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Gnredwing

Shanahan- Any Chance Wings Retire his #?

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If you even have to ask the question, the answer is no.

Thing is, if you retire Shanny's number, you have to retires Ozzie's, Fedorov's, Cheli's, Holmstrom's, Draper's and so on, until suddenly it's not that big of an honor anymore.

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Shanny? Not a chance.

Fedorov? Also not a chance.

Osgood? Better chance than the previous two but not even close enough to get the honor. He won't be getting his number up there because he wasn't the foundation of the franchise like Yzerman and Lidstrom were/are. That is a special honor for the very very few.

No one else is close at the moment.

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Shanny? Not a chance.

Fedorov? Also not a chance.

Osgood? Better chance than the previous two but not even close enough to get the honor. He won't be getting his number up there because he wasn't the foundation of the franchise like Yzerman and Lidstrom were/are. That is a special honor for the very very few.

No one else is close at the moment.

Yeah, this. Look at the names retired thus far: Yzerman, Howe, Lindsay, Sawchuk, Abel, Delvecchio... And add Lidstrom. All have been not only huge influences on the Wings organization, but hockey in general.

You actually have to be better than HOF-quality to get your number to hang in the rafters; you have to epitomize the Red Wings during the era you play for them.

The only two numbers I could see being retired other than 5 at this point are 13 and 40, and those still have a good 10 years to see what kind of legacy they'll leave. Even with the impact they've had on the org, they wouldn't be retired right now, and it wouldn't even be close.

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If Shanahan spent the rest of his career with Detroit, I think for sure, even if those last seasons were mediocre. I wouldn't be mad if they did retire his number, but I'd also be extremely surprised. I've always been a big fan of him, he was one of my favourite Wings for a good period of time, but it's a damn shame that we won't see that Irish bastard's number in the rafters... :(

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been said many times, but no it will not and should not happen.

i love shanny as does most other people here, and he was a key part to this team for awhile, but he didnt start nor finish his career here.

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With the Wings, if you have to think about it, it wont happen. Players who get their number retired in Detroit are no-brainers because of the impact they have made to the Wings. Shanny was a good player, but that was about it. The team could have won without him, unlike stevie or nick. Same with Fedorov or Ozzie. They both will probably go to the hall of fame, as they should, but they did not make that impact in Detroit that will demand that they be remembered for all-time with a retired number.

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I think as number retirements as players who DEFINED a franchise... Yzerman was a captain that led us for over two decades and was highly loved. He was the player that brought the Red Wings back to life and contention. Lidstrom is the defenseman that is arguably the best that's played the game, who was the backbone to four Stanley cups, was a career wing, and became our captain. Being an amazing player like Fedorov or Shanny isn't enough. Though we loved all these players, it's the ones that contribute most to the legacy of "being a Red Wing" that get up in the rafters.

Edited by The Nephilim

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There are a lot of factors that contribute to a player's number being retired...especially at the Joe. Not only do you need to be HOF caliber but you need to have had a huge impact on the team during yoru tenure, which Shanahan did. However, if you look at the list of retired numbers in Detroit one thing that you'll notice is that each and every guy demonstrated a very high level of loyalty to the game and to the franchise. Not only were they all winners but they all put the team ahead of themselves in order to win. Most of the retired numbers had long, long tenures with the Wings and are remembered as the face of the franchise during their stint. Maybe Shanahan's Red Wing legacy is overshadowed a bit by Yzerman and Lidstrom but the fact is Shanahan was a key cog in the Red Wings wheel but he wasn't the main cog. He is a hall of famer but will not have his number retired at the JOe. The Wings have high standards in order to have your number reitred, we're not the Avalanche who retired Ray Bourque's number after one year with the club. Talk about taking somethign away from the honour.

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I think as number retirements as players who DEFINED a franchise... Yzerman was a captain that led us for over two decades and was highly loved. He was the player that brought the Red Wings back to life and contention. Lidstrom is the defenseman that is arguably the best that's played the game, who was the backbone to four Stanley cups, was a career wing, and became our captain. Being an amazing player like Fedorov or Shanny isn't enough. Though we loved all these players, it's the ones that contribute most to the legacy of "being a Red Wing" that get up in the rafters.

