Jimmy Howard has championship skills

[stormboy 47]

K55 got at this, and i don't pretend to predict that howard will become a brick wall, but the dude is an NHL rookie. yeah, he's old for a rookie, but i don't see any reason to not believe that he can still improve on things like rebound control and stick handling. he's a rookie. datsyuk did not do his best stick-handling his rookie year; franzen did not score the most goals of his career his rookie season.

i keep reading people's comments about how howard has failed us and how that means we won't succeed in the future. i see no reason to believe that he won't improve. i'm not saying he WILL, but there's a good reason to believe that he might.

the j-ho we saw this year is not the best j-ho we will ever see.

[Nightfall 871]

Just something I want to point out...

Osgood is a 3 time cup winner, and still some LGW fans say he sucks.

Hasek came to Detroit and won a cup in 2002, and still some LGW fans say he sucks.

Vernon backstopped Detroit to their first championship in decades in 1997, and some LGW fans say he sucks.

We could probably have God in net stopping everything, and some LGW fans would say he sucks because he gives rebounds up.

The bar for goaltending in Detroit has been set so high I don't think any mortal has a possibility of reaching it. That being said, I think Howard is going to be just fine next season. We shall see how he does.

[titanium2 867]

Rookie of the year finalist (Myers will win) because the wings played great team defense during a pretty long stretch when they had all injuries and howard looked alot better than what he really is.

Is that a compliment to the Wings?

[Opie 308]

Did Mindfly just say the Wings played Great D in front of Howard?

ahahahahhahahahahahahaha good thing I didn't have a sip of coffee in my mouth.

Oh and SWF

Eva will never get over the Butthurt of Ozzie going to the pine.

So two of those three posters are not worth responding to in this topic.

And for any one to say the Wings were dominated in any category in a series that the 4 wins SJ did get were by 1 goal. The only domination shown in that series was SJ pp over DET pk, and game 4.

Man, I always do this, I tell myself I will stay away or just read in the off season, and then I go and get involved!

D'OH

[13dangledangle 958]

Laughing out loud at all 3 of you...

What's going to be even funnier is all of you will probably be so serious in your responses like, "WHY WON'T YOU OR ANYBODY ELSE BELIEVE ME?!" or "YOU'RE SO STUPID!" or "NICE RESPONSE *rolling eyes*"

Thanks for making my morning!

lol that was nicely timed my friend, I was just going to respond to all three as well.

Lets recap the scores Game 1, 4-3. Game 2, 4-3. Game 3, 4-3. Game 3, 4-3. Game 4, 7-1. Game 5, 2-1. First of all Im not arguing that 12 goals in the first three is good, but we got freaking rocked with BAD calls in the first two games. For the most part what Jimmy doesnt see Jimmy cant stop and the sharks did a good job in that area as well. He let in 3 goals in the remaining two giving the wings a chance to win. No need to talk Nabakov, he played well, just not why we lost.

Mindfly did you just say that people on LGW compare Howard to Roy then say we should get Price?? OMG, I see people have there views but Price over Howard? You have to explain so we can talk about this

I also LOVE that save I just watched it again, then again and came to the conclusion that maybe My opinion is bias because I ******* LOVE THIS GUY!! JIMMAYYY :!:

[Guest mindfly]

As I've said many times before, Price is an excellent goaltender, he probably has the best technique among all active goalies and great goalie physique for post-lockout-nhl, he just need to change team to a team that generally play great defense and have real twoway centers and wingers helping down low, get his ass out of Montreal and the heavy pressure that goes on there and he will be a top goalie in the nhl.

[Z and D for the C 712]

As I've said many times before, Price is an excellent goaltender, he probably has the best technique among all active goalies and great goalie physique for post-lockout-nhl, he just need to change team to a team that generally play great defense and have real twoway centers and wingers helping down low, get his ass out of Montreal and the heavy pressure that goes on there and he will be a top goalie in the nhl.

You are so stupid mindfly. It's truly unbelievable. You really think if Price, with his 1-3 playoff record and his 12-20 regular season record and last year's 0-4 playoff record, could get off the horrible team that just beat the Penguins AND the Capitals would be one of the best goalies in the league because of the pressure that the rookie Halak can handle is too much for the three year veteran Price?

I really hope you're saying this to get attention. But either way, I can't wait for the day some other team to has more swedes than the red wings so we can stop dealing with your relentless bulls***.

