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10/28 GDT: Sharks 4 at Red Wings 2


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#401 esteef

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 11:12 AM

Wings haven't won a game since their last fight.

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#402 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 11:19 AM

I know it's easy to say that fans just blame the refs every time, but in all honesty, and even over time I haven't cooled on this, the '10 series against the Sharks was the worst reffing ever. The reffing did actually affect the outcome of the crucial games to a ridiculous degree. That series should have gone longer than 5, and probably gone to the Wings.

Last year's series was the Wings own fault. Only one of the games was terribly reffed, and they just blew a tight series fair and square. But I will never let anyone convince me that the Wings lost that '10 series because they were the inferior team or because they choked.

And for the record, this team can clearly beat any team in the league...except for San Jose. Ergo, I think any changes to the team should be made with an eye toward beating San Jose, since their style of play is the only one that can consistently beat the Wings.

Honestly when they're performing I think this team has a lineup that is capable of beating any team in the league, including San Jose. Obviously no team is going to win every game, but the last couple seasons it's been such a huge difference night to night as to which Red Wings team shows up.

I don't know. Maybe I'm overvaluing the Wings and can't accept that San Jose is simply a better team. I can accept that maybe they won't have the goalscoring they once did, but the Wings haven't been excelling in areas where they should, like team defense. With a coach like Babcock and forwards like Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Flip, and Helm playing with defenseman like Lidstrom, Kronwall, White, and Stuart, along with Jimmy in net, they should be able to get it pretty locked down defensively throughout the season. And as we know, they were awful in GAA last season.

The Kings are my second favorite team, and they had great team defense last season, with a much less talented lineup than Detroit. They're a much more physical, grinding, dump and chase team though. I wonder if the puck possession system just doesn't work because the Wings don't have as much top end talent. So they're adjusting to a new style.

#403 Konnan511

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 11:26 AM

You win 20 games and you lose 20 games every season. If we hit that 20 loss mark come January, then I'll start becoming really worried.
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#404 puckloo39

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 12:44 PM

No GDT posted for tonight's game v. Wild, so...

Wings' "excuses" when they lose:

  • Bad bounces
  • Bad schedule
  • Bad ice
  • Bad refs
  • Bad calls (ok, in Homer's case, this one is true) :P


Other teams' excuses when the Wings win:

"It was the Red Wings." :o

:D

The skid stops tonight. Go, Wings!!! :clap:

Edited by puckloo39, 29 October 2011 - 12:44 PM.

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#405 uncle ovipositor

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 12:53 PM

But I will never let anyone convince me that the Wings lost that '10 series because they were the inferior team or because they choked.


I won't try then, even though I disagree with your premise that the refs cost them that series. They certainly didn't choke and I don't think they were definitively inferior, but they did lose the series.

Last year, the stats were so even in all of the games that either team could have won. If teams are evenly matched, either team can win a series. Even if they're unevenly matched, the lesser team often wins - a team that's 60% better is still going to lose 40% of the time, and a 7 game series actually makes those losses more probable.

As far as the season to date goes, this is what change looks like. Babcock is trying to do things differently with the same players. Usually that's not a good formula, but this is a very teachable team so it can work. But there are some significant structural changes, and those don't just magically come together right away. Maybe they won't be at the top of the central, but they'll still make the playoffs, and we'll see if they've got it sorted out by then.

Cleary hasn't been up to his new job, but I can see why he's getting a chance. If he can get it together he's fast and reasonably big and would help that line a lot. Ian White probably shouldn't be on the PP, but he's generally dependable. Put him with Stuart and let Stuart pinch and play more aggressively.

It'll come together.

#406 Nightfall

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 04:48 PM

This is worth repeating. It was bounces. It was the refs. It was that the other team was lucky enough to be healthy. Strange how those are never factors for the other team losing a playoff series to the Wings.

This place has gotten ridiculous. Are we no longer allowed to be unhappy with the way the Wings are playing, unless they're dead last or something? Even when people here criticize the Wings, at least they are actually talking about hockey in a hockey forum, rather than making all the sarcastic and trolling posts that the "real" fans here do.

It's three losses. People want to discuss it. The sky is not falling, but as I said in another thread, with this talented of a roster the Wings will almost certainly make the playoffs, so the prevailing question for the season is "what is different this year? have they improved enough to get past the Sharks?"

It's early yet, but people are looking for a sign that this isn't the same team as last season that took nights off and isn't solid defensively.

More talk about hockey. Less talk about what kind of fan people should be.

And therein lies the rub.

The problem that I have is that it isn't hockey talk. Its a ***** fest. I am upset about the Wings not doing well. At the same time though, I point out where they were deficient and how they can improve next game. The "hockey talk" that you mention is not hockey talk. It takes more effort to actually dissect a game and look at the keys in a game. It takes less effort to yell, "Fire Babcock" or "Homer is worthless". Guess which route many of the LGW forum members take? In the end, when they do take that route, it makes those members look like a bunch of whining entitled brats.

Otherwise, I agree with your assessment on the three losses. Its too early to tell. At the same time, the score was not indicative of how the game was played. Wings dominated in faceoffs and time of possession. Shots were about even. The Wings breakout was ok and their passing was average. In essence, they got beat by one goal.
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#407 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 05:28 PM

And therein lies the rub.

The problem that I have is that it isn't hockey talk. Its a ***** fest. I am upset about the Wings not doing well. At the same time though, I point out where they were deficient and how they can improve next game. The "hockey talk" that you mention is not hockey talk. It takes more effort to actually dissect a game and look at the keys in a game. It takes less effort to yell, "Fire Babcock" or "Homer is worthless". Guess which route many of the LGW forum members take? In the end, when they do take that route, it makes those members look like a bunch of whining entitled brats.

Otherwise, I agree with your assessment on the three losses. Its too early to tell. At the same time, the score was not indicative of how the game was played. Wings dominated in faceoffs and time of possession. Shots were about even. The Wings breakout was ok and their passing was average. In essence, they got beat by one goal.

I agree that there's a relatively small percentage of people venting from a loss with things like the "Wings f-ing suck!" But honestly it's much better than it used to be, and there's plenty of hockey talk here that gets bashed and shut down just because it's not popular or it's critical of the Wings.

Even if someone proposes a radical move, like trade Cleary, hell even trade Datsyuk, that's a legitimate hockey opinion and worth discussing, no matter how much the idea of trading those guys may offend Wings fans. Demoting someone, even Zetterberg to the 4th line is hockey talk. They may be outlandish and even foolish ideas, but they're legitimate opinions.

People who are generating topics to discuss are the lifeblood of this site. They're not all going to be brilliant, but I'll take them any day over the members (who are not mods) who've made themselves judges of what is and is not acceptable to say about the Red Wings. The people here who spend most of their time shutting down the ideas of other members and mocking them for their suggestions with posts like "OMG WINGS SUCK TRADE EVERYONE!!!"

If the Wings have only lost three games but someone wants to suggest radical changes, they should be able to do so without being bombarded by all the sarcastic, ******* responses from the Thought Police here.

Edited by haroldsnepsts, 29 October 2011 - 05:30 PM.


#408 DRWfan

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 06:31 PM

Who do you think was better Howard or Niemi?

#409 wingfan13

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Posted 29 October 2011 - 08:01 PM

Does anyone know where I can find the video of the disallowed goal ? I tried YouTube and shockingly NHL.com doesn't have the video in the highlights of the game. I saw it but a friend didn't and I wanted him to see it.
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