Thoughts on Ericsson?

[dobbles 252]

He's played 4 games of a 246 game contract, lets wait until at least 5% of the contract is played out before we decide its value

i guess we can finish this discussion up on nov. 6th then!

realistically though, he has played 167 games in the nhl now. people are basing their opinions not only on the 4 games this year, but how those 4 games compare to the other 163 he has played. lots of people feel that he is continuing to show the same problems he has had. i am of the opinion he peaked in the 09 playoff run and has been pretty mediocre since. that was fine when he was the 6th dman making <1mil a year. but now he is paid like a top guy. and i think i remember ken and mick saying they had talked with babs who said he expected him to grow into a top 4 type guy because of the contract. to me, thats a scarey thought.

[Guest 13GoWings40]

i guess we can finish this discussion up on nov. 6th then!

realistically though, he has played 167 games in the nhl now. people are basing their opinions not only on the 4 games this year, but how those 4 games compare to the other 163 he has played. lots of people feel that he is continuing to show the same problems he has had. i am of the opinion he peaked in the 09 playoff run and has been pretty mediocre since. that was fine when he was the 6th dman making <1mil a year. but now he is paid like a top guy. and i think i remember ken and mick saying they had talked with babs who said he expected him to grow into a top 4 type guy because of the contract. to me, thats a scarey thought.

I think it is entirely reasonable that next year he could be a top 4 guy. He really gets a lot more crap than he deserves for last year (3-12-15 +8 107 hits is not bad for a 3rd pairing defensive-Dman). He also has a 100 mph shot, which is something you can't teach. Defensemen have a big learning curve, but once it clicks it clicks. Look at Kronwall and Stuart.

[eva unit zero 271]

I think it is entirely reasonable that next year he could be a top 4 guy. He really gets a lot more crap than he deserves for last year (3-12-15 +8 107 hits is not bad for a 3rd pairing defensive-Dman). He also has a 100 mph shot, which is something you can't teach. Defensemen have a big learning curve, but once it clicks it clicks. Look at Kronwall and Stuart.

He won't be in Detroit's top four unless Lidstrom retires and the Wings lose at least one of Kronwall or Stuart to free agency, and no new top-four defensemen are signed.

Also, he's not a defensive d-man. That I think is where you are making your mistake. If he were a 3rd pairing defensive d-man putting up 15 points, that would be great. But he's not. He's mediocre defensively. And STOP with the shot. Anything you can't do in a game is something that doesn't count. Like Tomas Jurco's puck-on-the-stick video. Neat trick. But it would get the play blown dead for high sticking because the blade goes above his shoulders. Ericsson can't use his shot in game situations because his windup is too slow. You might say "Well, then nobody can do it!" But that's not true. Sergei Fedorov and Jiri Fischer were able to release 100mph shots in-game as Wings.

Ericsson's fate is probably to be traded, because he's good enough to play in the NHL but not good enough to play in Detroit's top four. Those facts aren't likely to change in the next three years, and Holland isn't the type to try to bury a guy in the minors for cap space.

[Scott Stevens 44]

He won't be in Detroit's top four unless Lidstrom retires and the Wings lose at least one of Kronwall or Stuart to free agency, and no new top-four defensemen are signed.

Also, he's not a defensive d-man. That I think is where you are making your mistake. If he were a 3rd pairing defensive d-man putting up 15 points, that would be great. But he's not. He's mediocre defensively. And STOP with the shot. Anything you can't do in a game is something that doesn't count. Like Tomas Jurco's puck-on-the-stick video. Neat trick. But it would get the play blown dead for high sticking because the blade goes above his shoulders. Ericsson can't use his shot in game situations because his windup is too slow. You might say "Well, then nobody can do it!" But that's not true. Sergei Fedorov and Jiri Fischer were able to release 100mph shots in-game as Wings.

Ericsson's fate is probably to be traded, because he's good enough to play in the NHL but not good enough to play in Detroit's top four. Those facts aren't likely to change in the next three years, and Holland isn't the type to try to bury a guy in the minors for cap space.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Stuart gone after this season and Ericsson in the 2nd pairing with Kronwall. Just a hunch, but I think Stuart is gonna want money Detroit doesn't want to give him.

Lidstrom - White

Kronwall - Ericsson

Kindl - Smith

Janik/Commodore

That's what our 2012 Defense is going to look like.

Post Script - I'd really like to see the Red Wings take a run at Matt Carle this off-season instead of Stuart. I'm big on that guy.

[eva unit zero 271]

I wouldn't be surprised to see Stuart gone after this season and Ericsson in the 2nd pairing with Kronwall. Just a hunch, but I think Stuart is gonna want money Detroit doesn't want to give him.

Lidstrom - White

Kronwall - Ericsson

Kindl - Smith

Janik/Commodore

That's what our 2012 Defense is going to look like.

Post Script - I'd really like to see the Red Wings take a run at Matt Carle this off-season instead of Stuart. I'm big on that guy.

