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#41 NEEDMOREGRIT

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 02:30 PM

I hope Rome comes back and makes another sweet hit like that.Glad someone is keeping the old school hockey spirit alive.Horton should keep his head up.

#42 Datsyerberger

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 02:32 PM

I'd like to point out that you guys are wrong about what defines charging. The "3 step" bit is obsolete and no longer in use due to the changes in speed of the game. Here's the main bit on what defines charging in 42.1

Charging shall mean the actions of a player who, as a result of distance traveled, shall violently check an opponent in any manner. A “charge” may be the result of a check into the boards, into the goal frame or in open ice.


In other words, it's very subjective: if it looks like traveling to the viewers with a say in discipline, then it's charging. This assumes some sort speedy movement over a distance (regardless of strides) into another player for the sole intent of hard contact. Obviously, this doesn't come into play all the time; if it's called as such it's usually because the action has been deemed to be headhunting.

Meanwhile, it was definitely interference. Almost 2 seconds late, which if nothing else should be enough to back off the hit some. Throw in interference that late with heavy follow through like Rome's hit and you've got very obvious interference. Throw in the rulebook supporting disciplinary action for any interference and you've got a case for suspension. Throw in borderline blindside (Rome starts off his stride from a diagonal position to Horton, and while his initial movement was north-south, by the time he's impacted Horton his movement is almost directly east-west), possible charging, and unnecessary follow through and you've got a recipe for a healthy suspension.

I'm all for physical play and I love big hits... if they're clean. What Rome did was careless, dangerous, and just stupid. The rest of the playoffs is just fine.
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#43 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 02:32 PM

I hope Rome comes back and makes another sweet hit like that.Glad someone is keeping the old school hockey spirit alive.Horton should keep his head up.

Yeah! More late hits! More concussions!

#44 Pskov Wings Fan

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 02:42 PM

Boston lost a player for the remainder of the series because of deliberate action of Vancouver player. The league decided that this action was illegal. League cannot restore the balance in full since Horton is a better player than Rome. So suspending Rome for 4 games is the best they can do.

Otherwise why not just break an arm or a leg of an opponent's star player and take a 2 minute slashing minor.

#45 Crymson

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:07 PM

I already said earlier in this thread that I may have gone over the top suggesting it carry over AND I think they got it right with what they handed out...

I've been playing hockey for over 23 years, but the reason players need to keep their heads up, is to protect themselves - This does not exonerate someone who threw a dirty hit, because the receiving player didn't follow the golden rule.


The hit was illegal. However, Horton made it far worse on himself by completely zoning out. This is uncharacteristic of a hockey player to do, because they know that it will often lead to them being freight-trained.

Specifically to rule 48, fine, that very specific rule, with its wording, does not apply here. It doesn't mean that it wasn't still a play that needs to be removed and/or isn't directly connected to that exact type of play...


It was a late hit, but the injury was incidental.

There's no way Horton wasn't getting hurt on that hit - moot point.


This is a horribly arbitrary statement. It's also absolutely wrong.

Regardless of which side you're on, the league got the discipline on this one right.


Again with the arbitrary statements. Obviously several of us disagree with you. And do you know what's funny? If this had been, say, Chara instead of Rome, he'd have gotten one game, maximum. The fact that Rome is a depth defenseman made the severity of the suspension much greater.

The more I watch the video, the more I can see your argument on the charge, there are 2 clear strides (backwards, or forwards, each distinct motion still counts) but the 3rd one is murky... I'll admit when I'm wrong and on this account, I may be - however, I disagree completely on the "watching the pass" BS, you can even see Horton check the line and the linesman as he enters... he was in a helpless position and that hit needs to be given up, no matter how you cut it.


It was not charging. Not a chance.

Horton was watching his pass. As others have mentioned, he had passed forward to Lucic. If Lucic wasn't offside, then Horton certainly wasn't. And he wasn't in a helpless position--and note that players are often in helpless positions when they are hit legally--but rather simply took the hit far harder than he would otherwise because he stopped being aware of his surroundings. All hockey players must be aware of what's going on around them, else they risk being crushed. Had Horton seen the hit coming, chances are high that he would have taken it much more smoothly.

Back to the suspension as well - they got it right, period.


If you're going to make these kinds of statements so repeatedly, you'd be better off just blogging rather than starting a discussion thread.

I added this to the game thread, but I think it fits pretty much here too.

http://www.vancouver...3011/story.html


I disagree with that. I think the Canucks just stopped skating and played a bad game in the 2nd and 3rd. Luongo was mediocre and Thomas was excellent.

#46 Datsyerberger

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:08 PM

It was not charging. Not a chance.


I disagree, it was charging, by my interpretation of a subjective rule rather than a numerical quota that no longer exists either in the rulebook or in the way the officials call the game. Want to disagree with me? It's subjective. And ultimately subject to the people who run the disciplinary stuff. I think it'd be fair to say that charging played a factor in their decision based upon the length.
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#47 Bring Back The Bruise Bros

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:09 PM

Why did my post get deleted..?

