291 replies to this topic

[eva unit zero]

Wasn't the much anticipated Igor Grigorenko pretty much gassed most of the training camp, and by no means ready for the NHL?

I have a hard time believing Jagr.

Tell ya what, go through a life threatening car accident where both of your legs are basically shattered, heal up to the point where you can actually play hockey again (after being given a 10% chance of LIVING) and see how well conditioned you are two or three years later compared to just before the accident.

[clutchngrab]

Igor is 26 and was 3rd in goals with 22 behind Radulov and Thoreson for the KHL team Ufa Salavat Yulayev. 4th overall in points. Here's to his recovery. Anyone have his NHL rights?

[titanium2]

Pav and Z should absolutely start next season on the same line; at least 15-20 games or until they go cold.

Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Holmstrom
Hudler-Filppula-Franzen
Cleary-Abdelkader-Eaves
Ritola-Helm-Miller
Draper-Maltby

But bearing in mind Babs' strange stubborn obsession with keeping the Euro Twins apart I would hope to see something like this:

Holmstrom-Datsyuk-Franzen
Cleary-Zetterberg-Filppula
Hudler-Helm-Eaves
Ritola-Abdelkader-Miller
Draper-Maltby

-The Datsyuk-Franzen pairing is a proven regular season hit.
-The Zetterberg-Filppula pairing is good as we all know
-Hudler worked well with Helm in the past; not so much with Z or Pav
-Ritola and Abdelkader are like best friends off the ice and it shows on the ice. These guys loved playing together and setting each other up for points in GR.

[Crymson]

I don't want Hudler back. He has proven over the last nine months---with his nonsense during the summer and his affairs with prostitutes---that he's being less mature rather than the opposite.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros]

I don't want Hudler back. He has proven over the last nine months---with his nonsense during the summer and his affairs with prostitutes---that he's being less mature rather than the opposite.

[SouthernWingsFan]

Hookers are so misunderstood.

Hudler in, Willie out. Whats to discuss? Other than trading someone for a legit top 4 defenceman?

Bingo on the bolded.

Hudler isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread, and at the time with him and Samuelsson and Hossa leaving, the signing of Williams was a decent one to hopefully fill some respectable percentage of the goal scoring void. I think now though for Williams with him being scratched, the writing is on the wall that he might not be re-signed. Never say never until it actually happens, but he hasn't done enough to impress overall I think.

Who knew back then we'd be missing Hudler and Samuelsson as much in terms of goal scoring?

I don't want Hudler back. He has proven over the last nine months---with his nonsense during the summer and his affairs with prostitutes---that he's being less mature rather than the opposite.

More often than not, I'm all about giving people second chances in life if they do their time, are willing to learn from their mistakes, whatever. And I'm talking about doing stuff much worse than this. Never forget, but you have to move on in life sometime. Hudler seems to have? Wings management seems to have, people around him who he works with probably have as well. Why can't you?

If this is deterrent if/when he returns to Detroit, it will be handled properly. Until then, quit being so proud and let's give him his chance if he returns to the Wings.

Edited by SouthernWingsFan, 20 April 2010 - 07:23 AM.

[Finnish Wing]

You really hate the guy don't you? There are like three people having this rebellion against Hudler coming back and you're one of them, with these comments that have no actual value to the discussion. "Hudler is selfish!" "Hudler paid for hooker!" "Hudler is not North American!"

Comments that have nothing to do with what he does on the ice. I think the only reason you hate him is because he isn't a big NA goon.

Edited by Finnish Wing, 20 April 2010 - 07:57 AM.

[F.Michael]

Tell ya what, go through a life threatening car accident where both of your legs are basically shattered, heal up to the point where you can actually play hockey again (after being given a 10% chance of LIVING) and see how well conditioned you are two or three years later compared to just before the accident.

Actually it was his left femur, and left tibia that was fractured, and not both legs...It was the fat embolism that formed from his fractures that the Russian MDs gave Grigorenko a 10% chance of survival; had he been here in the States I'm certain he would've gotten a much better prognosis, and it was 4 years from the time of his accident to the time he was in the Red Wings summer camp.

What I was trying to convey was the fact that Jagr is full of it when he claimed KHL players are/were in better shape due to more rigorous practices.

[micah]

You really hate the guy don't you? There are like three people having this rebellion against Hudler coming back and you're one of them, with these comments that have no actual value to the discussion. "Hudler is selfish!" "Hudler paid for hooker!" "Hudler is not North American!"

