Vladimir Konstantinov

[amsoil33 13]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6tJUp_V5C8

Great video.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

Wandering around youtube late at night since it's the offseason and found this video:

We talk about Fedorov getting his numbers hung up... I truly believe Vladdy would have been regarded almost as highly as Lidstrom had the accident never happened. Arguably could have been the best defensive Dman of all time in my mind.

[krsmith17 7,191]

3 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Wandering around youtube late at night since it's the offseason and found this video:

We talk about Fedorov getting his numbers hung up... I truly believe Vladdy would have been regarded almost as highly as Lidstrom had the accident never happened. Arguably could have been the best defensive Dman of all time in my mind.

2 hours ago, F.Michael said:

There's a spot in hell reserved for Richard Gnida (limo driver).

I have several home, and away Wings jersey's...My very 1st lettered/numbered was that of #16 Vladdy (SportsK does a great job).

I'm certain he would've won a Norris - possibly more.

EDIT - ya know he played center for a season with CSKA...

The only player in the league that I think rivaled Stevens, being the biggest hitter and most intimidating opponent in the league. Vladdy wasn't as big as Stevens, but he hit just as hard. Guy was an absolute beast out there. He wouldn't have ever been as good as Lidstrom offensively, but he was rock solid in his own zone and could produce as well. I really do believe we would have one at least one more Stanley Cup between '99-07 if it weren't for that brutal accident...

[Echolalia 2,961]

Guy was a +60 in 96.  That is absurd

[LeftWinger 4,953]

I've always wondered and might have even posted on a thread somewhere on here that IF the accident never happened, and Vladdy continued his rise as one of our best D, what kind of money would he have been making in before the 1st lockout and salary cap in 05, which was only $39M.  Remember, at the time we had Lidstrom making top dollar and also Hatcher making top dollar, who we had to buy out, along with McCarty in order to get Cap Compliant. Looking back, at that off season, lets say both Vladdy and Lids are making the same money, both are the elite defensemen that they were (well Lids did) on their way to being and the buyouts come. Do you think we'd have kept BOTH of them and bought out someone else or would one of them had to be bought out in order to become cap compliant? Going back to that era alone (no injury, not knowing what you know now about Lidstrom) which one do you keep?

[krsmith17 7,191]

20 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

I've always wondered and might have even posted on a thread somewhere on here that IF the accident never happened, and Vladdy continued his rise as one of our best D, what kind of money would he have been making in before the 1st lockout and salary cap in 05, which was only $39M.  Remember, at the time we had Lidstrom making top dollar and also Hatcher making top dollar, who we had to buy out, along with McCarty in order to get Cap Compliant. Looking back, at that off season, lets say both Vladdy and Lids are making the same money, both are the elite defensemen that they were (well Lids did) on their way to being and the buyouts come. Do you think we'd have kept BOTH of them and bought out someone else or would one of them had to be bought out in order to become cap compliant? Going back to that era alone (no injury, not knowing what you know now about Lidstrom) which one do you keep?

I absolutely think we would have kept both. Other moves would have been made before the organization would have even considered buying out one of Lidstrom or Konstantinov. If it did come down to one or the other, Lidstrom was then and would still be now, the undisputed keeper in my opinion. Nick was just entering his prime (27 years old) and was one of the top defensemen in the league. He was already a 0.68 points per game defenseman at that time. Konstantinov was great in his own right, but not close to the level of Lidstrom, not offensively anyway, at a 0.39 points per game.

[BigWillieStyle 662]

51 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

I've always wondered and might have even posted on a thread somewhere on here that IF the accident never happened, and Vladdy continued his rise as one of our best D, what kind of money would he have been making in before the 1st lockout and salary cap in 05, which was only $39M.  Remember, at the time we had Lidstrom making top dollar and also Hatcher making top dollar, who we had to buy out, along with McCarty in order to get Cap Compliant. Looking back, at that off season, lets say both Vladdy and Lids are making the same money, both are the elite defensemen that they were (well Lids did) on their way to being and the buyouts come. Do you think we'd have kept BOTH of them and bought out someone else or would one of them had to be bought out in order to become cap compliant? Going back to that era alone (no injury, not knowing what you know now about Lidstrom) which one do you keep?

