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#41 lilja4mvp

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Posted 19 March 2010 - 03:41 PM

So you would rather lose Stuart (who behind Lids, has been our best dman this season)

stuart is pretty expendable right now. he's a horrible value at 3.75. "bububububububu the DEFENSE! bubububububu the PK!" take a look at his +/- and his absolutely awful PK #s.


in efforts to sign Frolov who will cost $4-5 million per season when you could have Stuart and Hudler for roughly the same cost?

hudler would be honoring his previous contract at 2.8

frolov would likely take less than a 6.55 mil cap hit to sign.


I am not even going to compare Frolov and Hudler because that has been overdone on this site. Hudler can do everything Frolov can at a much lesser price.

you're insane. first we have one clown that says filppula is a better passer than hudler, now you think there's nothing frolov does better than hudler.

wings fans really love to overrate their 2nd/3rd line players.

Edited by lilja4mvp, 19 March 2010 - 03:50 PM.


#42 mmamolo

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Posted 19 March 2010 - 04:06 PM

So you would rather lose Stuart (who behind Lids, has been our best dman this season) in efforts to sign Frolov who will cost $4-5 million per season when you could have Stuart and Hudler for roughly the same cost? I am not even going to compare Frolov and Hudler because that has been overdone on this site. Hudler can do everything Frolov can at a much lesser price.


Stuart's Cap Hit - $3.75M
Hudler's Cap Hit - $2.875M
Total= $6.625

Even if Frolov signed for something insanely expensive like $5M that leaves you an additional $1.625.

That being said I personalyl don't think we should get go after Frolov at the expense of Stuart and Hudler but Im just saying you're argument wasnt exactly fair.


On a related note, does anyone know exactly how the Hudler situation works in terms of how much control the Wings have. If Hudler up and opts out of his KHL contract can he just flat out say, I'm coming back or do the Wings have to approve him coming back. They have a contract in place so I'm wondering can the Wings say hey look we want you to wait another year before you come back or would their hand be forced into taking him back whenever he feels like coming? Any one know?
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#43 DSM

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Posted 19 March 2010 - 06:02 PM

I think everyone's hopes for Hudler to return are a little too high. He'd be stupid to come back with the kind of money he's making in Russia.


On offense I'd let go of:
Williams - He's been useless this year, and even if he played every game this year he isn't even on par for more than 30 points.
Bertuzzi - Save for 1 stinkin' month, he has been equally useless.
Maltby - Do I need to explain?
May - Same

Resign Holmstrom, bring up Abdelkader and Ritola.

I'd leave a spot open for a 2nd/3rd line winger. Specifically, I'd target someone who plays with a bit of an edge and has some size, but can also go to the net. This player would effectively replace Bertuzzi. Miller and Eaves pretty much showed that they can fill Williams spot. Maltby really doesn't need to be replaced...

It would look something like this:

Franzen-Datsyuk-Holmstrom
Filppula-Zetterberg- ________
Cleary-Helm-Eaves
Miller-Draper-Abdelkader
Ritola


On defense I'd let go of:
Lebda - The past couple of years he's never really had a solidified spot in the line-up and continues to jostle between being the #6 and #7 dman. He's pretty much a dime a dozen and we need to make room for Kindl, since he is on a one way next season. If Detroit resigns both Lebda and Lilja, the latter of which I believe will be resigned, they'll risk losing Meech or Kindl for nothing in the same fashion they did Quincey.

Resign Lilja

Looking like:
Lidstrom-Rafalski
Stuart-Kronwall
Lilja-Ericsson/Kindl
Meech

In goal

no changes

Howard
Osgood

#44 king_malice

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Posted 19 March 2010 - 10:44 PM

Drake if Lids retires do the Wings take his 7.5 mill and offer Backstrom the full 7.5 you think thats enough ?and just use the money they save by not signing guys like Williams and others to bring up other guys? what is the Caps cap like right now ?

#45 pockets

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Posted 20 March 2010 - 02:52 AM

idk if he is a FA or if the wings could get him but id like to see Sharp in red and he could even play the point just like babs likes

#46 superstarsingh

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Posted 20 March 2010 - 08:36 AM

I would rather have Hudler and Stuart for a bit more money than Frolov. I will never understand this love for him on these boards. Frolov had 59 points in 77 games last year while consistently playing in the top 6. Hudler has 57 in 82 while playing in limited minutes. Given the same ice time over a season, I feel Hudler's numbers would trump Frolov's. If Hudler comes back, he is at $2.85, Frolov will cost more. Stuart has played well. Yes, lets look at plus minus on the PK and blame solely Brad Stuart. That does not make sense. Stuart has logged a lot of minutes this year and as I have said, he has played well. It should also be noted that Stuart is an enabler for Kronwall to do what he does (jump up for big hits, pinch, join a rush). At the end of the day, Hudler over Frolov in my opinion but is Frolov wants to play for 2.8 million? Why not.

Edited by superstarsingh, 20 March 2010 - 08:56 AM.