Edited May 20, 2010 by Z and D for the C

[Guest mindfly]

Swedes? I liked the 97/98 team much more than the current one...

[Frozen-Man 144]

He's overrated and a not-so-good goalie, people just won't admit it, he wouldn't have a spot on any other team.

Yeah what team would want a current Calder Trophy candidate. I'm glad we don't have Duchene and Myers too or the Wings future would really look bleak.

[chrisdetroit 189]

Rookie of the year finalist (Myers will win) because the wings played great team defense during a pretty long stretch when they had all injuries and howard looked alot better than what he really is.

Oh for f*** sake. Give the guy credit. You are saying that he is a rookie of the year finalist because of the team in front of him?

WOW. Just Wow

[The Secret 304]

Wings were dominated by SJ in the goaltending area.

Howard was solid in round 1, but totally outplayed by Nabokov in round 2.

With a championship goaltender, the wings would be right now en route for the cup finals.

Have to agree with you on this one... It wasn't all Howards fault but his soft goals were terrible and at the worst times possible. If he improves he could become what we hope but he needs to learn to control those gigantic rebounds, close that 5 hole and stop scrambling so much around the crease. We'll see next year!

[titanium2 867]

I think Mindfly is starting to realize how much "fun" it is to join the species of Carmen and Eva.

[Carman 387]

Titanium needs to get over his giant ***** for me. My posts are actually intelligent and logical.

[DyingAlive 27]

MOST OVERRATED SAVE OF THE YEAR.

The second chance was completely a result of failing to properly control the rebound on the first shot! Yes, the first save looked great, and the second save was a good reaction. But he never has to make that second save if not for his initial rebound failure. If he redirects it properly, the Wings might get to turn that back up ice and get a great scoring chance with Hanzal trapped in the corner like he was.

It's just that easy, eh?

[HankthaTank 1,100]

MOST OVERRATED SAVE OF THE YEAR.

The second chance was completely a result of failing to properly control the rebound on the first shot! Yes, the first save looked great, and the second save was a good reaction. But he never has to make that second save if not for his initial rebound failure. If he redirects it properly, the Wings might get to turn that back up ice and get a great scoring chance with Hanzal trapped in the corner like he was.

Yeah thats cool and being the biggest Ozzie slappy in here is as well so you would be blinded by the save. I picked a random video and you are over analyzing the dog crap out of it. But then again I realize you will pull out a statistical thread which will be about 4 pages long and I will still not be convinced that this guy isn't anything but our franchise tendy. Pump the brakes and realize the guy got us into the playoffs and played amazingly during a stretch when we had no one. Had 1 real bad game in the playoffs as a rook. I will take it. Next bashing reply coming right up......

[eva unit zero 271]

Yeah thats cool and being the biggest Ozzie slappy in here is as well so you would be blinded by the save. I picked a random video and you are over analyzing the dog crap out of it. But then again I realize you will pull out a statistical thread which will be about 4 pages long and I will still not be convinced that this guy isn't anything but our franchise tendy. Pump the brakes and realize the guy got us into the playoffs and played amazingly during a stretch when we had no one. Had 1 real bad game in the playoffs as a rook. I will take it. Next bashing reply coming right up......

Howard is a good goalie. He was faitgued in the playoffs and made some errors.

But one bad game? He had several bad games. I'm not saying they were his fault with regard to his ability, but they were his fault in terms of the fact that most goalies would normally have been able to stop the goals he had given up, and they were given up at bad moments that killed momentum.

As far as saying I am 'bashing Howard' I have supported Howard since he was drafted, even when most LGW members felt Howard was the worst of the signed prospects and should have been traded while he still had value, I felt he should be given the shot as the backup because he was still a high-end prospect and should be given the opportunity at the NHL level.

At the same time, he can't play every game and still isn't perfect.

[Opie 308]

Eva please explain which goals would have been stopped by most goalies?

I can count 1-2 a game, with 2 being a rarity.

Are you gonna blame him for goal mouth scrambles, deflections off d-men , d-men stick breaking, 5-3's, please be more specific, because as it is right now you have made accusations about Howard for every loss.

However:

When asked about it after the games you shut down once people starting pointing out that most of the goals a game were not his fault, and even pointed out that most of the back breaking goals were not his fault, especially during a 5-3 or a 3-1 break away.