Vladdy would have been 37 at the end of the 03-04 season, so, 38 coming out of the lockout. I'm not even sure if he would have still been playing at that point. And if he did, I'm sure that he wouldn't be making Lidstrom money. 

[kliq 3,755]

1 hour ago, LeftWinger said:

I've always wondered and might have even posted on a thread somewhere on here that IF the accident never happened, and Vladdy continued his rise as one of our best D, what kind of money would he have been making in before the 1st lockout and salary cap in 05, which was only $39M.  Remember, at the time we had Lidstrom making top dollar and also Hatcher making top dollar, who we had to buy out, along with McCarty in order to get Cap Compliant. Looking back, at that off season, lets say both Vladdy and Lids are making the same money, both are the elite defensemen that they were (well Lids did) on their way to being and the buyouts come. Do you think we'd have kept BOTH of them and bought out someone else or would one of them had to be bought out in order to become cap compliant? Going back to that era alone (no injury, not knowing what you know now about Lidstrom) which one do you keep?

The big change to our roster if we still had Vladdy would have been no Chelios. I read an article a few years ago written by Chelios himself where he flat out says that he was Vladdy's replacement.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

6 hours ago, F.Michael said:

There's a spot in hell reserved for Richard Gnida (limo driver).

I have several home, and away Wings jersey's...My very 1st lettered/numbered was that of #16 Vladdy (SportsK does a great job).

I'm certain he would've won a Norris - possibly more.

EDIT - ya know he played center for a season with CSKA...

 

Lol I have a Vladdy sweater from SportsK too

Is 2nd bold really true?

4 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

The only player in the league that I think rivaled Stevens, being the biggest hitter and most intimidating opponent in the league. Vladdy wasn't as big as Stevens, but he hit just as hard. Guy was an absolute beast out there. He wouldn't have ever been as good as Lidstrom offensively, but he was rock solid in his own zone and could produce as well. I really do believe we would have one at least one more Stanley Cup between '99-07 if it weren't for that brutal accident...

Stevens always pops into my mind when I think of Vlad. He never hit Vladdy's absurd plus/minus (that Echo pointed out) though.

1 hour ago, LeftWinger said:

I've always wondered and might have even posted on a thread somewhere on here that IF the accident never happened, and Vladdy continued his rise as one of our best D, what kind of money would he have been making in before the 1st lockout and salary cap in 05, which was only $39M.  Remember, at the time we had Lidstrom making top dollar and also Hatcher making top dollar, who we had to buy out, along with McCarty in order to get Cap Compliant. Looking back, at that off season, lets say both Vladdy and Lids are making the same money, both are the elite defensemen that they were (well Lids did) on their way to being and the buyouts come. Do you think we'd have kept BOTH of them and bought out someone else or would one of them had to be bought out in order to become cap compliant? Going back to that era alone (no injury, not knowing what you know now about Lidstrom) which one do you keep?

Hossa

[LeftWinger 4,953]

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

I absolutely think we would have kept both. Other moves would have been made before the organization would have even considered buying out one of Lidstrom or Konstantinov. If it did come down to one or the other, Lidstrom was then and would still be now, the undisputed keeper in my opinion. Nick was just entering his prime (27 years old) and was one of the top defensemen in the league. He was already a 0.68 points per game defenseman at that time. Konstantinov was great in his own right, but not close to the level of Lidstrom, not offensively anyway, at a 0.39 points per game.

