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Inultus

McCarty pulled a Bertuzzi

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For those of you who don't like the thread, get the hell out! It was meant to be a fun discussion, after all that's why this board exists.

Also, for those talking about Mac's actions in 97, he himself said it was a sucker punch. Anyone who knows hockey was glad it happened and had wanted revenge for a while, but it was still a sucker punch. Also, to be accurate Fors/Lar was the 3RD scrum in the game and no punches had been thrown until the Mac sucker punch.

Lastly, if you can't just have fun talking hockey I suggest you take your pansy ass to another board.

I don't give two craps if you agree with me or not, but we can still have a discussion, at least I thought so.

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Guest micah
For those of you who don't like the thread, get the hell out! It was meant to be a fun discussion, after all that's why this board exists.

Also, for those talking about Mac's actions in 97, he himself said it was a sucker punch. Anyone who knows hockey was glad it happened and had wanted revenge for a while, but it was still a sucker punch. Also, to be accurate Fors/Lar was the 3RD scrum in the game and no punches had been thrown until the Mac sucker punch.

Lastly, if you can't just have fun talking hockey I suggest you take your pansy ass to another board.

I don't give two craps if you agree with me or not, but we can still have a discussion, at least I thought so.

Great post.

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Guest GordieSid&Ted
once again, apples to oranges, you're combining 2 separate instances to support your claim...

The attack on Kaczmer was from behind, but was not premeditated and yes, it was wrong, but in the heat of the moment, it in fact DOES make a difference.

The fight with Lemieux was premeditated but was FACE TO FACE...

The second variable in both of those situations make a HUGE difference... and to overlook the significance of their combination in the scenario is weak.

HOMER ALERT....HOMER ALERT....HOMER ALERT....

Attention ladies and gentlemen. This is merely a notification that a blatant act of homerism is occurring and that although frightening in it's silliness, it is completely benign and not contagious for anyone in possession of an IQ over 80.

You may now continue with your regularly scheduled lucidity.

Not sure who made the claim that McCarty told Lemieux in the faceoff that he was going to fight him. When did this happen and what proof is there of this? The event that occurred on the 26th, to the best of my knowledge, did not include any "conversation" between Mac and Lemieux. Mac simply broke away from the linesman late in the 1st period and sucker punched a guy who's arms were down at his side. The "conversation" I believe that is being referred to earlier took place in a later game, after the "turtle" incident. Two separate games, two separate fights.

The Mac/Lemieux episode goes down as one of the great moments in Wings history. However, anybody who isn't a complete, gutless, f***tard and doesn't drink the Wings koolaid with every meal knows that Mac sucker punched Lemieux. Any talk of Lemieux needing to expect something or that he saw Mac skating towards him is meaningless. At that moment in time one guy's arms were down by his side and the other guy drilled him in the face. Any part of the planet you come from that is a sucker punch.

As for the OP's video. I've seen that before. The most hideous thing is Yzerman's wicked cross check to the head late in the game. That's a 20+ game suspension today and I don't even think Stevie got penalized on that.

As for comparisons of Bert and Mac. It's not exactly black and white. One the one hand you can say Mac's was in the heat of the moment. OK, but that doesn't make it "right". Jumping a player from behind has never been right. So stop trying to legitimize it. It's wrong no matter how you look at it.

Do we cut Mac some slack b/c it was heat of the moment and not premeditated? I guess I would. But just a wee bit of slack.

The OP has a point. There are elements to the situation that make them vary slightly. But there can be no arguing that in the Moore and Keczmer situations, both players were jumped from behind and driven headfirst into the ice. In the Mac/Lemeiux incident. It's a sucker punch clear as day. Just because you see a guy skating towards you with a scowl on your face doesn't mean he's going to cold cock you. Anybody who has ever played the game of hockey and pissed anybody off knows when the other guy is pissed at you. What you don't know for sure is what is going to happen. Clearly, Lemieux had zero clue that he was about to get his suck hole punched in by a McCarty right hand. If he did, he'd have had his arms and stick up to protect himself.

This is not comparing apples to oranges. It's comparing red apples to green apples.

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Guest GordieSid&Ted
What a dumbass thread.

