Jump to content


Photo
* * * - - 6 votes

Red Wings Making Play for Modano


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
1068 replies to this topic

#981 CaliWingsNut

CaliWingsNut

    PeeWee Bettman

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,744 posts
  • Location:Sonoma County, CA

Posted 24 July 2010 - 02:22 PM

How does that even make sense? If we sign one 40 year old center to a one year contract then two kids want a one and done contract so they can get out, but if we don't sign a 40 year old Center to a one year contract they are interested in staying 2+ years? Modano, one aging player will drive two kids away in years that he isn't even going to be signed for? Sorry, I don't get how that makes sense.


That's cause your not considering the cap in your equation.

The difference between what will be available for $ when re-signing next year compared to 2 years (with money potentially lost in the second year of contract).

Figures don't lie, but liars sure figure. - Mark Twain


#982 Z and D for the C

Z and D for the C

    This is the TBL forum, right?

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,026 posts
  • Location:D, Michigan

Posted 24 July 2010 - 03:13 PM

How does that even make sense? If we sign one 40 year old center to a one year contract then two kids want a one and done contract so they can get out, but if we don't sign a 40 year old Center to a one year contract they are interested in staying 2+ years? Modano, one aging player will drive two kids away in years that he isn't even going to be signed for? Sorry, I don't get how that makes sense.


I'm not dreaming it up, it's just what I read. There is no reason to think that they'll leave next year if Modano signs.

Just cause you look like the gimp don't mean you play like the gimp!


#983 NomadFromKazoo

NomadFromKazoo

    Kaz

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 500 posts
  • Location:North Carolina

Posted 24 July 2010 - 04:49 PM

I'm not dreaming it up, it's just what I read. There is no reason to think that they'll leave next year if Modano signs.

I know we're tight on the Cap, what CaliWingsNut said makes sense. I'm not sure what numbers it would take to do one or multi years so I'm not sure what Cap hit they're discussing, but I see how it could be an issue they want more pay if they commit longer. Is that what you're saying the issue is? I don't see how else Modano would affect whether they re-up for one or multi years though.
Frank Herbert: Fear is the mind-killer

Groucho Marx: Sincerity is the key to success. If you can fake that, you've got it made

George Patton: If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking

Doctor Who: Don't turn your back, don't look away, and don't blink

#984 germanwing

germanwing

    2nd Line Scorer

  • Gold Booster
  • 576 posts
  • Location:Bayern

Posted 24 July 2010 - 05:09 PM

http://www.detnews.c...Modano-s-answer

#985 Jesusberg

Jesusberg

    1st Line All-Star

  • Gold Booster
  • 1,621 posts
  • Location:Windsor, Ontario

Posted 24 July 2010 - 05:19 PM

"It's been a decade-long question," Holland said. "But I guess the question is do you want Helm on the team, or a tough guy? Do you want (Patrick) Eaves on the team, or a tough guy? Do you want (Kris) Draper on the team, or a tough guy ...?"


I'm in no way an enforcer slappy, but YES I would like an enforcer over KRIS DRAPER.

#986 haroldsnepsts

haroldsnepsts

    "Classy"

  • HoF Booster Mod
  • 16,912 posts

Posted 24 July 2010 - 05:23 PM

I don't often agree with Scott Burnside, but I think he's got some great points regarding Modano.

http://sports.espn.g...cott&id=5403991


It will be interesting to see how the Mike Modano saga plays out. Will he retire? Will he go "home" to Michigan and give it one last shot with the Red Wings? (Detroit coach Mike Babcock said publicly he thinks it's a given Modano will be a Red Wing come October.)

To us, this is where nostalgia runs smack dab into reality.

Modano missed 23 games to injury last season while scoring 14 times from a mostly third-line position on the Dallas Stars. He averaged 14:18 a night in ice time and scored just three times on the power play. Modano scored just 15 times in 2008-09 and has posted only 12 power-play goals over the past three seasons.

We're not sure exactly how he fits into the Wings' plans to rebound from a trying, injury-plagued 2009-10 campaign that saw them fall in the second round to San Jose.


It's not an issue of whether Modano has the will to lace 'em up in September or October; but what is his will to play out an entire season? That seemed to be an issue in Dallas the past couple of seasons and explains in part why the Stars made the choice to walk away from a player who has been the face of the franchise for two decades.

If we were Wings GM Ken Holland, we'd take a run at Bill Guerin or Paul Kariya to add veteran scoring punch and give one of their young prospects a shot at centering the third line. Less nostalgic, perhaps, but in the long run, we're guessing it would be a more productive move with less potential for dressing-room headaches.


