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Bring Back The Bruise Bros

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4 minutes ago, Euro_Twins said:

Wouldn't not reporting it to the league and police have been enough of a reason to have him agree to resign? 

It was Beach's place to call the Police. He is the only one who can press charges. The cops wont investigate if Beach doesnt want to go thru the criminal justice system. 

Reporting Aldrich to the league and/or police could open the team up to lawsuits from Aldrich. It was Aldrich's word against Beach's. Taking the accusations outside of the team, and going to the league about it, could give Aldrich reason to sue the BlackHawks as he could argue that his career was damaged by reporting unproven accusations that should have been kept in house.

It's not fair, but labor laws favor the worker in these situations. The same thing has happened with teachers and doctors who have been accused of serious wrongdoing. It's just easier to pass the buck if you cant prove they did anything wrong.

 

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13 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

It was Beach's place to call the Police. He is the only one who can press charges. The cops wont investigate if Beach doesnt want to go thru the criminal justice system. 

Reporting Aldrich to the league and/or police could open the team up to lawsuits from Aldrich. It was Aldrich's word against Beach's. Taking the accusations outside of the team, and going to the league about it, could give Aldrich reason to sue the BlackHawks as he could argue that his career was damaged by reporting unproven accusations that should have been kept in house.

It's not fair, but labor laws favor the worker in these situations. The same thing has happened with teachers and doctors who have been accused of serious wrongdoing. It's just easier to pass the buck if you cant prove they did anything wrong.

 

Nope. Reporting an incident your employee reports to you, to the league, would not open them up to a lawsuit. The incident was reported. Burying it was the thing that opens you up to a lawsuit, like literally they are being sued. 

 

I don't understand how people can be making excuses for this s***. This is 100x worse than anything babcock did and he got dragged hard for that. 

He went to the team for help, the hr department for help. Their job at that point, even if you say they can't call the cops, would be to assist him, and help him file a police report, if that's what he wants to do. Not parade the secual predator around like a show dog in front of the kid

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4 minutes ago, Euro_Twins said:

Nope. Reporting an incident your employee reports to you, to the league, would not open them up to a lawsuit. The incident was reported. Burying it was the thing that opens you up to a lawsuit, like literally they are being sued. 

 

I don't understand how people can be making excuses for this s***. This is 100x worse than anything babcock did and he got dragged hard for that. 

They could not prove anything. It's not defending bad behavior to say that.

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Just now, big man said:

I'm not trying to lighten the squeeze on Aldrich. He's clearly a dirt big kid toucher, who also engaged an employee beneath him in an inappropriate relationship, consensual or not.

I am defending the Hawks some, and casting some doubt on Kyle Beach's official story. An HR problem was brought to the Hawks attention, and they solved that problem by taking action and removing Brad Aldrich. An employee who had inappropriately engaged sexually with a player. Kyle Beach had no proof of what happened and didn't even contact the police about it. But Brad did admit the two engaged in consensual sex. That's enough to force him to re-sign.

What more did you want them to do? Have the Hawks call the police? Kyle didn't even do that. What is there to investigate anyway? All you're going to get is the same he said she said, only now the cops are hearing it, and it will also leak to the public. Maybe the popo can interview the girl? But she's only going to back Brad's side of the story.

How do you propose doing this? Once he's left the organization the Hawks have no power over his career.

If you mean they should not have given a letter of recommendation, okay, I sorta agree with you there. But there's a lot of doubt surrounding Kyle's full story, and I'm sure they were happy to give one if it meant he would resign and move on quietly without collecting unemployment on their insurance.

The only way the bullying makes sense to me is if it's psychological. Still, I put myself in his shoes, and I'm not letting tiny dudes dry hump me for any job. I don't care if its the NHL. I'd have been out of that apartment the second he started jerkin himself, all 5ft 6 of him his souvenir bat chasing me or not. 

 

What is the time lapse between the incident and Aldrich's resignation? I thought it was fairly quickly.

I think the recommendation is neither here nor there.

Why would the Hawks call the police for Kyle? IMO that's Kyle's business to handle. The Hawk's is the work side of it.

I doubt teams report internal things like this to the league on a regular basis at all. They have their own HR departments. And the Hawks execs did express some doubt about Kyle's story. And I can see why now.

Well, the incident occurred during the 3rd round of the playoffs, he stated around until they won the cup. He got to join in the cup celebration, got to take the cup home for a day, got a cup ring, and then was asked to resign....

 

 

That doesn't sound fairly quick to me, that sounds like a couple months maybe

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Just now, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

They could not prove anything. It's not defending bad behavior to say that.

Are you serious right now? They didn't even do an investigation. Everyone knew what happened and they didn't want to deal with it. He was harassing 3 people in the organization , had they conducted a proper investigation and suspended him until it's completion, they would have proved a lot. One way or another. 

