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Can the wings afford howard?


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#21 mindfly

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 01:19 AM

lol just don't worry about it it's not like he's gonna get 3million after one or two good years

#22 RedWings

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 02:13 AM

He won't get much
I guess the guy is already very happy that the Wings made him a #1 goaltender.
Last offseason instead of Bertuzzi / Williams we could have taken another Conklin... We gave the guy a chance.

#23 Uncle Danny

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 02:53 AM

Last offseason instead of Bertuzzi / Williams we could have taken another Conklin... We gave the guy a chance.


I'm hoping this is as true in his mind as it is in ours. He did spend years upon years in our development system, finally got his shot and took advantage of it like a stud. This is pure speculation, but I have to imagine that he's happy to be in Detroit given his trajectory. As our "goalie of the future" for so many years in GR, I'm fairly certain he could've raised a big enough stink by age 25 to get traded had he really wanted to. Another year like this, and he'll be due a hefty raise, but, given the speculation above, I don't anticipate hotly contested negotiations. I'm hoping he'll get the lowish end of his market value and not dicker...which will still be a heck of a lot more than Ozzy has made recently, but likely worth it if he avoids the sophomore slump.
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#24 Icesurfer

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 03:12 AM

Wings are going to have a few good goalies in the next few years!
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#25 mikl657

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 03:27 AM

also we have hudler coming off his khl contract the same time howard would need a contract too, should be interesting the next 2 years, I just hope we keep miller/eaves



#26 king_malice

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 04:02 AM

He will stay but Holland isnt going to low ball him either they both know about the Cap situation here in the D, plus im sure Howard has alot of friends on this team being here for so long already.

750k id offer him 6.5mill/3yrs 2.16mill a season or something. thats if they go short term with him. but you never know Kenny like throwing these long term deals out to.

how about a 7 year deal, lock him up until hes 33, which i wouldn't mind ive always liked Howard and even more now because of this season and i think he is only going to get better.

7yrs/24.5mill/3.5 per season

seems like alot from his 750k but im sure if he has this type of season next year alot of teams would be willing to offer even more. With or goalie struggles lately it seems we have found a answer in Howie

this is if he is a RFA not sure if he is or isnt

Edited by king_malice, 29 March 2010 - 04:04 AM.


#27 Drake_Marcus

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 04:59 AM

He will stay but Holland isnt going to low ball him either they both know about the Cap situation here in the D, plus im sure Howard has alot of friends on this team being here for so long already.

750k id offer him 6.5mill/3yrs 2.16mill a season or something. thats if they go short term with him. but you never know Kenny like throwing these long term deals out to.

how about a 7 year deal, lock him up until hes 33, which i wouldn't mind ive always liked Howard and even more now because of this season and i think he is only going to get better.

7yrs/24.5mill/3.5 per season

seems like alot from his 750k but im sure if he has this type of season next year alot of teams would be willing to offer even more. With or goalie struggles lately it seems we have found a answer in Howie

this is if he is a RFA not sure if he is or isnt


7 years is a very, very, very long time to lock any goalie up. It's even more dangerous if the goalie has only two years of NHL work to base your decision on. At 3.5 million it'd be impossible to move him unless he was putting up true #1 goalie numbers. If you're going to commit to a goalie for that long of a term with such a small body of evidence you better get a better deal than that or have some very confident talent analysis done.

I like your short-term deal better based on where Howie is now. If he plays like he is now for the next year I'd be far more confident paying him more and/or giving a longer term.
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#28 Finnish Wing

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 08:19 AM

I hope he respects the fact that the staff believed in him and gave him this chance to be what he is right now. Who wouldn't wanna play here for a small discount?

edit: AND yes, I wouldn't probably lock him up long-term, unless he puts up the same numbers next season. Howard wasn't a top prospect like Rask and Mason. I think we'll have to see if he's just overachieving this season.

Edited by Finnish Wing, 29 March 2010 - 08:22 AM.

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#29 13dangledangle

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 08:32 AM

Agreed. But that's why I'm glad of three things about this situation:

1. Howard isn't up for until next summer-- he'll have to do just as well next year.
2. Howard will be an RFA (I believe)
3. Ken Holland is the best GM in the NHL.