Ya, but you cannot go by that. You have to go by where Konstantinov WOULD HAVE BEEN in 2005. You cannot go by what he was in 1997, he no doubt would've grown into an even better player. Of course its all a big maybe, but assuming Vladdy and Nick both grew at the same rate, just Vladdy probably would've grown into an even more of a defensive beast than he already was. So, my question was, using your imagination as to where Vladdy would've grown along with Nick who would have been your choice. Me, I absolutely LOVED Vladdy, even more than Lidstrom, BUT, think about this, when Vladdy was hurt, he was 29 years old, Lids 3 years younger. In 2005 Vladdy would've been 37 years old. Even though Nick was also 34, I think the style of play that Vladdy played would've taken a bigger toll on his body, he may have already been retired by then, or on the brink of it. If we could've kept them both, that would've been awesome, remember we also had a pretty great D-Man in Hatcher, he didn't suck despite what people say, he had a bad knee injury. We bought him out because Nick became so good, I mean great. So anyway, factoring in the age and toll on the body, I think if I had to use a buyout on one of them, it would have been Vladdy. But like I said, I think he would have been retired or close to it, or maybe if he was bought out at 37 years old, he may have just retired at that point. OR think about this, in 2003, Sergei left via UFA, Detroit was done with Larionov in 2003 and he signed in NJ, Fetisov was already gone, as was Kozlov, so maybe, just maybe, if he may have also been on a UFA contract in the summer of 2003, Vladdy may have left us as well, to play with Sergei or something and we wouldn't of even had to choose! I hate the fact that the accident happened it cut short the career of one of the best defensemen in the NHL, in the WORLD. I agree and have NO DOUBT that we would've won even more Cups between 1997 and 2005. Quite possibly the 3rd in 1999. I am also betting that if he had stayed healthy, he would have been inducted in the HOF.

[The 91 of Ryans 3,014]

Lidstrom Rafalski

Konstantinov Fischer

Stuart Kronwall

 

[LeftWinger 4,953]

54 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Lol I have a Vladdy sweater from SportsK too

Is 2nd bold really true?

Stevens always pops into my mind when I think of Vlad. He never hit Vladdy's absurd plus/minus (that Echo pointed out) though.

Hossa

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=2780

It shows him playing 7 seasons with CSKA, but all the rosters show him as a D. Maybe he played at C from time to time or for a part of one season. If you search Fedorov, it doesn't show when he played that chunk of the season as a D either. So maybe he did play some center. He wasn't a sniper by any sense but if you watch his goals, he had some pretty good moves to deke out the goalie. They weren't all your typical defensemen slapper or snappers from the blue line.

[LeftWinger 4,953]

 

 

You may not have time to watch all these, plus they are in Russian, but here are 4 games with Vladdy playing on CSKA. I believe he still wore #16 in these games, but I can't tell. I don't speak, nor read Russian.

I wish I could find some highlights from him in his Russia/Red Army days.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

6 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

 

 

You may not have time to watch all these, plus they are in Russian, but here are 4 games with Vladdy playing on CSKA. I believe he still wore #16 in these games, but I can't tell. I don't speak, nor read Russian.

I wish I could find some highlights from him in his Russia/Red Army days.

Say no more fam:

 

[LeftWinger 4,953]

WTF on that shootout goal... That has to be the strangest thing I have ever seen in a shootout.

I don't think any of those are Vladdy though.

 

Edited July 30, 2018 by LeftWinger

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

1 minute ago, LeftWinger said:

WTF on that shootout goal... That has to be the strangest thing I have ever seen in a shootout.

Tried it on the golf course last weekend. Still working out the kinks.

[Neomaxizoomdweebie 3,083]

3 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

Ya, but you cannot go by that. You have to go by where Konstantinov WOULD HAVE BEEN in 2005. You cannot go by what he was in 1997, he no doubt would've grown into an even better player. Of course its all a big maybe, but assuming Vladdy and Nick both grew at the same rate, just Vladdy probably would've grown into an even more of a defensive beast than he already was. So, my question was, using your imagination as to where Vladdy would've grown along with Nick who would have been your choice. Me, I absolutely LOVED Vladdy, even more than Lidstrom, BUT, think about this, when Vladdy was hurt, he was 29 years old, Lids 3 years younger. In 2005 Vladdy would've been 37 years old. Even though Nick was also 34, I think the style of play that Vladdy played would've taken a bigger toll on his body, he may have already been retired by then, or on the brink of it. If we could've kept them both, that would've been awesome, remember we also had a pretty great D-Man in Hatcher, he didn't suck despite what people say, he had a bad knee injury. We bought him out because Nick became so good, I mean great. So anyway, factoring in the age and toll on the body, I think if I had to use a buyout on one of them, it would have been Vladdy. But like I said, I think he would have been retired or close to it, or maybe if he was bought out at 37 years old, he may have just retired at that point. OR think about this, in 2003, Sergei left via UFA, Detroit was done with Larionov in 2003 and he signed in NJ, Fetisov was already gone, as was Kozlov, so maybe, just maybe, if he may have also been on a UFA contract in the summer of 2003, Vladdy may have left us as well, to play with Sergei or something and we wouldn't of even had to choose! I hate the fact that the accident happened it cut short the career of one of the best defensemen in the NHL, in the WORLD. I agree and have NO DOUBT that we would've won even more Cups between 1997 and 2005. Quite possibly the 3rd in 1999. I am also betting that if he had stayed healthy, he would have been inducted in the HOF.

