Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 I was going through some old hockey cards and came across a ton of power forwards from back in the day like Rick Tocchet, Brendan Shanahan, Shayne Corson, Cam Neely, Wendel Clark, Kevin Stevens, etc. and i was trying to come up with names of power forwards in today's NHL and i could only come up with a handful. Is the power forward an "endangered species" in today's NHL? These are the true power forwards that i could come up with (and i know everyone has a different idea of what makes a power forward): Steve Downie Ryane Clowe Milan Lucic David Backes Brenden Morrow Chris Stewart Ryan Getzlaf Ryan Malone I think Hartnell could be added to that list, as well. I think Brandon Dubinsky of the Rangers could develop into one. When Ryan Malone is healthy, he's a force. He's ran into some injury problems lately. Getzlaf mucks it out in the corners, although he doesn't fight very often. If Dustin Penner developed more of a regular mean streak, and was willing to drop the gloves more, he would definitely be considered a power forward in my mind. To me, a power forward does it all. Puts up points, grinds it out in the corners and goes to the dirty areas to score, and doesn't shy away from the rough stuff Thoughts?? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Original-Six 254 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 Jarome Iginla Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Booster313 138 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 Franzen? Bert was at one point, still sorta plays that game. 1 Hockeymom1960 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jusek 437 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 James Neal and Bobby Ryan. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jollymania 162 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) Talking about power forwards has to be the most idiotic forum topic NO ONE AGREES and it will always turn into a s***storm Edited August 27, 2010 by jollymania 1 Shaman reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Original-Six 254 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 Talking about power forwards has to be the most idiotic forum topic NO ONE AGREES and it will always turn into a s***storm kinda like every topic..... 2 55fan and HankthaTank reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HankthaTank 1,100 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 kinda like every topic..... I don't know man...thinking its blueadams time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 Franzen? Bert was at one point, still sorta plays that game. Bert used to be a legit power forward. He doesn't play with half the edge that he used to. Talking about power forwards has to be the most idiotic forum topic NO ONE AGREES and it will always turn into a s***storm Then don't participate. 3 Original-Six, 55fan and ManLuv4Clears reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hockey Convert 55 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 Then don't participate. Yeah, I don't think the fact that some people will disagree is a valid reason to not have the discussion. Just try to at least consider everyone's points rather than getting all bent out of shape. Anyway, I don't think I've followed hockey seriously long enough to address the topic, but let me ask a question of Bruise and anyone else who wants it: do you think the decline is due to changing rules/trends in the NHL, or is it more that this type of player is rare and by chance there just aren't as many in the NHL at the moment? 1 55fan reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bring Back The Bruise Bros 1,029 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 Yeah, I don't think the fact that some people will disagree is a valid reason to not have the discussion. Just try to at least consider everyone's points rather than getting all bent out of shape. Anyway, I don't think I've followed hockey seriously long enough to address the topic, but let me ask a question of Bruise and anyone else who wants it: do you think the decline is due to changing rules/trends in the NHL, or is it more that this type of player is rare and by chance there just aren't as many in the NHL at the moment? I think it partially has to do with the change in rules, but i wouldn't put it all on the rule changes. The game is faster than it was in the '80s and '90s, can't clutch and grab like you used to. But i just can't blame the lack of true power forwards on a few rule changes. It's an interesting question. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Echolalia 2,961 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 I think it partially has to do with the change in rules, but i wouldn't put it all on the rule changes. The game is faster than it was in the '80s and '90s, can't clutch and grab like you used to. But i just can't blame the lack of true power forwards on a few rule changes. It's an interesting question. I think players are generally larger and more fit than in the past also. Power-forwards often rely on brute strength to barrel to the net, and that's not going to happen when everyone between you and the goalie is 200+ pounds. There seems to be an interesting graph supporting this idea here, but I don't have espn insiders so I can't know for sure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Original-Six 254 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) My idea of a power forward is 200+ pound 25-30+ goal scorer who will hit/fight on a regular basis. Pretty simple. Edited August 27, 2010 by Original-Six Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ben_usmc 253 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 The best power foward in the near future: Chris Stewart Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
