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Guest BCM

What is the purpose of the Game Winning Goal statistic?

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Guest BCM

By its name it sounds like it somehow indicates how clutch a guy is, but it's a completely useless stat.

If it's tied 2-2 and Zetterberg scores with a couple seconds left to win the game, then that's a clutch goal.

But the score could just as easily be 5-0 in the first period, with Mule having the game winner since he scored the first goal. Then the Wings get sloppy late in the third and the opponent scores a meaningless goal to make it 5-1. Zetterberg had the second goal, which means he now gets the game winning goal. Clutch? Not exactly.

It's useless.

Very well said and I am in 100% agreement with you. But we still don't quite know why the NHL has this stat and what they are trying to convey with it.

I think game winning goal and +/- are a similar type of stat when they stand out when i guy is +20 you know there is something special about that player, when a guy has 12 Game winning goals in the playoffs you know he wants to win bad he is battling he is showing heart.

To me its a good stat when measure in extremes.

Please explain how Brent Burns scoring a goal in the third period causes Henrik Zetterberg to show less heart while causing Dan Cleary to show more heart?

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Very well said and I am in 100% agreement with you. But we still don't quite know why the NHL has this stat and what they are trying to convey with it. Please explain how Brent Burns scoring a goal in the third period causes Henrik Zetterberg to show less heart while causing Dan Cleary to show more heart?

All this stat says is who scored the goal which was one more than the other team scored, in order to win the game. No where does it say that that player played harder or more clutch than anyone else. You are reading way to much into the statistics.

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Guest BCM

All this stat says is who scored the goal which was one more than the other team scored, in order to win the game. No where does it say that that player played harder or more clutch than anyone else. You are reading way to much into the statistics.

Cleary scored his goal before it was known it would be one more than the Wild ended up with at the end of the game. If the Wild had scored one more goal, the GWG would have shifted to Draper. So it is really just arbitrary. What does the NHL want to convey with such a meaningless and arbitrary stat?

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Guest BCM

Based on this thread, I think the NHL should only count GWG in games where a team only wins by 1 goal.

:thumbup:

Seriously.

That makes no sense at all. Imagine if your team goes up 5-0 and then loses 5-4. The fifth goal for your team is the GWG. But at the time it was scored, it was simply a lead-padding goal. How is the fifth goal any more significant - when it was scored - if the opposition scores four than if they score just one?

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That makes no sense at all. Imagine if your team goes up 5-0 and then loses 5-4. The fifth goal for your team is the GWG. But at the time it was scored, it was simply a lead-padding goal. How is the fifth goal any more significant - when it was scored - if the opposition scores four than if they score just one?

Then the goal was just enough for the win, and more than just padding stats at the end of the day.

That's a lot more impressive then giving out a GWG in a 5-1 game, as said by previous posters. Also, I was thinking more of a scenario where it's a close game, where having a GWG then becomes a big deal and is considered clutch.

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Guest BCM

Then the goal was just enough for the win, and more than just padding stats at the end of the day.

In the case of a 5-0 lead which ends up being a 5-4 win, each one of the five goals of the winning team was just enough for the win. No particular goal was worth more than any other goal. They are all equal in value.

That's a lot more impressive then giving out a GWG in a 5-1 game, as said by previous posters. Also, I was thinking more of a scenario where it's a close game, where having a GWG then becomes a big deal and is considered clutch.

A goal that puts you up 5-0 is no more impressive if the opposing team scores four goals or scores just one goal after your 5-0 lead. Why? Because either way, it put your team up 5-0.

If you want to have a clutch goal stat, then let's discuss ideas.

How about any goal scored in the last five minutes or overtime at which time there was no more than one goal separating the teams. That's fairly simple. And it does a much better job measuring clutch than the GWG does.

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In the case of a 5-0 lead which ends up being a 5-4 win, each one of the five goals of the winning team was just enough for the win. No particular goal was worth more than any other goal. They are all equal in value.

A goal that puts you up 5-0 is no more impressive if the opposing team scores four goals or scores just one goal after your 5-0 lead. Why? Because either way, it put your team up 5-0.

If you want to have a clutch goal stat, then let's discuss ideas.

How about any goal scored in the last five minutes or overtime at which time there was no more than one goal separating the teams. That's fairly simple. And it does a much better job measuring clutch than the GWG does.

I guess you could look at it that way, but I don't think all goals are equally important. Otherwise, even your proposal is pointless, because any of the other goals scored in the game become just as important as that goal in the last five minutes.

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Guest BCM

I guess you could look at it that way, but I don't think all goals are equally important.

Thus my proposal of the "clutch goal" stat.

Otherwise, even your proposal is pointless, because any of the other goals scored in the game become just as important as that goal in the last five minutes.

I'm not quite sure I understand what you're getting at. Can you elaborate?

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Cleary scored his goal before it was known it would be one more than the Wild ended up with at the end of the game. If the Wild had scored one more goal, the GWG would have shifted to Draper. So it is really just arbitrary. What does the NHL want to convey with such a meaningless and arbitrary stat?

It is really that arbitrary. Who says stats always mean something. They are just numbers. Yes, Draper would have received the GWG, if Minnesota scored another goal, because his goal was the one that would have put the Wings over the top.

Thus my proposal of the "clutch goal" stat.

So, you are questioning something as simple as who got the goal that put the team over the top, and you want another statistic to add to it?

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Thus my proposal of the "clutch goal" stat.

I'm not quite sure I understand what you're getting at. Can you elaborate?

If it's 4-4 and someone scores the 5th goal with say 4 minutes left, and the game ends 5-4, you could then say that the other 4 goals were just as important as the go ahead goal.

Hence, every goal counts equally, no matter when scored.

Edited by GMRwings1983

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I think this stat does have a use, you just have to use a much larger sample size and look at the goal/gwg ratio. If a player has 30 goals in 60 games, and 15 of those are gwg's that could be solid evidence to weather they are clutch but im not sure if there are any NHL players with half as many gwgs as goals.

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GWG is a nice, easy stat to understand. It's not meant to measure clutchness. Sure, you can develop those types of stats, but they tend to be more complicated to calculate and understand, and sometimes are just convoluted. Look at sabermetrics in baseball... some are really useful, but aren't as easy to list in the newspaper like batting average.

Many hockey stats are the same way. Yes, the first goal in a 5-0 game is just as much of a GWG as an OT one. Assists are the same... they don't measure the playmaking ability of a player. A perfect setup gets as many assists as a guy shooting it off the goalie's chest if a teammate gets the rebound. Even goals don't measure shooting ability. A perfect slapshot goal is just the same as if the puck bounces off of a guy's face into the goal.

Point is, don't imply that the stat is telling you something that it's not. Goals aren't about shooting ability... it's about who last touched the puck that went into the net. Assists aren't about playmaking ability... it's about who was the 2nd or 3rd last player to touch a puck that went into the net. GWGs don't measure clutchness... it's about who scored the goal that gives the winning team 1 more goal than the losing team at game end.

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