Pens Team Defense

[Frozen-Man 144]

keep thinking this way....... we love it

The easiest way to look at this is to look at the stats of the playoffs so far. The pens have played one more game than the wings so take that into consideration.

Pittsburgh? Defense?

How many two way forwards do they have? I can think of two.

I was interested in trying to see how good Pits defense is (statistically speaking which doensn't always quite match reality) by comparing teams that they had played in the playoffs with how those teams did against other teams (i.e. only teams that they played in the 2nd or 3rd round so I could compare them to the teams they played in earlier rounds).

Carolina:

First Round - Against New Jersey the Hurricanes averaged 2.48 goals per game.

Second Round - Against Boston the Hurricanes averaged 2.28 goals per game.

Third Round - Against Pittsburgh the Hurricanes averaged 2.25 goals per game.

So defensively speaking the Penguins held the Canes to 0.03 fewer goals per game than Boston did, 0.23 fewer goals per game than New Jersey did, and 0.13 goals per game less than the average of all other opponents Carolina played in the playoffs. This is not bad considering they held them to almost a quarter less goals per game than New Jersey did and they are always above average defensively and one of the best goalies of all time.

Washington:

First Round - Against NY Rangers the Capitals averaged 2.71 goals per game.

Second Round - Against Pittsburgh the Capitals averaged 3.14 goals per game.

So defensively speaking the Penguins allowed the Capitals to score 0.43 goals per game more than the New York Rangers did. This is not good for the Pens considering that they allowed the Caps to score almost half a point more per game than the Rangers did.

If you total all three series that means that Pit gave up an average of 0.06 goals per game more to their opponents than did the other teams that played those same opponents this not much but it doesn't show them to be that great defensively either.

Compare that with how the Red Wings matched up against their opponents

Chicago:

First Round - Against Calgary the Hawks averaged 3.50 goals per game.

Second Round - Against Vancouver the Hawks averaged 3.83 goals per game.

Third Round - Against Detroit the Hawks averaged 2.00 goals per game.

So defensively speaking the Wings held the Hawks to 1.50 fewer goals per game than Calgary did, 1.83 fewer goals per game than Vancouver did, and 1.67 goals per game less than the average of all other opponents the Hawks played in the playoffs. This is incredible especially considering they held the Hawks to well over a goal and a half less per game than two well above average defensive teams. *This should also say something to all those always whining about Ozzy or not spending cash on a high priced goalie - Kipper and Bobby Lou didn't get the job done.

Anaheim:

First Round - Against San Jose the Ducks averaged 3.00 goals per game.

Second Round - Against Detroit the Ducks averaged 2.42 goals per game.

So defensively speaking the Wings held the Ducks to 0.58 fewer goals per game than San Jose did. This also is a very good feat. The Wings held the Ducks to well over half a point per game fewer than the Sharks did.

If you total all three series that means that the Wings on average allowed 1.30 goals per game LESS to their opponents (-0.03, -0.23, +0.43 = +0.17) than did the other teams that played those same opponents. That number is huge and shows the great defensive prowess of this team (remember Pit actually allowed more goals per game (.06) than their opponents did, which give Detroit a differential of 1.36 goals per game over Pit).

One team is great defensively and it sure isn't the Penguins.

[Z Winged Dangler 2,082]

I was interested in trying to see how good Pits defense is (statistically speaking which doensn't always quite match reality) by comparing teams that they had played in the playoffs with how those teams did against other teams (i.e. only teams that they played in the 2nd or 3rd round so I could compare them to the teams they played in earlier rounds).

Carolina:

First Round - Against New Jersey the Hurricanes averaged 2.48 goals per game.

Second Round - Against Boston the Hurricanes averaged 2.28 goals per game.

Third Round - Against Pittsburgh the Hurricanes averaged 2.25 goals per game.

So defensively speaking the Penguins held the Canes to 0.03 fewer goals per game than Boston did, 0.23 fewer goals per game than New Jersey did, and 0.13 goals per game less than the average of all other opponents Carolina played in the playoffs. This is not bad considering they held them to almost a quarter less goals per game than New Jersey did and they are always above average defensively and one of the best goalies of all time.

Washington:

First Round - Against NY Rangers the Capitals averaged 2.71 goals per game.

Second Round - Against Pittsburgh the Capitals averaged 3.14 goals per game.

So defensively speaking the Penguins allowed the Capitals to score 0.43 goals per game more than the New York Rangers did. This is not good for the Pens considering that they allowed the Caps to score almost half a point more per game than the Rangers did.

