151 replies to this topic

[Crymson]

There are certain things one doesn't forget about goaltending.

1) How to make routine saves. This is done in practice all the time.
2) How to play odd man rushes correctly. Do NOT commit immediately to the first player and go several feet out of the net. This is a common sense matter for a goaltender.
3) How to track the puck and the play so that one can move and challenge where necessary. Once again, this is common sense.

I've just gone over the issues with Ozzie's first three goals against. None concerned being rusty. He just played well below par.

Edited by Crymson, 04 April 2010 - 03:46 PM.

[haroldsnepsts]

He started awful, but I thought he got better as the game wore on. and this season normally when Ozzy has started poorly, it was all downhill from there. Hopefully if they play him again before the playoffs (unlikely, but still) he'll pick up where he left off.

As much as many would like to see him fail and go away, he's already signed through next year, so it'd be better if he can get it together to be a consistent backup for Jimmy next season.

[GoWings1905]

We very well may have.

This team for some reason plays really well for Howard. If they don't he tends to bail them out more often then not. Last week we gave up a ton of odd man rushes and still won. That 4 on 2 was brutally played by Ozzie and lacking fundamentals because you haven't played in a game is no excuse when you practice everyday. He seemed to get better through out the game so I'll give him that.

While that has been true in many cases this season, it wasn't this past week at all. The offense bailed out the defense and Jimmy against Edmonton and Nashville to an extent.

I could see this result with Ozzie starting coming the day Babcock announced it. Two months is far too long between starts for any goalie. Ozzie isn't going to work off the rust if we need him in the playoffs at this point making one or maybe two lousy starts. It's a no-win scenario for Ozzie and the team right now. Babcock made the decision and it's all or nothing with Jimmy now.

[zettie85]

I don't remember where I saw it but I think he will play at least 1 more game out of our 3 remaining.

[GoWings1905]

I don't remember where I saw it but I think he will play at least 1 more game out of our 3 remaining.

That's correct. I just don't see what point it serves with playoff positioning at stake.

[Dynheart]

There are certain things one doesn't forget about goaltending.

1) Make routine saves. This is done in practice all the time.
2) Play odd man rushes correctly. Do NOT commit immediately to the first player and go several feet out of the net. This is a common sense matter for a goaltender.
3) Track the puck and the play so that you can move and challenge where necessary. Once again, this is common sense.

I've just gone over the issues with Ozzie's first three goals against. None concerned being rusty. He just played well below par.

Do you factor in nerves with this equation? I mean he is human, he is aloud to have nerves, right? Can you even do something that is routine, but accidently mess up? I really don't think people consider the mental game when it comes to sports. Sure you can do that in practice, I mean you are in the comfort of you friends/team mates. No pressure. Get thrown into a game where you haven't played in 3 months...you start to get nervous. Then you start to doubt your judgement...from there your confidence starts to wane. It's all one big train wreck. This just doesn't apply to hockey, but with all sports...hell it could even be with things such as making a simple analysis on a certain engine or car part...meh

Edited by Dynheart, 04 April 2010 - 03:55 PM.

[haroldsnepsts]

There are certain things one doesn't forget about goaltending.

1) How to make routine saves. This is done in practice all the time.
2) How to play odd man rushes correctly. Do NOT commit immediately to the first player and go several feet out of the net. This is a common sense matter for a goaltender.
3) How to track the puck and the play so that one can move and challenge where necessary. Once again, this is common sense.

I've just gone over the issues with Ozzie's first three goals against. None concerned being rusty. He just played well below par.

It's always been funny how your overly-optimistic view of the Wings doesn't include Osgood.

Nothing approaches game conditions. Ozzy was rusty. He started awful, but got better, and made a few big saves in the third.

Osgood played the shot on the 4 on 2, which is what he's supposed to do. Why no comments about Bert's bad decision, Kronwall's awful job playing the pass, and Ericsson trying to cover two Flyers at once and ended up covering neither? Or Lebda deciding to help out Stuart by having them both cover the same man, leaving the entire left side of the ice open?

The Wings played below par, including Osgood. But I was surprised at how good he looked in the third. That was about the best to be hoped for after the awful start.

[zettie85]

It's always been funny how your overly-optimistic view of the Wings doesn't include Osgood.

Nothing approaches game conditions. Ozzy was rusty. He started awful, but got better, and made a few big saves in the third.

Osgood played the shot on the 4 on 2, which is what he's supposed to do. Why no comments about Bert's bad decision, Kronwall's awful job playing the pass, and Ericsson trying to cover two Flyers at once and ended up covering neither? Or Lebda deciding to help out Stuart by having them both cover the same man, leaving the entire left side of the ice open?

