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Most Dominante Athletes Today


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#1 Gutierrez

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Posted 25 September 2009 - 03:11 PM

The thread about Lidstrom winning NHL player of the decade by Sporting News got me thinking who are the most dominant athletes today in sports, and not necessarily over the last decade. Feel free to include athletes from not only the big 4 sports but also swimming, track & field, boxing, etc. and rank them. My top 10 are:

1. Usain Bolt
2. Michael Phelps
3. Roger Federer
4. Tiger Woods
5. Fedor Emelianenko
6. Lebron James
7. Alexander Ovechkin
8. Kobe Bryant
9. Albert Pujols
10. Adrian Peterson

Peterson at 10 was tough because Manning and Brady are pretty dominant but I think the gap between AP and the next best running back is wider than the gap between Manning and Brady.


#2 TheDetroitRedWings

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Posted 26 September 2009 - 05:03 PM

I agree with everything on that list except Fedor. No way he is the most dominate in the sport. He has to prove that by fighting the best. Try replacing Fedor with Andersson Silva. Then I agree with the list 100%.

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#3 Ernesto_182

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Posted 27 September 2009 - 10:42 AM

That can't be true, Rafa Nadal is one of the most dominating athletes today.

And Cristiano Ronaldo also (more than Rafa)
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#4 timothy1997

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Posted 27 September 2009 - 02:36 PM

to me when you say "dominate", you imply that no one else is even close. Impossible to pick 2 people from the same sport then and my list would go like this, not in any order.

NBA--Kobe Bryant
NHL--Ovechkin
MLB--Pujols
NFL--Peterson
Golf--Tiger
Track--Bolt
Swimming--Phelps
NASCAR--Jimmie Johnson
Tennis--Federer
Soccer--Ronaldo

The list has to start there and IMO, the indiviual sports have the more dominate athletes, like golf, swimming or tennis.


#5 norrisnick

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Posted 02 October 2009 - 05:29 AM

QUOTE (TheDetroitRedWings @ September 26, 2009 - 05:03PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I agree with everything on that list except Fedor. No way he is the most dominate in the sport. He has to prove that by fighting the best. Try replacing Fedor with Andersson Silva. Then I agree with the list 100%.

Nobody in MMA has done anyting remotely close to what Fedor has done. Next best would likely be Nogueira, but Fedor owned him twice.

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#6 TheDetroitRedWings

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Posted 02 October 2009 - 06:27 AM

QUOTE (norrisnick @ October 2, 2009 - 06:29AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Nobody in MMA has done anyting remotely close to what Fedor has done. Next best would likely be Nogueira, but Fedor owned him twice.



We're not talking about several years ago. We're talking about right now (at least I thought we were). In which case, Silva or Machida would have to be considered "most dominant" in the sport.

Edited by TheDetroitRedWings, 02 October 2009 - 06:28 AM.

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#7 norrisnick

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Posted 02 October 2009 - 06:04 PM

QUOTE (TheDetroitRedWings @ October 2, 2009 - 06:27AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
We're not talking about several years ago. We're talking about right now (at least I thought we were). In which case, Silva or Machida would have to be considered "most dominant" in the sport.


Put either one of them in the ring/cage with Fedor and see who is most dominant. And neither are much smaller than Fedor is. 10-15lbs at most with both of the Brazilians being taller and with greater reach. Wins over Sylvia and Arlovski easily stack up to wins over Griffin and Evans which pretty much highlight Anderson and Machida's recent activity.

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#8 TheDetroitRedWings

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Posted 02 October 2009 - 07:29 PM

QUOTE (norrisnick @ October 2, 2009 - 07:04PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Put either one of them in the ring/cage with Fedor and see who is most dominant. And neither are much smaller than Fedor is. 10-15lbs at most with both of the Brazilians being taller and with greater reach.



blink.gif 10-15 lbs??? Yeah right dude. Machida and Silva are 205ers (Silva even fights at 185 sometimes). Fedor was almost 235 in his last bout. So try doubling that total. 30 lbs would be an INSANE advantage in an MMA fight. Whereas height isn't nearly the same level of an advantage (Machida is only 2 inches taller than Fedor, Silva is only ONE inch taller than Fedor). So either Fedor has to go on quite the diet, or Machida and Silva better start hitting Mickey Ds or something. Otherwise that fight would never happen in any MMA organization.