Comments that have nothing to do with what he does on the ice. I think the only reason you hate him is because he isn't a big NA goon.

1) Hudler is kinda selfish. He put his own wants ahead of the interest of the team he was with, the team I like.

2) It sounds like Huds did have a thing for hookers. Being that I know the kind of backgrounds most of these girls have, that's a pretty s***ty thing to do, even if they're asking for it. Prostitutes are human beings who are almost always in some sortof distress, and paying them to have sex with you is not how good men treat other human beings.

3) Who complained that he wasn't North American? I think you're making things up now.

You're right in that these things don't have anything to do with what he does on the ice - thankfully though, I'm not such a s***ty person that I only care about what my team's players are like on the ice. These are the Detroit Red Wings. I expect alot from the men who get a chance to play for them.

[Finnish Wing]

1) Hudler is kinda selfish. He put his own wants ahead of the interest of the team he was with, the team I like.

2) It sounds like Huds did have a thing for hookers. Being that I know the kind of backgrounds most of these girls have, that's a pretty s***ty thing to do, even if they're asking for it. Prostitutes are human beings who are almost always in some sortof distress, and paying them to have sex with you is not how good men treat other human beings.

3) Who complained that he wasn't North American? I think you're making things up now.

You're right in that these things don't have anything to do with what he does on the ice - thankfully though, I'm not such a s***ty person that I only care about what my team's players are like on the ice. These are the Detroit Red Wings. I expect alot from the men who get a chance to play for them.

I'm still waiting for some evidence of how Hudler is selfish. Because I think you're making thing up there. He does his job. He deserves to get paid for it. It was the same case with Sammy. I don't see him being selfish either.

About prostitutes. I believe the girls agree to do it themselves and get paid for it. I don't have a problem with that. Nice to see how you get all so sensitive considering you're the one who thinks players should be punished by punching them to face instead of suspensions.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros]

You really hate the guy don't you? There are like three people having this rebellion against Hudler coming back and you're one of them, with these comments that have no actual value to the discussion. "Hudler is selfish!" "Hudler paid for hooker!" "Hudler is not North American!"

Comments that have nothing to do with what he does on the ice. I think the only reason you hate him is because he isn't a big NA goon.

He wants to be the star of the team and he ******* about getting 3rd line minutes.He's nothing but a distraction.Sure he'll put up 50 points.That's great.But we've been through this with him before and he proves to be a distraction.I never said he paid for hookers.I said he is selfish because Moscow threw more money at him so he bolted out of here and now he wants to come back becuase he had a s*** year in the KHL.The loyalty isn't there.He's just like Fedorov,he loves the team and the organization and the city until you throw just a little more money at him to go somewhere else and he's gone.

1) Hudler is kinda selfish. He put his own wants ahead of the interest of the team he was with, the team I like.

2) It sounds like Huds did have a thing for hookers. Being that I know the kind of backgrounds most of these girls have, that's a pretty s***ty thing to do, even if they're asking for it. Prostitutes are human beings who are almost always in some sortof distress, and paying them to have sex with you is not how good men treat other human beings.

3) Who complained that he wasn't North American? I think you're making things up now.

You're right in that these things don't have anything to do with what he does on the ice - thankfully though, I'm not such a s***ty person that I only care about what my team's players are like on the ice. These are the Detroit Red Wings. I expect alot from the men who get a chance to play for them.

Thank you.good to know some there are a few people who aren't total disps***s in here.

[Finnish Wing]

He wants to be the star of the team and he ******* about getting 3rd line minutes.He's nothing but a distraction.Sure he'll put up 50 points.That's great.But we've been through this with him before and he proves to be a distraction.I never said he paid for hookers.I said he is selfish because Moscow threw more money at him so he bolted out of here and now he wants to come back becuase he had a s*** year in the KHL.The loyalty isn't there.He's just like Fedorov,he loves the team and the organization and the city until you throw just a little more money at him to go somewhere else and he's gone.

Where did he exactly said anything of wanting to be the "star of the team"? Who wouldn't WANT to play top line minutes. Better yet, if you know that you're an offensive player, don't you think it would help the team if you'd playing in an offensive role? I haven't seen him bitching about anything. Some evidence would be nice.

Nothing, but a distraction? OK. Why?

Put up 50 points? I think 57 points is rather 60 than 50 points. And he did that playing in the 3rd line.