First of all, the guys above arguing that Draper and Maltby had any remote chance of ever getting their name in the rafters are nuts. If Shanahan and Fedorov are even questionable, then the Grind Line has ZERO chance. Retired numbers are for iconic players, not guys who played for you a long time and made super-awesome Little Caesar's commercials.

I don't think Shanahan will have his number retired, and I'm starting to think Fedorov won't either (but I think Fedorov is probably deserving). But it's not for the reasons you said. I disagree with the "defining a franchise" definition. First, if you do have a defining player (like Howe or Yzerman), it's not impossible that their may be other H of F caliber players also on that team deserving of a number retirement (like Lidstrom and Fedorov with Yzerman, or Lindsay and Delvecchio in the 50's).

You can't penalize Fedorov for Yzerman being around. Yzerman resurrected the "Dead Wings" and is obviously #2 or #1a in terms of "most important Red Wings" (up with Howe). But without Fedorov, Yzerman couldn't make this into the elite team that they became by '94 and '95. Shanahan also added the "missing piece" of toughness that was necessary in its own way to make us a Stanley Cup champion, but his contributions were not as significant as Fedorov's. I totally agree with Fedorov's famous quote that if he were named "Sam" instead of being Russian, he would've been viewed much differently.

But I became more convinced that he'll never have his number retired after hearing Holland talk about how much they debated trading for him internally before the '08 Cup run. The fact that they were so conflicted (and chose not to do it) tells me that there really are lingering issues there. And we know that this organization does hold grudges (ask #6).

From a technical standpoint, though, it's somewhat of a moot point b/c nobody will have the balls to come out wearing a #91 on the back of a winged wheel jersey. Therefore, in Illitch's mind, it's really only the question of whether or not you want to extend this symbolic gesture to a guy that they feel wouldn't properly appreciate it, and whom many fans still dislike to this day (for reasons that largely escape me). That's why I don't believe it will ever happen. But if Shanny gets it and Fedorov doesn't, I might throw up.

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As much as I would like for them to, it will not happen. Nick is the only shoe-in at the moment.

Agreed (though there are certainly other Wings like Datsyuk and Zetterberg that could end up being "shoe-ins" some day, but it's just too early to tell.

Then there's Chris Osgood. I agree that he's by no means a "shoe-in", but I also feel like the story is not finished with him yet. Much like nobody thought of Kurt Warner as a "hall of famer" until he resurrected his career with the Cardinals, Osgood is still in the process of scripting his comeback phase. And it's almost as if he's negatively impacting his credentials by hanging around, unless he makes another strong playoff performance in 2010. But even though all the credentials are there for a # retirement (IMO), you also feel like there are at least 20 goalies in the NHL right now that (if they were Red Wings) would seriously threaten his regular season job. And the longer that goes on, the less I'm inclined to put #30 in the rafters (if that makes any sense).

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Though I don't believe that Shanny will have his number retired here, I would like to see him be honored with Shanahan Night. Have him come in on say, St. Patrick's Day, and do something for him. I would like to see the same for Hull, Luc, Cheli and Dom, Igor and possibly D-Mac. And when Drapes and Malts retire, the same for them. I think all deserve recognition for their careers here in Detroit, whether short or long, and what they did to bring championships here.

Even though Sergei left after 13 years, I think he also deserves a night of honor, if not a jersey retirement. He was one of the catalysts that helped Detroit win three cups, and he put up pretty good numbers.

As for Ozzie, I think that if he passes Sawchuk for wins as a Detroit goalie, he needs 43, he deserves serious consideration for his jersey to be retired. I agree with Kelly Hrudy, Ozzie still doesn't get the respect he deserves.

Lidstom is a no brainer, but I would like to have Red Kelly's number retired as well.

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First of all, the guys above arguing that Draper and Maltby had any remote chance of ever getting their name in the rafters are nuts. If Shanahan and Fedorov are even questionable, then the Grind Line has ZERO chance. Retired numbers are for iconic players, not guys who played for you a long time and made super-awesome Little Caesar's commercials.