The other main difference is Fedor hasn't fought nearly the best fighters in the world lately. You actually used Arlovski and Silvia as examples???? They aren't even half the fighters they were 5 years ago. Have you not watched them lately?? Not to mention Fedor was scared to come to the UFC and get destroyed by Lesnar. He refused to join the UFC unless Dana White gave him 100,000,000 dollars. Which of course Dana White just laughed and said yeah right.

No doubt about it, pound for pound Machida and Silva are the most dominant in the sport. The only real beef I have with them is they stupidly won't fight each other even though they're not related in any way. They're just "good friends." What a lame ass excuse for not fighting each other. But if they ever do, would be one of the best MMA fights ever.


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#9 norrisnick

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Posted 02 October 2009 - 09:48 PM

QUOTE (TheDetroitRedWings @ October 2, 2009 - 07:29PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
blink.gif 10-15 lbs??? Yeah right dude. Machida and Silva are 205ers (Silva even fights at 185 sometimes). Fedor was almost 235 in his last bout. So try doubling that total. 30 lbs would be an INSANE advantage in an MMA fight. Whereas height isn't nearly the same level of an advantage (Machida is only 2 inches taller than Fedor, Silva is only ONE inch taller than Fedor). So either Fedor has to go on quite the diet, or Machida and Silva better start hitting Mickey Ds or something. Otherwise that fight would never happen in any MMA organization.

The other main difference is Fedor hasn't fought nearly the best fighters in the world lately. You actually used Arlovski and Silvia as examples???? They aren't even half the fighters they were 5 years ago. Have you not watched them lately?? Not to mention Fedor was scared to come to the UFC and get destroyed by Lesnar. He refused to join the UFC unless Dana White gave him 100,000,000 dollars. Which of course Dana White just laughed and said yeah right.

No doubt about it, pound for pound Machida and Silva are the most dominant in the sport. The only real beef I have with them is they stupidly won't fight each other even though they're not related in any way. They're just "good friends." What a lame ass excuse for not fighting each other. But if they ever do, would be one of the best MMA fights ever.

There is an ever so slight difference between weigh-in weight and fight time weight. Most "205ers" are pushing 220+ when they actually get in the cage. Fedor is usually 230 or so. 10-15lbs. And most of that difference is padding, not muscle. He's a tiny HW. Guys his size fight LHW. And some that aren't good enough cut all the way down to 185. Should they ever meet at HW it's 50/50 that Silva or Machida would come in heavier as they wouldn't have to cut water weight and likely would bulk up a bit. Like when Wanderlei Silva fought in PRIDE's Open Weight GP. He was heavier than CroCop in their fight. There is no significant difference between small HWs and LHWs, apart from the fact that the small HWs don't feel the need to cut weight for a competitive edge.

As for 30lbs being a huge advantage for an MMA fight. Sure, but that's an advantage many of Fedor's opponents have had over him. He has fought guys, 10, 20, 30, 50, even 100lbs+ heavier than him. Can't say the same for the two guys you're pimping.

Sylvia's 3 fights prior to fighting Fedor were 2 title fight losses and a win over Vera. So, either Tim was still at the upper echelon of the UFC HWs or the current title means next to nothing as a complete scrub held it a little over 2 years ago.

Arlovski was on a 5 fight win streak. Three within the UFC and then Ben Rothwell and Roy Nelson with Affliction.

If you completely disregard the level those two were at at the time the fought Emelianenko you're opening up a HUGE can of worms with regards to the current crop of UFC HWs (which apparently Fedor is ducking) not to mention pretty much any other fighter. Trying to come up with arguments about these guys using evidence of what happened AFTER they lost to Fedor is delving into the absurd. Especially since not too long ago these guys ruled the UFC HW division.