If you total all three series that means that Pit gave up an average of 0.06 goals per game more to their opponents than did the other teams that played those same opponents this not much but it doesn't show them to be that great defensively either.

Compare that with how the Red Wings matched up against their opponents

Chicago:

First Round - Against Calgary the Hawks averaged 3.50 goals per game.

Second Round - Against Vancouver the Hawks averaged 3.83 goals per game.

Third Round - Against Detroit the Hawks averaged 2.00 goals per game.

So defensively speaking the Wings held the Hawks to 1.50 fewer goals per game than Calgary did, 1.83 fewer goals per game than Vancouver did, and 1.67 goals per game less than the average of all other opponents the Hawks played in the playoffs. This is incredible especially considering they held the Hawks to well over a goal and a half less per game than two well above average defensive teams. *This should also say something to all those always whining about Ozzy or not spending cash on a high priced goalie - Kipper and Bobby Lou didn't get the job done.

Anaheim:

First Round - Against San Jose the Ducks averaged 3.00 goals per game.

Second Round - Against Detroit the Ducks averaged 2.42 goals per game.

So defensively speaking the Wings held the Ducks to 0.58 fewer goals per game than San Jose did. This also is a very good feat. The Wings held the Ducks to well over half a point per game fewer than the Sharks did.

If you total all three series that means that the Wings on average allowed 1.30 goals per game LESS to their opponents (-0.03, -0.23, +0.43 = +0.17) than did the other teams that played those same opponents. That number is huge and shows the great defensive prowess of this team (remember Pit actually allowed more goals per game (.06) than their opponents did, which give Detroit a differential of 1.36 goals per game over Pit).

One team is great defensively and it sure isn't the Penguins.

great post! more stats for the pens fans to swallow.

[SuperNovaXll 124]

Let's just put it this way. In terms of defense, we've already faced the toughest team we're going to face... Anaheim.

Yep, I dont care how great the Pen's fans say there D is. Its nowhere near what the Ducks had.

I really think the key to this series is going to be how good of a job Z does on Cindy, How well Ozzy plays and if our PK is going to perform.

[flip 5]

The glaring problems with the Wings this season were their penalty kill and inconsistent goaltending. The latter has been taken care of. Unlike last year, Pittsburgh's powerplay is no longer anything to write home about. It has a lot to do with the fact that they don't have a Ryan Malone to stand in front of the goalie - Staal tries to on the second unit, but he's not very well versed. Add to that Gonchar's obvious injury, and the Wings should have an easier time on the penalty kill than in the Anaheim or Chicago series. Columbus's powerplay was just inept.

As for the Penguins defense, it's certainly the team's shortcoming. Gonchar played lights out last year, but as I said, he's still injured. Orpik is solid, but he has a propensity to take stupid penalties. The Scuderi/Gill pairing may become the Pens' third unit in the series because Gill moves like molasses on the ice and struggles with the cycle, and Scuderi has a difficult time getting the puck out of his own zone. The third pairing - Letang and Eaton - have zero Finals experience. Letang sat out the Finals last year after Luc Bourdon was killed and Eaton was still recovering from his ACL injury. Neither are large, physical defensemen (both weigh around 200).

The Penguins also lack the Wings' dedication to backchecking.

Midway through the Canes series, Fleury's save percentage was below .900, even though he was facing fewer than 30 shots per game. Combine that with the Wings tendency to average around 40 shots/game, and something's got to give.

Edit: Look no further than how befuddled the Penguins were by the Canes' cycle in the previous series. Point to the sweep as often as you please, but it had nothing to do with the Canes' failure to create opportunities and everything to do with the weak team defense and Cam Ward.

Edited May 29, 2009 by flip

[Idoit40fans 0]

All I know is that the Wings don't get a 2 game head start on the series this year. The Penguins will be ready to play a Stanley Cup Finals series.

[Idoit40fans 0]

Also, Letang played the first 2 games of the Finals last year.

[Manoir 70]

I've watched a lot of Pens games and they are not very impressive in any area. They have 2 superstars, that's it. The team looks good because they play in the horrible Eastern conference. The best d-man they've faced so far is an injured Kimmo Timonen. If it wasn't for the schedule the Wings would have had a real easy time.

Edited May 29, 2009 by Manoir

[Doc Holiday 0]

All I know is that the Wings don't get a 2 game head start on the series this year. The Penguins will be ready to play a Stanley Cup Finals series.

The Penguins had the benefit of having their backs to the wall when they realized they had to play better.

They don't have that benefit this year, and they still don't know how to play Detroit without that desperation.

