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Red Crazy

What this team needs

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I want to get the experts on LGW opinion on what this team needs to be a true Stanley Cup contender once the playoffs roll around. This team is lacking something and I just can't put my finger on it. In the past the media and others have pointed to goaltending as the hole in the armour but I don't think that you can say that with the year Jimmys been having. The defense for the most part is doing o.k with Lidstrom playing great and White is proving to be an asset. The forwards however seem to be all over the place. Not one of the forwards is playing lights out. It's not like they are playing that bad but it seems that nobody is stepping up during an off night to sneak out a win. Have the players become comfortable with the fact that the wings always make the playoffs and that they never trade players? After playing like hell for the last two games they are givin the day off today, so is it coaching? I know it is still early in the season and that no team ever wins all its games but what I find frusterating about this team is the lack effort some nights and that nobody will stick up for one another or plays with an edge. How many times will Franzen get punched in the face before he will push back? If the Blues had hurt Jimmy would anyone have stood up? When Kronwall was hit from behind did anyone do anything?

I think that the current roster could be contenders this year if they would dig down and grow some balls when the going gets tough but until then it looks like it may be a first or second round exit team.

Flame away.

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I want to get the experts on LGW opinion on what this team needs to be a true Stanley Cup contender once the playoffs roll around. This team is lacking something and I just can't put my finger on it. In the past the media and others have pointed to goaltending as the hole in the armour but I don't think that you can say that with the year Jimmys been having. The defense for the most part is doing o.k with Lidstrom playing great and White is proving to be an asset. The forwards however seem to be all over the place. Not one of the forwards is playing lights out. It's not like they are playing that bad but it seems that nobody is stepping up during an off night to sneak out a win. Have the players become comfortable with the fact that the wings always make the playoffs and that they never trade players? After playing like hell for the last two games they are givin the day off today, so is it coaching? I know it is still early in the season and that no team ever wins all its games but what I find frusterating about this team is the lack effort some nights and that nobody will stick up for one another or plays with an edge. How many times will Franzen get punched in the face before he will push back? If the Blues had hurt Jimmy would anyone have stood up? When Kronwall was hit from behind did anyone do anything?

I think that the current roster could be contenders this year if they would dig down and grow some balls when the going gets tough but until then it looks like it may be a first or second round exit team.

Flame away.

I lol'd :P then realised no one had replied and lol'd even more.

That being said, I think the fact that almost every player on this roster has a Stanley Cup ring (don't know all the exceptions but I think Conks, White, Bert, and the rookies are the only ones without, oh and Commodore. Think Howard technically has one, but not one that he won so throw him in too) has a lot to do with it. I mean almost EVERY player. It's like Brodeur owning every record then disappearing off the face of the hockey world. Just some people think it doesn't need to be done anymore, and most have other commitments now.

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I lol'd :P then realised no one had replied and lol'd even more.

That being said, I think the fact that almost every player on this roster has a Stanley Cup ring (don't know all the exceptions but I think Conks, White, Bert, and the rookies are the only ones without, oh and Commodore. Think Howard technically has one, but not one that he won so throw him in too) has a lot to do with it. I mean almost EVERY player. It's like Brodeur owning every record then disappearing off the face of the hockey world. Just some people think it doesn't need to be done anymore, and most have other commitments now.

I think Commodore won the Cup with Carolina in 2006.

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The Wings have motivation problems, that's it. That's all it is. We didn't win in 2008 because Downey was on our roster, we won because every single player on the wings was desperate for a Stanley Cup. The old cliche is true, whatever team wants it more gets it. The Penguins weren't necessarily a better team than us (and the same goes the opposite), they just wanted it a little more.

Edited by Z and D for the C
P. Marlowe and commadore183 like this

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I think Commodore won the Cup with Carolina in 2006.

Yea he did.

Hunger is def an issue.

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So if this team is lacking motivation how do they get back their hungar? It does seem like it has been a problem for the past couple of seasons.

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Not one of the forwards is playing lights out.

This guy disagrees:

pdatsyuk.jpg

He's posted something like 1.5 points per game over the last 9.

