A deeper look at Hudler

[mangothrower 0]

Hudler at $1.15M last season, in my mind was a huge value for the team.

What no one seems to want to mention is that he only played 13 minutes per night.

I created this a few weeks ago, it shows what each forward's production would have been, prorated to the number of games / minutes played by Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and Hossa throughout the season:

1. Datsyuk: 31G, 62A, 93 Pts

2. Hossa: 44G, 34A, 78 Pts

3. Hudler: 31G, 45A, 76 Pts

4. Zetterberg: 30G, 40A, 70 Pts

5. Franzen: 39G, 29A, 68 Pts

6. Holmstrom: 25G, 41A, 66 Pts

7. Cleary: 16G, 30A, 46 Pts

8. Filppula: 14G, 32A, 46 Pts

Sure, this isn't a perfect assessment. But when it comes to points per minute played, Hudler performed in line with Hossa, Zetterberg and Franzen. Holmstrom wasn't too far behind either, who has gotten a bad rap from a lot of fans this past season, considered he played injured for most of it.

Jiri Hudler may not provide the two-way play that others on the team do, but I think casting him off as a insignificant part of the Red Wings is ridiculous.

[Zetts 236]

I'd agree that Hudler is gifted offensively, as the numbers show. But at the same time this kind of skews the numbers. I don't believe for a second if Hudler had seen Z's ice time he would have produced to the level you have projected. There is a reason he plays so little and against lower-tier players. Also, as has been mentioned in the past, points don't go up linearly with ice time.

If your point is simply that he's elite offensively though, I would tend to somewhat agree. I do hope the Wings retain him.

And for Holmstrom, I agree that he's being treated unfairly. He was pretty brutal for parts of last year, but I don't think he just magically lost his touch. I think that he'll be back, healthy and better. I think that last season might have been a hint that he's almost done though.

Edited July 2, 2009 by Zetts

[HudlerFanatic 4]

[numberthirtynine 0]

The per minutes played thing is so perspectively skewed. For all we know, someone like Datsyuk may perform worse with less minutes. Just like we could guess Hudler would perform worse with more minutes. It could go either way, point being when given more ice time, against a different caliber of player, it's not automatic that he'll continue his point per minute pace. It gievs coaches incentive to try him out and see but it's no guarantee, and if they see a reason not to move him up, I'll trust them over most arm chair coaches.

[LeftWinger 4,949]

Just say No!

[Johnny Diamonds 25]

It's a shame Hudler is small, passive and slow otherwise he'd be a great two-way player.

[Pucks 66]

Hudler only plays 13 minutes per game because he hasn't been that effective in a top six role thus far. He does most of his damage on the power play where he has more room to operate. His great vision and passing comes out with all that room. If Hudler could skate a lot better I have no doubt he would be a star in this league. Even at his size.

But he can't and IMO never will. He's always trailing the play when he plays up in the top six role. On this team or another he will always be a 3rd line powerplay specialist IMO. Nothing wrong with that, but how much is it worth?

[HudlerFanatic 4]

http://www.blueseatblogs.com/2009/06/09/rf...ch-jiri-hudler/

partial quote taken from a Ranger's fan blogsite-

".........Should the Wings decide to go with Hossa, then that probably leaves them looking to deal Hudler. Hudler is due for a raise on his $1.105 million salary (and $1.015 million cap hit). With the minimum 10% raise for RFAs, the minimum qualifying offer to Hudler has to be $1.215 million. Obviously, Hudler is worth more than $1.215 million. He put up 23-34-57 for the Wings last season, while doubling his goals and still playing at a +7. Where does 23-34-57, +7 put him in terms of the Rangers? Well…

•his 57 points would put him 3rd on the team

•his 23 goals put him tied for first with Zherdev (Naslund retired, so his top mark of 24 goals isn’t included here)

•his 34 assists put him tied for 3rd on the team with Drury

•his +7 also puts him tied for tops on the team with Cally

•his 22 assists on the powerplay put him in first on the team by a very wide margin

Basically, at 24, Hudler would be a top scorer on the team. He would also provide much needed bang-for-the-buck, as he will definitely improve upon those numbers. ......."

Why would Detroit want to get rid of a player that they could keep under $3MIL (helping the cap problem) that would be a #3 Player (stat wise) on another team....Granted the Rangers aren't the all mighty hockey team but those players for the Ranger's that Hudler is being compared to are making a heck of a lot more than Hudler probably ever will.....and that's ok.

But why are so many here ready to get rid of him when he can keep up with other "key players" for other teams.

It's nice to see fans from another team find a reasoning of why they would WANT Hudler on their team......all the more reason I would love to see Hudler stay.

And if the RFA Compensation scale is correct that has been seen on th HFBoards..........................

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=656474

I don't think any team will offer the $3 MIL that (IMO) he deserves, so the best they get is a 2nd rounder....(of next year) ....so then WTF would Holland do THIS year......??? The Wings only have 19 signed players (capgeek)

Sign Huds for 2-3 years with no more than say 1st yr - $1.8 (leaving $1.5 for 09/10) then a bump in 10/11 when some of the key players and higher paid players come into their UFA/RFA (or are ready to retire)....or hell just sign Huds for a year at $1.8-$2.0...then use that extra to get somone that some of you want as a "cheap grinder"...

....Next year is going to be a better year cap wise and easier to do some "moving around" if needed.

But Huds is not a bad player, he may not be the 2-way player many of you would like to see....but he's proven that he can put up the points and that he can play on the PP and he does have some 100%FO on his stat board.....