Who are the best fighters at HW? Once you come up with a list, use the same standards you used to discredit Sylvia and Arlovski so you'll realize just how shallow the UFC's HW division is. The best fighter Dana has at HW is Big Nog. Dana is likely going to cling as hard as he can to the loss to Mir (with a torn MCL and being hospitalized during his training camp with a staph infection) to prevent Nog from getting a title shot. Because if Minotauro ever does, Brock can kiss his arm goodbye. And then Dana is stuck with a HW champ that Fedor has soundly defeated. Twice.

Fedor doesn't fear Lesnar. He doesn't fear anyone, otherwise he wouldn't have signed with an organization that has Alistair Overeem as a champion (he's currently one of the top 5 or so HW strikers in the world and expected to do well at the Dec. 5th K-1 World GP Final) and Fabricio Werdum who is the two time defending ADCC HW champion (ie best grappler in the world). There is nothing in the UFC that Fedor hasn't seen and beaten before. And there is nothing he won't see outside of the UFC either. Barnett, Werdum, Overeem, etc... are all fights available to him outside of the octagon.

As for Anderson and Machida... they're great fighters (when they actually want to fight and not dance). But they're not Fedor good.

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#10 TheDetroitRedWings

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 12:33 AM

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There is an ever so slight difference between weigh-in weight and fight time weight. Most "205ers" are pushing 220+ when they actually get in the cage. Fedor is usually 230 or so. 10-15lbs.


Yes maybe "most" of them are pushing 220, but that's not the case with Machida and Silva. Their walking around weight is around 200-205lbs. The only time they cut weight is when they fight at 185lbs. Or the occasional match-weight fights, which are usually 190-195lbs. No matter how you look at it, Fedor is a thicker man, and almost 30lbs heavier. And even though Fedor has fought guys a lot bigger than himself, that still doesn't take away from the fact that it would still be a huge advantage if he fought Machida or Silva. Unless Fedor fought at LHW. Otherwise, a HW fight would be to the advantage of Fedor. Oh, and not one of those huge guys Fedor fought was a top 5 fighter in the world.

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Sylvia's 3 fights prior to fighting Fedor were 2 title fight losses and a win over Vera. So, either Tim was still at the upper echelon of the UFC HWs or the current title means next to nothing as a complete scrub held it a little over 2 years ago.


He was good at one point in time yes. But Sylvia's game was already starting to go downhill before he fought Vera. The fight right before Vera was against Couture (who is almost a foot shorter than Sylvia, and not even close to Sylvia's reach)and Randy didn't just beat Sylvia, he completely embarrassed him the entire fight. Then Sylvia went on to beat Vera. And that's not saying much. Vera had quite the losing streak going before he just recently snapped it (and even though Vera snapped the losing streak, he still looked like a mediocre fighter in that fight). And that my friend, was Sylvia's last win in MMA until he recent beat Jason Riley (bum).

It's not that a scrub held the title, it's that MMA is just like any other sport in terms of losing the level of play you once had, even if you still had it just a few years prior. Need I remind you that Sylvia lost to Ray f-ing Mercer? (and it wasn't in a boxing ring) Just like any sport, all of the sudden talent just starts to fade a bit. Some guys drop off quicker than others, but you get the idea.

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Arlovski was on a 5 fight win streak. Three within the UFC and then Ben Rothwell and Roy Nelson with Affliction.


Even though Arlovski WAS on a 5 fight win steak, his game has arguably dropped further than even Sylia's. The last time Arlovski fought like the "elite" Arlovksi was Dec '06 against Cruz. His next fight after that was a fight that he looked just okay against Werdum. Then after that, he fought guys that will NEVER be considered elite: O'Brien, Rothwell and Nelson. So forgive me if I'm far from impressed with those 3 victories. Then as soon as Arlovski actually faced another "elite" fighter (Fedor), he gets his ass handed to him. Since '06 the only way Arlovski will get a win is against guys that are not top level.