McAwesome 754 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 I could see Evander Kane developing into a pretty good power forward, he just needs to hit the weight room as he's a little on the slight side (6'2" 195) but he has the hands, isn't afraid to crash the boards, and we all know and love what he did to Matt Cooke. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buppy 1,720 Report post Posted August 27, 2010 I don't think there are fewer power forwards. I think if anything there are just fewer 'star' type players in that mold who also fight. Ovie, Thornton, both Staals, Holmstrom, Nash, Doan, and Horton are a few that I can think of that make good use of their size and strength, even if they don't fight or aren't particularly physical. Then if you expand your definition to include players who aren't stars you find a whole host of players in that mold: Clutterbuck, Knuble, Byfuglien, Latendresse, Avery, and a lot more, depending on how narrow you want to define the term. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Motown4013 350 Report post Posted August 28, 2010 Yeah, I don't think the fact that some people will disagree is a valid reason to not have the discussion. Just try to at least consider everyone's points rather than getting all bent out of shape. Well said! Its a discussion board after all, isnt it? I'd definately put Franzen on that list! 1 55fan reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HankthaTank 1,100 Report post Posted August 28, 2010 (edited) Milan Lucic David Backes Brenden Morrow Chris Stewart Ryan Getzlaf Ryan Malone Those bolded are the true power forwards in this game right now. We can throw Doan-face, Ovie (also with skill), Latendresse as mentioned, Nash also mentioned, and Horton in there for sure as THE power forwards in this league right now. Edited August 28, 2010 by HankthaTank Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,794 Report post Posted August 28, 2010 My idea of a power forward is 200+ pound 25-30+ goal scorer who will hit/fight on a regular basis. Pretty simple. I agree. That was always the definition in the past, and I think the lack of many players like that nowadays has prompted many to include guys who don't fit the definition (like say Fraznen). So what we have now is a variation of the power forward, but definitely not the same thing as what there was in the late 80's and early 90's. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eva unit zero 271 Report post Posted August 28, 2010 The power forward. A skilled, strong offensive player capable of grinding in the corners, screening in front effectively without being easily displaced, and using their size and strength to overwhelm the opposing defensive players. For one, I've never considered fighting a required part of being a power forward. And to require it now, when fighting in general is rare, is even more ridiculous. How many fights happen per season? Probably fewer than happened per-TEAM in 1993. So physically powerful scoring forwards (maybe that's where the name "power forward" came from?) are basicallywhat we're looking for. Well for one, Shayne Corson wasn't, not did I ever consider him, a power forward. Excellent defensively? Sure. Great Grinder? Definitely. Power Forward? No way. He wasn't good enough offensively to get that title. Some guys in the league now who could be called a PF? Getzlaf, Perry, Ryan, Lucic, Iginla, Jokinen, E.Staal, Nash, Hossa, Morrow, Franzen, Zetterberg, Holmstrom, Kopitar, Latendresse, M.Richards, Doan, Downie, Backes, Malone, Lecavalier, Ovechkin, Malkin, Horton, Thornton A lot of those guys don't fit the "Score 30 goals, hit a ton, fight, get 200 PIMs" mold that a lot of people seem to have. I know some people wouldn't consider a lot of those guys power forwards. But these are all examples of players who will regularly use their physical presence as an offensive tool To compare based on my definition; yes Kevin Stevens was a good player, yes he had a good shot. But realistically, Jokinen has to use his body more to create offense, while Stevens could simply sit back and take the incoming pass from Mario Lemieux. Lemieux is another example of a power forward. He was physically large even for today's NHL, and played in a much smaller league, so a majority of his offense came from simply skating right through-over?