Edited by haroldsnepsts, 24 July 2010 - 05:23 PM.


#987 Original-Six

Original-Six

    1st Line Sniper

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 850 posts

Posted 24 July 2010 - 07:34 PM

"It's been a decade-long question," Holland said. "But I guess the question is do you want Helm on the team, or a tough guy? Do you want (Patrick) Eaves on the team, or a tough guy? Do you want (Kris) Draper on the team, or a tough guy ...?"


seems like the Wings prefer skill a over tough guy. Dont know why people expect different after all these years.

"But, Scotty Bowman was never one for the one for the one-dimensional tough guy," Holland said. "I've never been one. I think come playoff time those guys are obsolete, although they can be more valuable and important over 82 games.



Holland has answered.

#988 Buppy

Buppy

    1st Line All-Star

  • Silver Booster
  • 1,980 posts

Posted 24 July 2010 - 08:11 PM

How does that even make sense? If we sign one 40 year old center to a one year contract then two kids want a one and done contract so they can get out, but if we don't sign a 40 year old Center to a one year contract they are interested in staying 2+ years? Modano, one aging player will drive two kids away in years that he isn't even going to be signed for? Sorry, I don't get how that makes sense.

I think you're reading a little too much into that statement. But regardless, I just wanted to point out that the earliest Helm and Abdelkader could become unrestricted free agents (barring the Wings failing to qualify them or walking away from an arbitration decision...) is 2014. They could sign 1, 2, or 3 year deals, or 3 1 year deals in a row, etc., and they would still be RFAs.

#989 haroldsnepsts

haroldsnepsts

    "Classy"

  • HoF Booster Mod
  • 16,912 posts

Posted 24 July 2010 - 08:24 PM

"But, Scotty Bowman was never one for the one for the one-dimensional tough guy," Holland said. "I've never been one. I think come playoff time those guys are obsolete, although they can be more valuable and important over 82 games.

From The Detroit News: http://www.detnews.c...r#ixzz0ueXVrwjE


Riiight. I'm sure that's why Bowman brought in Grimson and brought back Kocur. Because they were such multi-dimensional players. He at least knew it was a necessarily evil.


Of course the ideal is a guy who can play and fight. What Holland doesn't mention is he hasn't made that a priority either.

Edited by haroldsnepsts, 24 July 2010 - 08:27 PM.


#990 mindfly

mindfly

    GRRRRR

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,170 posts
  • Location:The Multiverse

Posted 25 July 2010 - 08:07 AM

Datsyuk-Zetterberg-Holmstrom
Bertuzzi-Filppula-Franzen
Hudler-Modano-Cleary
Abdelkader-Helm-Eaves
Draper

Lidstrom-Rafalski
Kronwall-Stuart
Ericsson-Mckee/Hnidy/Other FA/Janik/Kindl/Smith(yes im very high on smith, not likely but surely not impossible)

Goodbye: Miller, Meech, Ritola(Dont wan't this but we all know they won't say goodbye to draper in his last year of his contract, typical Holland thing)

See no reason to complain, they can still get Modano AND a solid 6th Dman who can get the job done, and have 500k in capspace to bring up players on short-term injuries.

Thank you! Any mention of it comes back to track record.

I never said Holland was a bad GM. I never said that it made the Wings less successful.

If people would actually follow the thread of the conversation and not just jump in without knowing what the discussion is, they'd see I was responding specifically about how Holland has shown little to no interest in picking up players who fight as well as can play the game. He has built a certain kind of team. It is one where players who fight and mix it up are not a priority.


And again, I'm not saying I want the wings to model themselves after the Flyers. But I do believe this team could benefit from a little more sandpaper and a couple guys who can actually win fights when necessary.

To bring a fighter who who can play the game, that would definitely make detroit lose one of it's current top6 forwards, like Filppula.. is that worth it? maybe....maybe not... what players are you suggesting really? Fighter AND can play the game, not many of them in the league these days

Edited by mindfly, 25 July 2010 - 08:22 AM.


#991 DatsyukianDeke13

DatsyukianDeke13

    1st Line All-Star

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,229 posts

Posted 25 July 2010 - 10:51 AM

http://www.wingingit...-pass-on-modano

At first this whole Mike Modano to Detroit idea was intriguing, even a little exciting. Modano, who grew up in Livonia, coming home for one last chance to win a Cup. Who wouldnít get behind that?

Well, now it looks like nobody.