[Idoit40fans 0]

The Penguins had the benefit of having their backs to the wall when they realized they had to play better.

They don't have that benefit this year, and they still don't know how to play Detroit without that desperation.

We'll find out soon enough. If you can see the future though, let me know who will win the Super Bowl next year. I'm going to Vegas and I'll place my bet now.

[Frozen-Man 144]

All I know is that the Wings don't get a 2 game head start on the series this year. The Penguins will be ready to play a Stanley Cup Finals series.

I love how it is that the Wings had a "2 game head start on the series[,]" when it was nothing of the sort. It was a pummeling that the Wings gave as part of the entire 6 game series, you could just as easily say the Wings spotted Pittsburgh games 3 and 5.

[Snazzy 0]

great post! more stats for the pens fans to swallow.

From reading some of the Pens fan's posts on both this forum and theirs, they refuse to accept statistics unless it's in their favor. From reading some of the posts on their forum, they believe that they are already a sure lock to win the Stanley Cup because of Crosby and Malkins post-season points. When +/- and defense is mentioned, they'll refuse to respond, they'll comeback with "Stats are meaningless" as they ride off about how "Crosby and Malkin are the BESTESTESZZ PLAYERZZ IN THE WHOLE WIDE WORLDZZZZ--Just look at their goal statz!"

I'm yet to read one intelligent post from a Pens fan.

[Doc Holiday 0]

We'll find out soon enough. If you can see the future though, let me know who will win the Super Bowl next year. I'm going to Vegas and I'll place my bet now.

Who's predicting here?

Did the Penguins figure out how to play in the SCF without needing that desperation?

[Manoir 70]

Man, I hate the Penguins (also known as the team that is only good because they had top draft picks for like 7 years in a row).

[Idoit40fans 0]

Who's predicting here?

Did the Penguins figure out how to play in the SCF without needing that desperation?

We'll find out soon enough.

[Ms_Hockey 0]

From reading some of the Pens fan's posts on both this forum and theirs, they refuse to accept statistics unless it's in their favor. From reading some of the posts on their forum, they believe that they are already a sure lock to win the Stanley Cup because of Crosby and Malkins post-season points. When +/- and defense is mentioned, they'll refuse to respond, they'll comeback with "Stats are meaningless" as they ride off about how "Crosby and Malkin are the BESTESTESZZ PLAYERZZ IN THE WHOLE WIDE WORLDZZZZ--Just look at their goal statz!"

I'm yet to read one intelligent post from a Pens fan.

But noooooooooooo! They're much more than a two-man team! That's just a myth! ALL MYTH, I TELL YOU!

Yeah.. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

[Manoir 70]

Pens fans are very intelligent, they think Maxime Talbot should be considered for the Conn Smythe.

[Idoit40fans 0]

But noooooooooooo! They're much more than a two-man team! That's just a myth! ALL MYTH, I TELL YOU!

Yeah.. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

Yes, their feelings that the Pens will win are sooooo much different than the sure thing that so many people here make it out to be for Detroit.

[Ms_Hockey 0]

Yes, their feelings that the Pens will win are sooooo much different than the sure thing that so many people here make it out to be for Detroit.

That's not what I'm referring to. I wouldn't expect Pens fans to think they're going to lose. My comment was sarcasm over the fact that they actually think they have more than two star contributors.

They don't. And if you shut down Crosby & Malkin, they're going to have to change up their game plan.. and fast.

[Snazzy 0]

Man, I hate the Penguins (also known as the team that is only good because they had top draft picks for like 7 years in a row).

Yeah, no s*** right. If they played in the West, they'd be below Chicago. Chicago is a better team than the 2009 Penguins and would own them in 6 games at the most. I find it funny that they think they upgraded since last playoffs. The downgraded in terms of depth and defense. Sure their two stars are playing well, better than last year. Yet they refuse to comprehend that we are a MUCH better team than last year too. And I don't mean just with the Hossa factor, but this year we have a healthy Franzen and our young guys are dominating. Hell, even Flip (or 3rd line guy) was shutting down Getzlaf. Malkin is in for a big surprise if he thinks he's going to play well against Flip. And we already know Zetterberg owns Crosby. What else is funny is their #1 Dman would be our #3 at best. Our #5 would be their #2. We owned the Pens before, we'll just keep handing their asses back to them until they realize they are overrated in the Finals.

I can't wait to see the Peguins cry again...

[Frozen-Man 144]

Yes, their feelings that the Pens will win are sooooo much different than the sure thing that so many people here make it out to be for Detroit.