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Bring in a grizzled veteran that can chip in, play physical and rub his hunger for a Cup on everyone. We had a bunch of guys hungry for a Cup, and some veterans who'd been there in 2008 and then we added Drake who looked very much old and washed up during the regular season. But when playoffs came around he was an animal and sparked the team every ******* time he was on the ice. That's what we need some more of.For the record I'm not saying he has to be old and washed up, but a guy who plays physical and is looking for the Cup would be nice.

Edited by Detroit # 1 Fan

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Bring in a grizzled veteran that can chip in, play physical and rub his hunger for a Cup on everyone. We had a bunch of guys hungry for a Cup, and some veterans who'd been there in 2008 and then we added Drake who looked very much old and washed up during the regular season. But when playoffs came around he was an animal and sparked the team every ******* time he was on the ice. That's what we need some more of.For the record I'm not saying he has to be old and washed up, but a guy who plays physical and is looking for the Cup would be nice.

Is there anyone in your hometown who fits this definition?

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I think its a Drake type presence that is missing.

Not a guy who will go out and hit and fight and definitely not a goon, but Drake was a player who could play regularly and spark the team in a way noone on this roster really does.

Kronwall on D, and Abdelkader when hes playing the wing (sometimes).

They need to add that one guy, that when the skill just isnt working, can go out and crush 3 guys in one shift (Drake vs the Stars) and completely swing the momentum just because he throws his body around.

This team could use some skill in the top 6, but I think it could use some crazy in the bottom.

Trading for Prust at the deadline could help A LOT. He is that type of player.

wings1110 likes this

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I think its a Drake type presence that is missing.

Not a guy who will go out and hit and fight and definitely not a goon, but Drake was a player who could play regularly and spark the team in a way noone on this roster really does.

Kronwall on D, and Abdelkader when hes playing the wing (sometimes).

They need to add that one guy, that when the skill just isnt working, can go out and crush 3 guys in one shift (Drake vs the Stars) and completely swing the momentum just because he throws his body around.

This team could use some skill in the top 6, but I think it could use some crazy in the bottom.

Trading for Prust at the deadline could help A LOT. He is that type of player.

This ^ :clap:

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I think its a Drake type presence that is missing.

Not a guy who will go out and hit and fight and definitely not a goon, but Drake was a player who could play regularly and spark the team in a way noone on this roster really does.

Kronwall on D, and Abdelkader when hes playing the wing (sometimes).

They need to add that one guy, that when the skill just isnt working, can go out and crush 3 guys in one shift (Drake vs the Stars) and completely swing the momentum just because he throws his body around.

This team could use some skill in the top 6, but I think it could use some crazy in the bottom.

Trading for Prust at the deadline could help A LOT. He is that type of player.

The whole "Drake was the reason we won the cup" comments are getting way out of hand. The team played better, Drake may have had something to do with it, but he was never the reason why we won. The team had WAY more of a drive, everyone wanted the cup. Seems like a select few players now have gotten a big contract and have taken their foot off the gas for the season.

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They need someone with some fire, plain and simple. Half the time I watch the Wings, it seems like robots playing; just no emotion. Watching the Bruins isn't like that, which I use as comparison because they're the other team I watch on a regular basis.

Much as some people don't like it, the best place to get some fire is big, physical players. I would kill to have a Shawn Thornton on this team.

Edit: Actually, reading this again, I shouldn't say the "best" place; I should say the most accessible place to the Wings.

Edited by Hockey Convert

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Is there anyone in your hometown who fits this definition?