The Wings played below par, including Osgood. But I was surprised at how good he looked in the third. That was about the best to be hoped for after the awful start.

No. With one defender you play the shot.

With 2 defenders one plays the shooter to the outside. The other takes away the far post attempts to the outside. Ozzie shouldn't cheat but plays the square on player in the middle. The pass is inevitable and Ozzie should be square to him. It should be a quick shot or a backchecker gets him. Middle guy can't try and deke because there are 2 defenders to the outside and he also can't make a return pass.

Ozzie playing the shooter 2 feet out of the paint, while the defencman is on him is not smart. Ya Bert got caught but whenever you have 2 defenders back it's not that dangerous of a situation unless you let them control it.

Edited by zettie85, 04 April 2010 - 04:04 PM.

[haroldsnepsts]

No. With one defender you play the shot.

With 2 defenders one plays the shooter to the outside. The other takes away the far post attempts to the outside. Ozzie shouldn't cheat but plays the square on player in the middle. The pass is inevitable and Ozzie should be square to him. It should be a quick shot or a backchecker gets him. Middle guy can't try and deke because there are 2 defenders to the outside and he also can't make a return pass.

Ozzie playing the shooter 2 feet out of the paint, while the defencman is on him is not smart. Ya Bert got caught but whenever you have 2 defenders back it's not that dangerous of a situation unless you let them control it.

That makes no sense. If Ozzy plays square on the player in the middle, he is cheating and leaving the net open for the puck carrier. He has to respect the shot but be ready for the pass.

Osgood was too aggressive on the shot, but Kronwall and Ericsson also misplayed it badly. Then there's also the point that it was a friggin 4 on 2.

[zettie85]

That makes no sense. If Ozzy plays square on the player in the middle, he is cheating and leaving the net open for the puck carrier. He has to respect the shot but be ready for the pass.

Osgood was too aggressive on the shot, but Kronwall and Ericsson also misplayed it badly. Then there's also the point that it was a friggin 4 on 2.

This is what I mean. He does have to respect the shot but the shot was basically taken away. Lappy is not really a shooter either. Take that in to consideration. 90% of the time that pass is coming. Percentages increase when the shot is taken away.

If you take Timmonen, Lappy can walk in and cut across the face of the goal. Timmonen was the trailer. He is the best chance that Philly has to score if Ozzie plays the shot. He is also the best chance e have to see a save if Ozzie plays the pass to a shooter who is coming in square with no where else to go.

[haroldsnepsts]

This is what I mean. He does have to respect the shot but the shot was basically taken away. Lappy is not really a shooter either. Take that in to consideration. 90% of the time that pass is coming. Percentages increase when the shot is taken away.

If you take Timmonen, Lappy can walk in and cut across the face of the goal. Timmonen was the trailer. He is the best chance that Philly has to score if Ozzie plays the shot. He is also the best chance e have to see a save if Ozzie plays the pass to a shooter who is coming in square with no where else to go.

ok. I see what you're saying now.

Yeah, I'd say Ozzy was overly aggressive on the shot. Not sure it would've mattered, but at least there would've been less of a gaping net for the goal.

Like I said, there's some silver lining to me in that he recovered and made some big saves in the third. That's the first time I've seen that from him this season when he started that poorly. And the Wings need him to be stable as a backup for Howard, come playoff time and probably next season.

[Doc Holliday]

No. With one defender you play the shot.

With 2 defenders one plays the shooter to the outside. The other takes away the far post attempts to the outside. Ozzie shouldn't cheat but plays the square on player in the middle. The pass is inevitable and Ozzie should be square to him. It should be a quick shot or a backchecker gets him. Middle guy can't try and deke because there are 2 defenders to the outside and he also can't make a return pass.

Ozzie playing the shooter 2 feet out of the paint, while the defencman is on him is not smart. Ya Bert got caught but whenever you have 2 defenders back it's not that dangerous of a situation unless you let them control it.

Why would Osgood play the shot on a 2 on 1 when there is a good amount of space to make the pass and not on a 4 on 2 where there is less space to make passes?

[zettie85]

Why would Osgood play the shot on a 2 on 1 when there is a good amount of space to make the pass and not on a 4 on 2 where there is less space to make passes?

2 on 1 the goalie plays the shooter but the player tries to take away the pass. He doesn't give up on the shooter and play strictly the pass. If he did that it basically turns in to a break away. As a defenceman you never give up on the shooter but you play to take away the pass and be in position to clear the rebound if need be.

That specific 4 on 2 today turned in to a weird type of 2 on 1. They eliminated the back post players from getting the pass and the shooter was forced to the outside. Last resort for philly is hoping the trailer isn't covered and that Ozzie plays the shot. That is exactly what happened. Bert is to blame too. Don't get me wrong but Ozzie should not have been playing the shot in that situation when basically the opportunity for the shot was not even there.

