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If you were Brian Burke


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#61 eva unit zero

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Posted 27 May 2010 - 03:31 PM

I completely agree. Everyone keeps analyzing the D, but in my opinion the weakest link was Vesa Toskala.

Lots of the Leafs losses this season came during games where the Leafs outshot and outplayed their opponent. All the Leafs needed to win those games was average goaltending and Toskala couldn't even provide that.

Refusing to take instructions from his goalie coach Francois Allare and having an "I don't give a s***" attitude didn't help matters either.

I laughed my ass off when Anaheim dealt him without even playing him. I guess it didn't take long for them to realize he is crap.


Giguere has much better technique than most goalies in the league; his issues are mental. If he can get his head straight he can get back to form among one of the top goalies in the league. Furthermore, when he does have his head straight, he is one of the goalies in the league who is the kind of guy who takes the playoff pressure and comes up with his best games. Guys like Jiggy, Ozzie, Brodeur, Roy, Vernon, Hextall, etc. are examples of this while other guys have shown that when the playoff pressure gets heavy and they need to come up big for their team, they just shut down and can't do it. Luongo is the biggest name example of this type in the league right now; he has shown no ability to play his best under do-or-die pressure when his team needs it the most; instead he has repeatedly fallen apart.

Giguere is at a dangerous point in his career; he could turn it around into a great career, or he could fall apart into a washed up nothing.

Edited by eva unit zero, 27 May 2010 - 09:41 PM.

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#62 Bring Back The Bruise Bros

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Posted 27 May 2010 - 03:50 PM

Right now with this team I'm not exactly picky with if they bring a tough guy who wears a visor or not. I've seen him ditch it before his fights before and even if he didn't its better then nothing.

He's a tough customer for sure and has some size, he's like 6'1 215 pounds. Not bad at all if you ask me. I would welcome him with open arms.

From what i've seen of him,he ditches it 99% of the time.That would be a great signing.
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#63 puffy

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Posted 27 May 2010 - 07:14 PM

Giguere has much better technique than most goalies in the league; his issues are mental. If he can get his head straight he can get back to form among one of the top goalies in the league. Furthermore, when he does have his head straight, he is one of the goalies in the league who is the kind of guy who takes the playoff pressure and comes up with his best games. Guys like Jiggy, Ozzie, Brodeur, Roy, Vernon, Hextall, etc. are examples of this while other guys have shown that when the playoff pressure gets heavy and they need to come up big for their team, they just shut down and can't do it. Luongo is the biggest name example of this type in the league right now; he has shown no ability to play his best under do-or-die pressure when his team needs it the most; instead he has repeatedly fallen apart.

Giguere is at a dangerous point in his career; he could turn it around into a great career, or he could fall apart into a washed up nothing.


Either way I think the trade was a good move from Toronto's perspective. Even if he never "gets jiggy with it" again he can still be a very valuable mentor for Jonas Gustavsson.

Is it a coincidence that Gustavssons play dramatically improved after the addition of Giguere? I don't think so.

I would have traded Jason Blake and Vesa Toskala for a bag of expired Doritos :P

Edited by puffy, 27 May 2010 - 07:22 PM.


#64 Doc Holliday

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Posted 27 May 2010 - 07:56 PM

Either way I think the trade was a good move from Toronto's perspective. Even if he never "gets jiggy with it" again he can still be a very valuable mentor for Jonas Gustavsson.

Is it a coincidence that Gustavssons play dramatically improved after the addition of Giguere? I don't think so.

I would have traded Jason Blake and Vesa Toskala for a bag of expired Doritos :P


The Maple Leafs have always played better toward the end of the season.

Then they go back tof****** things up at the beginning of the season.

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#65 MacK_Attack

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Posted 27 May 2010 - 08:08 PM

The Maple Leafs have always played better toward the end of the season.

Then they go back tof****** things up at the beginning of the season.

I think the difference is that they were horrible up until the very moment Vesa Toskala was traded.

The Leafs penalty killing was 20 percent higher when Gustavsson was in net compared to Toskala.

They were out of the playoff race in November, but it wasn't until they got Toskala out of the net and ditched those 6 players that they started to play well. Of those 6 players, only Ian White had any future with the team. People can say Phaneuf is overrated, and he probably is, but I'd rather have Dion Phaneuf than any combination of the guys they gave to Calgary....especially considering the contract given to Stajan and the contract White is going to get.

