Trade Idea with the Ducks

[Shaman 713]

C'mon... You at least have to package Maltby into the deal.

Meech brings so much to the table i thought it would be unfair to the wings to have to part with someone as good as Maltby, but ill throw in a 7th round draft pick in a year to be named later.

If they want to get really deep, ill throw in the right to Larson and grigorenko for Perry and Hiller

Edited July 10, 2010 by Shaman464

[hooon 1,089]

getFlaf for zetter!

getrdone

[esteef 2,679]

I think Rafi can foresee the future. He knew he would suck after a couple years in Detroit so he made sure he got that NTC.

esteef

[Guest Crymson]

Let's say Modano doesn't sign with the Wings. How about this trade? Wings send Brad Stuart to Ducks (obviously Stuart has to waive NTC, but he loves Cali right?)

Wings get RFA rights to James Wisniewski, we also get Todd Marchant.

Ducks get a quality minutes eating veteran defensemen and more cap room to re-sign Bobby Ryan.

Wings get a young experienced defenseman who can smash people and is willing to drop the gloves. Wings also get a speedy verteran center good at killing penalties and forechecking. He also has an expiring contract after this season.

Thoughts?

What a terrible idea. We trade the guy who by far hits more than any other defenseman on the team (top-20 in hits in the NHL last season), and who is our #2 defenseman in the defensive sense, for a #6 defenseman and a washed-out forward? Give me a break.

I think his NTC is up at the start of next season

I wouldn't say all that now. He has his times where he makes mistakes and they usually cost us big.

Please list for me three major mistakes he made last season.

Marchant like I said kills penalties adds more speed to the team and he can win faceoffs. What's wrong with having another guy like that if say Modano doesn't sign here?

We already have plenty of speedy penalty-killers. Their names are Miller, Draper, Eaves and Helm. Oh, and I think you're stuck in the 90s, because Marchant's speed isn't so special anymore.

What's wrong with having another guy like that? Well, you're proposing that we trade a very good defenseman who comes at a very reasonable price.

Let me know the next time Stuart goes out and does this to a guy who was smashing our team all over the ice.

So he can fight. Big whoop. That contributes virtually nothing towards closing the gigantic gap in skill between he and Stuart.

I think Rafi can foresee the future. He knew he would suck after a couple years in Detroit so he made sure he got that NTC.

You detest Rafalski. We get it. However, bear in mind that many of us feel he's a very good defenseman. I think having Lidstrom, the only defenseman in the league who makes virtually zero mistakes on the ice, on the team has made you utterly spoiled. Teams pay out the ass for defensemen. We badly needed one after Schneider jetted, and Rafalski was the answer. Devils fans were furious with their GM for making the lowball offer that compelled Raffi to look for employment elsewhere. Two years on, they still don't have anyone to replace him.

To be honest, I'd rather keep Stuart and move Rafalski but his $6mil cap hit doesn't make it as easy.

I think Holland's skill as GM---i.e., not making terrible moves like so many GMs in the league do---has made avid perfectionists out of many people on these boards. Because the team is very good and has no hideous contracts, and because people still want to make improvements, they make frequently-absurd suggestions for unnecessary trades.

Edited July 11, 2010 by Crymson

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029]

Wisniewski is not an upgrade over Stuart.I'm thinking Drew Miller,Mattias Ritola and Derek Meech to Anaheim for Troy Bodie and a pick

[Theophany 110]

Please list for me three major mistakes he made last season.

1. $3.75m contract on a #4 defenseman at best: Kronwall is a $3m defenseman and is far superior (more upside on offense and less prone to catastrophic breakdowns on defense).

2. -12 last season, only matched or beaten by Ericsson and Meech. Hell, Ville Leino and Jason Williams couldn't beat him, as hard as they tried.

3. Kronwall played in 48 games and put up 22 points. Stuart played in 82 and put up 20. Rafalski, a guy most people like to criticize on his play, put up 42 in 78 games.

I could go back and find game footage of some of his massive breakdowns in front of the net (not lifting sticks, not going to the body on a guy in front), but that would take way too much time. You can go back and take a gander for yourself if you really care about being objective.

[Guest Crymson]

1. $3.75m contract on a #4 defenseman at best: Kronwall is a $3m defenseman and is far superior (more upside on offense and less prone to catastrophic breakdowns on defense).

2. -12 last season, only matched or beaten by Ericsson and Meech. Hell, Ville Leino and Jason Williams couldn't beat him, as hard as they tried.

3. Kronwall played in 48 games and put up 22 points. Stuart played in 82 and put up 20. Rafalski, a guy most people like to criticize on his play, put up 42 in 78 games.

I could go back and find game footage of some of his massive breakdowns in front of the net (not lifting sticks, not going to the body on a guy in front), but that would take way too much time. You can go back and take a gander for yourself if you really care about being objective.

Would you care to read my post? I was asking for three major mistakes that Stuart made last season.

[Theophany 110]

Would you care to read my post? I was asking for three major mistakes that Stuart made last season.

Yeah, I read it and had you read my entire post, you'd have seen that I read yours, too.

Regardless "three major breakdowns" doesn't prove a player is bad. Hell, I can think of one terrible one Lidstrom had that led directly to a one-on-none break from our offensive blue line, and he's still one of the best defensemen to ever lace 'em up.

Overall performance is what we should be looking at, and Stuart isn't that good, hence why I said he's a #4 defenseman at best.

Not saying I'd take someone like Lebda or Ericsson over him, but he's overrated and overpaid.

[Hossa4Life 4]

getFlaf for zetter!

getrdone

What a joke of a trade. Why would we give up our future captain.

[Andy Pred 48 337]

still think Kenny should have gone after Jay Bouwmeester last year. Could have Lids replacement bedded in with the master for 2 years.

[Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029]

Speaking of possible Lidstrom replacements,Boston is already talking contract extension with Zdeno Chara.

[Zion 93]

I remember this game. Wisniewski smoked Doan, and then everyone spent the rest of the period/game going after Wisniewski. f*** Doan.

I do agree that we do need someone to straighten out players like Doan who run around hitting all of the Wings, with no one to even run them back with any authority (no offense to Helm, and I'm pointing to you Kronwall).

[Guest Crymson]

still think Kenny should have gone after Jay Bouwmeester last year. Could have Lids replacement bedded in with the master for 2 years.

He costs $7m, and his first season with the Flames was the worst season of his post-lockout career.

[Shaman 713]

1. $3.75m contract on a #4 defenseman at best: Kronwall is a $3m defenseman and is far superior (more upside on offense and less prone to catastrophic breakdowns on defense).

2. -12 last season, only matched or beaten by Ericsson and Meech. Hell, Ville Leino and Jason Williams couldn't beat him, as hard as they tried.

3. Kronwall played in 48 games and put up 22 points. Stuart played in 82 and put up 20. Rafalski, a guy most people like to criticize on his play, put up 42 in 78 games.

I could go back and find game footage of some of his massive breakdowns in front of the net (not lifting sticks, not going to the body on a guy in front), but that would take way too much time. You can go back and take a gander for yourself if you really care about being objective.

@#2 He played 82 games, games in which Kronwall missed and half of the other team missed, he constantly played against top lines on a depleted team, the fact that he was -12 is really a misleading stat for his play last year.

@#3 So? He was never brought here to play the offensive defensemen role. When the team was healthy in the playoffs he 6 points in 12 games and was +6. If you look at his stats hes a solid playoff performer.

[Ram 240]

1. I don't think he'll waive his NTC

2. Isn't Stu one of our guys who can really lay someone out? Why let him go? (Other than the fact he's part of the core we'll need when Nick hangs them up.)

=> No thanks.

[Finnish Wing 110]

I think Rafi can foresee the future. He knew he would suck after a couple years in Detroit so he made sure he got that NTC.

Whatta ya know! A Jedi.

[eva unit zero 271]

Stuart is arguably the second best defensive defenseman on the Wings. Second best overall? I don't think so. Second best on his pairing? That sounds much more accurate. He's also the only defenseman in the Wings' top four who can be traded; Rafalski has a NTC, Kronwall is our best defenseman after Nick and the core of our defense going forward, and Nick is, well...Nick.

As for the trade...Wisniewski would make a good depth defenseman on the Wings, but I wouldn't trade Stuart for him given the fact he made $2.75m last season and will be looking for a nice raise. He'll be more expensive than Stuart, but would likely still score around 25-30 points as Detroit's 4th defenseman. Ericsson, Kindl, and Smith provide enough high-end defensive youth that Detroit doesn't need to trade Stuart for a guy like Wisniewski. Fold the prospects we have into the big club before trading off reliable top-four vets in favor of a younger guy who might not even beat out the prospects on the depth chart.

So basically, it goes down like this:

Stuart ($3.75) for Marchant ($1.125)

The Wings also get the rights to RFA Wisniewski.

Sorry, that's not anywhere near a fair deal. The Wings get an aging depth forward who costs more than a million, plus the rights to a decent young defenseman, in exchange for a bona-fide top-four defenseman. The Wings have enough speedy defensive forwards, all younger and cheaper than Marchant.

Drop Marchant in favor of a 2nd round pick, and maybe then we'll talk trade.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Let's say Modano doesn't sign with the Wings. How about this trade? Wings send Brad Stuart to Ducks (obviously Stuart has to waive NTC, but he loves Cali right?)

Wings get RFA rights to James Wisniewski, we also get Todd Marchant.

Ducks get a quality minutes eating veteran defensemen and more cap room to re-sign Bobby Ryan.

Wings get a young experienced defenseman who can smash people and is willing to drop the gloves. Wings also get a speedy verteran center good at killing penalties and forechecking. He also has an expiring contract after this season.

Thoughts?

Not really all that familiar with Whiz. Is Marchant up in years though? Not sure if this is an even-swap trade.