#47 Bannedforlife

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Posted 20 March 2010 - 01:49 PM

I think that New Jersey has been a poor fit for Kovalchuk, I doubt that he would want to stay unless things really improve. I would love to see Holland go after him July 1st, maybe even trade Filppula for the rights to Kovie and Clarkson?

Kovalchuk - Datsyuk - Holmstrom
Franzen - Zetterberg - Bertuzzi/Clarkson
Cleary - Abdelkader - Clarkson/Bertuzzi
Draper - Helm - Eaves
Miller

Lidstrom - Rafalski
Kronwall - Stuart
Lilja - Ericsson
Kindl

Howard
Osgood

I think this would change alot of the negative perceptions about the team (size, toughness, fighters, finishing ability) and make us a very tough team to play against. We would be right against the cap until guys like Rafalski, Cleary, Stuart, Draper came off the books, but I think something big has to be done to make this year the exception, not the norm.

FORWARDS
Ilya Kovalchuk - $7,000,000
Pavel Datsyuk - $6,700,000
Henrik Zetterberg - $6,083,333
Johan Franzen - $3,954,545
Daniel Cleary - $2,800,000
Kris Draper - $1,583,333
David Clarkson - $1,500,000
Todd Bertuzzi - $1,400,000
Tomas Holmstrom - $1,250,000
Darren Helm - $1,000,000
Justin Abdelkader - $1,000,000
Patrick Eaves - $750,000
Drew Miller - $600,000

DEFENSEMEN
Brian Rafalski - $6,000,000
Brad Stuart - $3,750,000
Nicklas Lidstrom - $3,500,000
Niklas Kronwall - $3,000,000
Andreas Lilja - $1,000,000
Jonathan Ericsson - $900,000
Jakub Kindl - $883,333

GOALTENDERS
Chris Osgood - $1,416,666
Jimmy Howard - $716,666

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER SIZE - 22
SALARY CAP - $56,800,000
PAYROLL - $56,787,876
CAP SPACE - $12,124

#48 titanium2

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Posted 20 March 2010 - 02:19 PM

Man that'd be awesome. Cleary can be a second liner as long as he is supposed to be like Holmstrom. Cleary is to Zetterberg as Holmstrom is to Datsyuk. Zetterberg just needs a shooter.

I just don't know how Holland feels about having a supposedly relatively high maintenance Russian.

#49 Buppy

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Posted 20 March 2010 - 02:36 PM

* Patrick Marleau ($6.000m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m)
Johan Franzen ($3.955m) / Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / * Ilya Kovalchuk ($6.700m)
* Patrick Eaves ($0.750m) / * Darren Helm ($1.000m) / * Dave Clarkson ($1.500m)
Kris Draper ($1.583m) / * Justin Abdelkader ($0.850m) / * Drew Miller ($0.650m)
* Mattias Ritola ($0.500m)
DEFENSEMEN
* Nicklas Lidstrom ($4.500m) / * Anton Volchenkov ($3.000m)
Niklas Kronwall ($3.000m) / * Anton Babchuk ($1.500m)
* Zbynek Michalek ($1.500m) / Jonathan Ericsson ($0.900m)
Jakub Kindl ($0.883m)
GOALTENDERS
Jimmy Howard ($0.717m) / Chris Osgood ($1.417m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER: 22; PAYROLL: $56.688m; CAP ROOM: $0.112m BONUSES: $0.000m

:)

Seriously though, I'd like to see us make a play for either Kovie or Marleau. If we couldn't work something out (and probably couldn't), Hudler coming back would be my next choice.

#50 titanium2

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Posted 21 March 2010 - 01:01 PM

The shopping list, if Kenny has the cap space to write one, should ask for an unquestionable top six forward. Not a 2nd/3rd line tweener.

Maybe a defensive defenseman who doesn't need offense in order to play well defensively. We don't know what Lils will do after this year.

#51 Dominator2005

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Posted 21 March 2010 - 01:16 PM

Draft day - Holland is going to pass on Lucic type's of player and draft Emmerton type's of player... He will pass on Latendresse type's of player and draft some swede at 5'1"...

FA - He will bring on Deveraux - just like he has done with Williams.
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#52 South Dakota wings fan

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Posted 21 March 2010 - 03:36 PM

Torres and Hudler please.

Raffi Torres at 2.5/yr for 2 yrs would be nice. Torres and Hudler would really improve the 2nd and third lines and both would come at under 3mil/yr for the next two years. Dumping J-Softy and Berslowzi along with Lids taking a pay cut (3.5-4mil/yr for 2yrs would be great) would get them both on board no problem. Meech can go elsewhere, Kindl comes up, Eaves is re-signed, Homer is re-signed, Miller is let go, Abdelkader is brought up, Lilja is re-signed for around the same money for 2yrs. These changes along with a "healthy" year from our top guys and a better year out of Filppula would go a long ways toward staying at the top of the conference rather than battling it out at the bottom.