Edited by MacK_Attack, 27 May 2010 - 08:13 PM.


#66 eva unit zero

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Posted 27 May 2010 - 09:56 PM

I think the difference is that they were horrible up until the very moment Vesa Toskala was traded.

The Leafs penalty killing was 20 percent higher when Gustavsson was in net compared to Toskala.

They were out of the playoff race in November, but it wasn't until they got Toskala out of the net and ditched those 6 players that they started to play well. Of those 6 players, only Ian White had any future with the team. People can say Phaneuf is overrated, and he probably is, but I'd rather have Dion Phaneuf than any combination of the guys they gave to Calgary....especially considering the contract given to Stajan and the contract White is going to get.


Stajan is a good center.

White vs. Phaneuf is a good question. This season, White was more offensively productive in both uniforms. Phaneuf is the more physical player, White is better defensively and blocks more shots. I'm not sure who I would take between the two if I had to choose. Same age, so that's not a factor.

The big question is, how much money is White going to get from the Flames? If it's $3m or less, then a combination of Stajan/White is definitely better than just Phaneuf. Phaneuf makes #6.5 for the next four seasons. Stajan makes $3.5 for the next four. White at $3m or less makes the deal fall heavily in favor of that pair for the same money. White for more and you can pose the question "What did Toronto get with the extra cap space?" but the answer, of course, will be that they got crap.

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#67 MacK_Attack

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 12:23 PM

Stajan is a good center.

White vs. Phaneuf is a good question. This season, White was more offensively productive in both uniforms. Phaneuf is the more physical player, White is better defensively and blocks more shots. I'm not sure who I would take between the two if I had to choose. Same age, so that's not a factor.

The big question is, how much money is White going to get from the Flames? If it's $3m or less, then a combination of Stajan/White is definitely better than just Phaneuf. Phaneuf makes #6.5 for the next four seasons. Stajan makes $3.5 for the next four. White at $3m or less makes the deal fall heavily in favor of that pair for the same money. White for more and you can pose the question "What did Toronto get with the extra cap space?" but the answer, of course, will be that they got crap.

The rumour before White was traded was that he was seeking $4-5 million.

Stajan is a good center, but I wouldn't pay him $3.5 million his best day.

The difference between White and Phaneuf this year is that White has probably been playing at the peak of his ability. I'm not sure he's going to get any better, and it might have just been a contract year performance.

Phaneuf has the potential to play much better and did in the very late stages of the season. I'd rather have Phaneuf than White/Stajan at $7-8 million combined.

Edited by MacK_Attack, 28 May 2010 - 12:49 PM.


#68 newfy

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 12:57 PM

The rumour before White was traded was that he was seeking $4-5 million.

Stajan is a good center, but I wouldn't pay him $3.5 million his best day.

The difference between White and Phaneuf this year is that White has probably been playing at the peak of his ability. I'm not sure he's going to get any better, and it might have just been a contract year performance.

Phaneuf has the potential to play much better and did in the very late stages of the season. I'd rather have Phaneuf than White/Stajan at $7-8 million combined.

Yeah people who think Stajan is a good center haven't watched a lot of TO games. He is serviceable but he's invisible some nights and others he can be solid.

White was a good all around defenseman but its not like he has amazing upside o brings anything special to his team.

Phaneuf has the potential to be a norris candidate or possible winner down the road, put up 60 points and be one of the meanest defenseman in the league.

The trade for Phaneuf was a good one for the rebuild of TO

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#69 F.Michael

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 03:24 PM

Stajan got hot just after the move to Calgary, but it didn't take too long for him, and the rest of the team to cool off just enough to miss the playoffs.

There's still a ton of upside in Phaneuf (if not at least some sloppy-seconds for Puffy ;)).

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#70 eva unit zero

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 06:15 PM

The rumour before White was traded was that he was seeking $4-5 million.

Stajan is a good center, but I wouldn't pay him $3.5 million his best day.

The difference between White and Phaneuf this year is that White has probably been playing at the peak of his ability. I'm not sure he's going to get any better, and it might have just been a contract year performance.

