Hudler's Future

[achildr1 255]

For f**k's sake eva unit zero, you got to stop this s**t.

Explaining it another way is simple.

YOU HAVE HUDLER BIAS.

Give it a fricken' rest.

Franzen has more defensive potential than Hudler, you'll rarely see Hudler in there at the end of a game if the team is leading. You'll see Franzen over Hudler 99 times out of 100. You don't see Hudler play 4-on-4. You see Franzen play 4-on-4. YOU may claim or YOU may say he is a good defensive forward or above average or whatever, but coaches and people making the decisions think otherwise.

I will repeat...

YOU HAVE HUDLER BIAS in levels beyond unimaginable and annoying and you will not shut up about it. I like Hudler, it's cool that you like him, but seeing your absurd bias with him makes me want to (1) strangle you until you are temporarily unconscious and (2) see him not do well and not be here so there might come a time where you might actually shut up about him.

I. DO. NOT. CARE. THAT. BADLY. about you trying to prove that Hudler is better than he is or that Franzen was worse or that Hudler is better than Franzen or whatever numbers or stats you pull out of your rear end. And I think it's a safe bet plenty of other people in here share some of the same thought.

When it comes to letting things go regarding this, you have the I.Q. of a deck chair.

For the love of god and everything good and holy, give it a fricken' rest.

Thank you. You just saved me a half hour of my life.

[ComradeWasabi 109]

I'm wondering why people are laying such big turds on both Hudler and Franzen. If these players were not effective enough, neither Babs nor Holland would have them.

Hudler is prone to streakiness. Watching his play on the ice is indicative of his effectiveness, not merely his numbers. I'm confused why no one mentions this.

Franzen is prone to injuries. He's a little weak in those regards, but even more so, he puts himself in the position to be injured -- likely out of clumsiness. When he isn't injured, or coming back from an injury, he's one of the league's best goal scorers. I'm sure both Babs and Holland are aware of this too.

This is exactly what we've been trying to tell eva this entire thread, read the last few pages. We've all mentioned it, his play on the ice isn't that great and you simply cannot take one of his hot streaks and say that merits him getting top-six time on a consistent basis. Eva simply refuses to listen to reason.

[eva unit zero 271]

This is exactly what we've been trying to tell eva this entire thread, read the last few pages. We've all mentioned it, his play on the ice isn't that great and you simply cannot take one of his hot streaks and say that merits him getting top-six time on a consistent basis. Eva simply refuses to listen to reason.

Who deserves top six ice time ahead of him? Todd Bertuzzi, who had it all season, largely with Datsyuk or Zetterberg, and scored only a couple more points? Hudler belongs in the top six, whether you think he's one of the top six forwards on the team or not. He may be streaky, but so is Franzen and people here seem to think Franzen is one of the league's top forwards, when Franzen isn't even one of the three best forwards on the Wings.

[HankthaTank 1,100]

Franzen isn't even one of the three best forwards on the Wings.

And yet, still better than Hudler. If we were to sit here and project Franzen's point totals all year what would you say to us consistently??

You're going in circles about what your actual point is here.

[Red Wings Addict 787]

[e_prime 1,936]

And yet, still better than Hudler. If we were to sit here and project Franzen's point totals all year what would you say to us consistently??

You're going in circles about what your actual point is here.

Eva's trying to make a point? Does it exist in some existential plane where Hudler scores 70+ points in an extrapolated algebraic equation?

[Broken 16 381]

Does it exist in some existential plane where Hudler scores 70+ points in an extrapolated algebraic equation?

In a word. Yes.

[Casey 145]

*snip*

When it comes to letting things go regarding this, you have the I.Q. of a deck chair.

For the love of god and everything good and holy, give it a fricken' rest.

You are a god. Or, more to the point...

[Nevermind 363]

Who deserves top six ice time ahead of him? Todd Bertuzzi, who had it all season, largely with Datsyuk or Zetterberg, and scored only a couple more points? Hudler belongs in the top six, whether you think he's one of the top six forwards on the team or not. He may be streaky, but so is Franzen and people here seem to think Franzen is one of the league's top forwards, when Franzen isn't even one of the three best forwards on the Wings.

