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2/10 GDT : Ducks 1 at Red Wings 2 (SO)


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#401 chrisdetroit

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 10:30 AM

I agree. I think I am just trying to squash the "Franzen can't hold a candle to Perry" argument. They are both about equal all things considered. Perry has youth while Franzen has a track record of performance.


There's one more important stat that everyone is overlooking. Perry make $5.3M a year. Mule make $3.95M a year. That's $1.3 M a year that we can spend on another guy. So really you have to compare Perry to Franzen + Darren Helm or Miller or Abby. Not so even now is it?
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#402 Taylorov

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 12:10 PM

Was Holmstrom/Lidstrom the answer to last nights trivia question?

#403 esteef

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 12:18 PM

^ Nope, Lids/Drapes.

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#404 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 01:03 PM

I agree. I think I am just trying to squash the "Franzen can't hold a candle to Perry" argument. They are both about equal all things considered. Perry has youth while Franzen has a track record of performance.

Actually Id' say Perry has the better track record of performance. Mule has two ridiculously explosive goal scoring years in the postseason and another overall good performance.

Perry has a 98 point season with 50 goals, two 70+ point seasons. Mule's regular season high is 34 goals and 59 points (which he'll likely break this season). Then factor in that Perry is on a crappy Ducks team the last couple seasons. The main reason they made the playoffs was his second half of the year.

I hate Perry when the Wings play against him, but if you're talking about a one for one swap, I'd take him over Mule. The Wings are better and harder to play against with him, and he's a RH shot to boot.

Neither set of stats is very useful as is. Stats from 2008 and beyond are most representative of the type of player Franzen is now. For three consecutive playoff years Franzen was PPG or better in the playoffs; last year he was hurt. He is certainly a more effective playoff scorer than regular season guy.

But you could say the same about Perry. He's a much better player now than he was as a 22 year old.

#405 MidMichSteve

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 03:35 PM

Just want to say that Joey Mac has earned the back-up job. Now Kenny can go after Selanne, Moen and Kubina.

Joey has been great. What if Jimmy had to miss games during the playoffs?

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#406 Doc Holliday

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 04:17 PM

Nope. According to most of you, he is the most clutch player in the NHL, so until he starts playing like it and actually puts in some "clutch" goals when the team needs them, then no I am not. Besides beating a dead horse means to keep saying something everyone knows is true. So I guess you think it is true too?


Try again.

Your delusion is clouding your logic.

The funny thing is he is getting paid a whopping 4 million and has 21 goals (leading the team), yet the onus is solely on him to score every single game.

Shouldn't your focus be on Zetterberg, the guy who won the Conn Smythe, earned a hefty lifetime contract, and isn't playing up to snuff this season?

Edited by Doc Holliday, 11 February 2012 - 04:19 PM.

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#407 haroldsnepsts

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 04:29 PM

Try again.

Your delusion is clouding your logic.

The funny thing is he is getting paid a whopping 4 million and has 21 goals (leading the team), yet the onus is solely on him to score every single game.

Shouldn't your focus be on Zetterberg, the guy who won the Conn Smythe, earned a hefty lifetime contract, and isn't playing up to snuff this season?

Z deserves some heat for his performance, but while Mule's cap hit is $4 mill (he's getting paid 5.25 million this season), he is also signed through 2020. Given that he's 32 now, that's also pretty much a lifetime contract.

I think the reason Franzen gets more heat is that when he's not scoring, he can be completely invisible. Zetterberg has had games where he looked great and was flying out there, it just didn't show up on the score sheet.

#408 Doc Holliday

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 04:37 PM

Z deserves some heat for his performance, but while Mule's cap hit is $4 mill (he's getting paid 5.25 million this season), he is also signed through 2020. Given that he's 32 now, that's also pretty much a lifetime contract.

I think the reason Franzen gets more heat is that when he's not scoring, he can be completely invisible. Zetterberg has had games where he looked great and was flying out there, it just didn't show up on the score sheet.


And Zetterberg has had many instances where he has been a non factor.

Mule's cap hit doesn't hinder Detroit a huge deal, especially in the later years when the cap goes up.

Zetterberg's is 2 million more, and for a similar length. Does he really deserve such less scrutiny than Franzen?

My issue isn't with holding Franzen responsible for his actions. My problem is the fact LeftWinger goes on and on and on about how much he cannot stand Franzen. We get it.

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#409 LeftWinger

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 05:20 PM

And Zetterberg has had many instances where he has been a non factor.

Mule's cap hit doesn't hinder Detroit a huge deal, especially in the later years when the cap goes up.