But you continue to make these accusations without backing them up, you are good at what you do.

Accusations with no support, and long ass posts with nothing really to say except some weird stats you made up.

Edit: for clarification:

He gave up 0 bad goals in games 4 and 5!

the only game I (personally) would hang on Howie would be game 2. He looked shell shocked and fatigued.

The rest of the series he looked very good, especially in games 4 & 5.

More Edit:

Those of you saying Nabby out played him do you remember some of the soft goals the wings scored on him? Homer with a wrist shot from 60 feet, I mean come on, Homer is the best at what he does, no one ever claimed his wrister was one of the best in the game, on the team, or even the best one taken at Nabby that game.

IMPORTNAT EDIT: Read SWF's post, his corrections make my post obsolete!

Edited May 21, 2010 by Opie

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Eva please explain which goals would have been stopped by most goalies?

I can count 1-2 a game, with 2 being a rarity.

Are you gonna blame him for goal mouth scrambles, deflections off d-men , d-men stick breaking, 5-3's, please be more specific, because as it is right now you have made accusations about Howard for every loss.

However:

When asked about it after the games you shut down once people starting pointing out that most of the goals a game were not his fault, and even pointed out that most of the back breaking goals were not his fault, especially during a 5-3 or a 3-1 break away.

But you continue to make these accusations without backing them up, you are good at what you do.

Accusations with no support, and long ass posts with nothing really to say except some weird stats you made up.

Edit: for clarification:

He gave up 0 bad goals in games 4 and 5!

the only game I (personally) would hang on Howie would be game 2. He looked shell shocked and fatigued.

The rest of the series he looked very good, especially in games 4 & 5.

More Edit:

Those of you saying Nabby out played him do you remember some of the soft goals the wings scored on him? Homer with a wrist shot from 60 feet, I mean come on, Homer is the best at what he does, no one ever claimed his wrister was one of the best in the game, on the team, or even the best one taken at Nabby that game.

I'm assuming you meant Sharks game 3 when Howard was shaky (Wings blew 3-1 lead in the 3rd and Howard let in the bad goal from the corner)?

And the Holmstrom wrister goal came on Brygalov in the Phoenix series I think.

Other than that, pretty much spot on. Howard was shaky at times (you can pretty much apply this to any goalie at any time imaginable), but far from terrible and blaming him for not stopping a 3-on-1 rush or 5-on-3 PP goals is pretty absurd.

And while Nabakov was the better goalie overall, to say that he just completely outplayed Howard and was the ultimate difference maker in the series is a pretty big stretch.

[Opie 308]

Thanks SWF Hadn't had coffee yet!

[Dimaline312000 51]

Jimmy really proved himself this season at least in my eyes he did. I was very impressed with his play this season. If he contiues to get better with experinece and time I think he will help lead this team to another Championship soon. I know everyone I've talked to thinks this is the last season the Wings are going to be worth anything for a while. Not quite sure if I believe that. The Wings have a lot of depth and heart and some very talented players that are willing to work hard and I know that Jimmy is one of them and he will help this team get better.

[HankthaTank 1,100]

No Jimmy... None of this

Yes... This

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=r_MYilLilvQ

Eva I understand you "supported" them drafting him and your stat sheet threads are nice and look professional and when people throw Rask and Niemi #'s in my face I just laugh. The guy played like 30 more games then both of those guys. Ozzie's time has come and gone and we appreciated everything he has done here but Jimmy Howard from here on out. Just hoping he gets some rest here and there with Ozzie backing up.

[eva unit zero 271]

Eva please explain which goals would have been stopped by most goalies?

I can count 1-2 a game, with 2 being a rarity.

Are you gonna blame him for goal mouth scrambles, deflections off d-men , d-men stick breaking, 5-3's, please be more specific, because as it is right now you have made accusations about Howard for every loss.

However:

When asked about it after the games you shut down once people starting pointing out that most of the goals a game were not his fault, and even pointed out that most of the back breaking goals were not his fault, especially during a 5-3 or a 3-1 break away.

But you continue to make these accusations without backing them up, you are good at what you do.

Accusations with no support, and long ass posts with nothing really to say except some weird stats you made up.

Edit: for clarification:

He gave up 0 bad goals in games 4 and 5!

the only game I (personally) would hang on Howie would be game 2. He looked shell shocked and fatigued.

The rest of the series he looked very good, especially in games 4 & 5.