...just in case you wanted a fourth

4. Thomas McCollum & Daniel Larsson-Our *worst case scenario.




(Just want to point out I want Howard here as per Im getting his jersey :yowza: )

Edited by 13dangledangle, 29 March 2010 - 08:33 AM.

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#30 JPT

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 08:37 AM

Any discussions about a long term deal are premature at this point. As others have said lets see what he does in the playoffs and then again next season. If towards the end of next season he's proven himself to be a starting goalie going forward then maybe a 3-4 yr deal for around 3 mil a season sounds reasonable.

#31 Drake_Marcus

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 10:56 AM

...just in case you wanted a fourth

4. Thomas McCollum & Daniel Larsson-Our *worst case scenario.




(Just want to point out I want Howard here as per Im getting his jersey :yowza: )


I'm leaning towards a Howie jersey too. I always wait until the next contract, though, just to be sure. That's how I managed to avoid having a useless Hudler jersey in my closet. :blush:
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#32 Zata fan 40

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 11:20 AM

I'd be interested in that useless Hudler. :)
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#33 13dangledangle

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 11:27 AM

I'm leaning towards a Howie jersey too. I always wait until the next contract, though, just to be sure. That's how I managed to avoid having a useless Hudler jersey in my closet. :blush:


I hear that, especially the way he left, it's similar to sporting a Fedorov Jersey. :ranting: lol
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#34 mmamolo

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 11:36 AM

Let's assume Howard keeps up his play through this year's playoffs and throughout next season and the 2010-11 playoffs. Personally I'd imagine he'd get the same treatment as the other young players that established themselves as part of the young core of the Wings moving forward (Kronwall, Filppula etc) and would get a similar contract. They got 5 year deals with their pay increasing over those years to reduce their cap hit. I'm not saying Howard would necessarily get 5 years because as ppl have mentioned goaltenders are a little riskier in terms of term of contract but I think he'd be treated similarly. I could see a 3-5 year deal in the $2.5-3M/yr range. Which, in my opinion, based on experience and performance would be fair.

It's true that his numbers are extremely good and that if they continued to be that solid through 2010-11 that some could argue that would be enough to establish himself as a legit potential long term #1 guy in my mind I think that earns you the trust and faith of a 3-5 contract as I outlined above. Personally I dont think that earns you a $5M/yr contract.

Also, after the 2010-11 season Osgood's contract is up and you'd imagine that either he'd retire or he'd be our full blown back up and would be paid accordingly (say 750k). Draper's deal would be up and he'd almost for sure retire as well or see a pay decrease (from his $1.583M/yr deal). So even if Draper resigned for say 750k suddenly you have an additional $1.5M to go towards Howard's new deal, plus the 715k coming off the original Howard deal for a total of $2.215M. If Howard were to get a deal with a $3M cap hit you only need an additional 785k to make that happen.

I think they'll absolutely make the room. After all the time and energy they put into this kid there is no way they let him walk if his play continues at this pace - let alone if he continues to grow and mature over the course of the next year +. Howard was, and still is, looked on as the goalie of the future. Ideally he has, or will, join the young core of players we'll watch for years to come on this Red Wings team.
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#35 Yzerfan1999

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 11:47 AM

Let's assume Howard keeps up his play through this year's playoffs and throughout next season and the 2010-11 playoffs. Personally I'd imagine he'd get the same treatment as the other young players that established themselves as part of the young core of the Wings moving forward (Kronwall, Filppula etc) and would get a similar contract. They got 5 year deals with their pay increasing over those years to reduce their cap hit. I'm not saying Howard would necessarily get 5 years because as ppl have mentioned goaltenders are a little riskier in terms of term of contract but I think he'd be treated similarly. I could see a 3-5 year deal in the $2.5-3M/yr range. Which, in my opinion, based on experience and performance would be fair.

It's true that his numbers are extremely good and that if they continued to be that solid through 2010-11 that some could argue that would be enough to establish himself as a legit potential long term #1 guy in my mind I think that earns you the trust and faith of a 3-5 contract as I outlined above. Personally I dont think that earns you a $5M/yr contract.

