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RedWingAbner

Is it time to rebuild?

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Well, it's nearly February and the Wings are seemingly locked into a sub-par season. I'm not saying that they won't do damage in the playoffs, but I haven't seen much to convince me that they will. Since the Stockholm games, when they blew leads to St. Louis, this has looked like a different team.

Is it time to consider that our #1 defenseman is on the decline, that there is not a "playoff quality" starting goalie on the roster (easy, Osgood lovers), and that Datsyuk/Zetterberg have been less than effective without the depth of previous seasons.

Is it time to take a look at this roster (Holmstrom, Osgood, Rafalski, Stuart, May, Draper, Maltby) and make some hard decisions? Don't get me wrong-- each of these guys is/has been vitally important to the team's success at some point (save May).

My fear is the fact that the Wings seem dedicated to "stay the course." Yes, Abdelkader will be a fine Draper replacement. But have we really grown a shutdown defender or top-6 forward lately (save Filppula, perhaps, but he's a #3 center, really). We have so much cap tied up in guys like Rafalski, Stuart, and Draper that could be better spent elsewhere (Rafalski especially). I know there are NTCs. Those can be waived, it's really just a tool used by players to give them say.

Is it time to rebuild the Wings?

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Well, it's nearly February and the Wings are seemingly locked into a sub-par season. I'm not saying that they won't do damage in the playoffs, but I haven't seen much to convince me that they will. Since the Stockholm games, when they blew leads to St. Louis, this has looked like a different team.

Is it time to consider that our #1 defenseman is on the decline, that there is not a "playoff quality" starting goalie on the roster (easy, Osgood lovers), and that Datsyuk/Zetterberg have been less than effective without the depth of previous seasons.

Is it time to take a look at this roster (Holmstrom, Osgood, Rafalski, Stuart, May, Draper, Maltby) and make some hard decisions? Don't get me wrong-- each of these guys is/has been vitally important to the team's success at some point (save May).

My fear is the fact that the Wings seem dedicated to "stay the course." Yes, Abdelkader will be a fine Draper replacement. But have we really grown a shutdown defender or top-6 forward lately (save Filppula, perhaps, but he's a #3 center, really). We have so much cap tied up in guys like Rafalski, Stuart, and Draper that could be better spent elsewhere (Rafalski especially). I know there are NTCs. Those can be waived, it's really just a tool used by players to give them say.

Is it time to rebuild the Wings?

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The Wings don't rebuild. They reload. Besides this season was all dictated by injuries. You can't determine much about this season, except how some of the younger guys perform with more ice time.

Yes, I know that cliche' as well. Injuries have certainly hurt, but you can't blame the entire thing on injuries. Do you really think that this team is a contender when we get excited about Jason Williams returning?

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who's excited about jason williams returning?

I'm saying, really, that how long can we tell ourselves that injuries are to blame? We've had flip for a month now, Ericsson, Kronwall (recently)......Is Jason Williams really the guy who is gonna put us back into contention? Or, can we see that this is a 6th-8th playoff team that had some injury problems?

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Yes!!! Let's trade everything we've got to the Coyotes, for everything they've got.

To be included in the trade:

All Players, Coaches, Staff, Equipment, Logos, and of course

Joe Louis Arena

The fans will have to waive their no trade clauses though, and move to phoenix.

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The obvious reason for a subpar season has been injuries. Jimmy Howard has actually been a nice surprise (much better than most people expected him to be, myself included). Rebuilding this team would be a horrendous idea, because it takes years to build a team from the ground up. As someone else said, we don't rebuild, we reload. Datsyuk and Zetterberg both dealt with injuries of some form or another this year, which has affected their play. While we would hope for them to be doing better, they are still great for us in all of the areas they need to be, with a drop in their scoring production. I'm not concerned about the Wings, they will continue to be a strong team for years to come.

Plenty of decisions in the upcoming offseason without any need to rebuild the team from scratch.

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3720f7a0ee5d3edf94deab9bf43c3e6f.png

Yes, let's rebuild a team that's one of the strongest healthy teams in the NHL.

Lidstrom isn't really on a decline, TBH. He's still playing better defensive hockey than literally 99.9% of the NHL, and he's been a point machine recently.

Injuries have made this year tough, but by no means do we need to rebuild. Maybe one or two acquisitions in the off-season and we'll be fine.

