esteef 2,679 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 (edited) esteef rulz. Edited September 30, 2010 by esteef 1 henrik40 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 (edited) I don't get how this is important. You claimed that every single team uses a Downey-like player. Washington did not have one last year, and they were enormously successful. They also had 20 fights last season, so... Edited September 30, 2010 by haroldsnepsts Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Funny part is that the Flyers went to the finals, farther then Detroit... One run makes a team, amirite? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hockeytown0001 7,652 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Not to mention they had a little luck with not only playing in the East, but with Boston pulling the greatest choke-job in 30+ years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
haroldsnepsts 4,826 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 The enforcer debates get ridiculous because it gets so overstated by both sides. Of course an enforcer is not going to somehow guarantee you'll go further in the playoffs, or clearly prevent injuries. But the thing is, players and coaches sure seem to like having guys in the lineup who will stick up for teammates and help prevent crap that happens after the whistle "to keep the flies off" as Babcock puts it. It's silly to pretend that's not a facet of the game, and a legitimate one. The ideal is someone who can play and fight, which Downey sure isn't. As I've said before, Holland makes a token gesture to pick a player up off the scrap heap who will fight. those guys are never going to be particularly talented, and likely not even great fighters. 2 F.Michael and ManLuv4Clears reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 The enforcer debates get ridiculous because it gets so overstated by both sides. Of course an enforcer is not going to somehow guarantee you'll go further in the playoffs, or clearly prevent injuries. But the thing is, players and coaches sure seem to like having guys in the lineup who will stick up for teammates and help prevent crap that happens after the whistle "to keep the flies off" as Babcock puts it. It's silly to pretend that's not a facet of the game, and a legitimate one. The ideal is someone who can play and fight, which Downey sure isn't. As I've said before, Holland makes a token gesture to pick a player up off the scrap heap who will fight. those guys are never going to be particularly talented, and likely not even great fighters. If we have players on the roster that will stick up for teammates, then why is there so much fanfare about having a token enforcer in the lineup? Bertuzzi went after Orpik. Eaves has gotten in a scrap. Abdelkader seems to have no problem with fighting even though he isn't any good at it. It's not like Datsyuk and Zetterberg are softies either when it comes to confrontation. Hell even Cleary got into a scrap with Pronger at one point. The need for one select guy to play 4 minutes a night and keep the flies off is grossly overstated. 1 dobbles reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jesusberg 1,256 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Kinda sucks, but what can ya do? I'm not overly pro or anti-enforcer, but I like Downey's attitude and philosophy. Hopefully a guy like Mitchell Callahan can continue to develop and put on some muscle too. I think the new type of enforcer that we might see is going to have to be a 20-30 point scorer, while still dropping the gloves. Who knows, but a lot of the pure enforcers are being weeded out, it would seem. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 The need for one select guy to play 4 minutes a night and keep the flies off is grossly overstated. Grossly overstated by every team in the league. esteef 1 GMRwings1983 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Grossly overstated by every team in the league. esteef Most teams have more than one select guy to do the "dirty" work for them. Argument from majority is meaningless, anyway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Most teams have more than one select guy to do the "dirty" work for them. Argument from majority is meaningless, anyway. You say meaningless, I say valid. I'd rather have more than one guy too. esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GoWings1905 2,694 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 (edited) Funny part is that the Flyers went to the finals, farther then Detroit... Come on, having Dan Carcillo on the team isn't the reason they went further than the Red Wings. The Flyers rack up PIM's every single season and where's their Stanley Cup to show for it? The Flyers play in the Eastern Conference and Boston gift-wrapped a series for them. To the Flyers credit, however, they have some incredible depth at forward and a solid defense. Hey, Anaheim is bigger and tougher than the Red Wings and they sure made a splash last season. Edited September 30, 2010 by GoWings1905 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hockeytown0001 7,652 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 I see what you did there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 You say meaningless, I say valid. I'd rather have more than one guy too. esteef Cool story, bro. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Yup - especially Franzen...Seems like Dats, and Hank have an uncanny way of avoiding alot of the cheap shots, but Franzen on the other hand Yeah, amazing how Dats and Zetterberg magically avoid these cheapshots that never happen. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Yeah, amazing how Dats and Zetterberg magically avoid these cheapshots that never happen. Gross overstatement. Hello kettle! esteef Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Gross overstatement. Hello kettle! esteef Shut up, pot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Cool story bro I'm sorry, at least I don't assume that because a certain player was not affected by a cheap-shot they were able to "avoid" getting affected by one. You are the one creating nonexistent cheap shot attempts to prove a point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kira 451 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Aaron came into camp with a wonderful attitude and worked his butt off. Unfortunately all it takes is one twist of fate, and it's all for naught. Whatever you do, Aaron, it was great to see you again. And thanks for the hugs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Oh that's right...Cheapshots (even attempted) never happen to star players. Yes, that's exactly what I said. You're missing the point of my post. I didn't miss it at all. You made the assertion that Datsyuk and Zetterberg were not injured by cheapshots because they are able to avoid attempted ones. That is just plain ridiculous. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,794 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 That we got farther with a "weaker" team"? Or, the people who don't care about the enforcer issue don't whine like a 7 year old girl with a skinned knee about it? personally, i don't get worked up over 4th liners, especially when we're not talking about developing young talent. So you only complain when the status quo agrees with you? Kind of pointless to post on a message board if you're afraid to share your opinion, even if it conflicts with popular opinion. I just don't remember any of you guys talking about how useless enforcers are when they were in our lineup. You only do it after the fact, and when others agree with you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Pred 48 337 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Still on the FA list, skates ok, plays well enough for the 4th or 3rd line, has untapped potential possably the strongest player in the NHL and is a fr###ing beast! Evgeny Artyukhin Get it done Kenny, I can live with some of his dumb pens he'd be a cult hero in Hockeytown. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Doc Holliday 1,888 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Seems like Dats, and Hank have an uncanny way of avoiding alot of the cheap shots, but Franzen on the other hand. If you look closely you'll see that there are slight differences. That implies there are a good number attempted cheapshots that they avoid. Once again, simply ridiculous, and is the same concept that I argued against in the post you quoted. GMR: I've never said that enforcers were a vital part of the team, even when guys like May were on the team. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kira 451 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 Aaron came to camp with a great attitude and worked hard. But one twist of fate and it's all for naught. It was great to see you again, Aaron, and thanks for the hugs. Good luck and good journeys. 1 crotty99 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,794 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 (edited) That implies there are a good number attempted cheapshots that they avoid. Once again, simply ridiculous, and is the same concept that I argued against in the post you quoted. GMR: I've never said that enforcers were a vital part of the team, even when guys like May were on the team. I wasn't talking about you in particular. I just don't remember anyone starting a thread talking about how Downey or May should be benched for more useful 4th liners from GR, or something like that. Edited September 30, 2010 by GMRwings1983 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
esteef 2,679 Report post Posted September 30, 2010 .....IMO Dats, and Hank have those similar abilities to avoid many (read not ALL) of the attempted runs taken at them. Just ask Mike Grier! esteef 1 woodrow40 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