-the defense and doing whatever he wanted. Granted, even in his later years, Lemieux was still far more offensively dominant than anyone else could hope to be. 3 seeinred, Frozen-Man and 55fan reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buppy 1,720 Report post Posted August 28, 2010 ...Some guys in the league now who could be called a PF? Getzlaf, Perry, Ryan, Lucic, Iginla, Jokinen, E.Staal, Nash, Hossa, Morrow, Franzen, Zetterberg, Holmstrom, Kopitar, Latendresse, M.Richards, Doan, Downie, Backes, Malone, Lecavalier, Ovechkin, Malkin, Horton, Thornton ... :looney: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WorkingOvertime 536 Report post Posted August 28, 2010 The power forward. A skilled, strong offensive player capable of grinding in the corners, screening in front effectively without being easily displaced, and using their size and strength to overwhelm the opposing defensive players. For one, I've never considered fighting a required part of being a power forward. And to require it now, when fighting in general is rare, is even more ridiculous. How many fights happen per season? Probably fewer than happened per-TEAM in 1993. So physically powerful scoring forwards (maybe that's where the name "power forward" came from?) are basicallywhat we're looking for. Well for one, Shayne Corson wasn't, not did I ever consider him, a power forward. Excellent defensively? Sure. Great Grinder? Definitely. Power Forward? No way. He wasn't good enough offensively to get that title. Some guys in the league now who could be called a PF? Getzlaf, Perry, Ryan, Lucic, Iginla, Jokinen, E.Staal, Nash, Hossa, Morrow, Franzen, Zetterberg, Holmstrom, Kopitar, Latendresse, M.Richards, Doan, Downie, Backes, Malone, Lecavalier, Ovechkin, Malkin, Horton, Thornton A lot of those guys don't fit the "Score 30 goals, hit a ton, fight, get 200 PIMs" mold that a lot of people seem to have. I know some people wouldn't consider a lot of those guys power forwards. But these are all examples of players who will regularly use their physical presence as an offensive tool To compare based on my definition; yes Kevin Stevens was a good player, yes he had a good shot. But realistically, Jokinen has to use his body more to create offense, while Stevens could simply sit back and take the incoming pass from Mario Lemieux. Lemieux is another example of a power forward. He was physically large even for today's NHL, and played in a much smaller league, so a majority of his offense came from simply skating right through-over?-the defense and doing whatever he wanted. Granted, even in his later years, Lemieux was still far more offensively dominant than anyone else could hope to be. The amount of fights in a season is no where near the per team average from the early nineties. The Flyers had 105 fights in the 1885-1986 season, which was a franchise high. Today it is not uncommon for teams to get 50+ fights in a season. They also had over 20 more fights last year than in 1993. Fighting is down from it's NHL highs, but your comment is severely erroneous. Zetterberg is not a power forward. Please show me evidence (or a consensus) that he is. Fighting is not a necessary to be considered a power forward. However, if a player is physical enough to use "their size and strength to overwhelm the opposing defensive players" they will likely be forced to fight. For someone to say that a player must fight to be a power forward is incorrect, but a good power forward is likely to be challenged often. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Broken 16 381 Report post Posted August 29, 2010 Discussing power forwards is so 90's. Let's discuss speedy centers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyerberger 279 Report post Posted August 29, 2010 Like any other term, it must evolve to fit the times. Eva more or less has it right: a power forward is a large and/or strong dude that uses his strength and body as a primary tool to get the job done. This involves a lot of physical play, such as being the go to guy in the corners, going to and occupying a position at or near the front of the net, and making a hole in the opposition's defense with said physical presence. Note that while hitting is part of physicality, physicality =/= hitting. Hence, in today's NHL, players like Franzen and Holmstrom fit the term power forward. While they do not compare entirely to the power forwards of yesteryear, they occupy a role that most closely resembles that of said players tailored to the rules and gameplay of today's NHL. 1 55fan reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wombat 26 Report post Posted August 29, 2010 Personally, I don't agree with labeling Getzlaf as a power forward. Perhaps I have a non-traditional definition of power forwards... but I usually don't think of centers as power forwards. I see power forwards as big, physical, goal scoring wingers. Most NHL players now are awfully strong, so I think it's harder for a power forward to shine above it all than it was in the past. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,794 Report post Posted August 29, 2010 Personally, I don't agree with labeling Getzlaf as a power forward. Perhaps I have a non-traditional definition of power forwards... but I usually don't think of centers as power forwards. I see power forwards as big, physical, goal scoring wingers. Most NHL players now are awfully strong, so I think it's harder for a power forward to shine above it all than it was in the past. So you wouldn't call Lindros a power forward? I guess the definition is indeed very subjective, as evidenced by all the different posts already in this thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites