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uk_redwing

Holland Looking to sign an Enforcer

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And by the sounds of it, a heavyweight one at that:

Red Wings GM Ken Holland gave the Detroit News's Chris McCosky a roster update, and in doing so, he revealed that his one personnel goal during free agency involves adding someone who can drop the gloves when necessary:

"You'd like to bring in a Brad May or an Aaron Downey-type player, but if it's not there, it's not there," Holland said. "If we can't fit it in, we would go without it. It's just impossible to address every single need in a cap world."

If the Wings can't find a fourth-liner with bite, however, Holland suggests that the Wings have enough toughness to get the job done without a dedicated enforcer:

"We have some size on the back end, as well," Holland said. "We'd like an enforcer type, yes, but it has to be the right fit. We'll watch what moves are made over the next couple of months and see what shakes out."

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I think this is more Mike Babcocks doing than Hollands, but its all good anyway! :clap:

CanadaBoy and wings1110 like this

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There will be huge competition for those bottom 2 lines...

So they won't sign a D-man for that 6th spot? They will go with Ericsson-Kindl/Janik? huh?

Edited by mindfly

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I think he earlier said he's looking to sign an enforcer and that comment is more like saying he maybe won't be able to sign one after all. "If it's not there, it's not there." "If we can't fit it in, we would go without it." I wouldn't also be so sure about that heavyweight thing. He's just referring to two former team members who could fight.

Edited by Finnish Wing
Lidstrom for life likes this

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I think this is more Mike Babcocks doing than Hollands, but its all good anyway! :clap:

Why do you think that exactly? Was getting Hudler for example more Holland's doing then?

I think Babcock affects in all player moves regarding the big club. I wouldn't say he's any more pro-enforcer than Holland is. Babcock after all likes his team to control the puck and have the possession. I think that strongly involves players like Hudler.

Edited by Finnish Wing

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I think he earlier said he's looking to sign an enforcer and that comment is more like saying he maybe won't sign one after all. "If it's not there, it's not there." "If we can't fit it in, we would go without it." I wouldn't also be so sure about that heavyweight thing. He's just referring to two former team members who could fight.

That's pretty much exactly how I took it too. Holland has made this type of comment before during past off-season's and it seems to be his way of getting out of bringing in a player of that style. Bottom line, the Wings don't need another May/Downey. Unless Kenny can bring in a Drake-type of player, I hope he forgets the whole thing.

There will be huge competition for those bottom 2 lines...

So they won't sign a D-man for that 6th spot? They will go with Ericsson-Kindl/Janik? huh?

Sidenote: Terrifying

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It'd be nice if Holland would go out and get a guy who can play the game a bit and also drop the gloves, rather than pick up someone who gets minimal minutes and will only play 40 games a year. But that will cost some precious cap money and possibly personnel.

It's better than nothing I guess, but it'd be great to have a player like that around for a few years rather than this token effort Holland makes in the off season to pick someone up off the scrap heap.

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It'd be nice if Holland would go out and get a guy who can play the game a bit and also drop the gloves, rather than pick up someone who gets minimal minutes and will only play 40 games a year. But that will cost some precious cap money and possibly personnel.

It's better than nothing I guess, but it'd be great to have a player like that around for a few years rather than this token effort Holland makes in the off season to pick someone up off the scrap heap.

Exactly! I'd be more than willing to lose a guy like Miller and likely another if it meant adding a Drake-type of player to a multi-year deal. Someone that's in your face and goes to the corners, is tough and will also drop 'em, but can also play the game and chip in offensively from time to time. That's the type of guy this team could use!

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Well if not we can send Eaves and Abby to Bobby Probert's boxing school?

And not Ericsson. His ass needs to learn how to play defense first.

Edited by Ram
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Here Holland is complaining about not being able to sign the guys he wants and having his hands tied due to the cap but yet is still considering throwing money away on Maltby. Christ man, put money where its NEEDED.

uk_redwing likes this

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Why do you think that exactly? Was getting Hudler for example more Holland's doing then?

What are you on about with that?

Anyway, Babcock has always been pressing for a tough guy. He said he was pushing for Holland to sign Brad May five years ago and has always openly praised enforcers and his need for wanting someone to "keep the flies off" whilst Holland has always made these wiggle-room remarks.

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There will be huge competition for those bottom 2 lines...

So they won't sign a D-man for that 6th spot? They will go with Ericsson-Kindl/Janik? huh?

ok, I'll bite...

He didn't say he was signing Hossa or re-acquiring Osgood a few years ago either... Holland is smart and will not reveal his cards... for all we know, he's planning on a blockbuster trade at the draft, followed up by a big FA signing on July 1st(HIGHLY UNLIKELY) - but I wouldn't rule anything out until the roster is set in stone... one way or another, I'm pretty convinced we will get some good sandpaper in here...

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What are you on about with that?

Anyway, Babcock has always been pressing for a tough guy. He said he was pushing for Holland to sign Brad May five years ago and has always openly praised enforcers and his need for wanting someone to "keep the flies off" whilst Holland has always made these wiggle-room remarks.

I was just thinking what you meant with that. I mean, Babcock probably affects every moves Holland makes concerning the big club. I just don't think Babcock affected Brad May signing any more than the Hudler signing for example.

I just got the image that you were saying Babcock is somehow more pro-enforcer and more after tougher players. I feel Babcock is one of the few coaches in the league who prefers skill over toughness in many situations considering they way he wants his team to play.

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I was just thinking what you meant with that. I mean, Babcock probably affects every moves Holland makes concerning the big club. I just don't think Babcock affected Brad May signing any more than the Hudler signing for example.

I just got the image that you were saying Babcock is somehow more pro-enforcer and more after tougher players. I feel Babcock is one of the few coaches in the league who prefers skill over toughness in many situations considering they way he wants his team to play.

