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1/4 GDT: Red Wings 5 at Oilers 3


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#561 VM1138

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Posted 04 January 2011 - 11:50 PM

How many did Ozzie let in today?


And if we lost the game it would be because Ozzie let in a weak one. I fail to see what puts Ozzie over Howard right now when they both are letting in 3 goals against in their own way.



Ozzie let in one soft goal. Howard lets in three a game, that was my point. THen there are additional goals that aren't their fault.

Therefore we have a 5-3 win with Ozzie instead of a 5-3 loss with Howard.
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#562 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 04 January 2011 - 11:53 PM

Glad to get the win. And goalie wars aside, this team still doesn't know how to clamp it down defensively.

#563 dragonballgtz

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Posted 04 January 2011 - 11:54 PM

Ozzie let in one soft goal. Howard lets in three a game, that was my point. THen there are additional goals that aren't their fault.

Therefore we have a 5-3 win with Ozzie instead of a 5-3 loss with Howard.

You mean the goals that are deflected or the ones that his own teammates put in are bad goals?

#564 gcom007

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:09 AM

How many did Ozzie let in today?


And if we lost the game it would be because Ozzie let in a weak one. I fail to see what puts Ozzie over Howard right now when they both are letting in 3 goals against in their own way.


Well, if you went back and looked at the last GDT, you'd see my response to Howard getting pulled as "Why the hell is Osgood in? This isn't on Howard." I thought it was an odd time to dump on Howard as he'd played far worse in other games, though i guess it was the straw that broke the camels back. And he hasn't been winning so well lately.

Not only that, at the very least, Howard is playing particularily below the level he showed last season and it'll be going on 2 months now real fast if something doesn't change. His record, GAA and sv. % over that time are brutal.

Meanwhile, despite coming off injury and not getting many games, Osgood has had nothing but strong outings even in losses. Look it up in the recaps and write-ups if you don't recall. Even in the losses, Osgood was praised for playing solid and doing all he could far more often than not.

He's been on the way up despite not getting much work while Howard's been on the way down, perhaps getting overworked. He hasn't looked impressive more often than not while Osgood has looked impressive and closer and closer to his old form. And again with Howard, you can clearly see his own frustration mounting and I think if anything, thats why he got pulled in the last game. Despite it not being his fault on those 2 tips, he was just losing his composure over it, probably because not much has been going right for him lately.

With Osgood playing well and Jimmy struggling, it just makes sense to balance things out again and see how it plays out down the stretch. Simple as that.
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#565 Dynheart

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:13 AM

You know...some of you people really do NOT think. So Osgood let in 3 goals out of 21 shots. Guess what...He faced the more dangerous shots agaist out of the two goalies tonight. 3 out of 21...YOu watch the game and throw out a stat like that...you did watch the game, right(Ozzie haters)? Two goals he had no chance on...3rd goal, well...stuff happens. But you are honestly going to sit there and type crap like "3 goals in 21 shots...normal form" crap, atleast know what you're talking about.

It's funny really. Ozzie could face 20 shots, 15 of them could be odd man rushes (2-1/3-1s), let in 3 goals and you'll sit there and say "3 goals in 20 shots.

I will give you Howie has been facing tipped shots and off his players skaes shots recently, but only recently (hasn't been happening for the last month and a half). Ozzie faced, what, 3 tip/redirections tonight. Zero went in.

The end of the day, it's about the quality of the shots, not the quanity... Even though he faced more shots, Khabby had it easy compared to Ozzie.

#566 dragonballgtz

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:14 AM

Well, if you went back and looked at the last GDT, you'd see my response to Howard getting pulled as "Why the hell is Osgood in? This isn't on Howard." I thought it was an odd time to dump on Howard as he'd played far worse in other games, though i guess it was the straw that broke the camels back. And he hasn't been winning so well lately.

Not only that, at the very least, Howard is playing particularily below the level he showed last season and it'll be going on 2 months now real fast if something doesn't change. His record, GAA and sv. % over that time are brutal.