Selfish? Again, is it selfish for getting the money you deserve? He's worth much more than 1.5m. Red Wings would be selfish if they wouldn't offer him more.

He is coming back because his contract ends, because the two teams are merging there. He is coming back because this organisation wants him. And as I said, I bet every team in the KHL would want him.

So you're dissing Fedorov now? Maybe because he isn't North American either? Again, the players do this for living. They deserve to be paid for it. And I think Fedorov has the right to end his career playing in his home country.

Edited by Finnish Wing, 20 April 2010 - 08:40 AM.

[sibiriak]

Actually it was his left femur, and left tibia that was fractured, and not both legs...It was the fat embolism that formed from his fractures that the Russian MDs gave Grigorenko a 10% chance of survival; had he been here in the States I'm certain he would've gotten a much better prognosis, and it was 4 years from the time of his accident to the time he was in the Red Wings summer camp.

What I was trying to convey was the fact that Jagr is full of it when he claimed KHL players are/were in better shape due to more rigorous practices.

Jagr was saying what he said mostly because there's a difference between Russia and the NHL in how the training process is structured. The KHL players are used to long pre-season training camp, which is designed to get them into game shape.
Also, they do much more actual physical training during the season (as opposite to NHL practices, that are more skill/tactics oriented). And their season is shorter. So they are probably fitter/less exausted in March than their NHL counterparts.
NHL players nowadays are expected to arrive for training camp already in/close to game shape. And they don't do as much weight/endurance training as the Russians during the season.
So when Grigorenko arrived to Detroit, he most likely expected to get in shape during the camp. He didn't expect everyone else to already be in shape, and so he couldn't keep up. I believe this was at least a part of the reason for his failure.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros]

Where did he exactly said anything of wanting to be the "star of the team"? Who wouldn't WANT to play top line minutes. Better yet, if you know that you're an offensive player, don't you think it would help the team if you'd playing in an offensive role? I haven't seen him bitching about anything. Some evidence would be nice.

Nothing, but a distraction? OK. Why?

Put up 50 points? I think 57 points is rather 60 than 50 points. And he did that playing in the 3rd line.

Selfish? Again, is it selfish for getting the money you deserve? He's worth much more than 1.5m. Red Wings would be selfish if they wouldn't offer him more.

He is coming back because his contract ends, because the two teams are merging there. He is coming back because this organisation wants him. And as I said, I bet every team in the KHL would want him.

So you're dissing Fedorov now? Maybe because he isn't North American either? Again, the players do this for living. They deserve to be paid for it. And I think Fedorov has the right to end his career playing in his home country.

Want evidence?Where does Mikael Samuelsson play now?huh?If it wasn't for Hudler taking us to arbitration and waiting out the whole thing,only to go to Russia,we would've re-signed Samuelsson.Samuelsson is worth a hell of a lot more than Hudler.I support Sammy and he isn't even North American.imagine that. As for Fedorov,he was a good player and all,but the loyalty thing is a factor here.Just another guy that bolts because he's washed up and can't hack it in the NHL.

[Finnish Wing]

Want evidence?Where does Mikael Samuelsson play now?huh?If it wasn't for Hudler taking us to arbitration and waiting out the whole thing,only to go to Russia,we would've re-signed Samuelsson.Samuelsson is worth a hell of a lot more than Hudler.I support Sammy and he isn't even North American.imagine that. As for Fedorov,he was a good player and all,but the loyalty thing is a factor here.Just another guy that bolts because he's washed up and can't hack it in the NHL.

Obviously you don't have anything to prove your other arguments then, as you only commented on that one...

If it wasn't for Red Wings GM wanting to have everything. It's like Sammy said, Red wings made the choice. They didn't offer Hudler what he deserved. Maybe they should've decided that they're gonna take either Hudler or Sammy and offer them the money they deserve rather than trying to get the best deal and end up losing both.

It was clearly a stupid mistake by the Red Wings. But of course the average fan always hates the player for something like that because they want their team to be the best.

edit: And Fedorov would still be a very useful player in many NHL teams. But as I said, doesn't player have the right to play in his home country. Does every player have to somehow respect the Oh So Great North America and NHL more than their home leagues? You obviously see other leagues and other players as some kinda aliens trying to ruin your perfect homeland. xD

Edited by Finnish Wing, 20 April 2010 - 09:00 AM.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros]

Obviously you don't have anything to prove your other arguments then, as you only commented on that one...

