow start or a slump looks glaring in comparison, but not if you compare him to others around the league.

Nick would also tell you that he doesn't consider himself the best of his generation or one of the top 3-4 all time either. He's in pain and I'm sure he's playing through it or compensating one way or another, but right now it's not holding him back in the least.

[shoe 165]

Would you rather have a injured Kronwall who can't play during the playoffs or a healthy Kronwall who can dish out the hits during the playoffs, when everything is on the line?

I have a theory about this that is related. Ever notice that players who deliver a good clean honest hard hit get jumped all over right after by the other team. Im wonering in the playoffs when giving up a power play oportunity can make or break a game that this whole you hit my guy ill slash/crosscheck/spear you back will go away and then Kronwall can give those big hits and not have to worry about some idiot retalliating.

There is also the whole no real tough guy on the team to put fear into curbing retaliation from players on the recieving end of a big hit. Eg Kronwall nails Crosby with an open ice hit. Would Matt Cooke take a cheap shot at Kronwall if he knew Downey was on the bench?

[norrisnick 1]

I have a theory about this that is related. Ever notice that players who deliver a good clean honest hard hit get jumped all over right after by the other team. Im wonering in the playoffs when giving up a power play oportunity can make or break a game that this whole you hit my guy ill slash/crosscheck/spear you back will go away and then Kronwall can give those big hits and not have to worry about some idiot retalliating.

There is also the whole no real tough guy on the team to put fear into curbing retaliation from players on the recieving end of a big hit. Eg Kronwall nails Crosby with an open ice hit. Would Matt Cooke take a cheap shot at Kronwall if he knew Downey was on the bench?

He'd do it if Downey were on the ice. Fighters don't scare the players that dish out questionable hits.

[Broken 16 381]

Yes. Dominating. He's always been a slow starter and this season it's been compounded by a short summer and adjusting to a visor. But he's been rock solid compared to ALL other defensemen, not just 90%. I don't think Wing fans realize how many mistakes the top D make around the league. No one in league history has ever been as flawless as Nick has been throughout his career. Others may have been more dominating in one facet or another, but in terms of mistake free positional defense no one touches Nick. So a slow start or a slump looks glaring in comparison, but not if you compare him to others around the league.

Nick would also tell you that he doesn't consider himself the best of his generation or one of the top 3-4 all time either. He's in pain and I'm sure he's playing through it or compensating one way or another, but right now it's not holding him back in the least.

I appreciate your passion for Lidstrom...

[norrisnick 1]

I appreciate your passion for Lidstrom...

Liar.

Lidstrom is playing Norris-caliber defense. He had an iffy November, but he's more than fine now. Had he not skipped the All-Star game and mentioned his elbow, this thread wouldn't exist.

[clutchngrab 12]

I have a theory about this that is related. Ever notice that players who deliver a good clean honest hard hit get jumped all over right after by the other team. Im wonering in the playoffs when giving up a power play oportunity can make or break a game that this whole you hit my guy ill slash/crosscheck/spear you back will go away and then Kronwall can give those big hits and not have to worry about some idiot retalliating.

There is also the whole no real tough guy on the team to put fear into curbing retaliation from players on the recieving end of a big hit. Eg Kronwall nails Crosby with an open ice hit. Would Matt Cooke take a cheap shot at Kronwall if he knew Downey was on the bench?

I think you are spot on. As much as we fans enjoy seeing him lay out other players, he has to pick his spots in order to not be a target. Part of that is because we don't have an enforcer and part of that is because Bettmans NHL basically sucks ass.

[Broken 16 381]

Liar.

Lidstrom is playing Norris-caliber defense. He had an iffy November, but he's more than fine now. Had he not skipped the All-Star game and mentioned his elbow, this thread wouldn't exist.

Wrong. I'm just not so blinded by love that I'm unwilling to admit when Nick is, obviously, not 100%.

Besides... if you had bothered to fully read my original post, you would have realized that I'm not even blaming him for anything. I'm more concerned about Kronwall. But we can continue to beat a dead horse and discuss the greatness that is Nick Lidstrom. Do you think he looks better in his whites or his reds?

For the record... I'm not a liar. As a Red Wing fan, I fully appreciate a staunch supporter of any Wing..

Edited February 15, 2009 by Broken 16

[norrisnick 1]

Nik has tried laying the body a ton, but he always seems to fly right by them in the neutral zone and gives up a rush against. You start swinging and missing like that and you're gonna tighten up and the whole thing snowballs. Once he gets his first good lick in, more should follow.

[Coolio Mendez 7]

Yes. Dominating. He's always been a slow starter and this season it's been compounded by a short summer and adjusting to a visor. But he's been rock solid compared to ALL other defensemen, not just 90%. I don't think Wing fans realize how many mistakes the top D make around the league. No one in league history has ever been as flawless as Nick has been throughout his career. Others may have been more dominating in one facet or another, but in terms of mistake free positional defense no one touches Nick. So a slow start or a slump looks glaring in comparison, but not if you compare him to others around the league.

Nick would also tell you that he doesn't consider himself the best of his generation or one of the top 3-4 all time either. He's in pain and I'm sure he's playing through it or compensating one way or another, but right now it's not holding him back in the least.

Last summer, Lidstrom's own President (and the guy who drafted Lidstrom) said that he doesn't have Lidstrom in his top 20 and that Denis Potvin was the best defenceman he ever drafted.

[norrisnick 1]

Wrong. I'm just not so blinded by love that I'm unwilling to admit when Nick is, obviously, not 100%.

Besides... if you had bothered to fully read my original post, you would have realized that I'm not even blaming him for anything. I'm more concerned about Kronwall. But we can continue to beat a dead horse and discuss the greatness that is Nick Lidstrom. Do you think he looks better in his whites or his reds?

Can you at least point to something, anything, tangible out on the ice that would suggest to you that he's not 100%? He's pokechecking, shooting, passing. Most of the rest of the defensive roster has been a giant sieve, but Nick has been fine barring an uncharacteristically low performing November. Put his November on par with the rest of his season and he's on pace for a 65 point season and +50-something. Obviously in decline...

So the question stands, if you're worried about Nik why is it Nick that is hurting?