Vladdy in 2005 would basically be what Kronner is now, and probably would be on a very expensive contract. He absolutely would have been bought out to get cap compliant and would have retired or gone back to play a year or 2 in the KHL. I don't see how he would have been in the league after that CBA.

[toby91_ca 620]

23 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

Ya, but you cannot go by that. You have to go by where Konstantinov WOULD HAVE BEEN in 2005. You cannot go by what he was in 1997, he no doubt would've grown into an even better player. Of course its all a big maybe, but assuming Vladdy and Nick both grew at the same rate, just Vladdy probably would've grown into an even more of a defensive beast than he already was. So, my question was, using your imagination as to where Vladdy would've grown along with Nick who would have been your choice. Me, I absolutely LOVED Vladdy, even more than Lidstrom, BUT, think about this, when Vladdy was hurt, he was 29 years old, Lids 3 years younger. In 2005 Vladdy would've been 37 years old. Even though Nick was also 34, I think the style of play that Vladdy played would've taken a bigger toll on his body, he may have already been retired by then, or on the brink of it. If we could've kept them both, that would've been awesome, remember we also had a pretty great D-Man in Hatcher, he didn't suck despite what people say, he had a bad knee injury. We bought him out because Nick became so good, I mean great. So anyway, factoring in the age and toll on the body, I think if I had to use a buyout on one of them, it would have been Vladdy. But like I said, I think he would have been retired or close to it, or maybe if he was bought out at 37 years old, he may have just retired at that point. OR think about this, in 2003, Sergei left via UFA, Detroit was done with Larionov in 2003 and he signed in NJ, Fetisov was already gone, as was Kozlov, so maybe, just maybe, if he may have also been on a UFA contract in the summer of 2003, Vladdy may have left us as well, to play with Sergei or something and we wouldn't of even had to choose! I hate the fact that the accident happened it cut short the career of one of the best defensemen in the NHL, in the WORLD. I agree and have NO DOUBT that we would've won even more Cups between 1997 and 2005. Quite possibly the 3rd in 1999. I am also betting that if he had stayed healthy, he would have been inducted in the HOF.

I think you are a year off....when he got hurt, he was already 30 and in 2005, he was 38.  

23 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

Stevens always pops into my mind when I think of Vlad. He never hit Vladdy's absurd plus/minus (that Echo pointed out) though.

Stevens didn't hit +60, but he did hit +53 a couple years before Vladdy's +60 and he hit +40 later on (a mark Vladdy never got to beyond his +60).  On average, I think both are fairly similar when you think +/-, but I won't go down the road of the relevance of the +/- stat.

[ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022]

4 minutes ago, toby91_ca said:

I think you are a year off....when he got hurt, he was already 30 and in 2005, he was 38.  

Stevens didn't hit +60, but he did hit +53 a couple years before Vladdy's +60 and he hit +40 later on (a mark Vladdy never got to beyond his +60).  On average, I think both are fairly similar when you think +/-, but I won't go down the road of the relevance of the +/- stat.

You're right. Vladdy hit +38 the year after his +60 though. That's pretty close. Plus/minus is pretty much garbage, but always still impressive to see these numbers by both Stevens and Vlad. You didn't score when these guys were on the ice. Steven's +40 came after his scoring dropped off too, and Vlads was never a big scorer. I can't think of anyone like this today. Defensive Dmen with super high +/- ..... The similarity between them is Stevens and Vlad were both feared around the league. No one's feared anymore.

[LeftWinger 4,953]

Again, I think it's safe to say that if Vladdy had played an entire career, he'd be in the HOF.