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Injured players take a while to really get timing and everything back, especially if they have been out for a long time. Filip is just now getting going. It will take Kronwall, Williams, Holmstrom, Franzen, etc. a little time to get going. Hopefully, by the time the league restarts after the Olympics, we should have everyone back and ready to go. Some of the injured guys could actually use the Olympics as another training camp.

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I love how LGW is just a place for kids who joined in 2009 to post thier stupid "facepalm" crap.

Instead of an actual debate, let's just be assface losers and give this thread 1 star.

Anyone want to discuss anything about what I actually said? I can agree that Lidstrom may not be declining, perhaps his numbers are weaker because he is playing safer to cover for the lack of depth. But really guys, this is one of the best "healthy" teams in the league? When was this team impressive this season?

Love the Wings, love Franzen and hope he can help when he gets back, but willing to face reality.

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Guest Howard He Do It?!
I love how LGW is just a place for kids who joined in 2009 to post thier stupid "facepalm" crap.

Instead of an actual debate, let's just be assface losers and give this thread 1 star.

Anyone want to discuss anything about what I actually said? I can agree that Lidstrom may not be declining, perhaps his numbers are weaker because he is playing safer to cover for the lack of depth. But really guys, this is one of the best "healthy" teams in the league? When was this team impressive this season?

Love the Wings, love Franzen and hope he can help when he gets back, but willing to face reality.

What a childish response. Seems like you cannot handle that people do not agree with you. It's only the internet.

You've just guaranteed that no actual debate will occur in this thread.

Edited by Howard He Do It?!

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Guest Howard He Do It?!
Thanks for proving my point, poster who joined two weeks ago.

I know people don't agree with me. I'd like to see reasons why, not stupid filler-- which you just provided. Nice job.

When does it matter when people joined? Oh yeah, it doesn't. You honestly think your opinion matters more or that you know more because you have been a member of an internet forum longer than other people? If you want reasons why people don't agree then don't resort to childish name calling while calling other members kids. You think longer term members would show a little more class.

Edited by Howard He Do It?!

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Guest Howard He Do It?!
Nice edit on the post to add that line. Next time, just reply to me. Still waiting for your insight.

The reply button exists for a reason and I can freely edit whatever I want. Just like you can freely edit your replies.

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When does it matter when people joined? Oh yeah, it doesn't. You honestly think your opinion matters more or that you know more because you have been a member of an internet forum longer than other people? If you want reasons why people don't agree then don't resort to childish name calling while calling other members kids. You think longer term members would show a little more class.

There's no name calling. It's just identification. When I said that this had descended into nothingness and there was a theme (new posters). You followed up by picking a fight, on the internet.......which you bemoaned in the same sentence.

I don't remember using the term "kids," I did say "assface" to describe blatant, "you suck" type stupidity. (EDIT: I re-read. I did use the term kids to describe childish behavior. My bad on forgetting.)

I never implied my opinion was better or higher. I just developed it and explained why I did.

You would think new members wouldn't jump into an argument whilst basically doing everything that was aggravating about responses in the thread to begin with.

Welcome to LGW. What do you think should be done? Why? Let's get this thread back on track.

Edited by RedWingAbner

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I love how LGW is just a place for kids who joined in 2009 to post thier stupid "facepalm" crap.

Instead of an actual debate, let's just be assface losers and give this thread 1 star.

Ironic of you to post this and completely ignore the points I made in my post: Lidstrom isn't in a decline on the defensive side of the puck (and not much of one on the offensive side, either), and that injuries have made this year rough.

You are the one ignoring points and derailing your own thread talking about random facepalm crap.

But then again, I wouldn't even need to post a facepalm if you knew anything about hockey; you don't need to rebuild when your team is half-full of Cup winners. You might replace a few role-players, but the core of this team is solid.

No need for rebuilding.

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Guest Howard He Do It?!
Well, it's nearly February and the Wings are seemingly locked into a sub-par season. I'm not saying that they won't do damage in the playoffs, but I haven't seen much to convince me that they will. Since the Stockholm games, when they blew leads to St. Louis, this has looked like a different team.

Is it time to consider that our #1 defenseman is on the decline, that there is not a "playoff quality" starting goalie on the roster (easy, Osgood lovers), and that Datsyuk/Zetterberg have been less than effective without the depth of previous seasons.