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If you completely disregard the level those two were at at the time the fought Emelianenko you're opening up a HUGE can of worms with regards to the current crop of UFC HWs (which apparently Fedor is ducking)


I'm not saying Fedor is scared of the entire crop of UFC heavyweights. I'm saying he's scared of Brock Lesnar only. And that's saying a lot considering Brock is the current champion. What lead me to that conclusion is the fact that Fedor knew damn well why Dana wanted him in the UFC. One reason and one reason only. Fedor Vs Brock. So Fedor decided to ask for a ridiculous amount of money (a hundred million bucks) knowing Dana would never accept. That was Fedor's way of saying, "I'm content fighting the guys here, I don't wanna come over to another organization and get immediately run over by Lesnar." And I'm not even saying Lesnar would actually beat Fedor. It just seams Fedor thinks so.
And there is no doubt (unless you haven't watched Sylvia and Arlovski throughout their careers) that their game was nowhere near their peak when they fought Fedor. So I'm far from impressed by those 2 Fedor victories.

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Trying to come up with arguments about these guys using evidence of what happened AFTER they lost to Fedor is delving into the absurd.


As you probably already read up there, that's not what I've done.

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There is nothing in the UFC that Fedor hasn't seen and beaten before. And there is nothing he won't see outside of the UFC either.


Oh I beg to differ my friend. His name is Brock Lesnar. A specimen Fedor has never dealt with. No one as big as Brock can move like Brock. Period.

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As for Anderson and Machida... they're great fighters (when they actually want to fight and not dance). But they're not Fedor good.


I will admit that sometimes Machida and Silva wait for the other guy to strike first (that is annoying as hell). But they are complete packages in terms of BJJ, Judo, Karate, striking power/quickness, and both are deceptively fast.

And keep in mind, I think Fedor is very good. In fact I do think of Fedor as one of the best in the world. I just don't think it's such a cut and dry conclusion that Fedor is the most dominant considering who Fedor has fought lately. Silva's list of recent victories is staggering (Nate Marquardt, Dan Henderson, Patrick Cote, Thales Leites, Forrest Griffin). And none of those fights left a scratch on Silva. Plus, Silva's next fight is against Vitor Belfort (Fedor's next fight is against Brett Rogers,lol). And Machida just destroyed Thiago Silva and Rashad Evans. Those lists are 10 times more impressive than Fedor's last few fights. We already discussed Sylvia and Arlovski. How about before them? Well get ready to laugh and reassess your stance: Choi, Lindland, Mark Hunt and wait for it.....Mark Coleman. laugh.gif Sorry man, but that list isn't even close to as impressive as Silva and Machida's (especially Silva's). When considering who they have fought lately, this is no contest.

Pound for pound the best mixed martial artists in the world RIGHT NOW (not in the past) is Anderson Silva with Lyoto Machida a close second. So actually you're right, they aren't "Fedor good." They're better (if were talking right this very second).

Edited by TheDetroitRedWings, 03 October 2009 - 01:01 AM.

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#11 norrisnick

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Posted 03 October 2009 - 07:24 AM

QUOTE (TheDetroitRedWings @ October 3, 2009 - 12:33AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Yes maybe "most" of them are pushing 220, but that's not the case with Machida and Silva. Their walking around weight is around 200-205lbs. The only time they cut weight is when they fight at 185lbs. Or the occasional match-weight fights, which are usually 190-195lbs. No matter how you look at it, Fedor is a thicker man, and almost 30lbs heavier. And even though Fedor has fought guys a lot bigger than himself, that still doesn't take away from the fact that it would still be a huge advantage if he fought Machida or Silva. Unless Fedor fought at LHW. Otherwise, a HW fight would be to the advantage of Fedor. Oh, and not one of those huge guys Fedor fought was a top 5 fighter in the world.

You're out of your mind if you think Machida and especially Silva walk around at 200-205. Anderson has gone on record that he's usually 220 and above between fights. He's a big dude. Machida doesn't fight at 185 and I don't believe he ever has.

