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Jiri Hudler, the answer to all of our prayers


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#41 EZBAKETHAGANGSTA

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 02:44 AM

Does anyone know if the "poison pill" loophole is prohibbited in the NHL CBA? I know this loophole has been exploited in the NFL a few times...

For those of you that dont know what this is, it applies to restricted free agents. Here is an example...

Detroit Signs Nicklas Backstrom to an offer sheet... say 10 years, 60 million. Under normal circumstances Washington would match this offer in seconds. However, part of the contract negotiated with the Wings would award a bonus of $40 million to Backstrom if he plays 30 games in the Verizon Center, making it next to impossible for the Caps to match...


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#42 DatsyukianDeke13

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 02:49 AM

If Kenny Holland could get Backstrom without giving anything up, I think it would be appropriate to erect a 50 foot statue of him outside of the Joe....the people mover would be in the way though....
Mixed feelings about this
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#43 wingsownnhl43

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 02:53 AM

If Kenny Holland could get Backstrom without giving anything up, I think it would be appropriate to erect a 50 foot statue of him outside of the Joe....the people mover would be in the way though....

Well, Washington would be awarded a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick. But thats a small price considering Backstroms a 22 year old forward that has already scored 100 points in this league. I Just wonder if the posion pill loophole is prohibbited, or if anyone in the wings brass would even think of doing it.

#44 EZBAKETHAGANGSTA

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 03:00 AM

Well, Washington would be awarded a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick. But thats a small price considering Backstroms a 22 year old forward that has already scored 100 points in this league. I Just wonder if the posion pill loophole is prohibbited, or if anyone in the wings brass would even think of doing it.


I'm not sure if the legality status of a move like that when it comes to the NHL, but my good friend actually lives a few houses down to Ken Holland in Northville. Maybe I'll drop a little suggestion in his mailbox or something.

I just looked up some examples of this in the NFL, and was honestly astonished at the hilariousness of it.

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In professional sports, a poison pill is a component of a contract, which one team offers a player, that makes it difficult or impossible for another team (which has the right of first refusal) to match. While it can often refer to a salary structure or clause that would affect all teams equally, it has taken on a new specific meaning of a clause that has unbalanced impact. For example, in March 2006, the Minnesota Vikings offered Steve Hutchinson, an offensive guard with the Seattle Seahawks, a seven-year, $49 million contract of which $16 million was guaranteed. This contract offer had two poison pills in it. One was the salary structure, which would require the team to pay $13 million in the first year of the contract. That salary structure would apply to both teams equally, as the Seahawks would also have to pay $13 million in the first contract year, were they to match the offer. The second was a clause that required Hutchinson to be the highest paid player on the offensive line, or else the entire contract would be guaranteed. Since the Seahawks had another offensive lineman, Walter Jones, with a higher salary and the Vikings did not, this clause would have required the Seahawks to guarantee $49 million, and it effectively eliminated the Seahawks' opportunity to match the contract offer.

In the wake of this contract offer, similar clauses have appeared in other contract offers, including a contract offered to Vikings wide receiver Nate Burleson by the Seahawks, which, with irony fully intended, was structured as a seven year, $49 million deal. The contract given to Burleson had two vengeful poison pill clauses in response to the contract offered to Hutchinson. Firstly, it stipulated that if Burleson were to play five or more games in the state of Minnesota during any single season over the life of the contract, the entire $49 million would become guaranteed. Secondly, if Burleson were to earn more per year on average than all of his team's running backs combined, the $49 million would be guaranteed. Since the Vikings play half of their games at home in Minnesota, and their running backs combined earned less per year than the $7 million in Burleson's contract, Minnesota was unable to match it.
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#45 king_malice

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 04:21 AM

does anyone know what the Caps cap looks like for next season ? before signing Backstrom just curious, and i agree 22 already has a 100 pointer id give up 1st.2nd.3rd.4th and 5th for him could you imagine what this kid could do playing with Datsyuk !

Franzen-Datsyuk-Backstrom
Zetterberg-Filppula-Holmstrom
Cleary-Helm-Hudler
Eaves-Abdelkader-Draper/Miller

Kronwall-Rafalski
Stuart-Kindl
Lilja-Ericcson

#46 Red Wings 2010

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 07:13 AM

I love the way Little Huds plays, but someone needs to stand up for him FFS! Hes only like 3 foot tall!!