You can't penalize Fedorov for Yzerman being around. Yzerman resurrected the "Dead Wings" and is obviously #2 or #1a in terms of "most important Red Wings" (up with Howe). But without Fedorov, Yzerman couldn't make this into the elite team that they became by '94 and '95. Shanahan also added the "missing piece" of toughness that was necessary in its own way to make us a Stanley Cup champion, but his contributions were not as significant as Fedorov's. I totally agree with Fedorov's famous quote that if he were named "Sam" instead of being Russian, he would've been viewed much differently.

Few things, I don't recall anyone arguing that Maltby and Draper should have their #s retired (if some1 did, it was a small minority). However, I did list the likelihood of players getting to the rafters, putting Lids as the only guarantee, and listing Draper, Osgood, and Federov above Shanny.

I do, however, disagree on retiring Federov's number. I think he was monumentally important to this frachise's resurrection, and was instrumental in 3 of our recent cup wins... but the list of significant contributing names is a long one, and the list of career Wings with a heavy importance to this franchise is at its most saturated in our team's history. We've had three recent guys in Draper, Yzerman and Lids who have all gotten in over 1000 games in the Wings uni, two of which have over 1000 points too. Holmstrom and Maltby are getting close to the 1000 game mark, and considering they've both had relatively strong starts to the season, it's likely they'll be around a year or two more to get a chance at that mark. Datsyuk, Franzen, and Zetterberg are all signed long enough to get a chance for the mark too. Couple that with Osgood likely getting many of the franchise goaltending records and how many HOFers we've had come through lately, and the competition for the rafters is at its stiffest in our history. I think in a different era, with a different team, Federov would have his number retired, but ultimately, he's been gone from the team so long, and is a figure so detached from the Detroit area, it's just very hard to imagine them retiring his number.

I do believe that there is a history of prejudice in the NHL community and fanbase against European players, especially if they even so much as think about making any money from hockey (ironic that nobody has mentioned Shanny chasing the dollars as a youngster), but in this case I don't think a Canadian or American born-player with Federov's exact numbers and history, would be rafter worthy for this franchise.

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Shanahan will not and should not get his number retired in Detroit. He was a Red Wing for what, nine seasons?

He had some good years in Detroit, but he did not start his career as a Red Wing, in fact he was already in his prime by the time he came to the Wings. A hired gun, if you will. He stayed for some Cup wins, and played well in those seasons but later on, when he had declined as a player, he left Detroit. He gave the reason "Because I'm part of the past" but it also happened to be a fact that the Rangers were offering a considerably higher salary than Detroit was to a player who has been a money-chaser in the past.

All of the players currently retired began their careers as Red Wings and were strong influences on the team, very good players for the team for a long time, and exemplified the team's character on and off the ice. Lidstrom and Osgood are the only realistic choices who have yet to receive the honor. Dats and Z certainly could reach that status.

As for those arguing that Ozzie shouldn't get it, why? I've heard things like "Maybe two more Cups" or "There are 20 goalies in the league that could challenge him for his starting job" and my question to all of those is as follows: Did those 20 goalies spend many years backstopping the Wings, always giving the Wings a chance to win regardless of how the team played, putting up per-game postseason statistics comparable to Patrick Roy? How many Cups does a goalie have to win to earn jersey retirement? Sawchuk won a bunch of Cups, but he has four teammates retired alongside him. Ozzie constantly gets hit with the "his team was great" argument. If Ozzie's team was so wonderful, and Sawchuk had four teammates who were great enough to deserve this extremely rare and illustrious honor....then doesn't it follow that Sawchuk's teams were pretty ******* awesome?

Osgood has never missed the playoffs or posted a losing record in the regular season, not even when he played for terrible Islanders and Blues teams. He is about to crack the 400-win plateau and will soon be the Wings' all-time wins leader. People keep saying Osgood is a scrub, or has always been terrible, or stuff like that. Well if that's true, then why has he been able to post these numbers? It's not luck, and he doesn't play enough games to be able to accumulate these win numbers simply by playing a lot like some goalies, so the remaining answer as to how it happens is skill.

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