Zetterberg's is 2 million more, and for a similar length. Does he really deserve such less scrutiny than Franzen?

My issue isn't with holding Franzen responsible for his actions. My problem is the fact LeftWinger goes on and on and on about how much he cannot stand Franzen. We get it.

I am glad you get it, but according to you and most people here, he is the most clutch player in the league with his 9 GWG's, and Zetterberg is not regarded as that. So, until Franzen decides to show up EVERY game, EVERY shift and EVERY minute and prove that he was worth keeping over a REAL Sniper in Marian Hossa, then yes, I will despise him and call for his head every game he doesn't do something to impact the game. Not to mention score more consistently. He scores a game, then takes 6 games off, then scores and takes 5 games off...

I agree, Zetterberg should get some slack too, but Franzen is and was kept around to be our sniper, our scorer, they signed him instead of Hossa. Granted, Hossa has his playoffs issues, but Franzen hasn't lit it up in a few years either. Great that he has 21 goals, that just makes him that much more trade-able in my book. I am just waiting to see him be clutch, that's all I want.

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#410 dragonballgtz

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 01:13 PM

Mighty Mac is the only reason the wings won tonight.

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He did his part but watching the replays on NHL.com he left a lot of juicy rebounds around the net and at times didn't even know where the puck was. The defense3 bailed his butt out a few times IMO.

#411 Nightfall

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 03:57 PM

I am glad you get it, but according to you and most people here, he is the most clutch player in the league with his 9 GWG's, and Zetterberg is not regarded as that. So, until Franzen decides to show up EVERY game, EVERY shift and EVERY minute and prove that he was worth keeping over a REAL Sniper in Marian Hossa, then yes, I will despise him and call for his head every game he doesn't do something to impact the game. Not to mention score more consistently. He scores a game, then takes 6 games off, then scores and takes 5 games off...

I agree, Zetterberg should get some slack too, but Franzen is and was kept around to be our sniper, our scorer, they signed him instead of Hossa. Granted, Hossa has his playoffs issues, but Franzen hasn't lit it up in a few years either. Great that he has 21 goals, that just makes him that much more trade-able in my book. I am just waiting to see him be clutch, that's all I want.

I think that you have too lofty of expectations coming from Franzen. The best players in the world can't show up every game. Sidney Crosby is probably the only guy in the NHL that can do that and he is making 8 million a season, and even he is not an impact player every game. I know there really isn't anything that I or anyone else can say to change your mind on this though. Usually, those that are biased in one way aren't going to change the way they think, even if Franzen became a 100 point guy, then he would be bitched at for something else in your eyes. Lack of speed, poor decisions with the puck, and so on.

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#412 Doc Holliday

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 04:16 PM

I am glad you get it, but according to you and most people here, he is the most clutch player in the league with his 9 GWG's, and Zetterberg is not regarded as that. So, until Franzen decides to show up EVERY game, EVERY shift and EVERY minute and prove that he was worth keeping over a REAL Sniper in Marian Hossa, then yes, I will despise him and call for his head every game he doesn't do something to impact the game. Not to mention score more consistently. He scores a game, then takes 6 games off, then scores and takes 5 games off...


Scorers are streaky. And if you can find anything that implies the grand consensus is he is the most "clutch" player in the league, I'd be glad to hear it.

Franzen currently leads the team in goals and is second in points, so he is doing quite well for himself. Hell, the guy has 1 less game winning goal than Zetterberg has goals.

I agree, Zetterberg should get some slack too, but Franzen is and was kept around to be our sniper, our scorer, they signed him instead of Hossa. Granted, Hossa has his playoffs issues, but Franzen hasn't lit it up in a few years either. Great that he has 21 goals, that just makes him that much more trade-able in my book. I am just waiting to see him be clutch, that's all I want.


1. Franzen was injured last playoffs. Not entirely a big deal. The year before he was well over a ppg.
2. Hossa happened to have a great playoff as soon as he was put on Crosby's wing, and hasn't reached anything near that level since. Plus, he was looking for more than Franzen, was not drafted, and in fact was going to be signed after Franzen had his contract already signed.
3. Hudler is the reason Hossa took another deal. That took all summer, and kept Holland from using that extra cap space to gain them both.
4. Franzen is a trade-able asset because he has a lot of value that other teams could want. I have never denied that. But for you to admit that you have to admit he holds value to other teams, including this one. Your posts have stated quite the opposite.

So there we go. Franzen gets more flak than anyone on the team, so I don't really think he is overrated.

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