Ericsson won't end up in that spot next season unless he shows this season he deserves it. Kindl looks like more of a top-four defenseman than Ericsson has shown he can be. But if neither Kindl nor Ericsson grab that spot and take it by force, we'll see a new face on the blueline in the top four - unless we see all of Lidstrom, Kronwall, and Stuart sign new deals.

Carle would be a nice replacement for Stuart. Coburn is also available. Although I think if Stuart is getting money hungry, I might look into trading him for Meszaros because Philly will (will they?) want to try and keep Carle and Coburn; Meszaros would be a solid replacement for Stuart that would cost less than the other two likely will.

[brett 1,029]

I find it kind of funny that he doesn't have better offensive instincts/capabilities considering he was drafted as an offense men

Edited October 18, 2011 by brett

[Scott Stevens 44]

Ericsson won't end up in that spot next season unless he shows this season he deserves it. Kindl looks like more of a top-four defenseman than Ericsson has shown he can be. But if neither Kindl nor Ericsson grab that spot and take it by force, we'll see a new face on the blueline in the top four - unless we see all of Lidstrom, Kronwall, and Stuart sign new deals.

Carle would be a nice replacement for Stuart. Coburn is also available. Although I think if Stuart is getting money hungry, I might look into trading him for Meszaros because Philly will (will they?) want to try and keep Carle and Coburn; Meszaros would be a solid replacement for Stuart that would cost less than the other two likely will.

I think you're right. I think Philadelphia will re-sign Carle before he gets picked up by another team.

[P. Marlowe 748]

I find it kind of funny that he doesn't have better offensive instincts/capabilities considering he was drafted as an offense men

If I remember correctly the game that Håkan Andersson was the first that Ericsson played as defenseman. Before that he'd been a forward. Andersson liked what he saw and the plan was to have Ericsson as a defenseman from the start.

I don't really care if Ericsson's overpayed or not as long his contract doesn't handcuff Wings in the future. He's played OK so they don't have a reason to get rid of him and Wings have lots of cap space for future signings.

[SouthernWingsFan 854]

Big Rig's been fine. Nothing outstanding, but far from whipping boy status people often get with him in here.

[eva unit zero 271]

If I remember correctly the game that Håkan Andersson was the first that Ericsson played as defenseman. Before that he'd been a forward. Andersson liked what he saw and the plan was to have Ericsson as a defenseman from the start.

Ericsson was a center and was asked to fill in on defense in that game. Andersson recommended after the game that Ericsson make the switch full-time.

[Scott Stevens 44]

Ericsson was a center and was asked to fill in on defense in that game. Andersson recommended after the game that Ericsson make the switch full-time.

I wonder what he'd be like with Dats and Z. In front of the net on the PP too.

[Rick D 350]

I wonder what he'd be like with Dats and Z. In front of the net on the PP too.

Sounds like the perfect job for him. he is great at just standing in front of people.

[eva unit zero 271]

I wonder what he'd be like with Dats and Z. In front of the net on the PP too.

He'd score 35 points, and then we'd trade him to Atlanta Winnipeg, where he would officially be a defenseman, but play rover and put up huge numbers?

[Scott Stevens 44]

He'd score 35 points, and then we'd trade him to Atlanta Winnipeg, where he would officially be a defenseman, but play rover and put up huge numbers?

I never could understand why we didn't put this guy up front when we entered the playoffs and use him for back-up if one of our d guys went down.

[Shawn Lutz 1]

I liked Ericsson when he came in for the playoffs. Since then he shows intermittent signs of playing to that level. I also thought we overpaid for him on his new contract. I think there may have been a KH panic with Raffy retiring abruptly. E has some traits of a top 4 but his weakness is his hockey IQ. He just isnt a very smart player. He makes the same mistakes over and over, gets caught watching the play and not the open man. He is fairly weak along the wall as doesnt make player pay the price for standing in front of Howard getting 2-3 whacks at loose pucks.

Expectations rise along with pay and if Big E doesn't meet those expectations then he can become trade bait. I think so far only 4 games in he's playing pretty good. Having said that his role hasn't increased any nor has he taken on any added responsibilities. Kindl to me has been better. WHen Nick Lidstrom retires after this season we have some decisions to make and I's rather give Kronner a good raise, retain Stuart and package E with some other players to land a big franchise UFA like Weber. I was hping Brendan Smith would show more than he did at camp but maybe a year in GR will help he along and he can make the squad next season. We'll have Kronner, White, Stuart, Kindl, Commodore Ericsson and a UFA and Smith in the waiting in the wings. A Hudler, Ericsson and TBD players could be used as trade bait. You can't fill Nicks shoes with what we have now and on the farm so we'll need to go the FA route for that in my opinion.

[kipwinger 8,522]

Well it could be worse, we could have paid James Wisneiwski 5 million a year to do nothing (a position I was in favor of during the off season and am currently eating crow on).

[Holmstrom96 347]

It's too early to tell. I've been a HUGE Ericsson hater, but from what I've seen in the first four games he's been marginally better.

I'm doubtful I'll think he's earning what we're paying him, but I want to at least give him a chance.