God, please don't tell me Hudler is third best.

I never bothered ranking, but if I had to here's the top of my list. Remember, defense and intangibles can be just as important (if not more) as offense.

1a. Datsyuk

1b. Zetterberg

3. Franzen

4. Filppula

5. Cleary

After these two groups, I would say players like Helm, Holmstrom and Eaves are much more essential to our team than Hudler. They all have a certain niche on our team.

[St. Michael (the Red Wing) 422]

I would rate Franzen above Hudler as well as I think most of the board would agree and Wings fans in general. Really not even comparable at this point. Maybe 3 seasons ago, maybe. Franzen is a way more sound 2-way player than Huds. With all the hype surrounding Hudler rejoining our team it was a letdown but not surprising. Thing that pissed me off the most about Hudler was he ditched out on our team for the KHL and this last season everyone welcomed him with open arms after our injury ridden season before last.

Edited May 26, 2011 by St. Michael (the Red Wing)

[eva unit zero 271]

God, please don't tell me Hudler is third best.

I never bothered ranking, but if I had to here's the top of my list. Remember, defense and intangibles can be just as important (if not more) as offense.

1a. Datsyuk

1b. Zetterberg

3. Franzen

4. Filppula

5. Cleary

After these two groups, I would say players like Helm, Holmstrom and Eaves are much more essential to our team than Hudler. They all have a certain niche on our team.

Z, Dats, and Flip are all better than Franzen. Hudler and Cleary are basically even with Franzen. Cleary and Franzen are both very average at passing and playmaking, while Hudler is among the best in the league in that regard. Cleary is easily the best skater and defensive forward of the three, and Franzen has the most monstrous goal-scoring ability. But overall, the three of them are on basically the same level.

[Konnan511 1,736]

Hudler can easily put up 60-70 points, he just won't with the Wings. He can't skate and he doesn't like to play defense. If he played like he did in the final two games of the San jose series, we wouldn't be having this talk, but truth is, he won't and can't. On another team, though, he'd flourish with top line and top PP minutes.

[Doc Holliday 1,888]

Z, Dats, and Flip are all better than Franzen. Hudler and Cleary are basically even with Franzen. Cleary and Franzen are both very average at passing and playmaking, while Hudler is among the best in the league in that regard. Cleary is easily the best skater and defensive forward of the three, and Franzen has the most monstrous goal-scoring ability. But overall, the three of them are on basically the same level.

Cleary can be at par and better with Franzen. Some times.

But neither Fil or Hudler are at the same level as Franzen. Give your head a shake.

[Guest Crymson]

In no universe is Hudler more valuable to this team than Cleary.

[Mitchmac33 103]

I love how I am accused of not being objective about Hudler because I don't get irrationally angry about how small he is, or the fact he isn't a speedster. I have never claimed Hudler to be a superstar, I don't act like he's some kind of hero, but I get s*** on because I don't s*** on him. That's what's unwarranted.

Never claimed him to be a superstar, but says it's possible for him to score 105 points...that's superstar level. That is why you get s*** on. Because you do act like he has some untapped superstar potential.

It's easy to not have a long pointless streak playing with Datsyuk. What would March and April have looked like if the Hudler/Datsyuk/Cleary line hadn't been broken up for those last 15 games? If Hudler scores at the same pace he did while it was together, he's around 50 points on the season.

Yes, Hudler wasn't scoring early on. I wonder how "elite scorer" Franzen would have done without Dats or Z to feed him?

The reason Babcock must've broken that line up was because they were just too darn good to keep together. Bettman probably made him do it.

Z, Dats, and Flip are all better than Franzen. Hudler and Cleary are basically even with Franzen. Cleary and Franzen are both very average at passing and playmaking, while Hudler is among the best in the league in that regard. Cleary is easily the best skater and defensive forward of the three, and Franzen has the most monstrous goal-scoring ability. But overall, the three of them are on basically the same level.

You honestly think that Hudler is on the same play making level as Pavel Datsyuk and Henrik Sedin? because they are the best in the league in that regard. That alone shows that you do have a biased view of hudler

Edited May 26, 2011 by Mitchmac33

[Casey 145]

Z, Dats, and Flip are all better than Franzen. Hudler and Cleary are basically even with Franzen. Cleary and Franzen are both very average at passing and playmaking, while Hudler is among the best in the league in that regard. Cleary is easily the best skater and defensive forward of the three, and Franzen has the most monstrous goal-scoring ability. But overall, the three of them are on basically the same level.