These two plays could only be considered remotely alike for those who think people falling on Moore is what broke his neck and not the suckerpunch to from behind. Mac tackles the guy from behind and rides him to the ice.

Nevermind, I've already wasted to many words on this. If it's not obvious to him by the video, there ain't no explaining it.

EDIT: My favorite part of that video is Mac pointing at the guy as he says "you're ******* dead!"

It's claims like this by Brad May and alleged claims to the same effect by Crawford and Bertuzzi that lead to their asses getting sued.

I'm not a namby pamby so this kind of talk doesn't bother me at all. But I detect a faint smell of hypocrisy as it's McCarty and it's a Redwing making the claims. Oh, and Keczmer's neck don't get broken.

If we had on ice audio of Bert saying "hey, Moore, i'm going to kill you" and then he did what he did. I don't think you'd find much favor in that.

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Gordie, Mac hauled his man down to the ice.

Bertuzzi grabbed his man, punched him in the side of the head, then used his other arm to push his head into the ice.

"Honor" is irrelevant because that is not what is meant to be compared. The only comparison is how they did it, and Bert's was much more vicious and dangerous than Mac's was.

Also who even started the conversation about the Claude incident anyways? It has no bearing on the original discussion.

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It's claims like this by Brad May and alleged claims to the same effect by Crawford and Bertuzzi that lead to their asses getting sued.

I'm not a namby pamby so this kind of talk doesn't bother me at all. But I detect a faint smell of hypocrisy as it's McCarty and it's a Redwing making the claims. Oh, and Keczmer's neck don't get broken.

If we had on ice audio of Bert saying "hey, Moore, i'm going to kill you" and then he did what he did. I don't think you'd find much favor in that.

How many times in a season do you think players say "you're ******* dead" to one another? It's the actions, not words. Maybe i'd feel differently if the next time the two teams met, Mac had followed Keczmer down the ice trying to get him to fight, and when he wouldn't oblige, completely cold cocked him from behind and broke his neck. But he didn't.

In the video Gordie, it's not even close. Mac grabs him from behind and rides him to the ice. Looks like he did throw a punch when he was down on the ice, but because of the way Mac took him down the guy is basically turtled and has to know something is coming. That's not nearly the same as punching a guy in the back of the head when he is completely unprepared for it.

I've never pretended that the Red Wings were innocent of any cheapshots. Fedorov crosschecking a guy in the head, Fischer rearranging some front teeth with his stick, and countless others. The incidents aren't even close. Mac jumping Lemieux is at least a closer comparison, and that's one that's already been beat to death by a few of these same people.

This is just a thread to stir up s***.

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Hey Inultus, are you having some apples for lunch or oranges. My guess is either would work for you.

Thanks for posting this video. The only thoughts it gave me were of pride in a team that sticks up for each other and their honor and wishing we had more of this today. A lot more.

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Fights occur in hockey all the time.

Brawls/melees, while less frequent obviously (perhaps rare), still occur and aren't unusual. McCarty-Lemieux and that Red Wings-Avs game in 1997 fit in this bill.

Incidents like Bertuzzi-Moore happens very, very rarely. Only other thing that would compare to that that I can think of is McSorely-Brashear incident.

The McCarty-Lemieux incident doesn't even come close to comparing to Bertuzzi-Moore.

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Incidents like Bertuzzi-Moore happens very, very rarely. Only other thing that would compare to that that I can think of is McSorely-Brashear incident.

Huge difference. If Moore had walked away from that sucker punch Bert would have gotten prolly instigator and a roughing.

McSorely would have gotten a suspension (assuming the refs didn't just think it was an accidental high stick) whether Brashear went down or not due to the intent to injure.

The McSorely incident was way worse than Bert's IMO. I've been sucker punched before and I will take that all day over a stick to the face (a sucker-stick, so to speak).

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Huge difference. If Moore had walked away from that sucker punch Bert would have gotten prolly instigator and a roughing.

McSorely would have gotten a suspension (assuming the refs didn't just think it was an accidental high stick) whether Brashear went down or not due to the intent to injure.

The McSorely incident was way worse than Bert's IMO. I've been sucker punched before and I will take that all day over a stick to the face (a sucker-stick, so to speak).

Careers have been ended by sucker punches to the side of the head.

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