Also, after the 2010-11 season Osgood's contract is up and you'd imagine that either he'd retire or he'd be our full blown back up and would be paid accordingly (say 750k). Draper's deal would be up and he'd almost for sure retire as well or see a pay decrease (from his $1.583M/yr deal). So even if Draper resigned for say 750k suddenly you have an additional $1.5M to go towards Howard's new deal, plus the 715k coming off the original Howard deal for a total of $2.215M. If Howard were to get a deal with a $3M cap hit you only need an additional 785k to make that happen.

I think they'll absolutely make the room. After all the time and energy they put into this kid there is no way they let him walk if his play continues at this pace - let alone if he continues to grow and mature over the course of the next year +. Howard was, and still is, looked on as the goalie of the future. Ideally he has, or will, join the young core of players we'll watch for years to come on this Red Wings team.



THIS.

Draper's contract coming to an end, and Lidstrom most likely only resigning for 1 year beyond this one, the Wings will have some cap space to work with Howard. My guess is he gets a 4-5 year contract averaging 3-3.5 per season.
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#36 mikl657

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 12:27 PM

I hear that, especially the way he left, it's similar to sporting a Fedorov Jersey. Posted Image lol




for some reason I think the whole hudler leaving thing was planned, its when the league dragged it out that messed holland up

#37 RedWingsRox

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 01:04 PM

When it comes to playoffs experience for Howie, realistically what kind of performance would you be happy with? Afterall, he is a rookie. Personally, if we go deep into round 2, I think he'd learn a lot. If we go into Conference Final, then I think he would get some really good playoff experience.

#38 funguy21

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 02:19 PM

Yeah I disagree I really highly doubt that Howard going to take a discount if he continues to play like he is now deep into the playoffs and next year. Yeah they got lucky with Howard this year but I highly doubt they anticipated the result they got. Really he been with the team for 5 years he played a few games here and there when injuries came up in those years. Last year they decided to go and get a back up rather then take a chance on Howard. This year was a transition year and that is the only reason Howard was playing and they didn't even expect him to do anything maybe win 25 games like Conklin did last year. This year the wings had no choice but to bring him up or lose him. If the Wings had more money and could have brought in another back up they would have easily let Howard go to via waiver or free agency or how ever he would have been lost. If you look at it from the Red Wings perspective last off season. They had Osgood who just brought the team to game 7 after winning the cup a year before and Jimmy Howard who has consistently under achieved in his 5 years in the griffins. Knowing that Osgood has weak season and strong playoff if they had more cap space in off season they would have kept Conklin or found someone else to back up Osgood who was not Howard. Howard would have been picked up by some other team and played back up to some superstar goalie or put on waiver and play a few more years for an AHL team. Howard got lucky with the cap and being able to play in the NHL. That was the only break he needed cause he stole the show and now he is firmly in the starter position. If he plays like this next year he has all the power on his side to get whatever he wants out of the Wings. Hockey is after all only a business and well business is good for Howard. He knows as well as anybody else that he could have as easily been playing somewhere else this season. This season wasn't we are finally going to see what our goalie of the future can do it was more like last chance Howard. So considering he was an after thought for 5 season placed as back up just cause we couldn't afford any one else and his entry contract was up and we could sign him for cheap. Also consider the number he has put up this year saving our asses for the good part of the season and he is Calder cup nominee that not even including his potential in the play offs and next season. Howard has the wings by the short and curlies and frankly if continues to play this well he will deserve a significant increase in pay. Which Detroit will happily pay especially if he has two strong season. He will not get a long contract 2 maybe 3 years makes. To risky to go long with a goalie some where down the road on or the other or both our going to be disappointed with there deal. Goalies tend to go up and down thats why there contract should be short term.

#39 Grim

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 03:16 PM

having an overachieving goalie is supposed to be a blessing! lets see how he does this postseason first, before drawing conclusions. Believe it or not, Kenny would certainly have been looking for an upgrade in goalie this summer (Turco? Biron?)... better to spend that money in-house if Howie is indeed ready to take that role.

#40 paulwoodsfan

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Posted 29 March 2010 - 03:34 PM

Holland stated pretty forcefully last season that he is no longer in favour of tying up a lot of money on goalies. That was a pretty big change from what things were like with Hasek and Joseph, but that was before the cap came in. I love Howard but I can't see paying him more than $2-3M/year, especially with Larsson and McCollum in the wings.





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