Would a real gritty fighter help or hurt this team?

[titanium2 867]

Here's our enforcer right here.

[newfy 695]

Enforcers aren't effective deterrents at all.

I have stated this repeatedly in other threads, but I'll say it again:

If you want someone to be afraid of the consequences of their actions, there has to be a chance that they will face them.

A 5-minute enforcer for Team A does nothing to deter Team B's 10-minute fourth liner from laying a cheap shot on Team A's star player. The chances they will play a shift against each other are low, thus low chance for consequences.

What you need are players in your lineup who actually contribute offensively and/or defensively AND can be a physical presence.

We don't need guys who can be physical and contribute offensively. We need guys who are tough and can find a role. We could have a tough guy that kills penalties well, or just a tough guy who is good enough to play a regular 4th line shift for about 8-10 minutes per game.

How many teams have a 4th line that each player will score 10 goals a season. Its just unrealistic. You said fights are a useless stat and bring up Probert being intimidating. The reason Probert was intimidating was BECAUSE the amount he would fight. The fact that he was crazy enough to sucker punch Mcguire after he fought Yzerman while the linesman had a hold of him made him intimidating, the fact that he would drop the gloves in a heart beat for his team made him intimidating, not because he was big and checked people. I guarantee you Probert scared players more then Ericcson does but theyre the same size. Its because Probert fought 25 times a season.

Players that play extremely physical will get in fights. Abdelkader for example in the playoffs got into 3 fights in like 11 games. Its because he was our only heavy hitting forward. It doesn't matter that he wasn't looking for fights, they just happen if you are a really good physical player. This is why your " fights are a useless stat is dumb". I can almost guarantee you that a guy with 5+ fights(5 prettym uch means they are willing fighters) in a season is a more physical guy with 0 fights. When speaking about physicality and toughness, fighting is definitely an important stat to list.

[eva unit zero 271]

We don't need guys who can be physical and contribute offensively. We need guys who are tough and can find a role. We could have a tough guy that kills penalties well, or just a tough guy who is good enough to play a regular 4th line shift for about 8-10 minutes per game.

How many teams have a 4th line that each player will score 10 goals a season. Its just unrealistic. You said fights are a useless stat and bring up Probert being intimidating. The reason Probert was intimidating was BECAUSE the amount he would fight. The fact that he was crazy enough to sucker punch Mcguire after he fought Yzerman while the linesman had a hold of him made him intimidating, the fact that he would drop the gloves in a heart beat for his team made him intimidating, not because he was big and checked people. I guarantee you Probert scared players more then Ericcson does but theyre the same size. Its because Probert fought 25 times a season.

Players that play extremely physical will get in fights. Abdelkader for example in the playoffs got into 3 fights in like 11 games. Its because he was our only heavy hitting forward. It doesn't matter that he wasn't looking for fights, they just happen if you are a really good physical player. This is why your " fights are a useless stat is dumb". I can almost guarantee you that a guy with 5+ fights(5 prettym uch means they are willing fighters) in a season is a more physical guy with 0 fights. When speaking about physicality and toughness, fighting is definitely an important stat to list.

True, Probert intimidated people because he would beat the s*** out of them, but that doesn't mean that he would be any less intimidating with no fights. If nobody was willing to fight him, maybe it's because he's even MORE intimidating than if he did fight? Physicality is one part of it. But number of fights is meaningless because you may not end up fighting if guys don't want to fight you because they would get destroyed. See Kirk Maltby for an example of this kind of behavior.

[newfy 695]

True, Probert intimidated people because he would beat the s*** out of them, but that doesn't mean that he would be any less intimidating with no fights. If nobody was willing to fight him, maybe it's because he's even MORE intimidating than if he did fight? Physicality is one part of it. But number of fights is meaningless because you may not end up fighting if guys don't want to fight you because they would get destroyed. See Kirk Maltby for an example of this kind of behavior.

Yeah but at some point Probert would've had to fight a lot to become as intimidating as he was. In his prime after being in the league for about 5 years he probably was at the peak of how intimidating he was. But he had to establish himself in the league as the toughest SOB around those first 5 years so that people would be scared of him.

And yeah there is always those cases where players won't fight but Maltby ran his mouth more then anything, he was never really a huge hitter(he was physical but not a huge hitter) and he didn't really try hurting people when he hit except when he hit Klesla.

Guys that fight can usually mean 2 things. They hit a lot so they have people come after them which also means more PPs, or you have a guy who can stop other peoples meat heads from rnuning around at our players on occasion. Either way I think its fair to say 9 times out of 10 a player who fights 5 times a season compared to soemone who never fights or fights once a year is going to be tougher in other facets of the game besides just fighting.

[Doc Holliday 1,888]

Kind of agree with the general obsevation here. Its not a fighter type per say what this team needs; but more grit like players who are willing to engage when neccesary. The Flyers Hawk's series illusstrated well the toughnes that is needed to go in the corners and all the way . The current Wings are a far cry from that with no change of direction in sight; this team is way too soft.

1. Soft play had nothing to do with the Wings getting beat in round 2.

2. The team can easily change direction before the season starts.

3. Apparently I like to do lists.

[newfy 695]

1. Soft play had nothing to do with the Wings getting beat in round 2.

2. The team can easily change direction before the season starts.

3. Apparently I like to do lists.

Even if the wings didn't get screwed in the playoffs by the refs etc. I still think the 08 team or last years team would've overcame that. Those teams were physically and mentally tougher then this team for sure.

Where was Kronwall all playoffs?

[Drake_Marcus 890]

1. Soft play had nothing to do with the Wings getting beat in round 2.

2. The team can easily change direction before the season starts.

3. Apparently I like to do lists.

4. .....

5. Profit!

Fixed it for ya.

Where was Kronwall all playoffs?

This part was crippling, in my opinion. Kronwall was a bigger part of the 08 win than most people think.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029]

I don't want a guy that's gonna run around,but take dumb,avoidable penalties.I want a guy who's tough as nails but disciplined at the same time.I want a guy who's gonna run around and answer the bell,no matter who challenges him,and a defensively responsible player.Obviously in today's NHL you have to be able to skate a little bit.This team would be a Cup contender if we got a little grittier on the bottom 6 and we tightened our defense.I believe the offense and the chemistry among players is there.I believe Jimmy Howard is solid enough to carry us.Just need a little more grit and we need go tighten up defensively

[Doc Holliday 1,888]

Even if the wings didn't get screwed in the playoffs by the refs etc. I still think the 08 team or last years team would've overcame that. Those teams were physically and mentally tougher then this team for sure.

Where was Kronwall all playoffs?

The 08 was up and down better all around.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029]

All said and done, who could really say no to Derrick Boogaard?

He would beat the s*** outta anyone who wouldn't want him on their team.