351 replies to this topic

[wingsownnhl43]

I just hope one day after he reitres he comes back as a D coach maybe a few years after taking a break he will get the itch to get back like most greats do, come back and help out/teach guys like Kindl,Smith and other young guys we will have in the line up.



if the Cap goes up by 2 mill maybe something like this would be ok.


Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Johan Franzen ($3.955m)
Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / Jiri Hudler ($2.875m) / Daniel Cleary ($2.800m)
* Tomas Holmstrom ($2.125m) / * Todd Bertuzzi ($1.650m) / Kris Draper ($1.583m)
* Justin Abdelkader ($1.000m) / * Darren Helm ($0.899m) / * Adam Burish ($0.775m)
Mattias Ritola ($0.517m)
DEFENSEMEN
Nicklas Lidstrom ($6.200m) / Brian Rafalski ($6.000m)
Brad Stuart ($3.750m) / Niklas Kronwall ($3.000m)
* Carlo Coliacovo ($1.555m) / Jonathan Ericsson ($0.900m)
Jakub Kindl ($0.883m)
GOALTENDERS
Chris Osgood ($1.417m) / Jimmy Howard ($0.717m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
(these totals are compiled using the bonus cushion)
ROSTER: 22; CAP: $56.8m; PAYROLL: $58.384m; CAP ROOM: $-1.584m BONUSES: $0.000m



Franzen-Zetterberg-Holmstrom
Hudler-Datsyuk-Bertuzzi
Cleary-Filppula-Abdelkader
Burish-Draper-Helm or Bursih-Helm-Ritola (Draper subs)
Ritola

Stuart-Rafalski
Lidstrom-Kronwall
Coliacovo-Ericcson
Kindl

Howard
Osgood

Man, I really hope Kenny has resigning Eaves as a priority. I really think he has the potential to improve upon his 22 point season, and at a fraction over 500k, thats a tremendous value.

[Carman]

You dont go off points in determining how good a player is. I like your posts on here carman, but you cant actually value Pavel Datsyuk in the 20 range.

He is easily top 5.

Oh agreed I have them both much higher then those numbers. I was merely making an example.

Both are part of the elite of their positions.

[Heroes of Hockeytown]

This is fine with me. Some of the talk of him taking $4-5M was a little out there, I can't recall any time when a player of Nick's caliber would take such a paycut.

I know that Duncan Keith and Chris Pronger have been mentioned for their lower cap hits, but it's not the same thing. Both of those guys are locked into deals until they're 40+; they are probably going to be very overpaid for their cap hits in their final seasons. We know exactly how good Lidstrom is right now, and he's being paid accordingly for right now.

[Hockeytown0001]

Good news. Unfortunately, the 1 year deal sounds like it could be his last.

[Doc Holliday]

First off I would like to remind everyone that Nick Lidstrom is NOT the best Dman in the league now. Anyone who thinks so has a serious bias towards the wings. Is he still good? Yes. However, he got exposed this year and while i think he can do better, i don't think he is worth 6.5 million.

He was a +20 on a team that was at around an even goal differential for almost the entire season last year.

He is a top 5 d-man. He deserves top-5 pay. Especially when there aren't that many elite defensemen in the league.

Who would you take over him? Doughty? Keith? Pronger? The list pretty much ends there.

Who is going to replace him when he is gone? You have to correctly understand the value of a player when discussing his cap hit. Supply and demand.

Where's your motivation to come back? Is this general motors worker trying to win a championship? No. I'm sorry but this is still a bad comparison. The GM worker is asked to come back to help them make more money and run the company smoothly. Nick Lidstrom is asked to come back to help win a championship.
Right, cuz living with (we'll say) 30 million is so much different then living with 28 or 27. Lidstrom and his family are set for life. I'm pretty sure they can live off of a multi million bank account.

Doesn't mean he isn't entitled to his money considering a much weaker Rafalski is being paid 6 mil.

All in all I also am pretty disappointed with the value. I think Nick needs to be back to 2008 form to be worth his 6.5 or whatever million dollars. I just don't understand the thought process that goes in to these players when coming back. Do you wanna make money or win a cup? if you wanna win, take a cut.

So you think he was overpaid in 08 whn he was being paid 7.4 mil and the team won a cup?

Is it just me or is there something wrong with the logic of this man?

Edited by Doc Holliday, 01 June 2010 - 07:16 PM.

[NC WINGS FAN]

After reading the comments that some of you have left regarding Lidstrom re-signing for next year I'am actually embarrassed to be associated with you. Have you been so spoiled over the past 15 years that the fact that Holland signed our best player to a $1.2 mill discount is hurting the team? The way i see it the only way our team could be worse next year is if Lidstrom retired or asked for more than he made last year. He could have demanded the league max and forced Holland to tear the team apart to sign him, because he is worth the league max. He could have retired and the wings could hope that they find his replacement in the draft sometime in the next....30 years, players like him come around once every generation or so and the fact that he played for the wings his entire career is a blessing. If you guys don't want the best player of the past 20 years there are 29 other teams that will gladly take him off our hands even at 40 y/o. Had he retired could we had a shot a getting Kovi? sure, but last time i checked Kovi doesn't play 28 min/game and wont shut down the other teams best players every game. Lidstrom has the kind of impact on games that Crosby and Ovechkin have and Holland signed him for close to $3 mill less than those guys are getting. I'am thanking the Hockey gods everyday(alot today)for allowing the wings to have players like Lidstrom, Zetterberg, and Datsyuk because every other team had a shot at drafting these guy and the wings could have the success that the Florida Panthers has had. Those of you that are complaining I want you to go root for the Panthers or the Thrashers next year so you can be humbled and because you don't deserve to be associated with the Red Wings. You are the reason that every other fan base can't stand us thinks we are entitled to everything. Could he have signed for 4 or 5 million? yes, but the fact that he still want to play and still wants to play for the wings is worth 6.2 million dollars. If you want to call him up and pay him 2 million out of your own pocket so he could sign for 4 mill im sure he would take you up on it.

Thank you for reading my rant and if you are very happy that Lids is just coming back and that you think Holland will work his magic and the wings will be a cup contender next year then this was not about you, i still have respect for you and if you are ever in Wyoming you are welcome to come watch a wings game at my house. <-- in 2011

We Wings fans can be a little spoiled.

Last year, there were fans coming on here and saying,

"I would have almost rather lost to the Ducks in the 2nd round rather than to the Pens in the SCF so we can be more motivated and better rested going into next year".

All I can say to that is, tell it to some Leafs fans and see what happens.

[cjm502]

Good news. Unfortunately, the 1 year deal sounds like it could be his last.

Mlive
This article gave me a glimmer of hope.

[jeff48109]

Im overjoyed to have Nick back, but still for so much is disappointing. I love him, but how are the Wings supposed to get better when we'll barely be able to retain our current team that was ousted in the 2nd round of the playoffs. Hopefully we wont have the same injury trouble and maybe that'll change our fortunes, who knows. Excited to see the rest of the moves Kenny makes this offseason.

you do realize we are getting Hudler back, that is an improvement over Williams.

[Konnan511]

That's because this discussion involves the West. As soon as Eastern players enter the discussion it's a retard rodeo. I won't mention who, and for the love of everything holy please don't do so either.

Let me guess who it might be from a certain "Bettman lead team": Craig F'n Adams!

[haroldsnepsts]

Maybe he didn't want to kick the guy most responsible for the Wings' success the past 15 years in the balls.

$6.2 is beyond fair for the organization and its something Lids can live with. That's most likely where that number came from....not some personal need to be the highest paid. It never was. Besides, if that were the case he'd be making $6.7+ next season given Datsyuk's salary. The "Lidstrom Cap" was awarded to him from Kenny for his financial sacrifices, not something Lids enforced.

Exactly.

And how many millions of dollars do you think the Wings have made off of Lidstrom in his career?

This deal was made in the real world, one apparently a lot of people here don't live in. If Nick is going to split up his family, and play another grueling year where he could get injured (like getting speared in the balls, for example), he should be compensated at or near market value for that.

Boof****** hoo that he didn't play for millions of dollars less than he's worth. That's not his job. His job is to play defense, and he's proven himself to be pretty f-ing good at it.

There are a lot of teams in the league who would've fallen all over themselves to get a 40 year old Lidstrom in their lineup. They probably have already worked out the math on how many more wins that'd get 'em in a season.

[GoWings1905]

I agree with you on Nick being underappreciated by Red Wings fans throughout his career. With that said,how much longer am I going to have to hear about how Nick is our best player? When will the Rosey Colored Wings fans acknowledge that he has declined even a little bit??

I may be splitting hairs here, but to me, Pavel has without a doubt surpassed him as our best player.

Take one away from the team and which would cause the bigger dropoff?

Easily Lidstrom -- I think you could make the case Datsyuk isn't even the best forward on the team, let alone Nick obviously being the best d-man.

Edited by GoWings1905, 01 June 2010 - 08:28 PM.

[soonboomer]

Imagine if he had gone to another team. What would he add to a team like the Caps? (Just a hypothetical.....don't you capgeeks go nuts on me)

[WingNut 25]

Count me as very disappointed he signed for the dollar amount he did. That hurts next year's team, plain and simple. This team was very unimpressive during the post season save for 2 games out of 12 and the addition of Hudler, while great, does not fix the problems.