Homer-Dats-Franzen
Hudler-Z-Cleary
Torres-Filppula-Helm
Eaves-Draper-Abdelkader


Lids-Rafi
Stewie-Kronner
Lilja-Lebda/Kindl
Ericsson



I think you are on the right track. One problem is that you have 8 D and only 12 forwards. What is the roster limit? 22 or 23? I think you could bring Miller back instead of Maltby.

Homer-Pav-Mule
Huds-Z-Flip
Torres-Abdel-Cleary
Eaves-Helm-Draper
Miller (Maltby)

Lids-Rafi
Stu-Kronn
Lilja-E (assuming he pulls his head out)
Kindl

If the roster limit is 23 you could have Miller and Malby as extra forwards, cap room willing. One thing that worries me is that Huds was given the chance to be a 2nd line player last year and didn't perform. What makes us think he could do it next year? Cleary seemed to play better when he wasn't expected to score so much. But 2.8 mil per year becomes a lot of $$ for a 3rd line player. Flip is too good not to be playing 2nd line minutes.

#53 Lidstromboli

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Posted 21 March 2010 - 03:38 PM

i don't get the obsession with frolov here

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#54 sharkfan20

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Posted 21 March 2010 - 04:26 PM

you can Get Marleau or Nabokov or Thornton. :o
]"Some of the guys have got to become man- Nabokov"

Sharks in 2010?!

#55 Guest_screwdahawks (Guest)

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Posted 21 March 2010 - 07:34 PM

I think the chances of Marleau leaving the Sharks by choice is pretty slim unless they low-ball him really bad.

#56 Guest_screwdahawks (Guest)

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Posted 22 March 2010 - 06:53 AM

I also think that Lidstrom will play next season and people on this board that think he will sign for 3.5 to 4.5M are not being very realistic. He is still one of the top defencemen in the League and should he decide to sign another contract I doubt it would be for less than 5.0M. Actually 6M seems more realistic when you consider what Rafalski is making.

#57 Andy Pred 48

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Posted 22 March 2010 - 07:36 AM

Here's the deal, we ring the Thrashers and ask for Maxim Afinogenov,Evgeny Artyukhin and Boris Valabik. We give them Daniel Cleary,Brett Lebda, Mattias Ritola and the rights to Hudler.

Next we offer the Oilers, Kronwall, Meech and 2nd round pick for Alex Plante and Zack Stortini.

We let Maltby ride into the sunset with Draper and Osqood.(buy out the later 2 if need be)
We choose not to re-sign Williams.

Zetterberg Filppula Franzen

Afinogenov Datsyuk Bertuzzi

Eaves Helm Miller

Artyukin Abdelkader Stortini

Holmstrom


Lidstrom Rafalski
Stuart Plante
Ericsson Valabik
Lilja Kindl

Howard Larsson

The Wings have just got bigger faster and meaner.

Edited by Andy Pred 48, 22 March 2010 - 07:37 AM.

"What are you guys doing?" Reggie Dunlop
"Putting on the foil coach" Jeff Hanson
"Yeah, every game, you want some coach?" Steve Hanson
"Er, no. No thanks guys." Reggie Dunlop
"Make sure they don't leave the bench!" Reggie Dunlop.

#58 Guest_screwdahawks (Guest)

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Posted 22 March 2010 - 07:59 AM

Here's the deal, we ring the Thrashers and ask for Maxim Afinogenov,Evgeny Artyukhin and Boris Valabik. We give them Daniel Cleary,Brett Lebda, Mattias Ritola and the rights to Hudler.

Next we offer the Oilers, Kronwall, Meech and 2nd round pick for Alex Plante and Zack Stortini.

We let Maltby ride into the sunset with Draper and Osqood.(buy out the later 2 if need be)
We choose not to re-sign Williams.

Zetterberg Filppula Franzen

Afinogenov Datsyuk Bertuzzi

Eaves Helm Miller

Artyukin Abdelkader Stortini

Holmstrom


Lidstrom Rafalski
Stuart Plante
Ericsson Valabik
Lilja Kindl

Howard Larsson

The Wings have just got bigger faster and meaner.



Artyukhin and Afinogenov are both UFA.

#59 lilja4mvp

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Posted 22 March 2010 - 10:25 AM

i don't get the obsession with frolov here


i doubt anyone here is "obsessed" with frolov.

they just realize that this team needs a legit goal scorer if D and Z are going to center separate lines, and the options are pretty limited this offseason.

yeah, we'd all love kovalchuck but that's not realistic.

hudler isn't your standard top-6 material. you can usually get by lacking size if you have speed...he has neither.

#60 superstarsingh

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Posted 22 March 2010 - 10:42 AM

At the end of the day, regardless of his size, Hudler's production (last year) was right on par with Frolov's. Hudler was not logging the same amount of minutes as Frolov as well. So IF Hudler comes back, at $2.85 million, he is a better (and more realistic) option than Frolov.

Edited by superstarsingh, 22 March 2010 - 10:42 AM.






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