Red Wings bloggers across the nation have voiced their opinions, and the consensus seems to be a resounding "No to Mo." After dragging out his decision into what now looks like at least August, you can add me to the list.

The problem for me isnít about Modano waffling, or even the cap space that heíll take up. The simple, honest truth is this: the Detroit Red Wings really donít need Mike Modano.

With Modano on the team it would give the Red Wings five legitimate centers on the roster, assuming that deals with Justin Abdelkader and Darren Helm get done. The indication is that both will be on the team regardless of what happens with Modano. Mike Babcock has said that Pavel Datsyuk and Henrik Zetterberg will play together next season, leaving three spots for four players.

One of those spots will go to Valtteri Filppula, who is slated to center the second line. Modano presumably would get line three, centering Jiri Hudler and Dan Cleary.

That leaves Helm and Abdelkader duking it out on line four, along with Drew Miller, Patrick Eaves, and Kris Draper, who are all already under contract for next season.

Iím no mathematician, but I believe thatís way too many players.





Modano is nearing 41-years-old, but the guy can still put up 15-20 goals a season. After all, this is the all-time leading scorer among American-born players. But if signing Modano means pushing back promising young guns like Helm and Abdelkader back a year in their development, then the Red Wings should tell Mo "thanks, but no thanks."

Helm and Abdelkader both showed that they are NHL-ready last season. Helm is an excellent penalty killer and could become one of the most dangerous players in the league if he can find a scoring touch to go with his incredible speed. Abdelkader is a great agitator, and has come up with very timely goals in his sporadic playing time the past couple of seasons. And as the Detroit Free Press reported today, the Modano Saga is dragging out contract talks with Helm and Abdelkader. Until Modano signs, Helm and Abby are stuck waiting.

With Modano on the team, one of those guys is going to be watching a lot of games from the press box, and that wonít help either one of them.

But hey, at least Derek Meech will have some company.

Ultimately, Ken Holland is not going to turn down a chance to sign Modano. Heís expressed a lot of interest in him ever since the Stars axed him about a month ago, which included taking him on a super sweet date to Comerica to watch a Tigers game. If Modano wants in, Holland isnít going to say "Ehhhhh, I changed my mind."

And if thatís what happens, Iíll grit my teeth and get on the bandwagon for a year (or two).

After all, this is Mike Modano.
Mixed feelings about this
JERSEY SALE!!!!! PM IF INTERESTED!(I have international and red wings jerseys)
Posted Image

#992 redwingfan19

redwingfan19

    On a mission

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,523 posts

Posted 25 July 2010 - 11:21 AM

The Great Enforcer Debate.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IU1bzZheWk
You may not like tough hockey, but it's winning hockey.

Mitch Callahan: 48GP, 6G, 3A, 9PTS,+/- -3, 103PIMS

14 Fighting Majors

#993 esteef

esteef

    Legend

  • HoF Booster
  • 8,874 posts

Posted 25 July 2010 - 11:28 AM

I agree with you harold, but I'm too lazy to explain.

esteef
"The Wings haven't won a Cup without Darren McCarty since 1955."

#994 Doc Holliday

Doc Holliday

    LGW's impromptu Photoshopper

  • Silver Booster
  • 4,337 posts

Posted 25 July 2010 - 11:30 AM

Not sure why you're post got a -2, because I think you're actually asking relevant questions.


Did I now? Eh.

Teams do change. And I don't think skill has been overtaking grit as much as you make it sound. It has on the Wings for sure. But there are plenty of teams who still play the physical game. The Ducks and the Flyers being a recent example of two successful teams who play that way.


I agree, but in general there has not been as much grit going around. How many power forwards could you think of in the 90s? Now how many power forwards are there?

Although there are still teams that keep that grit all around in the system, not as much of it is going around which could be attributed to the greater focus on European players than years past. Perhaps not.

The ideal is not an enforcer. It's a third line guy who hits and is a respected fighter. Well, the ideal is a top three line guy who does that, but as you point out, they're hard to come by. I can't really fault Holland for not landing a Getzlaf. But there had to have been opportunities to bring in a guy who has the qualities of a Dallas Drake, but is not at the tail end of his career.


Understood.

But I feel I've beat this subject to death at this point.

A lot of it is frustration with Holland going after an aging, injury prone center when this team has much greater needs, toughness being one of them.


Very well then.

Posted Image


#995 chrisdetroit

chrisdetroit

    Hall-of-Famer

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,407 posts

Posted 25 July 2010 - 11:58 AM

Simple. Look at the lineup of the Red Wings in 1997 when Holland took over. Look at them now.