[Peadydog]

After reading the comments that some of you have left regarding Lidstrom re-signing for next year I'am actually embarrassed to be associated with you. Have you been so spoiled over the past 15 years that the fact that Holland signed our best player to a $1.2 mill discount is hurting the team? The way i see it the only way our team could be worse next year is if Lidstrom retired or asked for more than he made last year. He could have demanded the league max and forced Holland to tear the team apart to sign him, because he is worth the league max. He could have retired and the wings could hope that they find his replacement in the draft sometime in the next....30 years, players like him come around once every generation or so and the fact that he played for the wings his entire career is a blessing. If you guys don't want the best player of the past 20 years there are 29 other teams that will gladly take him off our hands even at 40 y/o. Had he retired could we had a shot a getting Kovi? sure, but last time i checked Kovi doesn't play 28 min/game and wont shut down the other teams best players every game. Lidstrom has the kind of impact on games that Crosby and Ovechkin have and Holland signed him for close to $3 mill less than those guys are getting. I'am thanking the Hockey gods everyday(alot today)for allowing the wings to have players like Lidstrom, Zetterberg, and Datsyuk because every other team had a shot at drafting these guy and the wings could have the success that the Florida Panthers has had. Those of you that are complaining I want you to go root for the Panthers or the Thrashers next year so you can be humbled and because you don't deserve to be associated with the Red Wings. You are the reason that every other fan base can't stand us thinks we are entitled to everything. Could he have signed for 4 or 5 million? yes, but the fact that he still want to play and still wants to play for the wings is worth 6.2 million dollars. If you want to call him up and pay him 2 million out of your own pocket so he could sign for 4 mill im sure he would take you up on it.

Thank you for reading my rant and if you are very happy that Lids is just coming back and that you think Holland will work his magic and the wings will be a cup contender next year then this was not about you, i still have respect for you and if you are ever in Wyoming you are welcome to come watch a wings game at my house. <-- in 2011

Great post. If you ever head down to Denver from Casper, you are welcome to watch the Wings at my house. Or we could catch them at Pepsi Center!

[Lidstromboli]

Zdeno Chara - 7.50
Brian Campbell - 7.14
Scott Neidermayer - 6.75
Jay Bouwmeester - 6.68
Dan Boyle - 6.66
Wade Redden - 6.50
Dion Phaneuf - 6.50
Kimmo Timonen - 6.33
Chris Pronger - 6.25

These guys' cap hit is higher (this year) than what Lidstrom's will be next season. Would you rather have any of them instead? Wade Redden sure would sure look awesome in a Wings uniform

[newfy]

Zdeno Chara - 7.50
Brian Campbell - 7.14
Scott Neidermayer - 6.75
Jay Bouwmeester - 6.68
Dan Boyle - 6.66
Wade Redden - 6.50
Dion Phaneuf - 6.50
Kimmo Timonen - 6.33
Chris Pronger - 6.25

These guys' cap hit is higher (this year) than what Lidstrom's will be next season. Would you rather have any of them instead? Wade Redden sure would sure look awesome in a Wings uniform

Umm I would consider taking Chara yeah. Seriously people Lids is a great defenseman still, but he is 40 and is clearly on the decline. I'm not saying he sucks, but people claiming he is worth the league maximum are just as dumb as the people saying he's only worth 4 million.

Signing anywhere between 5.5 and 6.5 million is a reasonable cap hit, no lower and no higher. You don't get paid for how good you were in teh past,Lids is not a league maximum player.

[Ram]

Thank goodness, all I can say. Go Wings! Thank you Nick!

[soonboomer]

Umm I would consider taking Chara yeah. Seriously people Lids is a great defenseman still, but he is 40 and is clearly on the decline. I'm not saying he sucks, but people claiming he is worth the league maximum are just as dumb as the people saying he's only worth 4 million.

Signing anywhere between 5.5 and 6.5 million is a reasonable cap hit, no lower and no higher. You don't get paid for how good you were in teh past,Lids is not a league maximum player.

For this team, for one upcoming year, Lids at 6.2 is a better value than any of them. Longer term, obviously not.

[Doc Holliday]

Umm I would consider taking Chara yeah. Seriously people Lids is a great defenseman still, but he is 40 and is clearly on the decline. I'm not saying he sucks, but people claiming he is worth the league maximum are just as dumb as the people saying he's only worth 4 million.

Signing anywhere between 5.5 and 6.5 million is a reasonable cap hit, no lower and no higher. You don't get paid for how good you were in teh past,Lids is not a league maximum player.

Lids on the decline is still better than all those defensemen, minus Pronger (and that is arguable).

[Lidstromboli]

lets say you could have one of those guys for only one year

would you rather have chara or lidstrom