If it wasn't for Red Wings GM wanting to have everything. It's like Sammy said, Red wings made the choice. They didn't offer Hudler what he deserved. Maybe they should've decided that they're gonna take either Hudler or Sammy and offer them the money they deserve rather than trying to get the best deal and end up losing both.

It was clearly a stupid mistake by the Red Wings. But of course the average fan always hates the player for something like that because they want their team to be the best.

I think Kenny was doing his job by trying to work out both of their contracts.GMs are sort of supposed to do that.But since Hudler was so SELFISH he bolted.If he really liked playing here,he would've taken a paycut to keep Sammy here.If he really liked playing here,he would've taken a paycut like Lidstrom does basically every year so Kenny can re-sign guys and keep this thing going so we can stay in contention.

[Finnish Wing]

I think Kenny was doing his job by trying to work out both of their contracts.GMs are sort of supposed to do that.But since Hudler was so SELFISH he bolted.If he really liked playing here,he would've taken a paycut to keep Sammy here.If he really liked playing here,he would've taken a paycut like Lidstrom does basically every year so Kenny can re-sign guys and keep this thing going so we can stay in contention.

Selfish? He had played on a 3rd line here and he was better than that. Everyone knows it. You don't take paycuts if you haven't even been in the organization that long and you're a semi-young player still getting better. With that logic every player here are selfish because they don't take the league minimum to get other good players here. Obviously Red Wings gambled as they didn't show any concrete signs of really wanting to have Hudler here. I think no player who still have a lot of years left want to be in that kinda unsure situation.

Lidstrom has been here for many years. It's totally different thing for veterans like Selanne too.

Again your argument is completely stupid and you're just trying to make things up to make Hudler look bad. Blaming a young player for not taking a paycut... What a load of crap.

edit: The only SELFISH guy here was the Red Wings who wanted it all but eventually got nothing.

Edited by Finnish Wing, 20 April 2010 - 09:08 AM.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros]

Selfish? He had played on a 3rd line here and he was better than that. Everyone knows it. You don't take paycuts if you haven't even been in the organization that long and you're a semi-young player still getting better. With that logic every player here are selfish because they don't take the league minimum to get other good players here. Obviously Red Wings gambled as they didn't show any concrete signs of really wanting to have Hudler here. I think no player who still have a lot of years left want to be in that kinda unsure situation.

Lidstrom has been here for many years. It's totally different thing for veterans like Selanne too.

Again your argument is completely stupid and you're just trying to make things up to make Hudler look bad. Blaming a young player for not taking a paycut... What a load of crap.

edit: The only SELFISH guy here was the Red Wings who wanted it all but eventually got nothing.

You do if you truly want the team to win.I'm not saying everyone should take league minimum,now am i?How am i making up things?Hudler bolted for Russia because he was offered more money.did he not?

[Finnish Wing]

You do if you truly want the team to win.I'm not saying everyone should take league minimum,now am i?How am i making up things?Hudler bolted for Russia because he was offered more money.did he not?

Truly want the team to win? Why would you choose a team that hasn't even shown any real interest and risk your own career (=your job, your future in life) while you're still a young player. Red Wings didn't offer Hudler the money that he deserves, don't you get it? If you don't even know if that team wants you, how stupid you are if you take a paycut? With that logic every player here is selfish.

Kinda easier for Lidstrom or Selanne to take paycuts because they've already got enough money to never do any work ever again and still live luxuriously.

He went to Russia because Red Wings didn't show that they really wanted him because they were not willing to offer the money to show it (=because they wanted it all for less money). He actually honored Red Wings by not going to any other NHL team.

Edited by Finnish Wing, 20 April 2010 - 09:20 AM.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros]

Truly want the team to win? Why would you choose a team that hasn't even shown any real interest and risk your own career (=your job, your future in life) while you're still a young player. Red Wings didn't offer Hudler the money that he deserves, don't you get it? If you don't even know if that team wants you, how stupid you are if you take a paycut? With that logic every player here is selfish.

Kinda easier for Lidstrom or Selanne to take paycuts because they've already got enough money to never do any work ever again and still live luxuriously.

He went to Russia because Red Wings didn't show that they really wanted him because they were not willing to offer the money to show it (=because they wanted it all for less money). He actually honored Red Wings by not going to any other NHL team.

He didn't honor the Red Wings by not going to another NHL team.He was offered the most by Moscow and bolted.His decision to leave Detroit was purely about money.