Back when Fedor fought Herring he was top 5 and close to 30lbs heavier. Schilt was solid competition and 50lbs heavier. Hunt just barely in the top 10 and again 50lbs heavier. Sylvia was ranked top 3 when he fought Fedor 40lbs heavier. Sure Choi and Zuluzinho weren't much to worry about, but those guys in the 250-280+ range were quality wins.

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He was good at one point in time yes. But Sylvia's game was already starting to go downhill before he fought Vera. The fight right before Vera was against Couture (who is almost a foot shorter than Sylvia, and not even close to Sylvia's reach)and Randy didn't just beat Sylvia, he completely embarrassed him the entire fight. Then Sylvia went on to beat Vera. And that's not saying much. Vera had quite the losing streak going before he just recently snapped it (and even though Vera snapped the losing streak, he still looked like a mediocre fighter in that fight). And that my friend, was Sylvia's last win in MMA until he recent beat Jason Riley (bum).

And then Couture went on to lose to Brock and Nogueira (looking far better against Brock than the Brazilian). Maybe, just maybe, Brock hasn't seen much competition to hold that belt. If a 46 year old that's 50lbs smaller and was coming off of a year long layoff is your stiffest competition maybe you shouldn't be ranked quite that high.

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It's not that a scrub held the title, it's that MMA is just like any other sport in terms of losing the level of play you once had, even if you still had it just a few years prior. Need I remind you that Sylvia lost to Ray f-ing Mercer? (and it wasn't in a boxing ring) Just like any sport, all of the sudden talent just starts to fade a bit. Some guys drop off quicker than others, but you get the idea.

Even though Arlovski WAS on a 5 fight win steak, his game has arguably dropped further than even Sylia's. The last time Arlovski fought like the "elite" Arlovksi was Dec '06 against Cruz. His next fight after that was a fight that he looked just okay against Werdum. Then after that, he fought guys that will NEVER be considered elite: O'Brien, Rothwell and Nelson. So forgive me if I'm far from impressed with those 3 victories. Then as soon as Arlovski actually faced another "elite" fighter (Fedor), he gets his ass handed to him. Since '06 the only way Arlovski will get a win is against guys that are not top level.

Arlovski would beat Brock. Handily. Brock would get torn apart standing by one of the quickest striking HWs out there. And Andrei is savvy enough to keep it on the feet. Brock doesn't have the handspeed to do what Fedor did to him. Not when Mir got the best of him standing.

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I'm not saying Fedor is scared of the entire crop of UFC heavyweights. I'm saying he's scared of Brock Lesnar only. And that's saying a lot considering Brock is the current champion. What lead me to that conclusion is the fact that Fedor knew damn well why Dana wanted him in the UFC. One reason and one reason only. Fedor Vs Brock. So Fedor decided to ask for a ridiculous amount of money (a hundred million bucks) knowing Dana would never accept. That was Fedor's way of saying, "I'm content fighting the guys here, I don't wanna come over to another organization and get immediately run over by Lesnar." And I'm not even saying Lesnar would actually beat Fedor. It just seams Fedor thinks so.
And there is no doubt (unless you haven't watched Sylvia and Arlovski throughout their careers) that their game was nowhere near their peak when they fought Fedor. So I'm far from impressed by those 2 Fedor victories.

That one reason, is that Dana can finally say the UFC has the best HW out there. Not having Fedor is a black cloud over the most prestigious division in combat sports, the heavyweights. As a promoter you want to have the best fighters to promote, and he doesn't have Fedor. As for why Fedor was willing to hold out for large sums of money, he doesn't need tp sign his life away to the UFC to further his legacy (it's not about money or Brock Lesnar, but about control over his life/career). He's already the greatest MMA fighter of all time. Not fighting Brock Lesnar (he of the almighty 4-1 record) isn't going to change that.