........ Put him on the 2nd w/ Fils and Franz and I believe his points wil rise.....

[GMRwings1983 8,793]

Maybe if he didn't suck the 2nd half of the playoffs, more of us would want him to stay.

I could care less about these projected stats.

[Pucks 66]

He's one of those guys that's so valuable during the regular season on the power play. He helps you get that great seed for the playoffs. Then once the post season roles around he fades into the background. The only time you notice he's playing is when there's a power play or when the other team has a defensive breakdown, and he get's a two on one with someone where he has space and time. Otherwise he's just so easy to contain for big defensmen. They just angle him and bump him off the puck. He either needs to be fast or bigger unfortunately he's not.

[Johnny Diamonds 25]

A deeper look inside the mind of Hudler

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Just say No!

Why do you hate Hudler so much? It is a pretty disturbing obsession. Plenty of people would really like to know I think.

[titanium2 867]

Why do you hate Hudler so much? It is a pretty disturbing obsession. Plenty of people would really like to know I think.

The cluck gives him painful memories of some reptile bite he suffered when he was younger.

[stillwater 186]

Oh, finally ... a Hudler thread.

[Silent Hill 3]

Hudler's 2-way game has improved dramatically and there's no reason to think it won't continue to do so under Mike Babcock, who leans on him pretty hard.

...

He's always trailing the play when he plays up in the top six role...

It always looked to me like he was over-efforting his defensive play when he was bumped up, a way to show Babcock that he is responsible defensively. I'm hoping that will change once Hudler is more confident defensively and Babcock trusts him a bit more, allowing Hudler to not worry about being benched if he makes a defensive mistake. It's a trust thing and they have to work it out.

[eva unit zero 271]

Hudler only plays 13 minutes per game because he hasn't been that effective in a top six role thus far. He does most of his damage on the power play where he has more room to operate. His great vision and passing comes out with all that room. If Hudler could skate a lot better I have no doubt he would be a star in this league. Even at his size.

But he can't and IMO never will. He's always trailing the play when he plays up in the top six role. On this team or another he will always be a 3rd line powerplay specialist IMO. Nothing wrong with that, but how much is it worth?

Hudler only played 13 minutes per game last season because the Wings had Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Holmstrom, Hossa, Franzen, and Cleary who Babcock wanted to use on the top two lines. Hossa is gone. The quality of Holmstrom's play faded as the season went on, and he was horrible in the playoffs.

Hudler's offensive ability on the top two lines with more ice time is going to be a NECESSARY thing next season. As was posted in another thread:

The downside to having Jiri Hudler is that he makes your third line a consistent scoring threat.

Think about this for a second.

But since someone was posting prorated numbers, I'll post more important prorated numbers. I'll post the Wings' top nine scoring forwards G-A-P from this past season, prorated to Datsyuk's ice time at ES, PP, and PK separately. So rather than taking players who play a larger percentage of time on PP or PK, we'll get a fair and even look.

EVEN STRENGTH:

Pavel Datsyuk: 20g-39a-59p

Marian Hossa: 34g-19a-53p

Tomas Holmstrom: 11g-35a-46p

Johan Franzen: 25g-19a-44p

Henrik Zetterberg: 17g-25a-42p

Dan Cleary: 13g-27a-40p

Valtteri Filppula: 12g-27a-39p

Jiri Hudler: 22g-16a-38p

Mikael Samuelsson: 14g-9a-23p

POWER PLAY:

Pavel Datsyuk: 11g-25a-36p

Jiri Hudler: 7g-24a-31p

Henrik Zetterberg: 12g-18a-30p

Marian Hossa: 12g-16a-28p

Johan Franzen: 15g-11a-26p

Mikael Samuelsson: 9g-16a-25p

Tomas Holmstrom: 13g-6a-19p

Valtteri Filppula: 4g-13a-17p

Dan Cleary: 6g-6a-12p

SHORTHANDED:

Johan Franzen: 2g-0a-2p

Henrik Zetterberg: 2g-0a-2p

Pavel Datsyuk: 1g-1a-2p

Marian Hossa: 0g-2a-2p

Tomas Holmstrom: 0g-0a-0p

Dan Cleary: 0g-0a-0p

Valtteri Filppula: 0g-0a-0p

Jiri Hudler: 0g-0a-0p

Mikael Samuelsson: 0g-0a-0p

OVERALL:

Pavel Datsyuk: 32g-65a-97p

Marian Hossa: 46g-37a-83p

Henrik Zetterberg: 31g-43a-74p

Johan Franzen: 42g-30a-72p

Jiri Hudler: 29g-40a-69p

Tomas Holmstrom: 24g-41a-65p

Valtteri Filppula: 16g-40a-56p

Dan Cleary: 19g-33a-52p

Mikael Samuelsson: 23g-25a-48p

At even strength, Hudler is in a group of six players who are separated by 8 points from 3rd to 8th in the group of nine. Hudler likely would have been closer to the top or even clearly exceeded the group had he gotten more ice time with higher quality linemates. This is shown by the fact that Hudler is third in even strength goals. Also, on the power play, Hudler is the most productive forward after Datsyuk. The fact that Hudler's even strength numbers are goal-heavy yet his power-play stats are assist-heavy show that he has to generate his own offense on even strength, while he creates plays for others to finish on the power play and does a very good job of it. Putting Hudler in a real playmaker role, such as with Franzen, would allow him to exercise that talent at even strength and do quite a bit to make up for the loss of Hossa.