Ken Holland is always right (exception Jason Williams), so I have no doubt that I will be proven wrong.

[sean 19]

He's not too overpaid IMO, even if he only plays at this level (which is actually decent).

Things will look a little more proportionate when Kronwall gets his new contract, which will probably be 5-6 million. Lidstrom taking a huge pay-cut, with respect to what he could be making, also makes E's contract look bigger.

Also, you can bet that having 10 million or so in cap-space this offseason sure played into his agent's hand.

Finally, keep in mind that E's contract is only about 2.8 million in 2010-2011 dollars.

[Scott Stevens 44]

It's too early to tell. I've been a HUGE Ericsson hater, but from what I've seen in the first four games he's been marginally better.

I'm doubtful I'll think he's earning what we're paying him, but I want to at least give him a chance.

Ken Holland is always right (exception Jason Williams), so I have no doubt that I will be proven wrong.

Ughhh. I don't think so. Hakan Andersson and Scotty Bowman are responsible for the Wings turnaround. Ken Holland is a pawn in the game.

For every Shanahan and Hull, there has been a Kruup and Hatcher out of Holland.

Holland is an ok GM in my opinion, but I wouldn't consider him anything else but o.k.

Importing the Russians and Swedes when that became vogue was Andersson's work. Getting the team to play defense was Bowman's work. All Holland had to do was bring in/ship out a few pieces when Bowman told him what he needed.

[Dave 324]

Ughhh. I don't think so. Hakan Andersson and Scotty Bowman are responsible for the Wings turnaround. Ken Holland is a pawn in the game.

For every Shanahan and Hull, there has been a Kruup and Hatcher out of Holland.

Holland is an ok GM in my opinion, but I wouldn't consider him anything else but o.k.

Importing the Russians and Swedes when that became vogue was Andersson's work. Getting the team to play defense was Bowman's work. All Holland had to do was bring in/ship out a few pieces when Bowman told him what he needed.

Jim Devellano

[Doc Holliday 1,888]

You hear that? According to Scott Stevens, Holland just did what he was told. He didn't have a say in any of his own decisions.

[Motown4013 350]

I like to think I'm usually pretty reluctant to criticize "controversial" players after just a few games, but Ericsson is my one exception. Having watched him since he's come up from the GRG, I just haven't seen him improve much, if at all, over the course of his NHL career. And I haven't seen anything in the first four games to suggest I'm going to have any different opinion about him this year.

I see the guy make stupid plays in every game, whether they're minor blips or major screw ups. Maybe he's out of position, maybe he gets caught on a bad pinch, maybe he makes a stupid turnover, or maybe he takes a bad angle toward the boards and as a result misses a chance to play the puck; but it's always something. I don't consider it good if I "don't notice Ericsson," because he's the only player on the roster for whom I haven't thought to myself "wow he made a good play there." Usually the best I can give him is "well, he managed not to screw that one up."

My prayer is that he has a stretch where he somehow "turns it on" and ups his trade value while some other team is hurting on D men. I'd really rather not be stuck with him on the Wings.

Well besides Lidstrom, is there a single D-Man that doesnt make at least one error every game??

[eva unit zero 271]

Ughhh. I don't think so. Hakan Andersson and Scotty Bowman are responsible for the Wings turnaround. Ken Holland is a pawn in the game.

For every Shanahan and Hull, there has been a Kruup and Hatcher out of Holland.

Holland is an ok GM in my opinion, but I wouldn't consider him anything else but o.k.

Importing the Russians and Swedes when that became vogue was Andersson's work. Getting the team to play defense was Bowman's work. All Holland had to do was bring in/ship out a few pieces when Bowman told him what he needed.

Holland brought in Brett Hull, not Bowman. Holland brought in Marian Hossa. Brian Rafalski, Brad Stuart. Derian Hatcher was considered a top defenseman when Holland signed him; calling that signing a mistake because he was injured is like saying the Wings shouldn't have drafted Jiri Fischer because of his then unknown heart condition.

[Scott Stevens 44]

Holland brought in Brett Hull, not Bowman. Holland brought in Marian Hossa. Brian Rafalski, Brad Stuart. Derian Hatcher was considered a top defenseman when Holland signed him; calling that signing a mistake because he was injured is like saying the Wings shouldn't have drafted Jiri Fischer because of his then unknown heart condition.

You're saying the same thing I'm saying. He's brought in players that have HELPED at times. Andersson and Bowman are responsible for players/development that have been the BACKBONE = Lidstrom, Fedorov, Konstantinov, Datsyuk, Zetterberg, etc, etc, etc.

[haroldsnepsts 4,826]

Well besides Lidstrom, is there a single D-Man that doesnt make at least one error every game??

That's part of the problem in evaluating defensemen in Detroit. We get spoiled watching Lidstrom, so it seems like they shouldn't ever make mistakes.

Chris Pronger got absolutely undressed a couple games ago. That doesn't mean he's not a great defenseman. It just happens to the best of them from time to time, unless you're a robot like Lidstrom.