Meanwhile, despite coming off injury and not getting many games, Osgood has had nothing but strong outings even in losses. Look it up in the recaps and write-ups if you don't recall. Even in the losses, Osgood was praised for playing solid and doing all he could far more often than not.

He's been on the way up despite not getting much work while Howard's been on the way down, perhaps getting overworked. He hasn't looked impressive more often than not while Osgood has looked impressive and closer and closer to his old form. And again with Howard, you can clearly see his own frustration mounting and I think if anything, thats why he got pulled in the last game. Despite it not being his fault on those 2 tips, he was just losing his composure over it, probably because not much has been going right for him lately.

With Osgood playing well and Jimmy struggling, it just makes sense to balance things out again and see how it plays out down the stretch. Simple as that.

Seeing as how both goalies are damn near allowing 3 goals against every game this past month I see it as more of a bad team defense issue. For people to call out Ozzie like he is a hero these past few games is ridiculous.

#567 Dynheart

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:19 AM

Seeing as how both goalies are damn near allowing 3 goals against every game this past month I see it as more of a bad team defense issue. For people to call out Ozzie like he is a hero these past few games is ridiculous.


Why not, though? He made key saves tonight. Two out of the three was an open man...point blank...with time to shoot...in the slot no-less. If you expect those oppertunities to be a routine save then you obviously have crazy expectations. Third goal, meh...it stunk. But he made atleast 4-5 sure goal saves tonight. The wings could have easly lost this game if he didn't make key saves (team moral is a huge thing in hockey...or any sport for that matter).

Edited by Dynheart, 05 January 2011 - 12:20 AM.


#568 LidsFan

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:22 AM

I am so happy Ozzie got the win! I really miss Eaves, I hope that he gets to play in the next game.

#569 Drake_Marcus

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:24 AM

Franzen and Lidstrom both made huge saves tonight (Franzen's being the more impressive one). Ozzy was great too, even if the last goal was very deflating.

How about Helm's goal? That was slick. :thumbup:
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#570 SDavis35

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:24 AM

Seeing as how both goalies are damn near allowing 3 goals against every game this past month I see it as more of a bad team defense issue. For people to call out Ozzie like he is a hero these past few games is ridiculous.


Come on... this is LGW, everything is ridiculous. Remember two months ago when these same people were calling for Ozzie's head? It's pretty simple, Ozzie screwed up on a softie, Howard's been average, and our defense hasn't been able to play a full 60, gotta work the kinks out soon, but I say Osgood's been making some big saves lately, and Howard was not. Howard's definitely working hard (imo) but things aren't hitting him and that's why we play the backup.

#571 titanium2

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:26 AM

1st goal against I feel like both Ericsson and Helm are to blame but moreso Ericsson. He definitely could've made a simpler play that didn't lead to a turnover in the neutral zone that led to whole unit scrambling to get back on defense. I mean, sure, the others missed assignments but I feel like it all started with that turnover.

2nd goal against it seemed like Hudler was lacking in defensive zone awareness.

3rd goal was definitely a soft one on Ozzie but Filppula is slightly responsible for losing a faceoff in the defensive zone.

#572 gcom007

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:29 AM

Seeing as how both goalies are damn near allowing 3 goals against every game this past month I see it as more of a bad team defense issue. For people to call out Ozzie like he is a hero these past few games is ridiculous.


Hero is certainly over the top as he still needs to keep it going, but a return to form is excellent for the Wings because as we've seen in he past, there aren't many who are better than Osgood in the playoffs lately if it comes to that. But again, you can't just go solely on the stats; you've got to look at the games too. As said, in Osgoods efforts he's been praised in the press by those ever-anxious to tear him down even in losses. Why? He's making the big saves, he's not giving up more than a soft goal a game which in my mind is right on par with what you want from your goalie as every goalie tends to give up a soft one a game.

