146 replies to this topic

[Finnish Wing]

He did! He said himself he was pushing for Holland to sign May for years!

And again, he is! His Anahiem teams were always tough, he's always openly praised his tough guys and enforcers in general...I dont know what else to say...

My image of Babcock is that he's one of the best coaches in the World and one of the few coaches in the NHL whose team play modern hockey. Modern hockey involves puck posession and puck control. Of course you can do that with players who have less skill as well, but it's easier to do with skilled players. Usually more tougher players are less skilled if you want them to be cap-friendly.

Maybe I'm wrong. Because I've seen changes in the way we play after McLellan left. Sharks play the puck posession style now, and I feel we don't play it the same way we did few years ago. We don't control the game like we used to. Everyone talked about how we lost Hossa etc. but I was pretty concerned at losing McLellan.

We'll see how next year goes, but Babcock is still considered one of the best coaches tactically right now. After McLellan left I began to think that McLellan was actually more involved tactically while Babcock was handled more of the mental coaching.

And in today's hockey you get nowhere by just shouting to the players. You have to know about the tactical elements as well. Different breakout rhythms etc. Like I said I still think Babcock can make this team play like they did few years ago controlling the game, at least I hope so. But maybe I'm wrong.

Yes I agree.. Maltby, Ilary, last season add Willy, maybe Miller they are plugs of the wrong kind. I'm not for getting a bonafide goon that can't do anything but fight but some money needs to be spent on what our grind line needs... players that will grind, hit and fight on occasion. At this point I would be happy if our 4th line had players that will finish their checks with some authority and play some decent offense.

What has this have to do with our NHL team's cap?

Edited by Finnish Wing, 22 June 2010 - 09:20 AM.

[stevkrause]

Yes I agree.. Maltby, Ilary, last season add Willy, maybe Miller they are plugs of the wrong kind. I'm not for getting a bonafide goon that can't do anything but fight but some money needs to be spent on what our grind line needs... players that will grind, hit and fight on occasion. At this point I would be happy if our 4th line had players that will finish their checks with some authority and play some decent offense.

I think everyone is reading WAY too far into a lot of this... most of the reports Holland "leaks" are lip service... I don't think there's any intention of bringing Maltby back, I think he's just saying that out of respect for what Maltby did for us and maybe helping him up his stock to latch on somewhere else...

As for Miller, he is an RFA and all he did was qualify him, that's just good GM work, if we can sign him for another 550k or so, he's a great filler and if we run out of roster spots, waive him and send him to GR, if he doesn't clear, well... it's no worse than had we never signed him in the first place, is it?

Next, Illari is waiver eligible and will likely be in GR all year, but if he impresses, could fill a nice filler role for call-ups and if we catch lightning in a bottle, then it's a GREAT signing - for the millionth time - ZERO risk, high reward potential - another GREAT GM move

And adding a guy who isn't afraid to drop them and muck it up, does not mean "goon" in today's NHL - Guys like Asham, Konopka, Artukyin, etc... are still bottom liners, but they can still skate and even occasionally score 10 a year... fillers with bite is really what they are, and THAT'S what you need in a cap world, fillers that fill a role and one of those roles, is to "keep the flies off"

[Mickey Redmond]

Is that because players would be scared of Abbys fearsome might?

certainly not but in the sense that he's a good young energy guy and dropping the gloves to stand up for his teammates once in a while isn't really out of his comfort zone.

[The Secret]

What has this have to do with our NHL team's cap?

None of the above mentioned are factors affecting the cap of the current roster at the moment but it makes me wonder what he is looking at in terms of filling what we need right now and moreso when looking at the names in the list.

[Finnish Wing]

None of the above mentioned are factors affecting the cap of the current roster at the moment but it makes me wonder what he is looking at in terms of filling what we need right now and moreso when looking at the names in the list.

Well if you're looking for a 1st line center for your AHL team I think that's better fit than someone like Carcillo for example.

Edited by Finnish Wing, 22 June 2010 - 09:26 AM.

[Mors]

I'll believe it when I see it. Holland is looking for some mythical creature for the 4th line who will score, hit, fight and do it all for $500k and either be European or over 35 years old.

[stevkrause]

I'll believe it when I see it. Holland is looking for some mythical creature for the 4th line who will score, hit, fight and do it all for $500k and either be European or over 35 years old.

so pessimistic... they drafted Mitchell Callahan last year (and signed him this year) and have Lashoff coming into the system on D from 2 years ago... he's obviously been drafting to get tougher and the signings of Downey, then May, prove that he WILL fill the need when it makes sense... bulldozers that can score like Lucic don't just fall in every teams lap and it's even harder when you're drafting late every year...

have some faith...

[uk_redwing]

I think you bolded the wrong part of his quote. He mentioned ideally he would like to grab an enforcer, but he also alluded to the slim pickings on the market, especially for the particular molding Holland would be looking for.