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

1 hour ago, LeftWinger said:

Again, I think it's safe to say that if Vladdy had played an entire career, he'd be in the HOF.

LOL.  There's a thread about this on HFboards' history section and it's not even close.  He wouldn't be in the HHOF.  He was already in his 30's when the accident happened.  He would have needed to play another 10 years at an absurd level to make the HOF.  He was never known for his offensive prowess, and that's what makes the HOF these days.  

Look, Konstantinov was a very good player for the Wings and it's terrible what's happened to him, but his career trajectory has been way too overstated on this forum.  On what planet would he actually make the HOF or get his number retired?  Not on this one.    

[krsmith17 7,191]

46 minutes ago, GMRwings1983 said:

LOL.  There's a thread about this on HFboards' history section and it's not even close.  He wouldn't be in the HHOF.  He was already in his 30's when the accident happened.  He would have needed to play another 10 years at an absurd level to make the HOF.  He was never known for his offensive prowess, and that's what makes the HOF these days.  

Look, Konstantinov was a very good player for the Wings and it's terrible what's happened to him, but his career trajectory has been way too overstated on this forum.  On what planet would he actually make the HOF or get his number retired?  Not on this one.    

Unfortunately, I agree. I love(d) Vladdy, but I don't think he would have been close to HHOF worthy. He wouldn't have had the offensive numbers required to get in.

[Learn2LuvIt 245]

8 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Unfortunately, I agree. I love(d) Vladdy, but I don't think he would have been close to HHOF worthy. He wouldn't have had the offensive numbers required to get in.

Agree with these sentiments.  Plus, you have to consider the Canadian contingent that has a heavy hand in the whole HHOF process/Board of Directors/Selection Committee. More of late It's gotten more representation from people who's home country isn't Canada (e.g. Igor Larionov), but you have to be a no-brainer, LOCK, if were a player from Russia. 

[Buppy 1,720]

1 hour ago, GMRwings1983 said:

LOL.  There's a thread about this on HFboards' history section and it's not even close.  He wouldn't be in the HHOF.  He was already in his 30's when the accident happened.  He would have needed to play another 10 years at an absurd level to make the HOF.  He was never known for his offensive prowess, and that's what makes the HOF these days.  

Look, Konstantinov was a very good player for the Wings and it's terrible what's happened to him, but his career trajectory has been way too overstated on this forum.  On what planet would he actually make the HOF or get his number retired?  Not on this one.    

52 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

Unfortunately, I agree. I love(d) Vladdy, but I don't think he would have been close to HHOF worthy. He wouldn't have had the offensive numbers required to get in.

Rod Langway was no offensive juggernaut. 

Not saying he'd be a lock for the HHoF by any means, but it's not unreasonable to think he could have had a chance. He had just turned 30, so probably had at least a few more years of "prime", maybe could have won a Norris. Would have had to maintain a high level for a bit longer than would be normal, but nothing crazy. 6-8 more years, ending up with stats similar to Langway, another couple Cups, win a Norris or at least be a finalist a few more times. He would have been a realistic candidate.

 

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

1 hour ago, Buppy said:

Rod Langway was no offensive juggernaut. 

Not saying he'd be a lock for the HHoF by any means, but it's not unreasonable to think he could have had a chance. He had just turned 30, so probably had at least a few more years of "prime", maybe could have won a Norris. Would have had to maintain a high level for a bit longer than would be normal, but nothing crazy. 6-8 more years, ending up with stats similar to Langway, another couple Cups, win a Norris or at least be a finalist a few more times. He would have been a realistic candidate.

 

Langway was an outlier, but he was one of the very best defensive defensemen of all time.  He also played more seasons in the NHL.  Stats similar to Langway's didn't win too many Norris trophies in the 90's.  Also, stats similar to Langway's don't get you into the HHOF these days as a defenseman.  Now it's someone like Housley who scored a billion points but wasn't very good in his own end.    

Look at a great defensive defenseman like Foote, who was a prominent part of all those Avs teams.  He'll likely never get into the HHOF.  And oh yeah, there's the North American bias.  There's so many great foreign born players who still aren't in the HHOF.