Of course the cap has had an effect, especially with how successful the Wings have been over that stretch, but other teams somehow manage to keep from getting smaller and softer every passing year under the cap.

Holland's only effort seems to be picking an enforcer up off the scrap heap late in the offseason, which is really the worst kind of effort because we'll end up with a guy who plays 5 minutes a game for 40 games.

But this is all really off topic for the thread.

Still, the Wings have more pressing needs than the ones Modano fills. Like a physical stay at home defenseman.



hahahah

And what has he accomplished since 1997. Do I need to go over the details? 1998, 2002, 2008. 'nuf said

Thank you! Any mention of it comes back to track record.

I never said Holland was a bad GM. I never said that it made the Wings less successful.

If people would actually follow the thread of the conversation and not just jump in without knowing what the discussion is, they'd see I was responding specifically about how Holland has shown little to no interest in picking up players who fight as well as can play the game. He has built a certain kind of team. It is one where players who fight and mix it up are not a priority.


And again, I'm not saying I want the wings to model themselves after the Flyers. But I do believe this team could benefit from a little more sandpaper and a couple guys who can actually win fights when necessary.



But, the sucess that Holland has proves you wrong. Yes, Holland has not made enforcers his priority and the result has been winning and lots of winning. So you point out that he has not made enforcers a priority. So what? Your point is moot.
Do or do not. There is no try

#996 NomadFromKazoo

NomadFromKazoo

    Kaz

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 500 posts
  • Location:North Carolina

Posted 25 July 2010 - 12:02 PM

hahahah

And what has he accomplished since 1997. Do I need to go over the details? 1998, 2002, 2008. 'nuf said

100 points in 10 straight seasons in the Cap era. When you look most of our team being out for long stretches and how we did it again last year it's truly amazing. How do we keep that much talent so deep we can be playing the guys we did and not fall apart? And with a rookie goalie as well for the critical stretch. The whole we're soft thing is so overplayed anyway.
Frank Herbert: Fear is the mind-killer

Groucho Marx: Sincerity is the key to success. If you can fake that, you've got it made

George Patton: If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking

Doctor Who: Don't turn your back, don't look away, and don't blink

#997 thedisappearer

thedisappearer

    Hall-of-Famer

  • Silver Booster
  • 2,194 posts
  • Location:gladly not, Texas

Posted 25 July 2010 - 02:10 PM

100 points in 10 straight seasons in the Cap era.

While I agree with the intent of your post, there have been 5 season of the Cap Era.
*this space for rent*

#998 Andy Pred 48

Andy Pred 48

    Coming soon,"the slovak line" Marek and 2 Toms!

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,865 posts
  • Location:Peterborough England

Posted 25 July 2010 - 02:58 PM

if the Wings dont get Modano there are still plenty of options out there. They could get a 5/6 D and a gritty 4th liner with the money they have set aside for Modano. what sort of money is Christian Backman looking for or is he signed in the KHL already? Is Alex Henry out with an injury, he could provide the grit as the 6th D and then go for a more productive 3/4 liner. Flip's old line mate Sean Bergenheim could be a good fit, but nothing is going to happen until Mike lets Kenny know of his intentions, either way I feel 1 or 2 currently on the roster will be traded to make way for new personnel.
"What are you guys doing?" Reggie Dunlop
"Putting on the foil coach" Jeff Hanson
"Yeah, every game, you want some coach?" Steve Hanson
"Er, no. No thanks guys." Reggie Dunlop
"Make sure they don't leave the bench!" Reggie Dunlop.

#999 mindfly

mindfly

    GRRRRR

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,170 posts
  • Location:The Multiverse

Posted 25 July 2010 - 03:31 PM

Christian Bšckman? God no, he's way too soft for NHL, he went back to play in the SEL last season and he looks good there but not a good fit for the nhl game

#1000 NomadFromKazoo

NomadFromKazoo

    Kaz

  • Member
  • PipPipPip
  • 500 posts
  • Location:North Carolina

Posted 25 July 2010 - 03:44 PM

While I agree with the intent of your post, there have been 5 season of the Cap Era.

That's true, the Cap era has been 5 years. Thanks for that observation, Disapperer.
Frank Herbert: Fear is the mind-killer

Groucho Marx: Sincerity is the key to success. If you can fake that, you've got it made

George Patton: If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking

Doctor Who: Don't turn your back, don't look away, and don't blink





Similar Topics Collapse

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users