Whoa, whoa, I just live in Calgary it isn't my hometown :D

But, hell yes there's a guy here who the Wings could use

iginla.jpg

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Well, I think (and this is only my opinion) this team needs a shakeup. Either from within or out. The so-called "Top 6" are too comfortable in their role and the "Bottom 6" know Babcock will not give them a promotion, so they do want they are asked to do and nothing more. I love the addition of Ian White, but he is not that physical presence that this team has lacked since, say it with me, Konstaninov and Rouse. They haven't had a true power forward since before Shanahan got married. Yet they were a great team in 2008 and 2009, why? Hunger. Experience. Excitement. In 2009 the team had much more of a physical presence AND they had more reason's to win the Cup. Say what you want about Downey, but he was a intricate cog in the wheel that year. Dallas Drake was Dallas Drake, not a superstar, not a scrub, but he did his job and wasn't afraid to get his nose dirty or stick up for a teammate, plus the team had some motivation to win it for him. They had motivation to win it for Lidstrom being the first Euro-Captain to hoist the Cup. They wanted to prove that Chris Osgood WAS a legit #1 goalie and he showed that when he took over for Dom. Draper and Maltby may have been on the end of their careers, but they had a hunger and drive that would probably still rank higher than most players on this team today. They had a young core playing to prove they belong in this league, Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Hudler, Franzen. Out of that group, Datsyuk is the only one continuing to live up to his contract. Franzen is becoming more consistent, but he has shown this before only to go stretches of 15-20 games without a point, so far so good with him. Zetterberg has got to be hurt or he just has the Shanahan marriage disease, because his play as well has gotten worse since he said "I Do." If he continues at this rapid decline, he will be scoring 20 points per season for the majority of that life-long contract. I only hope its an injury and he gets himself healed and soon!

So, what to do, well, there is always an internal shakeup, sit some players that aren't producing, sit Ericsson, sit Cleary, sit Hudler, make up some injuries, teams do it all the time, bring up some youngins' and let the "top 6" guys get the picture. For pete's sake keep Cleary out of the top 6, that is too big of role for him! Babcock needs to get his head out of his ass and dress Commodore for a stretch and see what he can or cannot do. He cannot do any worse than Ericcson, nobody could. If you ask me, he is the biggest bust on this team outside of Hudler.

and if that doesn't work, there is always the trade. You guys speak of "Drake" type guys out there, who is out there? Well for one Shane Doan, but right now Phoenix is doing very well and if they continue won't be looking to trade him away. There is always Iginla, of course he isn't a Drake type, he is more of a sniper, but if the Wings could acquire him that would be huge. You can look to all the bottom teams and find someone who you could argue that would help Detroit. Look at Montreal, Calgary, Blue Jackets, Hurricanes, Ducks, Islanders. Somewhere on those rosters is someone looking to come to a Stanley Cup contender, looking for one shot (or multiple) at the coveted Silver. Just who though, are you willing to give up to get that player(s) here.

I love this team, I am glad they have won 9 of the last 13 games, but sadly, this team in its current state, is no more that a playoff contender, first or second round. Far from the Cup, yet for most of the bottom teams, those players would love to make the playoffs and if the right cog gets placed, Detroit will be that Cup contender...

The whole "Drake was the reason we won the cup" comments are getting way out of hand. The team played better, Drake may have had something to do with it, but he was never the reason why we won. The team had WAY more of a drive, everyone wanted the cup. Seems like a select few players now have gotten a big contract and have taken their foot off the gas for the season.

Agreed, and you can list those players: Zetterberg, Ericsson, Hudler, Franzen to an extent...

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I think its a Drake type presence that is missing.

Not a guy who will go out and hit and fight and definitely not a goon, but Drake was a player who could play regularly and spark the team in a way noone on this roster really does.

Kronwall on D, and Abdelkader when hes playing the wing (sometimes).

They need to add that one guy, that when the skill just isnt working, can go out and crush 3 guys in one shift (Drake vs the Stars) and completely swing the momentum just because he throws his body around.

This team could use some skill in the top 6, but I think it could use some crazy in the bottom.

Trading for Prust at the deadline could help A LOT. He is that type of player.

I think they need more than one guy. Definitely a guy like you are describing, but they need that defenseman that other teams fear. Babcock refuses to give Commodore his time to prove if he can play or not, so damn, trade for someone then, because this current D corps, with all their goals, couldn't scare their way out of a wet paper bag. Just like my wish says for 2012 TWO snipers and a LEGIT #1 defenseman. Another second round (or earlier) exit and heads need to change tables. You got cap space, if our "kids" are that good, bring one up and show us, give them a couple games on the top line to show us that they are snipers or power forwards, let's see them, one at a time and when one clicks, he stays. And so on and so on...