Phaneuf has the potential to play much better and did in the very late stages of the season. I'd rather have Phaneuf than White/Stajan at $7-8 million combined.


White has gotten consistently better as he's come up in the Leafs organization. He's 25.
Phaneuf started out as a flash and had a big year, and then dropped off considerably. He's 25.

White, not Phaneuf, is the one who has been consistently improving year-by-year. Phaneuf's six-year, $39m contract which he is still playing out was signed in the middle of 2007-08, which is to-date his best season. What makes you think White peaked because it was a contract year and Phaneuf didn't do the same?

Phaneuf hasn't played even close to the level he was at in 2007-08. It's not unreasonable to suggest that White has just as much chance as Phaneuf of getting up to that level in the future.

As for Stajan, he's scored 55+ points two seasons in a row and is a decent defensive player. $3.5 might be a little high, but not wildly out of the range you would pay for a player of his ability. Compare it to Valtteri Filppula, for instance. Flip's deal is a 5-year, $3m per year signed at the same time. Flip has scored at a slightly lower PPG and is comparable defensively. He's the same age. Stajan signed a four-year deal with the Flames worth the same amount soon after Calgary acquired him. So Stajan is signed for one year longer than Flip and is a comparable talent with a comparable contract and is the same age.

Stajan won't be a Pavel Datsyuk, but he's a solid top-six forward.


Stajan got hot just after the move to Calgary, but it didn't take too long for him, and the rest of the team to cool off just enough to miss the playoffs.

There's still a ton of upside in Phaneuf (if not at least some sloppy-seconds for Puffy ;)).


41 points in 55 games in Toronto for Stajan. Whether he got hot in Calgary or not, he was scoring at a pretty good clip in Toronto.
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#71 puffy

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 06:39 PM

There's still a ton of upside in Phaneuf (if not at least some sloppy-seconds for Puffy ;)).


Who wouldn't trade Stajan,Hagman,Mayers and White for exclusive rights to Elisha Cuthbert? Everyone keeps mentioning Phaneuf, but Cuthbert was clearly the key component in that trade ;)

#72 WorkingOvertime

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 10:35 PM

I remember reading that Burke would have liked to see Rosehill in more games this past season. I watched a lot of Leafs games this year because I love their team tenacity. At one point they iced a forth line of Orr- Mayers- Rosehill (clip here ).

#73 Bring Back The Bruise Bros

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 10:56 PM

I remember reading that Burke would have liked to see Rosehill in more games this past season. I watched a lot of Leafs games this year because I love their team tenacity. At one point they iced a forth line of Orr- Mayers- Rosehill (clip here ).

That was a pretty badass line.Rosehill will be more of a regular next year for sure.Burke will get another tough guy for the fourth line.
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#74 Lidstromboli

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 11:16 PM

i like how orr cross checked mike green and then got beat up by morrisson

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 11:21 PM

i like how orr cross checked mike green and then got beat up by morrisson

I don't really remember Morrisonn absolutely teeing off on Orr.
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#76 larionov_8

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 11:39 PM

Hey - as long as he can play physical, block shots, and move opponents outta the crease on a regular basis - I'll be a happy man...I honestly miss guys like Bob Rouse, and Terry Carkner; just simple stay at home Dmen who did the job in an efficient manner.



Yeah, I'm not even sure he accomplishes that. He will definitely cork guys once and a while but he is prone to making some really poor decisions with the puck. I'd say his defensive ability, in terms of his coverage and puck moving ability, is worse than Lebda's or Lilja's. If I remember right (I tried not to watch Leafs hockey...), he was a healthy scratch on a regularl basis.

#77 F.Michael

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 01:17 AM

Who wouldn't trade Stajan,Hagman,Mayers and White for exclusive rights to Elisha Cuthbert? Everyone keeps mentioning Phaneuf, but Cuthbert was clearly the key component in that trade ;)

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#78 titanium2

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 01:21 AM

Don't really understand how Sean Avery woos girls like that.

#79 Lidstromboli

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 01:50 AM

well he seems to actually have some sort of personality

... unlike 99% of the players in the nhl

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Posted 29 May 2010 - 07:47 AM

well he seems to actually have some sort of personality

... unlike 99% of the players in the nhl

I'd rather have no personality than be an insecure,stuck up ****** bag.
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