 

You're literally defending a disgusting evil person

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1 minute ago, big man said:

The incident was reported to the NHLPA. Fehr took no action. That's where I see serious mishandling. Yet he's somehow escaped all of this.

Bittman, and fear should be fired along with the rest that already have resigned

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1 minute ago, big man said:

What do you think they would have proved? It's a case of he said she said. Maybe they get more statements from other employees saying yeah Brad is creepy.

Then what? Force him to re-sign or fire him? Yeah they did exactly that.

They would have been able to get text messages at the time (they're no longer able to get them because the phone company doesn't keep records that long) and using the texts they could deduce whether or not he was a willing partner in the activity. Testimonial from the woman at the bat, I mean they could literally have done this exact investigation they just did, but 11 years earlier and got better results. 

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9 minutes ago, big man said:

Okay, if that's true, I agree with there. Something should have been done faster than a month or more.

It's very much true. They told him his azz was grass. But were nice enough to let him stick around and party with the boys first. Imagine that. " Hey pedo you're going to jail but first we need you to finish that ice cream route of yours" 

Basically, they were cowards and wanted this thing to disolve without drawing too much attention to it.

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Just now, big man said:

Okay, but what do you expect those text messages to say?

They're going to say crap about what restaurant/bar they met up to eat at. Then it's gonna be a bunch crap from Brad about "don't tell anyone it's our little secret". The only threat I heard about was made face to face.

Also the woman is supporting Brads side of the story. That would have been, and is, damaging to Kyle's story.

Brad can be a dirt bag, and Kyle can be spinning this too. It's not one or the other.

Honestly this isn't even about who did what. This is about a company that's worth a billion dollars, burying a sexual assault claim by one if their employees so they could focus on hockey. This is about the mishandling of what should have been a cut and dry procedure. Instead they chose glory and fame over players safety. 

 

Don't forget they let him resign, gave him a letter of recommendation and deleted his employee files so there are no records of anything. 

 

If you think they handled this correctly then this conversation is finished. 

 

I'll let the court decide whether or not the sex was consensual or not. 

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3 minutes ago, Euro_Twins said:

Are you serious right now? They didn't even do an investigation. Everyone knew what happened and they didn't want to deal with it. He was harassing 3 people in the organization , had they conducted a proper investigation and suspended him until it's completion, they would have proved a lot. One way or another. 

 

You're literally defending a disgusting evil person

I am not defending anyone. I said that the team could not prove Aldrich did anything wrong other than engage in acts with a subordinate. I am not defending the Blackhawks organization either. I have already said that Aldrich did something wrong and the team should have handled things differently. I have also said that the team was put in a tough spot. I dont have all the facts. But I do think that some of the teams hesitation was based on potential liability and not because they were trying to protect a predator.

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10 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

I am not defending anyone. I said that the team could not prove Aldrich did anything wrong other than engage in acts with a subordinate. I am not defending the Blackhawks organization either. I have already said that Aldrich did something wrong and the team should have handled things differently. I have also said that the team was put in a tough spot. I dont have all the facts. But I do think that some of the teams hesitation was based on potential liability and not because they were trying to protect a predator.

Hesitation because of liability after the fact. For 11 years. 

At the time they blatantly ignored the situation because they didn't want to disrupt their playoff run. This was coach Q's contribution to "the meeting" . 

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3 minutes ago, big man said:

But as always... hindsight is 20/20. It certainly seems they had doubts as to the truthfulness of Beach's full story. Doubts that can still be seen today. My first question for Beach would've been "If this is all true, why haven't you gone to the police with this...?". 

What's this cop BS? There will be no criminal charges. You know you can abuse someone in the workplace without going to jail. 

Read this statement by Brent Sopel

He and Nick Boyton spoke up to management during the playoffs. Along with skills coach Paul Vincent. They were assured it was being dealt with....

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2 hours ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Hesitation because of liability after the fact. For 11 years. 

At the time they blatantly ignored the situation because they didn't want to disrupt their playoff run. This was coach Q's contribution to "the meeting" . 

They were aware that something happened. How much? IDK. In the end, they decided to rid themselves of Aldrich by making him someone else's problem. I am willing to bet they talked to him, realized it was a "he said, he said" and just wanted him to go away. Was anything actionable on the team's part? Again, IDK.He probably agreed to resign if they agreed to give a letter of recommendation. The team was probably so glad to get rid of the problem, they agreed to it hoping the problem would go away on its own or blow up years down the road. Not defending their actions. Just explaining what I think happened.