I think this is what Babs wants -

11 skilled forwards dressed every night

1 tough forward dressed every night

any forward that is skilled and tough - MAJOR bonus...

Defense help more on the ice, than the box, toughness for a defenseman should be judged in areas other than dropping the mitts...

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I was just thinking what you meant with that. I mean, Babcock probably affects every moves Holland makes concerning the big club. I just don't think Babcock affected Brad May signing any more than the Hudler signing for example.

I just got the image that you were saying Babcock is somehow more pro-enforcer and more after tougher players. I feel Babcock is one of the few coaches in the league who prefers skill over toughness in many situations considering they way he wants his team to play.

He did! He said himself he was pushing for Holland to sign May for years! :scared:

And again, he is! His Anahiem teams were always tough, he's always openly praised his tough guys and enforcers in general...I dont know what else to say...

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if abby would drop the gloves we really wouldn't need an enforcer.

Is that because players would be scared of Abbys fearsome might? :rolleyes:

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Here Holland is complaining about not being able to sign the guys he wants and having his hands tied due to the cap but yet is still considering throwing money away on Maltby. Christ man, put money where its NEEDED.

Yes I agree.. Maltby, Ilary, last season add Willy, maybe Miller they are plugs of the wrong kind. I'm not for getting a bonafide goon that can't do anything but fight but some money needs to be spent on what our grind line needs... players that will grind, hit and fight on occasion. At this point I would be happy if our 4th line had players that will finish their checks with some authority and play some decent offense.

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I think you bolded the wrong part of his quote. He mentioned ideally he would like to grab an enforcer, but he also alluded to the slim pickings on the market, especially for the particular molding Holland would be looking for. He also said he has no problem going without one if need be. I take that whole quote as saying "I know I told you guys that I was going to sign an enforcer a couple weeks ago, but I don't know if I will so much anymore..."

edit: also "keep the flies off" is quickly becoming the most used Quote of Babcock on LGW.

Edited by Echolalia

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He did! He said himself he was pushing for Holland to sign May for years! :scared:

And again, he is! His Anahiem teams were always tough, he's always openly praised his tough guys and enforcers in general...I dont know what else to say...

My image of Babcock is that he's one of the best coaches in the World and one of the few coaches in the NHL whose team play modern hockey. Modern hockey involves puck posession and puck control. Of course you can do that with players who have less skill as well, but it's easier to do with skilled players. Usually more tougher players are less skilled if you want them to be cap-friendly.

Maybe I'm wrong. Because I've seen changes in the way we play after McLellan left. Sharks play the puck posession style now, and I feel we don't play it the same way we did few years ago. We don't control the game like we used to. Everyone talked about how we lost Hossa etc. but I was pretty concerned at losing McLellan.

We'll see how next year goes, but Babcock is still considered one of the best coaches tactically right now. After McLellan left I began to think that McLellan was actually more involved tactically while Babcock was handled more of the mental coaching.

And in today's hockey you get nowhere by just shouting to the players. You have to know about the tactical elements as well. Different breakout rhythms etc. Like I said I still think Babcock can make this team play like they did few years ago controlling the game, at least I hope so. But maybe I'm wrong.

Yes I agree.. Maltby, Ilary, last season add Willy, maybe Miller they are plugs of the wrong kind. I'm not for getting a bonafide goon that can't do anything but fight but some money needs to be spent on what our grind line needs... players that will grind, hit and fight on occasion. At this point I would be happy if our 4th line had players that will finish their checks with some authority and play some decent offense.

What has this have to do with our NHL team's cap? Edited by Finnish Wing

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Yes I agree.. Maltby, Ilary, last season add Willy, maybe Miller they are plugs of the wrong kind. I'm not for getting a bonafide goon that can't do anything but fight but some money needs to be spent on what our grind line needs... players that will grind, hit and fight on occasion. At this point I would be happy if our 4th line had players that will finish their checks with some authority and play some decent offense.

I think everyone is reading WAY too far into a lot of this... most of the reports Holland "leaks" are lip service... I don't think there's any intention of bringing Maltby back, I think he's just saying that out of respect for what Maltby did for us and maybe helping him up his stock to latch on somewhere else...

As for Miller, he is an RFA and all he did was qualify him, that's just good GM work, if we can sign him for another 550k or so, he's a great filler and if we run out of roster spots, waive him and send him to GR, if he doesn't clear, well... it's no worse than had we never signed him in the first place, is it?

Next, Illari is waiver eligible and will likely be in GR all year, but if he impresses, could fill a nice filler role for call-ups and if we catch lightning in a bottle, then it's a GREAT signing - for the millionth time - ZERO risk, high reward potential - another GREAT GM move

And adding a guy who isn't afraid to drop them and muck it up, does not mean "goon" in today's NHL - Guys like Asham, Konopka, Artukyin, etc... are still bottom liners, but they can still skate and even occasionally score 10 a year... fillers with bite is really what they are, and THAT'S what you need in a cap world, fillers that fill a role and one of those roles, is to "keep the flies off"

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Is that because players would be scared of Abbys fearsome might? :rolleyes:

certainly not but in the sense that he's a good young energy guy and dropping the gloves to stand up for his teammates once in a while isn't really out of his comfort zone.

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What has this have to do with our NHL team's cap?

None of the above mentioned are factors affecting the cap of the current roster at the moment but it makes me wonder what he is looking at in terms of filling what we need right now and moreso when looking at the names in the list.

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None of the above mentioned are factors affecting the cap of the current roster at the moment but it makes me wonder what he is looking at in terms of filling what we need right now and moreso when looking at the names in the list.

Well if you're looking for a 1st line center for your AHL team I think that's better fit than someone like Carcillo for example. Edited by Finnish Wing

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