Is it time to take a look at this roster (Holmstrom, Osgood, Rafalski, Stuart, May, Draper, Maltby) and make some hard decisions? Don't get me wrong-- each of these guys is/has been vitally important to the team's success at some point (save May).

My fear is the fact that the Wings seem dedicated to "stay the course." Yes, Abdelkader will be a fine Draper replacement. But have we really grown a shutdown defender or top-6 forward lately (save Filppula, perhaps, but he's a #3 center, really). We have so much cap tied up in guys like Rafalski, Stuart, and Draper that could be better spent elsewhere (Rafalski especially). I know there are NTCs. Those can be waived, it's really just a tool used by players to give them say.

Is it time to rebuild the Wings?

Lidstrom is not on the decline. Lidstrom has been strong defensively all season and he has always been a second half point producer.

Ozzie has proven his playoff prowess and Howard has had a strong season. What's to say that Howard will not play well in the playoffs if the Wings make it?

Holmstrom had a tough year last year with injuries but he bounced back nicely this year until he suffered a fluke injury. Stuart has been one of our better defenders this year but has played some bad games recently. I'm not ready to ship him out of town because of a few bad games. Draper is on the roster to win faceoffs and skate fast, which he does. Draper is a role player and he plays that roll well, same goes for Maltby. Maltby has shot blocking ability and is great at being a pest. Maltby has also put some points up which is a nice bonus. May has played well lately, but he wasn't brought on to be some spectacular player. Rafalski's skills are declining but he has strong games and then games where he looks like a rookie. Rafa is a curious case and is the biggest question mark.

Abs is not the Draper replacement, Helm is. I'd say Abs is a Maltby replacement. There are plenty of guys in the system that are going to be quality players. Kindl is a Top 6 defenseman and Tatar is tearing it up in GR. The Red Wings have a long way to go until they need to rebuild.

Edited by Howard He Do It?!

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Guest Howard He Do It?!
Ironic of you to post this and completely ignore the points I made in my post: Lidstrom isn't in a decline on the defensive side of the puck (and not much of one on the offensive side, either), and that injuries have made this year rough.

You are the one ignoring points and derailing your own thread talking about random facepalm crap.

But then again, I wouldn't even need to post a facepalm if you knew anything about hockey; you don't need to rebuild when your team is half-full of Cup winners. You might replace a few role-players, but the core of this team is solid.

No need for rebuilding.

Thank you Theo. Very well said.

I agree with you completely. No need to rebuild.

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Ironic of you to post this and completely ignore the points I made in my post: Lidstrom isn't in a decline on the defensive side of the puck (and not much of one on the offensive side, either), and that injuries have made this year rough.

You are the one ignoring points and derailing your own thread talking about random facepalm crap.

But then again, I wouldn't even need to post a facepalm if you knew anything about hockey; you don't need to rebuild when your team is half-full of Cup winners. You might replace a few role-players, but the core of this team is solid.

No need for rebuilding.

I wasn't speaking specifically of you. I did mention that I tended to see your point, albeit without quoting you, on page 1.

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Short answer: No.

Long answer: No, and I'm glad you're not Ken Holland. When a team is having to use AHL players on their 2nd line for almost a month's worth of play and their #7-8 d-men as their #4 and 5 for an extended period of time, it's not the appropriate time to make any significant changes based on a performance evaluation. Some people on this website are annoyingly spoiled (I live in Florida; I watch a lot of the Bolts).

If anything, we should be surprised that a team suffering as many injuries to as significant of players for as long of time as the Wings have this year has kept above .500 and in playoff contention. Most of the players on this team (such as Lidstrom, who currently ranks #1 in defensive ranking among defensemen, or Datsyuk, who leads the league with takeaways and is a significant plus on a minus team, or Bertuzzi, who has majorly revamped his game) deserve praise, not criticism.

Edit: Source on Lidstrom comment --

top_defensive_dmen_458141a.JPG

Alternatively, you could use this, where Lidstrom is #3 (behind the amazing defensive tandem of Keith and Seabrook. Lidstrom partners with Rafalski [or at some points in the season, Stuart]).

http://www.behindthenet.ca/2009/gvt.php?so...team=&pos=D

I think the fact that Raffi is in the top 10 on the above list is another credit to him. While he's not god awful defensively like some here enjoy painting him, it's certainly not his specialization and I don't want to see him as a regular on the PK.

Edited by Datsyerberger

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