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Yet they were a great team in 2008 and 2009, why? Hunger. Experience. Excitement. In 2009 the team had much more of a physical presence AND they had more reason's to win the Cup. Say what you want about Downey, but he was a intricate cog in the wheel that year...

So, what to do, well, there is always an internal shakeup, sit some players that aren't producing, sit Ericsson, sit Cleary, sit Hudler, make up some injuries... Babcock needs to get his head out of his ass and dress Commodore for a stretch and see what he can or cannot do...

I love this team, I am glad they have won 9 of the last 13 games, but sadly, this team in its current state, is no more that a playoff contender, first or second round. Far from the Cup, yet for most of the bottom teams, those players would love to make the playoffs and if the right cog gets placed, Detroit will be that Cup contender...

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Bertuzzi is our Drake but he'd better pick up the hitting if he's going to have an effect like this.

esteef

...sadly all those hits would be deemed suspendable according the NHL's new hitting standards. Besides, Bertuzzi is afraid to hit like that anymore.

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Man I miss having a guy that would roam the ice like a cannonball and give the opposition a good wearing down.

Not even Abdelkader does it anymore.

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Man I miss having a guy that would roam the ice like a cannonball and give the opposition a good wearing down.

Not even Abdelkader does it anymore.

They have gone away from that for some reason. In 2008 they had two players like that, Drake and Downey. Sure they didn't play all 82 games, but when they did play, the other team knew it. Nothing personifies their play like Downey destroying Laperierre after injuring Lidstrom. Nobody on today's team will do that. Nobody. Datsyuk gets run around and there is no retaliation. Goon? No, but someone to patrol, yes.

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Man I miss having a guy that would roam the ice like a cannonball and give the opposition a good wearing down.

Not even Abdelkader does it anymore.

I think Abdelkader is the only consistently physical forward. But I also question how much running around he wants to do with no backup if someone tries to go after him after.

Add one more guy that plays similar to him like Prust, and I bet you wuold see his physical play jump up considerably because they feed off eachother.

When Franzen is out there turning away from every check and not finishing them, it probably doesnt give any energy to the team to finish their hits.

Look at the bruins, the team has a lot of legit tough guys. Chara, Mcquaid, Thornton and Looch, than all of a sudden Nathan Horton goes there and feeds off their energy and hes in more than his career total in fights in one season in Boston and completely upped his physical play.

Benoit Pouliot plays tough, and hes no tough guy. Brad Marchand can run around and do whatever the hell he wants.

I'm not saying the wings need to go out and trade their team to make it like Boston's, but I do think adding one or 2 more Abdelkader types to the lineup would help everyone know that somebody has their back and they can feel free to play more on the edge.

They need a Prust, or prime Brad May type. Maybe even Travis Moen. Once Abdelkader has one more guy running guys out there with him and show that they can take some of the crap from other teams, he will be more effective and a physical force out there

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...sadly all those hits would be deemed suspendable according the NHL's new hitting standards. Besides, Bertuzzi is afraid to hit like that anymore.

Not even. These are textbook hits. Doesn't charge, isn't late, doesn't leave feet, doesn't target head, leads with shoulder, elbows and stick down, separates man from puck, puts man on his ass. Beauties!

esteef

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I agree there is a correlation between having a tougher guy on the roster and everyone else playing with a couple of extra inches of height. Players feed off each others energy and physicality and gives the team a mental attitude of giving that extra bit of toughness which goes hand in hand with a general increased work ethic.

The same can be said about a team with no toughness. If no one consistently sticks up for their teammates, the idea of backing someone up will seem almost foreign and players will be hesitant. Same goes for playing with a physical edge.

Winning the mental side of the game is essential to being a consistent regular season team and a successful post season team. Physicality comes under that, for sure.

Don't get me started on Franzen's pathetic display last night. Hudler fights back and shows more balls than he does and he should take a long look at himself.

edit: grammar

Edited by uk_redwing

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