[Crymson]

It's always been funny how your overly-optimistic view of the Wings

Hahaha. That one statement speaks volumes about you.

[cupforwings]

the only bad goal he let in was the first one. A 4 on 2 is unacceptable and the goalie is not at fault... He played the the shooter, but the shooter had 3 passing options and picked the right one... it is completely unreasonable to blame him for that goal. The second and third goal were left to players all alone in the slot... neither of those were his fault. Blaming Ozzy for this loss is unfair... the team played bad and it cost them.

[Doc Holliday]

Hahaha. That one statement speaks volumes about you.

That's right. Instead of argue the post, go after the poster.

That brings an intellectual, civil discussion to the table.

[RockyMountainWingGal]

He started awful, but I thought he got better as the game wore on. and this season normally when Ozzy has started poorly, it was all downhill from there. Hopefully if they play him again before the playoffs (unlikely, but still) he'll pick up where he left off.

As much as many would like to see him fail and go away, he's already signed through next year, so it'd be better if he can get it together to be a consistent backup for Jimmy next season.

Good post - the first goal was awful and set the tone but he did improve deeper into the game.

Don't know why anyone would want a player wearing Red and the Winged wheel to fail - but Oz doesn't instill in me much confidence that he can come in and get the job done in a pinch if needed.

He is our B/U goaltender now so I do expect him to be able to step in at any time and pick up where Howard left off....don't care about rust or not - that's his job now and I hope he is able to do it.

Edited by RockyMountainWingGal, 04 April 2010 - 07:15 PM.

[Yzerman191]

I hope Osgood gets another start this season. He's obviously rusty, and I think with a little more experience (just like in the game today) his game will improve. Leaving him completely rusty essentially puts all your eggs in one basket, completely relying on Howard not to falter (which is entirely possible). I'm not sure it really matters where we end up in the standings anyways; there doesn't seem to be a clear-cut best team to play IMO.

[Paul MacLean's Mustache]

I hope Osgood gets another start this season. He's obviously rusty, and I think with a little more experience (just like in the game today) his game will improve. Leaving him completely rusty essentially puts all your eggs in one basket, completely relying on Howard not to falter (which is entirely possible). I'm not sure it really matters where we end up in the standings anyways; there doesn't seem to be a clear-cut best team to play IMO.

Ozzie's easily the scapegoat today and to some degree it's warranted. What I'm worried about are the defensive lapses in our own zone. We saw it today on the Asham goal and yesterday in the Preds game. Ericsson looked AWFUL today. I'd rather see a Lilja-Ledba line these days.

[Drake_Marcus]

Ozzie's easily the scapegoat today and to some degree it's warranted. What I'm worried about are the defensive lapses in our own zone. We saw it today on the Asham goal and yesterday in the Preds game. Ericsson looked AWFUL today. I'd rather see a Lilja-Ledba line these days.

How so? I watched the whole thing and didn't notice E looking terrible. He wasn't good on the goal-against he was on for but he looked good on the two goals-for he was on for.

He had one turnover but that was negated by the fact that he also had a takeaway. He was a +1 and had 2 hits. He also had a blocked shot. He played on the PK and wasn't on for a PP goal against.

Was he positionally perfect? No, he looked like a rookie at times. But Lebda was TERRIBLE. Stuart looked bad on the goal he was out with Lebda for. How can Ericsson look good when his partner was a s*** show?

Honestly, I just didn't have a problem with E today. He definitely bounced back after misplaying the pass on that goal. What else did you expect in a game where the forwards played horrible defense and the Wings were constantly back on their heels?

EDIT:

Also, why would you say you'd rather see a Lilja-Lebda line over Lilja-Ericsson when Lebda was the worst d-man on the ice today? The Lilja-E pairing has been great so far.

2 on 1 the goalie plays the shooter but the player tries to take away the pass. He doesn't give up on the shooter and play strictly the pass. If he did that it basically turns in to a break away. As a defenceman you never give up on the shooter but you play to take away the pass and be in position to clear the rebound if need be.

That specific 4 on 2 today turned in to a weird type of 2 on 1. They eliminated the back post players from getting the pass and the shooter was forced to the outside. Last resort for philly is hoping the trailer isn't covered and that Ozzie plays the shot. That is exactly what happened. Bert is to blame too. Don't get me wrong but Ozzie should not have been playing the shot in that situation when basically the opportunity for the shot was not even there.

Was he ever! Bert saw both his line-mates almost behind the Philly net and he still doesn't drop back until it's too late. Even then he did about the most half-assed back check in the history of hockey.

Edited by Drake_Marcus, 04 April 2010 - 08:43 PM.