#47 eva unit zero

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 08:30 AM

I'd rather have Umberger or Cullen than Hudler. Cullen is basically a 50 pt guy who has some size and was a major force vs Pitts for Ottawa. Umberger has good size and could be useful as a 2nd line goal scorer, plus he picks up his game in the playoffs.I'm not too comfortable having so many guys under 6 feet tall on the top two lines.


Cullen is 33 and makes Hudler's cap hit this season, turning UFA in the summer, and has been a consistent second/third line forward the past few years who has played first unit PP time. Umberger has a cap hit of $3.75m the next two seasons (WTF?) while being a 45-55 point scorer playing first-line ice time and second-line PP time.
Cullen will be going for a raise. Umberger costs a million more over the same time frame, and is two years older. Plus RJ would cost assets because he's under contract. Umberger's numbers are inflated from playing with guys like Richards, Carter, Nash, Briere, Gagne, while Hudler has had wonderfully productive players like Draper, Maltby, Filppula, Kopecky, Helm, Samuelsson and Cleary on his line during the 08-09 season, none of whom cleared 20 goals or 40 points during that season while Hudler was the highest scoring player of any of the three (Hudler/Cullen/Umberger), despite the fact that the other two were often the second or even third highest scorers on their line based on end-of-season production.
Neither Umberger nor Cullen is particularly capably on the wing, and none of the three are terribly stellar on faceoffs, meaning none would be a very good choice to center a checking line, and again I mention only Hudler has shown the ability to maintain his full ability while playing on the wing.

So how are either a better choice than Hudler? I'll give you a hint. They're not. Hudler is a better choice to play on the wing with Dats or Z (who he has proven chemistry with, and who have better faceoff skills than Cheeseburger or Cullen) and Filppula on the third line is a much better choice than either. Save money on a player who fits better? Definitely.

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#48 eva unit zero

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 08:50 AM

Does anyone know if the "poison pill" loophole is prohibbited in the NHL CBA? I know this loophole has been exploited in the NFL a few times...

For those of you that dont know what this is, it applies to restricted free agents. Here is an example...

Detroit Signs Nicklas Backstrom to an offer sheet... say 10 years, 60 million. Under normal circumstances Washington would match this offer in seconds. However, part of the contract negotiated with the Wings would award a bonus of $40 million to Backstrom if he plays 30 games in the Verizon Center, making it next to impossible for the Caps to match...


No go. Bonuses are only allowed in entry level contracts, and can only be performance-based. You can't just have random bonuses like "If you win 20 divisional games in regulation time while posting 4 division shutouts, a .920 division sv% or better and 1.5 division GAA or lower then you get $3m" on a contract like you used to be able to. That's basically 3 goals every 40 shots over a span of at least 20 games, more likely 25-30; assuming the goaltender were to be played in that many (as the goalie approaches 26 wins, unless the playoffs are locked in, the backup likely gets the weak division opponents to kill the bonus chance if it's looking possible) As I said, only certain types of bonuses are allowed, and even then teams often try to avoid them (such as goaltender wins/shutouts/games played) if possible. When the team is fighting for a playoff spot and the team has no choice but to play a player who is closing in on a bonus, they have to accept it if that player hits the bonus (although the other team keying on that player if he's a forward does help the team's other skaters.)

But trying to get Backstrom with an offer sheet is a no-go as I said. The Wings won't give up the compensation, and Washington will match anything Holland is willing to pay.

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#49 mmamolo

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 08:51 AM

Does anyone know if the "poison pill" loophole is prohibbited in the NHL CBA? I know this loophole has been exploited in the NFL a few times...

For those of you that dont know what this is, it applies to restricted free agents. Here is an example...

Detroit Signs Nicklas Backstrom to an offer sheet... say 10 years, 60 million. Under normal circumstances Washington would match this offer in seconds. However, part of the contract negotiated with the Wings would award a bonus of $40 million to Backstrom if he plays 30 games in the Verizon Center, making it next to impossible for the Caps to match...