Seriously, look at Brock's credentials. Beat a scrub (after Choi wasn't cleared to fight). Lost to Frank Mir in under 2 minutes. Beat Heath Herring by riding him like a pony for 15 minutes. Magically gets a title shot at this point. Beats a senior citizen. Beats Frank Mir. That's it. Fedor signed up to fight Barnett (an exponentially more well rounded fighter than Brock is) and then joined an organization that features the best HW striker and best HW grappler in MMA. Barnett or Overeem would be the UFC champ if they fought in the octagon (the last time Josh fought in the UFC he was the UFC HW champ). I guarantee you if Dana called up Fedor's management and proposed to let the two fight as a one-shot deal with no strings attached Fedor would be more than happy to oblige. But Dana won't do that. He won't allow his champion to be beaten without owning whoever beat him. And that's why Fedor won't sign with the UFC. He saw first hand how Dana jerked Couture around when Randy wanted to set up a fight with Fedor. Emelianenko won't allow himself to be put in that situation where Dana controls his career.

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As you probably already read up there, that's not what I've done.

I must have daydreamed the Ray Mercer mention...

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Oh I beg to differ my friend. His name is Brock Lesnar. A specimen Fedor has never dealt with. No one as big as Brock can move like Brock. Period.

Let Brock flesh out his resume a bit before we canonize him. Lesnar has never had to deal with someone like Crocop who is a lethal striker. Or Nogueira who is a magician on the ground. Let alone Fedor who is a master at both. Takedowns and hammerfists can only get you so far. What happens when Brock is put on his back? Does he know how to do anything down there? What happens when someone rocks him? What sort of instincts take over? What happens when he sees his own blood all over the place? Will he panic and get caught by something else? Takedowns and hammerfists are the extent of what Brock has shown us. Brock has a whole hell of a lot more to worry about facing Fedor than vice versa.

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I will admit that sometimes Machida and Silva wait for the other guy to strike first (that is annoying as hell). But they are complete packages in terms of BJJ, Judo, Karate, striking power/quickness, and both are deceptively fast.

And Fedor isn't? No one is as complete and as good at all the elements as Fedor is. And no one is smarter in the ring. Never flustered. Never frustrated. Has an answer for everything.

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And keep in mind, I think Fedor is very good. In fact I do think of Fedor as one of the best in the world. I just don't think it's such a cut and dry conclusion that Fedor is the most dominant considering who Fedor has fought lately. Silva's list of recent victories is staggering (Nate Marquardt, Dan Henderson, Patrick Cote, Thales Leites, Forrest Griffin). And none of those fights left a scratch on Silva. Plus, Silva's next fight is against Vitor Belfort (Fedor's next fight is against Brett Rogers,lol). And Machida just destroyed Thiago Silva and Rashad Evans. Those lists are 10 times more impressive than Fedor's last few fights. We already discussed Sylvia and Arlovski. How about before them? Well get ready to laugh and reassess your stance: Choi, Lindland, Mark Hunt and wait for it.....Mark Coleman. laugh.gif Sorry man, but that list isn't even close to as impressive as Silva and Machida's (especially Silva's). When considering who they have fought lately, this is no contest.

I guess we have differing opinions on the matter (obviously) as I don't think Silva has beaten anyone of consequence since Henderson. The judges are still out, IMO, on the quality of the TUF era of UFC fighters. They become big names, but are they really as good as their popularity? I don't think they are.

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Pound for pound the best mixed martial artists in the world RIGHT NOW (not in the past) is Anderson Silva with Lyoto Machida a close second. So actually you're right, they aren't "Fedor good." They're better (if were talking right this very second).

Again, put them in a ring/cage with Fedor and see who wins. The size difference is negligible.


That's Anderson at roughly 215-220.


This is Fedor at exactly 230. In his jeans.

I'd say there's a 5lb difference in frame/musculature and a 5-10lb difference in fluff. Factor in that Anderson has a 2" height/reach advantage and it's a wash.

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#12 TheDetroitRedWings

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Posted 10 October 2009 - 06:52 PM

WOW...I don't even know where to start...

We'll just have to agree to disagree. Cause we're obviously on two different wave lengths.

P.S. You are wrong. lol

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