More Edit:

Those of you saying Nabby out played him do you remember some of the soft goals the wings scored on him? Homer with a wrist shot from 60 feet, I mean come on, Homer is the best at what he does, no one ever claimed his wrister was one of the best in the game, on the team, or even the best one taken at Nabby that game.

IMPORTNAT EDIT: Read SWF's post, his corrections make my post obsolete!

Many times goals were either soft goals (45 feet out, medium-speed wrister, no screen?) or quite often goals which were results of Howard's misplays or poor decisions. Such as tossing the puck into Nik Kronwall's skates with his glove when there is a forechecker right on Kronwall, instead of just freezing the puck. Bad rebounds (redirecting a short from the corner to the slot rather than the endboards) or coming out of his crease to challenge the shooter and failing to return to the crease as the shooter advanced, despite the attacking player on the other side of the ice. Overcommitting on multiple 2-on-1 rushes, some of which his defensemen saved his ass on. No, he wasn't the only Wing making errors. But he made some pretty huge ones, and he is given the "but he's a rookie" free pass that guys like Osgood and other 90s rookies never got, despite the fact he has much more pro experience than any of them did and many of them were better in their rookie year than Howard was this year.

[RedFX 48]

As a rookie, he handled the pressure of this season well. It's really not often you'll see a veteran team pin a large majority of a season's fate on a rookie goaltender. And I thought for the most part he handled it well. But now the key question is if he can do it consistently on a season-to-season basis.

[HankthaTank 1,100]

Chris Osgood's first season:

GP-41

W-23

L-8

T-5

MIN-2,206

GA-105

GAA-2.86

SO-2

SV%-.895

Jimmy Howard's first season:

GP-63

W-37

L-15

T/OL-10

MIN-3740

GA-162

GAA-2.32

SO-3

SV%-.922

Granted more games but that would give him more time to bring these #'s down right???

CANNOT base any of this on his first year but I think we are in pretty good hands. Has time to control rebounds and hone his skills on these "exploited" inconsistencies he apparently has. Healthy team all year...I like our chances with Jimmy in there.

Edited May 21, 2010 by HankthaTank

[eva unit zero 271]

Chris Osgood's first season:

GP-41

W-23

L-8

T-5

MIN-2,206

GA-105

GAA-2.86

SO-2

SV%-.895

Jimmy Howard's first season:

GP-63

W-37

L-15

T/OL-10

MIN-3740

GA-162

GAA-2.32

SO-3

SV%-.922

Granted more games but that would give him more time to bring these #'s down right???

CANNOT base any of this on his first year but I think we are in pretty good hands. Has time to control rebounds and hone his skills on these "exploited" inconsistencies he apparently has. Healthy team all year...I like our chances with Jimmy in there.

Not to mention the fact that goaltending numbers IN GENERAL are much better nowadays than they were in the 80s or early 90s. Howard's regular season statistics would have placed him as 3rd in GAA (behind Hasek), 2nd in sv% (behind Hasek), tied for 2nd in wins with Belfour 2nd in wins (behind Richter), and tied for 8th in SO with Irbe, Potvin, Brodeur, Vernon, McLean, and Wakaluk (behind Belfour, Roy, Hasek, Richter, Hextall, Puppa, and Casey) while Howard currently places 5th in GAA, 6th in sv%, tied for 8th in wins, and tied for 20th in SO.

But let's look at two interesting points. I said Osgood was better in the playoffs than Howard in their rookie years. Osgood made fewer mistakes, and Osgood's GAA dropped from 2.86 to 2.31 while Howard's increased from 2.32 to 2.75...Osgood's save percentage went from .895 to .891, Howard's from .924 to .915. Osgood was also several years younger.

Let's take a look at equal age.

Howard turned 26 this season. His stat line is as follows:

Regular season: 63 GP, 37-15-0-10, 3 SO, 2.26, .924

Playoffs: 12 GP, 5-7, 1 SO, 2.75, .915

By comparison, Osgood's stat line for the season he turned 26:

Regular season: 64 GP, 33-20-11-0, 6 SO, 2.21, .913

Playoffs: 22 GP, 16-6, 2 SO, 2.12, .918

Howard lost two games in shootouts, so his record under the old system would be 37-23-8

Give him time, he'll serve well in the playoffs. But don't diss Ozzy just because you don't like him; He was great, has had a HOF career and is still good.