If he's looking for an Aaron Downey or Brad May type, then the market is anything BUT slim pickings.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros]

Take your pick Kenny:

Jared Boll (Yet to be re-signed by Columbus)
Brad Winchester
Zenon Konopka
Tanner Glass
Raitis Ivanans
Eric Boulton
Brandon Prust (RFA)
Tim Jackman
Krys Barch

[The Secret]

Well if you're looking for a 1st line center for your AHL team I think that's better fit than someone like Carcillo for example.

The other thought I have is that recently there have been alot of "potential" top rate european players brought into our farm system only to leave for home when they hit some bumps on the road in NA. Maybe its time to find a few local diamonds in the rough?

[Mors]

so pessimistic... they drafted Mitchell Callahan last year (and signed him this year) and have Lashoff coming into the system on D from 2 years ago... he's obviously been drafting to get tougher and the signings of Downey, then May, prove that he WILL fill the need when it makes sense... bulldozers that can score like Lucic don't just fall in every teams lap and it's even harder when you're drafting late every year...

have some faith...

I call it like I see it...there are at least 10 guys out there right now who could easily fill this role at a salary the Wings can afford. If Holland can't see them, then he's choosing not to.

[titanium2]

I felt like that article was more of a downer to those who desperately want some classic toughness on the team.

I mean, "If we can't fit it in, we would go without it."

Not something I imagine the pro-enforcer crowd likes to hear.

[stevkrause]

I call it like I see it...there are at least 10 guys out there right now who could easily fill this role at a salary the Wings can afford. If Holland can't see them, then he's choosing not to.

I agree - but until we ice a team on October 8th that does not include one of those guys, give it a chance... I, for one, am convinced one of these guys WILL be signed.

I felt like that article was more of a downer to those who desperately want some classic toughness on the team.

I mean, "If we can't fit it in, we would go without it."

Not something I imagine the pro-enforcer crowd likes to hear.

just playing his cards close to his vest... if he says "we need one at all cost" - it drives prices up and makes negotiations harder...

[HankthaTank]

Drake-type of player to a multi-year deal. Someone that's in your face and goes to the corners, is tough and will also drop 'em, but can also play the game and chip in offensively from time to time. That's the type of guy this team could use!

Jared Boll or Arron Asham please and thank you. As it has been said a

Boll-Apple Fritter-Patty Sunshine line would be a lovely 4th if I do say so myself.

[Finnish Wing]

The other thought I have is that recently there have been alot of "potential" top rate european players brought into our farm system only to leave for home when they hit some bumps on the road in NA. Maybe its time to find a few local diamonds in the rough?

It's the way of the AHL. Not every player continues in the organization, but what do we lose when it's FA signing? Not every player in the minors can be prospects. There are always some older guys who may only play a year or two but still help the team and possibly replace injuries for the NHL team when needed.

I see nothing bad with these kind of signings.

[titanium2]

just playing his cards close to his vest... if he says "we need one at all cost" - it drives prices up and makes negotiations harder...

True but the pro enforcer people on here know all too well the way Kenny appreciates or perhaps unappreciates the value of enforcers and true toughness and whatnot.

[HankthaTank]

True but the pro enforcer people on here know all too well the way Kenny appreciates or perhaps unappreciates the value of enforcers and true toughness and whatnot.

Not sure why... they have been on just about all Cup winning teams we have had.

[redwingfan19]

another holland quote :

“Ideally, yeah, we’d love to go out and get an enforcer,” general manager Ken Holland said Monday. “But I can’t make one up. We don’t have one in our organization right now, so I have one of two choices. Either I trade for one or I get one through free agency.”


C'mon kenny there are lots of guys out there that can fit the enforcer bill. Konopka is still my first choice because he can play every game and will come at the minimum.

[stevkrause]

True but the pro enforcer people on here know all too well the way Kenny appreciates or perhaps unappreciates the value of enforcers and true toughness and whatnot.

That's where the debate gets sketchy... I will argue until I'm blue in the face that a PURE enforcer is useless in today's game - but a role player that can protect his teammates AND is a mid-heavyweight, or straight heavyweight, which can still be defensively responsible, forecheck AND give you 8-10 SOLID, mistake free minutes a night, that doesn't take bad penalties is invaluable and is BADLY needed by EVERY team...

most of the mentioned players in other threads fill this need, however, a Boogard type player in today's league, doesn't serve much purpose and basically wastes a roster spot...

[F.Michael]

That's where the debate gets sketchy... I will argue until I'm blue in the face that a PURE enforcer is useless in today's game - but a role player that can protect his teammates AND is a mid-heavyweight, or straight heavyweight, which can still be defensively responsible, forecheck AND give you 8-10 SOLID, mistake free minutes a night, that doesn't take bad penalties is invaluable and is BADLY needed by EVERY team...

most of the mentioned players in other threads fill this need, however, a Boogard type player in today's league, doesn't serve much purpose and basically wastes a roster spot...

IMHO the Wings could use 2, or 3 of theose guys; 1, or 2 of them on the forward lines, and 1 on D.