That may be the sneakiest/funniest thing I have ever heard. But we all know the Wings don't operate that way.
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#50 Z and D for the C

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 08:56 AM

So how are either a better choice than Hudler? I'll give you a hint. They're not. Hudler is a better choice to play on the wing with Dats or Z (who he has proven chemistry with, and who have better faceoff skills than Cheeseburger or Cullen) and Filppula on the third line is a much better choice than either. Save money on a player who fits better? Definitely.[/font]


You realize if it's either Filppula or Hudler who has to go on the third line, it's going to be Hudler, right?

You realize Filppula and Hudler had the exact same scoring rate at even strength in 0809, right?

Just Yes/No questions.

Edited by Z and D for the C, 05 May 2010 - 08:57 AM.

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#51 VM1138

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 09:42 AM

You realize if it's either Filppula or Hudler who has to go on the third line, it's going to be Hudler, right?

You realize Filppula and Hudler had the exact same scoring rate at even strength in 0809, right?

Just Yes/No questions.


Yeah, Flip isn't all that effective but he's our strongest option for 2nd line center if we reunited Zetterberg and Datsyuk.

I'm liking a lineup like this:

Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Holmstrom
Hudler-Flip-Franzen
Eaves-Helm-Miller
Abdelkader-Draper-Cleary
Ritola

Lidstrom-Kronwall (just to see if he's ready for top pairing minutes)
Stuart-Rafalski
Ericsson-Free Agent
Kindl

Gone are: Williams, Meech, Lebda, Lilja, Bertuzzi.

We definitely have a weird situation with roster spots. Without getting rid of someone who needs to be rewarded (Eaves, Miller) there's really no room for new players to fit in the lineup.
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#52 wingsownnhl43

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 09:56 AM

Yeah, Flip isn't all that effective but he's our strongest option for 2nd line center if we reunited Zetterberg and Datsyuk.

I'm liking a lineup like this:

Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Holmstrom
Hudler-Flip-Franzen
Eaves-Helm-Miller
Abdelkader-Draper-Cleary
Ritola

Lidstrom-Kronwall (just to see if he's ready for top pairing minutes)
Stuart-Rafalski
Ericsson-Free Agent
Kindl

Gone are: Williams, Meech, Lebda, Lilja, Bertuzzi.

We definitely have a weird situation with roster spots. Without getting rid of someone who needs to be rewarded (Eaves, Miller) there's really no room for new players to fit in the lineup.

Under your scenerio, there is absolutely room to add new players unless you think Lidstrom going to sign for 7 million again, which in my mind wouldnt be worth it.

Players are listed left to right in order of salary. With $4.4 million in cap room, we definitely can add a third line forward or two, which is desperatley needed.

Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Johan Franzen ($3.955m)
Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / Jiri Hudler ($2.875m) / Daniel Cleary ($2.800m)
Kris Draper ($1.583m) / * Tomas Holmstrom ($1.500m) / * Justin Abdelkader ($0.850m)
* Darren Helm ($0.750m) / * Patrick Eaves ($0.600m)
DEFENSEMEN
Brian Rafalski ($6.000m) / * Nicklas Lidstrom ($4.450m)
Brad Stuart ($3.750m) / Niklas Kronwall ($3.000m)
Jonathan Ericsson ($0.900m) / Jakub Kindl ($0.883m)
* Doug Janik ($0.500m)
GOALTENDERS
Chris Osgood ($1.417m) / Jimmy Howard ($0.717m)
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#53 Finnish Wing

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 11:26 AM

Hudler and Filppula will both be in top6. They're the Euro Twins vol. 2!

Zetterberg-Datsyuk-Holmstrom
Hudler-Filppula-Franzen
Cleary-Abdelkader-Eaves
Miller-Helm-"TOUGH GUY"
+ Draper, Ritola

Lidstrom-Rafalski
Kronwall-Stuart
Kindl-Ericsson
+ Meech

Howard
Osgood

I think we'd have a cap space to get a better 3rd liner than Eaves or a better d-man than Ericsson or a better goalie than Howard, BUT I just left it like that. Someone can count the cap, but I like those lines already, even if there would be 5m cap space.
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#54 titanium2

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Posted 05 May 2010 - 11:37 AM

Maybe Helm, despite his size, will develop into the best pound for pound guy who can fight. His hands are rather average on a team like the Red Wings anyways. Yeah it's a longshot dream but that would solve so many problems.





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