You're insane. In no world is Hudler an elite playmaker.

[Guest Crymson]

Cleary and Franzen are both very average at passing and playmaking, while Hudler is among the best in the league in that regard.

I'm just here to laugh at your comments now. This was one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen from a longtime poster.

Edited May 27, 2011 by Crymson

[Guest Crymson]

I love how I am accused of not being objective about Hudler because I don't get irrationally angry about how small he is, or the fact he isn't a speedster. I have never claimed Hudler to be a superstar, I don't act like he's some kind of hero, but I get s*** on because I don't s*** on him. That's what's unwarranted.

Bad news: you just did claim that Hudler is a superstar, having claimed that he's one of the best set-up men in the league (and thus in the world).

[Jesusberg 1,256]

Why is this still going on? It's in full troll mode now

[RockyMountainWingGal 108]

I don't either.

Honestly I think Hudler was working his ass off out there. Trying to play physical. Ultimately I think he's just too damn small and slow. Maybe he'd be okay if it were one of the two, but not both. I held out hope he'd be this crafty little sniper, but he hasn't done enough to justify his salary. Maybe he will be somewhere, but it doesn't seem like it's going to happen on the Wings.

Bingo. It worked in 08 when the team was practically flawless and firing on all cylinders. It doesn't work in '11 when Huds is asked to do a bit more - I'll give him he's busting his ass - he just can't do it. In the cap era it's just not feasible to keep a 2.8 Mill player around that has outlived his usefulness. I think he could help another team - perhaps - just not the wings anymore.

[eva unit zero 271]

Bad news: you just did claim that Hudler is a superstar, having claimed that he's one of the best set-up men in the league (and thus in the world).

Ok, let's look this over.

1. If a player is really good at one thing, does that make him a superstar? No.

2. There are only a handful of players who are as good or better playmakers than Hudler.

Perhaps Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Crosby, Thornton, D.Sedin, H.Sedin, Savard, Getzlaf, Toews, Kopitar, Koivu, Gomez, Spezza, Malkin, St.Louis, Backstrom. There might be one or two more I can't think of offhand, but that list should be pretty close. That's among forwards.

In other words; Hudler is not a superstar, he's just a very good playmaker. Just as Franzen is not a superstar, he is just a very good sniper.

[Guest Crymson]

Ok, let's look this over.

1. If a player is really good at one thing, does that make him a superstar? No.

2. There are only a handful of players who are as good or better playmakers than Hudler.

Perhaps Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Crosby, Thornton, D.Sedin, H.Sedin, Savard, Getzlaf, Toews, Kopitar, Koivu, Gomez, Spezza, Malkin, St.Louis, Backstrom. There might be one or two more I can't think of offhand, but that list should be pretty close. That's among forwards.

In other words; Hudler is not a superstar, he's just a very good playmaker. Just as Franzen is not a superstar, he is just a very good sniper.

I'll just call you eva unit minus one for this post... again.

(Translation: sigh).

Edited May 27, 2011 by Crymson

[eva unit zero 271]

Never claimed him to be a superstar, but says it's possible for him to score 105 points...that's superstar level. That is why you get s*** on. Because you do act like he has some untapped superstar potential.

I never claimed him to be a superstar, and the 105 points was the pace he scored at over an 11-game period. It's good that I keep track of this because you guys sure get lost.

The reason Babcock must've broken that line up was because they were just too darn good to keep together. Bettman probably made him do it.

The line was broken up because Franzen was playing like s*** so Babcock was putting Franzen back with Datsyuk. Didn't produce any results, though. Franzen continued to not score goals.

Edited May 27, 2011 by eva unit zero

[Casey 145]

In other words; Hudler is not a superstar, he's just a very good playmaker.

No. Just... no.

129th in the league in assists. 253rd in the league in goals scored.

Or have you some definition of "playmaker" that would involve not generating either goals or assists?

[Red Wings Addict 787]