Edit: nevermind.

Edited by Bring Back The Bruise Bros, 07 June 2011 - 03:11 PM.

"Ice hockey is a form of disorderly conduct in which the score is kept."

RIP Bob Probert
RIP Wade Belak
RIP Derek Boogaard
RIP Rick Rypien

#48 Crymson

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:09 PM

I disagree, it was charging, by my interpretation of a subjective rule rather than a numerical quota that no longer exists either in the rulebook or in the way the officials call the game. Want to disagree with me? It's subjective. And ultimately subject to the people who run the disciplinary stuff. I think it'd be fair to say that charging played a factor in their decision based upon the length.


My opinion is objective.

#49 stevkrause

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:12 PM

My opinion is objective.

Now THAT is subjective...

and arbitrary.

Edited by stevkrause, 07 June 2011 - 03:13 PM.

All I have to say about Holland and our off-season:

Here in this thread

Here in this one as well

Here in this one too

and finally

Here


Holland is a damn good GM. period.


#50 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:14 PM

My opinion is objective.

The funny thing is, I think you actually believe that.

#51 Datsyerberger

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:15 PM

My opinion is objective.


Then it should be demonstrable with a logical reality. Objectively align your opinion with the rulebook. Show where the rule on charging has absolutely no chance of being enforced on this play.
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#52 cusimano_brothers

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:17 PM

Doesn't the League like occasional carnage?

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#53 plopster

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:08 PM

The guy made a late hit on another player who didn't know he was stepping up to hit him and he knew it. End of discussion. THAT is what they want out of the game, a guy making a hit to another guy at a high rate of speed that has no idea it is coming. It should be out of respect for the individual that you don't take a shot at him like that. All the people saying good for him keeping old school hockey alive, how about what horton is thinking right now as a human being? Thats a person, and his mind is probably permanently damaged because another guy wanted to keep the old school in hockey. News flash to the old school hockey lovers- the new school technology in equipment and training mixed with the old school physical play is a recipe for people being hurt like this. The players are stronger, faster and more athletic than ever. He could have just slowed up and given him a hey Im here bump, or at the worst, given him an OLD SCHOOL hip check. Why does he need to hit him up high there? At the rate they were both going, a love tap would have put him on his ass. Whether the guy wasn't looking is of no consequence. The fact is Rome WAS looking at him and knew he was unsuspecting. You have to make a decision to be responsible to the other player. As I have always said, bones, muscles, tendons, and joints can heal or be repaired. The brain can't. Look at Probert. Look at Lindros. Look at Boogaard. This is not just about hockey, this about other people's lives. The league needs to let the players know they are taking these injuries seriously. And I think they did there.

#54 Jusek

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:17 PM

I think Canucks fans are happy to get rid of him. He is their whipping boy.
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#55 Datsyerberger

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:26 PM

I think Canucks fans are happy to get rid of him. He is their whipping boy.


They've laid off of him a lot this post-season, where he's been more solid than expected.
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#56 Drake_Marcus

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:29 PM

I can't believe Canucks fans are whining about a schlub like Rome being suspended. He severely concussed Boston's 2nd best forward on a pretty late hit. Horton had his head down so he won't get many sympathy cards for that.

The big point here is that it was a vicious hit to a defenceless player's head and the league's made it clear they want to eliminate those hits. Horton's got brain damage now. The long term effects may be mild but don't doubt that concussions like this can have long term repercussions.

I think Canucks fans are happy to get rid of him. He is their whipping boy.


:lol: So it's not just a LGW thing.

Edited by Drake_Marcus, 07 June 2011 - 04:33 PM.

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#57 rrasco

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:30 PM

I don't think Rome ever intended on making that kind of play, but he did. If he kept his feet on the ground and hit him a little lower, I bet we don't even see a call. There was no initial interference call on the ice until after Horton was injured. Hell, I was staring right at the play and didn't see the initial contact, just Horton laid out with stiff arms. The call was in response to the injury. Late hits like that happen in every game of the NHL, I believe people refer to it as finishing a check. I personally don't think he hit him as late as some people are claiming it to be, but it was a little late.

I'm kind of middle of the road on this one. I see the faults in the hit and I also see why it is considered borderline. It's not the definition of rule 48, but it's a very similar hit in the way it went down, including the result. A little late of a hit, appears to make contact with head, and he leaves his feet. All things that could be taken into consideration that Rome could have done to prevent his circumstances.

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#58 jollymania

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:31 PM

Ban ice, that is what caused most of the damage.
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#59 number9

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:31 PM

legal

#60 wingslogo19

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:33 PM

I hope Rome comes back and makes another sweet hit like that.Glad someone is keeping the old school hockey spirit alive.Horton should keep his head up.

:scared:
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