The defense is absolutely a bigger problem, I agree. I won't argue that and I've been harping on it for almost 3 years now since...that new one...ugh...took over the defense coaching position. It's been a mess. Last year Howard played well despite it. This year he's taken their hits all while beginning to struggle personally as well. His bad habits have gotten worse and guys are figuring out how to better exploit them. I've said again and again that he's not playing as poorly as some suggest, but he's simply not playing well enough, and Osgood is outplaying him on the ice, and his recent stats are better as well.

Personally, i think we should be happy that Osgood's getting his game back because again, when he's on, we've seen what he's capable of when it matters most. And this is just Howards 2nd year. If we can say anything, we can say that it's clear that he still has more to learn. Watching Osgood actually do his thing will be good for him.

I guarantee you Osgood's not as down as Howard after this game despite having a comparable 2 defense/1 softie situation to deal with. He shook off the 3rd goal and came back with some really big saves in the end to hold the lead. Howard was losing it after the 2nd goal let alone the 3rd on Sunday. This is a big trial for him personally, make no mistake. What better way for him to learn how to deal with it then by getting a chance to relax a bit and observe how a 400-win goalie with 3 Cup rings does it?
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#573 Selliria

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:38 AM

Wow. I literally joined this site right before tonight's game and I can already see how almost every thread gets turned into a goalie war.

#574 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:40 AM

Wow. I literally joined this site right before tonight's game and I can already see how almost every thread gets turned into a goalie war.

It is unfortunate.

But welcome to the boards! There's other stuff here besides goalie wars, I swear. Stick around! :P

#575 Yzermania

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:41 AM

just got home and watched the highlights..did bert have as an awesome as a game as they made it seem he did? It was nice to see Draper score an actual nice goal, good for him.

#576 Selliria

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:43 AM

It is unfortunate.

But welcome to the boards! There's other stuff here besides goalie wars, I swear. Stick around! :P


Thank you. :)

I just moved to Atlanta from Metro Detroit so you guys have to replace my at-home hockey crowd. :P

#577 GoWings1905

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:45 AM

Glad to get the win. And goalie wars aside, this team still doesn't know how to clamp it down defensively.


Agreed. The Red Wings have a ton of trouble in their own zone when teams intensify the forecheck like the Oilers did in the third. I think Rafalski and Ericsson need to be split up - those two turned the puck over a ton tonight. That's not really anything new for Rafalski, but I think he would be better suited paired with someone more reliable defensively like Stuart. They have got to improve greatly as a team at cutting down on turnovers and improving defensive coverage. The front of the net is too accessible for opponents right now.

Ozzie had some huge saves, especially when the game was 3-1 and then again near the end. Third goal was rather weak and even though the Oilers didn't have many shots, a good chunk were quality scoring chances. He gave the team a chance to win with some timely stops. I hope people don't look at the GAA or save percentage and deem this game a failure for Ozzie because it definitely was not the case.
 
 
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#578 Jedi

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 12:50 AM

Wow. I literally joined this site right before tonight's game and I can already see how almost every thread gets turned into a goalie war.

You should have seen the Hasek/Cujo/Legace debacle in '03-'04. I still have nightmares...

And welcome to the boards!

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#579 GSBrooks13

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 01:03 AM

Wow. I literally joined this site right before tonight's game and I can already see how almost every thread gets turned into a goalie war.



Enough with the small talk!

What's it gonna be.. Osgood or Howard!?

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#580 Doc Holliday

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Posted 05 January 2011 - 01:12 AM

How many did Ozzie let in today?


And if we lost the game it would be because Ozzie let in a weak one. I fail to see what puts Ozzie over Howard right now when they both are letting in 3 goals against in their own way.


Perhaps the context of the situation is necessary?

The defense is not doing the goaltenders any favors right now. However, Osgood is doing good with what he has while Howard is doing alright with what he has.

Howard needs to get from alright to great. He is our #1 and he needs to show he can bail out the defense on occasion.

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