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4 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

They were aware that something happened. How much? IDK. In the end, they decided to rid themselves of Aldrich by making him someone else's problem. I am willing to bet they talked to him, realized it was a "he said, he said" and just wanted him to go away. Was anything actionable on the team's part? Again, IDK.He probably agreed to resign if they agreed to give a letter of recommendation. The team was probably so glad to get rid of the problem, they agreed to it hoping the problem would go away on its own or blow up years down the road. Not defending their actions. Just explaining what I think happened.

Agreed to resign? He had no power. Should have been suspended or fired immediately. But they didn't want to stir the pot while headed to the conference finals.

So when you say "agreed to resign" you mean "agreed to leave quietly". Which is what everyone wanted. Except for and few payers, a skills coach, and of course Kyle Beach. 

 

Edited by The 91 of Ryans

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18 minutes ago, The 91 of Ryans said:

Agreed to resign? He had no power. Should have been suspended or fired immediately. But they didn't want to stir the pot while headed to the conference finals.

So when you say "agreed to resign" you mean "agreed to leave quietly". Which is what everyone wanted. Except for and few payers, a skills coach, and of course Kyle Beach. 

 

Yes. That's obviously what they wanted. Get rid of the problem as quietly as possible. That's why they're all in hot water now. If they had done nothing wrong they wouldn't be getting purged now.

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Just now, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Yes. That's obviously what they wanted. Get rid of the problem as quietly as possible. That's why they're all in hot water now. If they had done nothing wrong they wouldn't be getting purged now.

Yes. It is this simple. 

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10 hours ago, big man said:

I'm not condoing their actions, but you can understand why they wanted it do it this way.

>Coach resigns (or fired) during the 3rd round of active playoffs

That's going to catch a ton of attention. Every reporter for miles is going to have the backhoe out to dig into that one. And it almost certainly would have become a sideshow distraction. I get the sense that some folks think the headlines would have read "Brave Strong Blackhawks Do Right By Victims And Fire Evil Coach For Sexual Abuse" and we all clap and go back to watching hockey knowing the world is good and right. No, it would have been "Sex Scandal! Hawks Coaches Abusing Players!" and the team is going to have to answer all the "How could u let this happen?" questions about that rolled through the media and lockerroom during a deep cup run.

Again, not condoning, but I can understand exactly why they waited and dismissed him once the playoffs ended.

The moral of the story here is - if u get raped - GO TO THE POLICE

Kyle's hurt that he made an unsubstantiated allegation against a coworker and the team didn't just take his word for it and fire the guy on the spot.

Should the Hawks have investigated harder? Maybe. But the Hawks aren't the FBI either. They met with the employee he made the claim against and got a whole different story. All they know at that point is sex occurred between a player and a superior coach and so they took the correct action to push the coach out of the organization because of this - albeit slower than they probably would have liked because of the playoffs.

And yeah I bet a few eyebrows were raised when neanderthal Beach told them a little gnome managed to force him into unconsensual sex

This isn't a criminal matter. It's a civil case. There would be no police involvement.

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Phil Kessel

 

If Steve wants to chase a playoff berth this year, we need to pick him up.  Arizona will give him to us if we pick up his contract.  As much as I dont want to see Ken Holland style moves, this guy solves a 2nd line problem for us and doesnt hurt our rebuild.  

 

Bertuzzi-Larkin-Raymond

Zadina(Vrana)-Suter-Kessel

 

That 2nd line gets a huge shot in the arm and makes our forward group a lot less one dimensional.

 

 

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Just now, Jonas Mahonas said:

Phil Kessel

 

If Steve wants to chase a playoff berth this year, we need to pick him up.  Arizona will give him to us if we pick up his contract.  As much as I dont want to see Ken Holland style moves, this guy solves a 2nd line problem for us and doesnt hurt our rebuild.  

 

Bertuzzi-Larkin-Raymond

Zadina(Vrana)-Suter-Kessel

 

That 2nd line gets a huge shot in the arm and makes our forward group a lot less one dimensional.

 

 

Not a terrible idea. 

And when the Wings play in Canada like they did tonight with no Bertuzzi and (suprise) no Larkin, Phil can center the first line!

Edit: Also why is Kevin from Home Alone your profile pic? 

Edited by The 91 of Ryans

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8 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Phil Kessel

 

If Steve wants to chase a playoff berth this year, we need to pick him up.  Arizona will give him to us if we pick up his contract.  As much as I dont want to see Ken Holland style moves, this guy solves a 2nd line problem for us and doesnt hurt our rebuild.  

 

Bertuzzi-Larkin-Raymond

Zadina(Vrana)-Suter-Kessel

 

That 2nd line gets a huge shot in the arm and makes our forward group a lot less one dimensional.

 

 

Arizona needs that contract to stay above the cap floor. They are in no rush to give it up. They will do it at the deadline for assets and taking on another team's contract. 

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